Why I doubt Frostwolf will die like Neltharion

I see a lot of guys predicting Neltharion's fate will be Frostwolf's. I guess anything is possible, but I doubt it- here's why:

1. MoP is the only pvp expansion for people who want to get BiS gear from just pvp. With Cata, you still had all kinds of OP pve trinkets and stuff that turned off people who just did pvp and didn't want to donate.

2. MoP health pools are a lot bigger than Cata's, meaning the pvp feels a lot different from WOTLK. Cata feels a little different, but not enough to make a real change of pace from WOTLK.

3. Conquest catchup. You can gear up way faster on MoP than Cata.

4. Lots of new class abilities in MoP. I play resto druid, and things like displacer beast, symbiosis, disorienting roar, mass entanglement/typhoon, genesis, ironbark and might of ursoc make the spec a lot more fun to play than in Cata. The ability prune happened in WoD, so if you like a lot of buttons to push, then MoP is the best choice.

5. 5 minute deserter debuff. It may not seem like a big deal, but when I play on WOTLK and leave a crap bg, the 15 minute deserter seems like it takes forever. MoP is better for just casually queuing bgs.

6. MoP, not Cata, is the last "new" expansion still standing on private servers. Some people like both MoP and Cata and would be happy to play either. For those people, MoP is still around, and Cata is dead. So they will play MoP.

Now, some say Frostwolf already is dead, but I did bgs during off-hours last night and got fast queues and fun games. It was way more fun than retail or WOTLK bgs. So a lot is how you look at it- if you need a real crowded server, then Frostwolf isn't for you, but there's still plenty of bgs anyway and I expect there will be in the future as well.

1. The first community to go was the Role Playing Community, for they not only lost access to their little cross faction meet ups, they lost even more access to the zones that they utilize, one area being The Wandering Isle via in game unstuck, for they tend to pop up there the most, and the only community to report bug problems, fixes and solutions to that zone. There is only ONE horde player that still has access to that area, and he is not a Pandaren, and he refuses to change his hearthstone location because A, he would lose access to the zone and B it serves as a reminder to what happen. He is there at times helping new Pandaren, but it is uncertain if he still logs since his whole community was destroyed. The RP community consist of over 500+ players, all gone.

2. There has been several low level instances and dungeons that have been closed without an explanation, the first being Magister Terrace. These dungeons had NO PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER, but was closed without warning and we were not given an explanation as to why this, as well as other dungeons have been closed. It has been a couple months now and no word was brought up, we are to act as if the dungeon had been closed, as with others, when said dungeons have been opened since the very VERY early days of Frostwolf MOP and had no problems whatsoever. These dungeons, especially MT, was the bread and butter for the low lvl community, who partake in honor running and conquest gaining events held, but now this gone. This is the same case when Sunwell was opened 3 times, and was closed 3 times, and the bugs we have been suffering in the low lvl community since the beginning has been address hundreds and hundreds of times, yet no help was offered or solution. The only time a warmane staffer responded to us was via forms, Protteran I believe but this was a year or 2 back, nothing was done and the low lvl community was left to whiter away, ironically, some still make an effort.

3. Frostwolf is plagued with bugs, some of these bugs can even break the game and yet they still exist. Some of the most silly ones have been dealt with like the Hunter Problem Townlong Steppes, The Killer Priest and the Batman'ing a way back, but said fixes lead to more problems. This has also caused some zones to get bugged out, mainly the Pandaren, Worgen and Goblin zones, for no access means no fixes and those who know what the issue is are gone now. And with a lowered pop, BG ques are not the same as they use to be before compared to now. When there is a critical bug, they do not fix it, they block the quest, dungeon and or objective entirely when a fix could have been made. Warmane has also included bugs of their own, example being, the insta res after relog, that served as problem for some arena players and opens door to cheating.

4. Cata players were somewhat promised a free transfer to Frostwolf since their realm was indeed dying, but nothing was done and those looking forward to it lost hope. Some Cata players were willing and able to transfer any of their toons over ranging from lvls 1-85 just so they can join in on MOP without having to sacrifice their Cata main, but were forced to re-make a toon to play here.

5. Some of their fixes, like I said, opens door for more problems. For some people, players tend to TP back in place, sometimes stuck in a loop, halting gameplay right there, this has been addressed time and time again, but nothing was done. This problem still persist and has been a problem to most players. The drop test also prove that this problem continues via flying high as a priest and dropping to the ground with levitation, in addition, this problem is the root cause to the fly path looping and demoutning problem.

6. They made some TBC fixes that they simply ported over to MOP, we saw this because one of the fixes includes hand of justice a blue item trinket, ironically, the item NEVER worked on MOP and seeing that TBC stuff has been moved on to MOP, when said TBC fixes never worked on MOP is rather telling. Hand of Justice never worked, ever, since the opening of Frostwolf, why say you reduced the proc rate of an item that is known to not work, as well as other things listed that can be compared to TBC fixes that somehow got on to MOP.

7. Another blow to the low lvl community was the fact we were told that a problem was fixed, but when tested, it was not fixed at all, this caused people to leave Frostwolf that same day, very pissed, and opened door for promoting other working MOP realms. The very player who called everyone to Dalaran to do a test, was the most pissed off out of everyone else, our petition was made known, but nothing was done still, and right there a good chuck of the MOP community died that day, for it was the final straw with them.

In the end a lot of things has been catering to the end game players and low players are forced to go to 90 instantly without being able to enjoy other things, being discouraged because there is not much to do unless you are a 90. This is why some are forced to power level, illegally, in very high level zones like Uldum - for a lot of things have been bugged, blocked and or disabled, leaving players with this sole option at times, while others try to make it to 90 solely alone. Back in the day, low lvl areas and dungeons were filled, it is empty now.

In the end, MOP may not be dead, but it has taken many, many MANY blows in the past that resulted in its current state.
For me, I have no issues, even though those past problems bother me, as with current ones that are still present, but hurt me the post is the closing of these low lvl dungeons, mainly MT, which I ran since day 1 on Frostwolf for anyone and everyone, and have not been given an explanation as to why, and many people want to know why also. Another thing is we only had one GM log in ONCE on Frostwolf, an that was a loooong time ago, for he came to address the lag issue that has never been fixed, the video of that still exist on Youtube.

Other then that, this has to be said because it seems the community is not being listened to as much when they addressed this on their now long gone twitch videos - I was the one of the few who brought up staff to community relations.

Many problems Blackshroud mentioned and many left to mention! The future of fw is not same as Neltharion, NOT YET! But its obvious we lost many many ppl and the fact that fw not recieving any attention hurts us! Just check out pvp ladder u see barely ppl reaching 2.1k rate while in previous seasons, after more than a month after season reset, we had many 2.3k+ ppl! Bg ques are mostly taking sooo long specially when u try que as a grp! But well QQing about problems never helped us and never will! Just deal with it or leave and join wotlk or tbc or idk retail or what!

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Originally Posted by BlackShroud

1. The first community to go was the Role Playing Community, for they not only lost access to their little cross faction meet ups, they lost even more access to the zones that they utilize, one area being The Wandering Isle via in game unstuck, for they tend to pop up there the most, and the only community to report bug problems, fixes and solutions to that zone. There is only ONE horde player that still has access to that area, and he is not a Pandaren, and he refuses to change his hearthstone location because A, he would lose access to the zone and B it serves as a reminder to what happen. He is there at times helping new Pandaren, but it is uncertain if he still logs since his whole community was destroyed. The RP community consist of over 500+ players, all gone.

2. There has been several low level instances and dungeons that have been closed without an explanation, the first being Magister Terrace. These dungeons had NO PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER, but was closed without warning and we were not given an explanation as to why this, as well as other dungeons have been closed. It has been a couple months now and no word was brought up, we are to act as if the dungeon had been closed, as with others, when said dungeons have been opened since the very VERY early days of Frostwolf MOP and had no problems whatsoever. These dungeons, especially MT, was the bread and butter for the low lvl community, who partake in honor running and conquest gaining events held, but now this gone. This is the same case when Sunwell was opened 3 times, and was closed 3 times, and the bugs we have been suffering in the low lvl community since the beginning has been address hundreds and hundreds of times, yet no help was offered or solution. The only time a warmane staffer responded to us was via forms, Protteran I believe but this was a year or 2 back, nothing was done and the low lvl community was left to whiter away, ironically, some still make an effort.

3. Frostwolf is plagued with bugs, some of these bugs can even break the game and yet they still exist. Some of the most silly ones have been dealt with like the Hunter Problem Townlong Steppes, The Killer Priest and the Batman'ing a way back, but said fixes lead to more problems. This has also caused some zones to get bugged out, mainly the Pandaren, Worgen and Goblin zones, for no access means no fixes and those who know what the issue is are gone now. And with a lowered pop, BG ques are not the same as they use to be before compared to now. When there is a critical bug, they do not fix it, they block the quest, dungeon and or objective entirely when a fix could have been made. Warmane has also included bugs of their own, example being, the insta res after relog, that served as problem for some arena players and opens door to cheating.

4. Cata players were somewhat promised a free transfer to Frostwolf since their realm was indeed dying, but nothing was done and those looking forward to it lost hope. Some Cata players were willing and able to transfer any of their toons over ranging from lvls 1-85 just so they can join in on MOP without having to sacrifice their Cata main, but were forced to re-make a toon to play here.

5. Some of their fixes, like I said, opens door for more problems. For some people, players tend to TP back in place, sometimes stuck in a loop, halting gameplay right there, this has been addressed time and time again, but nothing was done. This problem still persist and has been a problem to most players. The drop test also prove that this problem continues via flying high as a priest and dropping to the ground with levitation, in addition, this problem is the root cause to the fly path looping and demoutning problem.

6. They made some TBC fixes that they simply ported over to MOP, we saw this because one of the fixes includes hand of justice a blue item trinket, ironically, the item NEVER worked on MOP and seeing that TBC stuff has been moved on to MOP, when said TBC fixes never worked on MOP is rather telling. Hand of Justice never worked, ever, since the opening of Frostwolf, why say you reduced the proc rate of an item that is known to not work, as well as other things listed that can be compared to TBC fixes that somehow got on to MOP.

7. Another blow to the low lvl community was the fact we were told that a problem was fixed, but when tested, it was not fixed at all, this caused people to leave Frostwolf that same day, very pissed, and opened door for promoting other working MOP realms. The very player who called everyone to Dalaran to do a test, was the most pissed off out of everyone else, our petition was made known, but nothing was done still, and right there a good chuck of the MOP community died that day, for it was the final straw with them.

In the end a lot of things has been catering to the end game players and low players are forced to go to 90 instantly without being able to enjoy other things, being discouraged because there is not much to do unless you are a 90. This is why some are forced to power level, illegally, in very high level zones like Uldum - for a lot of things have been bugged, blocked and or disabled, leaving players with this sole option at times, while others try to make it to 90 solely alone. Back in the day, low lvl areas and dungeons were filled, it is empty now.

In the end, MOP may not be dead, but it has taken many, many MANY blows in the past that resulted in its current state.
For me, I have no issues, even though those past problems bother me, as with current ones that are still present, but hurt me the post is the closing of these low lvl dungeons, mainly MT, which I ran since day 1 on Frostwolf for anyone and everyone, and have not been given an explanation as to why, and many people want to know why also. Another thing is we only had one GM log in ONCE on Frostwolf, an that was a loooong time ago, for he came to address the lag issue that has never been fixed, the video of that still exist on Youtube.

Other then that, this has to be said because it seems the community is not being listened to as much when they addressed this on their now long gone twitch videos - I was the one of the few who brought up staff to community relations.

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I guess every one is looking at things from their own perspective,but let's be real here.
Closing MT or the loss of (allegedly) 500rp players (I play on FW for quite a bit of time and I never known or heard of a rp guild so large) is not the issue with the server, and it never will be. The problem as any private server is the lack of content. No matter what the developers do at the end of the day the content of said expansion ends and people are slowly leaving.
About the bugs you mentioned on worgen , panda and goblin zones I will add the folowing:
Goblin: no idea at all since I don't play horde.
Panda: I have leveled 2 pandas until now with very few problems.
Worgen: Currently I have 5 worgen alts leveled from 1-90 with zero problems.
And lastly there is no such thing as a low level community, and if there was calling 5-6 friends that run dungeons together is hardly a community.

well, while MOP pvp i awesome, in this server the gearing at 90 can be annoying due to low population, if a premade is running you will face them every bg.

the economy is trash and the <90 content is poor, so you have a server that can-t be played outside of 90 and with problems for set up.

So isn't only MOP problem, is server quality.

Or they optimize the content or make the server instant 90 pvp.

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Originally Posted by 420megicha420

I guess every one is looking at things from their own perspective,but let's be real here.
Closing MT or the loss of (allegedly) 500rp players (I play on FW for quite a bit of time and I never known or heard of a rp guild so large) is not the issue with the server, and it never will be. The problem as any private server is the lack of content. No matter what the developers do at the end of the day the content of said expansion ends and people are slowly leaving.
About the bugs you mentioned on worgen , panda and goblin zones I will add the folowing:
Goblin: no idea at all since I don't play horde.
Panda: I have leveled 2 pandas until now with very few problems.
Worgen: Currently I have 5 worgen alts leveled from 1-90 with zero problems.
And lastly there is no such thing as a low level community, and if there was calling 5-6 friends that run dungeons together is hardly a community.

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He is correct. In the early days of Frostwolf Role-Playing was indeed a thing that was popular on Frostwolf, namely at the time whereas Alliance and Horde players were able to communicate with each other, they began to populate zones people would not normally go to, like the Ruins of Gilneas, but the most popular zone of them all was Wandering Isle, for not only Alliance and Horde (most of the time Pandarens) couls communicate, but they are able to communicate with their Factionless counterparts clearly.
Eventually, cross-faction chat has been fixed, despite some who claim they were still able to have access to speak to other factions, and Factionless Pandarens were not really harmed by this fix, for they can understand Orcish and Common vs. players who are of those Factions, until later on this has been fixed, and eventually the RP community started to go down from there, and what sealed the deal with the change of the in-game unstuck for those who small few who try to maintain the community, thus RP now does not exist on Frostwolf, as it did before. RP had well over 500 players, even spanning some guilds, the only area that was known to be well populated was Ruins of Gilneas, but Wandering Isle was where you'd find most of them - at the time.

The bugs mentioned by Shroud are random ones, whereas the phase can change at any given time if relog or getting stuck/bugged. This was and has been the case with Worgens and Goblins since the Warmane launched, even in its older Molten days, this continues to be a problem. The only known way to test that out is getting to instance Gilneas or Kezan, then relogging. The Wandering Isle has no phasing, however, the phasing there does not separate the players from each other regardless of which phase/quest they are on, however, some fixes tend to break something else in the zone, examples like the rocks, players being transported off the zone into some bottomless pit via Air-Baloon, players being launched into a weird area with non-Pandaren NPCs, or the infamous Pandaren Grave, to name a few. In addition to that, visual things in the zone has been an issue since several changelogs ago, and a game breaking bug exist there, even to this day whereas a good chuck of the questline can be skipped, hastening a Factionless Pandaren player to picking a faction without needing to do the beginning portions of the quest, something that Warmane has left behind for this was never there in the early days of Warmane/Molten.

This is indeed true, lack of content. Some content that has been released and or fixed eventually become closed and or disabled months later, a good example of this is Sunwell Plateau, for it was open very early on without anyone's knowdlegw besides the low level community that consist of those who partake in Arenas and Battalegrounds and various events for their level, in addition to that, Kil'Jaden, the last boss of SWP was known to have spawned as a weak, one move enemy outside of the instance in Quel'Danas, my memory served be correctly, he use to spawn behind Magister Terrace and was farmed by some people until end game level 90s claim the area, and eventually the mob had been removed just days after SWP has been closed. SWP opened up again without anyone's knowledge, but was closed again a few days later, the 3rd time it was announced by Warmane that Sunwell Plateau would be released, and it did and this time everyone knew and had access to it, as usually, level 90 end game players exploited a bug inside the instance, and SWP was closed, and Warmane gave a reason as to why they cosed it, because of a bug people were abusing, so instead of fixing the issue, we lost access to the dungeon because of bug abusers and any mention of SWP release has been erased by Warmane, evident in the past changelogs and comments made by several Frostwolf players.
Magister Terrace on the other hand, was bug-free, both Normal and Heroic versions of the instance, no issues whatsoever. The area is usually ran by 90s who are farming mats and or gearing their alts, and the area was also ran by those of the low level community as well and had been farmed and ran by them 24/7, some of them are somewhat strong enough to run the dungeon on Normal either alone or with another partner their level, without the aid of 90s.

There is indeed a Low Level Community, I am one of them from said community. The community was about 250-300ish players or so, during the early days, even more when players from the other MOP realm Warmane had came over (I think it was Stormstout/Hellscream, something like that, can't remember), bumping the count to like 400ish, in addton to the effort some have made to recruit people to Frostwolf from other non-Warmane MOP realms. We did many things, farming, gold making, Honor Running, Arenas, BGs, etc. Our bread and butter was BGs and Arena for we thrived off of it, as well as help others gain Conquest Points very early before even hitting level 90, for instance, a Monk level 73 was able to gain nearly over 100k CP before even hitting 90 due to our brackets being that active at the time, and we use to meet up at Dalaran, or anywhere in Northend. Over time a rival group was made and they took over the Keep in Northend, a Horde group, and they've dominated the PvP scene in the Low Level Community for a while until Ally stepped up, were not able to take down the streak the Horde got, but we manage to do what we do best. We even promoted an event to Warmane regarding Air-Ship Battles based off the 2 ships near Icrcrown and eventually Warmane Staffer Proterrean even asked us what events we would want, and we expressed our ideas to him, but nothing came about that.
But eventually the changes Warmane had done took an affect on our community. Just like the RP players, we used the cross-faction communication until it was fixed, but we still had a discord and other means of communication, even translators via factioned alts. SWP clsoing and removal of Kil'Jaden did take a an affect on us and has reduced our numbers, and what hurt us the most was the infamous Que Bug whereas the game things we are 90 and tries to put us in a BG/Arena map we do not have access to, and petition and asked Warmane many many times to have it fix, they even address our problem but nothing was done. Eventually they said it was fixed and when we tested it out, it turns out we were lied to at the time and a lot of people were pissed off and our numbers went down and people went to other MOP servers outside of Warmane and even tried to pull some veterans from Frostwolf with them and since then the community slowly but surely has gotten colder by the day to the point where BGs/Areas were a struggle to maintain, and eventually it ceased, it comes back breifly, but onlywhen people want early Conquest to get Prideful Gear before hitting 90 (mainly monks). Someone from the Warmane community on here tried to help us out, even having us test the issue, but still, no care in the world for this low level community, and eventually we rely on just dungeons like BT and MT, preparing should a day comes where our problems have been fixed, but now MT is closed, as with several other instances, and some quests that worked before have been disabled and or blocked. And no it was not just 5-6 friends, we had a plethora of players in our community to do things with, even forming events.
As of now, the low lvl community is unknown, perhaps 20-25ish now, possibly more, some of them have mains on Verbally Violent and Devastation, Myriads, etc.
There has been private Arena matches going on for the low lvl bracket during the weekends, but knowing who is running the show for it, I think it is a bit shady, for the 2s usually consist of 2 really tough players verse not so tough people, other times it is mixed and or handicapped, it varies knowing the rogue who runs it now.
But yeah, we do exist, we have threads and posts on these forums, to say we do not exist or not such a thing only shows not a lot of people really knows the communities, both current and or former on Frostwolf, that is like saying Multi-Boxer Communities do not exist, yet they are found in the realm by those who bare witness to them - Frostwolf did have and possibly still does have Multi-Boxers, there was one last week seen in Dragonblight.

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Originally Posted by voyerista

well, while MOP pvp i awesome, in this server the gearing at 90 can be annoying due to low population, if a premade is running you will face them every bg.

the economy is trash and the <90 content is poor, so you have a server that can-t be played outside of 90 and with problems for set up.

So isn't only MOP problem, is server quality.

Or they optimize the content or make the server instant 90 pvp.

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Perhaps so. Indeed this realm is awesome, but more can be done. Instead of the obvious port fixes from tbc to here, we should try to fix things on MOP itself, those tbc ports are irrelevant to Frostwolf. 90 gearing is indeed annoying, unless 2 options, A, you have a good team/guild who helps you out or B, you get the conquest early. By level 10, you can start to farm conquest points, which was a thing back in the day for any player 10-89 and around the 10-74 mark, conquest and honor point gains are so frequent some would say it is broken, i.e. 30 honor points for a single kill, 35 for another, 40 for a 3rd, etc.

The Economy is indeed messed up, and I do not see the need for a gold cut every now and then when it does not really change anything, we went through 2 gold cuts already and it didn't do much.

I believe if more effort was put on Frostwolf, we would be better, but it is unlikely. As for 90s, not everyone is a fan of end game content, you'd be surprise of how much people would like to try out our community, that has been struggling for a while now and would boom if the fixes have been made.

But we have a whole list of problems that need to be dealt with, but the more we speak about it, we are not really heard.

You must be new.

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Originally Posted by Gobarz

Perhaps so. Indeed this realm is awesome, but more can be done. Instead of the obvious port fixes from tbc to here, we should try to fix things on MOP itself, those tbc ports are irrelevant to Frostwolf. 90 gearing is indeed annoying, unless 2 options, A, you have a good team/guild who helps you out or B, you get the conquest early. By level 10, you can start to farm conquest points, which was a thing back in the day for any player 10-89 and around the 10-74 mark, conquest and honor point gains are so frequent some would say it is broken, i.e. 30 honor points for a single kill, 35 for another, 40 for a 3rd, etc.

The Economy is indeed messed up, and I do not see the need for a gold cut every now and then when it does not really change anything, we went through 2 gold cuts already and it didn't do much.

I believe if more effort was put on Frostwolf, we would be better, but it is unlikely. As for 90s, not everyone is a fan of end game content, you'd be surprise of how much people would like to try out our community, that has been struggling for a while now and would boom if the fixes have been made.

But we have a whole list of problems that need to be dealt with, but the more we speak about it, we are not really heard.

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Wait, gearing up at 90 is so easy...
You get a 530 char in a week by doing the folowing:
IOT quests-daily
2 rdf hc- daily
Not to mention celestrials, world bosses and so on.
And that is something you neither need a guild or a team for. So saying that gearing at lvl 90 is a pain is just...far from the truth

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Originally Posted by 420megicha420

Wait, gearing up at 90 is so easy...
You get a 530 char in a week by doing the folowing:
IOT quests-daily
2 rdf hc- daily
Not to mention celestrials, world bosses and so on.
And that is something you neither need a guild or a team for. So saying that gearing at lvl 90 is a pain is just...far from the truth

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Indeed it is, but some people took the other route, getting conquest points earlier, there was always another alternative, mainly for those who want to join BG/Arenas before they even hit 90.
Frostwolf had always had options, some of which people take instead of the normal route. Conquest point gains were also increased for our bracket at the time compared to 90s, so that was another reason as to why people picked that round before. For such is accomplished with or without a team/guild.

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Originally Posted by Vuly

You must be new.

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A lot of people around here are new, they don't know much about the good ol' days.

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Originally Posted by 420megicha420

Wait, gearing up at 90 is so easy...
You get a 530 char in a week by doing the folowing:
IOT quests-daily
2 rdf hc- daily
Not to mention celestrials, world bosses and so on.
And that is something you neither need a guild or a team for. So saying that gearing at lvl 90 is a pain is just...far from the truth

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We know how to gear, but in us time zone things don't pop so often, in retail you could even gear with only bg alliance side in the same week and be full 522. Here for some reason i can't even queue for bg and dungeon/raid at the same time...