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Pretty new to the class. Some guides mention SS should be reapplied onto the target with certain buffs, others say that's a waste of time and DPS. So how does it work really? If applied when buffed, does it keep the buffs throughout the entire fight or does it lose them? Which buffs does it keep? And do the buffs increase SS tick damage or only Chimera Shot damage?
You should refresh if you gonna refresh only when you gain 2t10 bonus since even after the buff expires, its effect on serpent sting (if refreshed/applied while the buff was active.) stays on.
PS: Its about rng aswell, if proc comes at start, its golden.
Not true,
serpent sting regular dmg with no buff: 869
serpent sting dmg with re-applying on 2p t10 proc : 978
serpent sting dmg with using chimera shot and not re-applying on 2p t10 proc: 978
serpent sting dmg with using chimera shot after 2p t10 proc expired : 869
so no your theory does not work. just use chimera shot on cd and dont bother re-applying serpent sting, wasting a gcd.
and even then, you wanna maximize dps during that proc, the dps gain from re-applying serpent sting is so minimal compared to using that gcd on a chimera/aimed or steady
According to what you wrote, there is no gain at all at refreshing, which makes your second post unnecessary. And its not my theory, people already claimed that this is true back then on retail.
https://www.wowhead.com/forums&topic=164771
I went out and tested personally. Removed any trinkets and 4rd t10 piece before to not get any atk power buffs. And numbers are here
651, pre 2t10 buff.
651, 2t10 procced and I casted chimera but didnt refresh.
750, refreshed while buff was active and still does the buffed dmg even it disappeared.
https://imgur.com/a/jwOR9Bu
Since I proved what I wrote, lets discuss the next thing if its beneficial or not? As I said, if at start its golden. On fights where you can keep the sting up (almost all bosses in icc with the exception of lk, bpc and sindragosa.), it will definetly give more dps than just one gcd.
Every modifier of stats will be applyed to the serpent sting with chimera shot. The "problem" is that serpernt sting REMEMBER the "damage modifier" that you have when you apply it.
I mean when you cast SS you have no bonus set procced, so when it procc'd if you dont re-cast SS you will miss the buff on the serpent sting.
Thanks to the fact SS remember the damge modifier, you will need to re-cast SS just once, and not if you lose the buff and gain again.
Numbers:
-Cast SS, dmg: 100
if you gain the 2t10 buff, you get +15% dmg, so dmg: 115 -> here if you dont re cast SS, your chimera will not "update" the numbers and you will continue to do 100 dmg.
If you cast chimera-> SS dmg= 115. After 10s the buff is expired, but SS will continue to do 115 bc it remembers the +15% dmg buff. Here if you cast chimera, chimera will apply ONLY the buff to you ap/agy/ecc, but SS will still remember the dmg modifier buff.
For this is reason: EVER AND NEVER apply SS during viper aspect, coz SS will remember the 50% dmg even if you cast chimera and you must cast SS again for "normal" dmg.
Amazingly inaccurate piece of information.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fmtansei
SS damage and the bonus damage provided by chimera while SS is active are 2 separate damage sources that have nothing to do with each other. ChimeraSS isn't modified by refreshing your sting, only the ticking damage is modified.
Serpent sting benefits from attack power and crit. Refreshing or applying your sting when all of your procs are up is a pretty significant dps boost. You don't refresh it when you have a tier set proc as stated above by Bastardbottle, you want to refresh it while you have your trinkets up with the tier set procs being an added bonus and you only want to refresh it once per fight right at the start (in case there's no downtime on the boss).
1. Open with SS, do your chimera/aimed so your first chimera gets the extra SS damage, get your trinket procs + ashen proc + maybe get lucky on some tier procs and refresh serpent. Make sure you refresh serpent while your trinkets are still active.
2. Open with Chimera/Aimed (hunter's mark/explosive and whatever else you have to do depending on the boss fight) and apply your sting a bit delayed right before your second Chimera comes off cooldown. You lose the initial ChimeraSS damage and the chance of getting a tier proc from the first 2 or 3 ticks of SS but you save a gcd and you're more flexible on your readiness (you can use it on your second chimera rotation while still being inside the sts proc, the first rotation has to instantly readiness because of the wasted gcd).
Main idea is that you have to apply/refresh your serpent sting whenever you have attack power effects active at the start of the fight and avoid dropping it for the rest of the fight. You only have to do it once as long as your serpent sting doesn't fall off. Once your buffed serpent sting is applied, it will keep ticking for the buffed amount of damage regardless of your trinkets falling off.
This is the ultimate answer for the op. Atk power buffs will expire the second you refresh the duration with chimera but any dmg modifier will stay on target if you refresh serpent sting one time and keep it with chimera rest of the fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aurumwz
what youre saying does not make any sense, as chimera shot does refresh serpent sting and gives the 2p t10 % multiplier, chimera shot has a 10 second cooldown and the proc lasts for 10 second, 99% of the time you will have chimera shot available during that proc time there is also literally no point in refreshing serpent sting on proc because 1- you waste a GCD, 2- after you re-apply with serpent sting itself your next chimera will reset your serpent sting on the next cooldown, making it not last the entire duration anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aurumwz
If you refer to the numbers i showed earlier, because yes i tested every possibility of this, u can see that chimera does re-apply a new serpent sting debuff and does not refresh the current one.
before talking non-sense go test stuff out like I did.
Please go and do some testing, you will see that chimera applies a brand new serpent sting everytime you use chimera shot (valued with procs),Quote:
Originally Posted by Sprotess
before you say random *** **** like re-applying serpent manually is giving me aids, wasting GCD's to gain barely nothing because your next chimera will reset your serpent sting before its even done half the duration, go make some testings mate.
Your numbers are sadly invalid. You prolly thought the wrong buff as 2t10 buff. 869 x 1.15 = 999.35 (999-1002).Quote:
Originally Posted by Fmtansei
And I already posted the pics, check them.
2p t10 or 4p t10 doesnt change the fact that you dont want to waste a GCD while being on procs just to gain 15% for barely 5 seconds on serpent sting because you will chimera shot and reset it on your next chimera, stop wasting your ****ing GCD's on a serpent sting re-apply and do some steady shots.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bastardbottle
and if you cant read, I LITERALLY TESTED the 2p proc dmg % multiplier, IT DOES NOT GET CARRIED OVER, it LITERALLY resets after your next chimera, hence making re-applying a serpent sting manually, ****ing wasting a GCD.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bastardbottle
https://imgur.com/a/whIjXdk Base dmg with no proc (there is a proc but the serpent sting applied is before proc)
https://imgur.com/a/O2TZsQX Serpent Sting dmg by using Chimera after procs
https://imgur.com/a/5RlOAEW Serpent Sting dmg by using Chimera shot ONLY when proc's ended, literally applies a brand new base SerpSting
so idk wtf you're doing while testing but you're completely wrong.
As I said, you mistook the buff. What you see there is the atkpower bonus from sts, not the 2t10 buff. Try to refresh (by manually applying serpent sting without chimera.) when 2t10 appears and check again. 666 x 1.15 = 766 , not 839.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fmtansei