(TBC) Horde bg queue times with recent changes

Horde went from instant-1 min queues at weekend peak times, to 5-10 min.

The first point is that having the alliance/horde population seemingly balanced in numbers doesn't necessarily means that either population's pve and pvp participation is also equal. Horde bg queues have been longer since i joined the server, which indicates more horde players are trying to match up with a smaller pvp alliance player pool.

Now this wasn't a such a problem before the x2 changes came in, as queues were longer, yes but not drastically. Now what changed it the following.

1 ) The alliance>horde transfer made it so even more horde players would queue bgs, as alliance would lose some of their numbers even further.
2 ) The removal of bg queues provides more balanced bgs, but further lenghtens queue times.


As much as i welcome the philosophy of both changes individually, the combination of the x2 made an already long honor grind twice as tedious.
Can a solution be found for this? Allowing horde to queue against other horde teams would be one, even though not ideal, it's still better than sitting 10 minute for every bg to pop. Which most of the times is extremely one sided anyway due to premades.

http://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=384512

unfortunately the "feel free to state your opinion here" thread got closed because of the "bad opinions"

balanced battlegrounds (jk still more alliance premades because of faster queues) and honor cut in half per time spent is apparently the way we go now

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Originally Posted by Kruschpakwins

unfortunately the "feel free to state your opinion here" thread got closed because of the "bad opinions"

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It got closed by the Palutena as it was clear that the feedback we were going to receive was already there and nothing different was being added, just repeated. The aim of the change, yet again, wasn't to make battlegrounds "balanced" in a "let's do the impossible and have every match have equal opposing teams" way, but to keep people from ditching them and leaving most matches imbalanced in the number of players a team had. It didn't aim to do anything about gear or skill.

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Originally Posted by Obnoxious

It got closed by the Palutena as it was clear that the feedback we were going to receive was already there and nothing different was being added, just repeated. The aim of the change, yet again, wasn't to make battlegrounds "balanced" in a "let's do the impossible and have every match have equal opposing teams" way, but to keep people from ditching them and leaving most matches imbalanced in the number of players a team had. It didn't aim to do anything about gear or skill.

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nothing different was added because the thread was closed after 2 days where 99% of the ppl playing bgs probably didnt even realize that change was made and you had like 10 different ppl talking in that thread

having to wait 20 minutes and beyond for everything but warsong should bring up the suggestion if we would rather have horde vs horde bgs

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Originally Posted by Kruschpakwins

should bring up the suggestion if we would rather have horde vs horde bgs

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Which wouldn't belong in that thread, as that was only for feedback on the specific change of not allowing people to remain in other queues when they joined a battleground. Even your "feedback" in the previous post was exactly the only things that were given by the people complaining about the change: it takes "too long" and there's "too little honor" now that people can't ditch.

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Originally Posted by Obnoxious

Which wouldn't belong in that thread, as that was only for feedback on the specific change of not allowing people to remain in other queues when they joined a battleground. Even your "feedback" in the previous post was exactly the only things that were given by the people complaining about the change: it takes "too long" and there's "too little honor" now that people can't ditch.

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So that was rather an announcement thread and not meant to be a discussion about its consequences thread. Then you should've removed the "post opinions" line though. Its quite obvious that making pvp more fair is a good change but I'm afraid you guys consider bg's fixed while the situation on horde got worse. Alliance with instant queue pop is way more appealing to make premades as you get fast invite anyway while horde is sitting >30 minute queue with 10 ppl premade, thats why horde vs horde bgs would be a good change.
I know you want to keep stuff "blizzlike" but not everything blizzlike is good, especially when it comes to pvp.

Could give us honor on arena wins :p

Completely agree, the que times are detrimental to new 70s which is the majority of the BG population...

Dont kill the future =/

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Originally Posted by Kruschpakwins

So that was rather an announcement thread and not meant to be a discussion about its consequences thread. Then you should've removed the "post opinions" line though.

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It was both, but you apparently can't understand the delimitation of a topic's subject. People posted their opinions on the subject of the change, but when it became clear the "feedback" was just complains about queue times and honor gains now correctly reflecting what should be happening without ditchers ruining most matches, the call was made to close the thread. Want evidence? You've made two posts since I clarified why it was closed, and you haven't added anything new to the subject of that thread, just went outside it twice.

I like the changes but I kinda understand that it sucks when u play on horde side and u have to wait 20 min in a capital city until ur BG pops up.

Imo its crucial to activate free faction change from horde to alliance again. I assume that many horde pvper, especially newcomers that still need to gear up and are tired of the long queues, would switch to alliance. Maybe that alone would already solve the faction imbalance and reduce the queue times on horde side.

In addition I think that they should add new BG queue NPCs on some Wpvp and farming locations so ppl have something to do until their BG pops up.

I think making battleground queue work like raid finder queue on retail might fix the problem:
Players would not get removed from queue but it would be put on hold so it doesn't pop while they are in another battleground.
They would keep their position in queue so when they exit battleground, they still have priority over those who queued later.

But it would be more complicated to implement than current solution.

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Originally Posted by Obnoxious

It got closed by the Palutena as it was clear that the feedback we were going to receive was already there and nothing different was being added, just repeated. The aim of the change, yet again, wasn't to make battlegrounds "balanced" in a "let's do the impossible and have every match have equal opposing teams" way, but to keep people from ditching them and leaving most matches imbalanced in the number of players a team had. It didn't aim to do anything about gear or skill.

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the change is good overall and yes i did notice a little longer q times past few days but last nigh in a 3 man pm horde side,we waited like 2-3 mins thats it.
we are also at the end of s3 = less people qing bgs atm so im sure when s4 drops alot more people will q for bgs to get new gear.
the change is good and it was needed way to many people sitting around afking in bgs then dropping when a new bg q pops,rinse and repeat making to many unplayable bgs.

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Originally Posted by Obnoxious

It was both, but you apparently can't understand the delimitation of a topic's subject. People posted their opinions on the subject of the change, but when it became clear the "feedback" was just complains about queue times and honor gains now correctly reflecting what should be happening without ditchers ruining most matches, the call was made to close the thread. Want evidence? You've made two posts since I clarified why it was closed, and you haven't added anything new to the subject of that thread, just went outside it twice.

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just don't close a thread that is meant to discuss a change after <48 hours where you cant even do any meaningful statistic as the increase in bg queue time could aswell be statistical fluctuation since the queue times vary significantly from day to day. We're talking about a change that affects almost everyone on the server so you might wanna listen a bit longer and not just arguing with that other guy that reinforced his claims by posting with 10 different accounts.

opening post also said that you are open to "new ideas that might do a better job", yet you think horde vs horde bg is offtopic there

on topic I do even believe that the ditching is a problem when those ppl que bgs alone, it gets problematic however wenn full groups of 5-10 ppl hop from BG to BG, thats where the imbalance in battlegrounds usually started with, the 5vs15 is just some 10 man or double 5 man premade that stayed in another BG and didnt abort queue and everyone else who joins then sees the imbalance and jumps to another BG aswell. You could've started with preventing groups from BG hopping.

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Originally Posted by anyone0

I think making battleground queue work like raid finder queue on retail might fix the problem:
Players would not get removed from queue but it would be put on hold so it doesn't pop while they are in another battleground.
They would keep their position in queue so when they exit battleground, they still have priority over those who queued later.

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see that is quality post

Can these guys not grasp that not everyone felt that "ditchers" were "ruining" games? lol

I mean yea it was lame, but it affected both factions equally. And it sure beat waiting for 15+ mins at NA evenings

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Originally Posted by Obnoxious

People posted their opinions on the subject of the change, but when it became clear the "feedback" was just complains about queue times and honor gains now [U]correctly

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Agree with Krushpak on this. 48 hours is not enough time to discuss a new system's pros and cons, as most people would base their opinion on theory rather than experiencing said system first hand. On theory, i would also have supported the change, that's before i actually tried to queue, ending up spending more time running around shattrath than actually playing the game.

Please do not underestimate how big of a change this is for a consistent portion of the server. I know you loathe bgs Obnoxious, as you stated before, but some of us don't. These queues are killing my will to play bgs at all, and most in my circle of friends feel the same.

In conclusion, If you really wanted to listen to the population's opinion, then it was closed too early. Give people some time to come up with suggestions worth discussing, locking the thread felt like debate was not welcome, which is quite disappointing to say the least.

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Originally Posted by babbidi

Agree with Krushpak on this. 48 hours is not enough time to discuss a new system's pros and cons, as most people would base their opinion on theory rather than experiencing said system first hand. On theory, i would also have supported the change, that's before i actually tried to queue, ending up spending more time running around shattrath than actually playing the game.

Please do not underestimate how big of a change this is for a consistent portion of the server. I know you loathe bgs Obnoxious, as you stated before, but some of us don't. These queues are killing my will to play bgs at all, and most in my circle of friends feel the same.

In conclusion, If you really wanted to listen to the population's opinion, then it was closed too early. Give people some time to come up with suggestions worth discussing, locking the thread felt like debate was not welcome, which is quite disappointing to say the least.

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And you, just like him, don't add anything that wasn't said by others in that thread, just repeat the "it takes too long now" that was said multiple times there. As I said in that thread, feedback doesn't means gathering as many people repeating the same complain as many times as possible; the Staff was fully aware the people who relied on the side-effects of the multi-queue-multi-ditching wouldn't like to see those gone. If it was about getting amount of people complaining, we could have just opened a poll. If anything you just prove the point that led Palutena to close it: no new arguments were being added, just the same "feedback" repeated.