Share something pointless about your life!

[Mednieks4]

I did say "almost", i bet your grandfather did nothing, so give me a break with that grandpa talk.

Fighting isnt only done in wars, its done through all your life.
For example one day after working for 30 years every day (especially back then with the world wars and bad education in most of the world) you get to build your house and move your family in it for generations to come. Would you like that house falling into hands of someone who invaded you? Your family belongings spread around the pillagers as loot, your family members murdered or worse in the very place you all felt safe in?

Or for a more realistic view of it based on current status of white countries, you pay taxes.
That is a well designed system as long as it applies only to the well-being of the ones that contribute to it.
But now it is beyond that, now it focuses on the well-being of the ones that don't contribute in any way to the country you live in.
So now you will pay 0.8e for the bread*that feeds your family instead of 0.5e, because the 0.3e has to go to an immigrant that doesn't want to find work and has to live in a shelter designed for them to have free meals and activities and education if needed.
Basically you work for them to have a nice life, instead of investing fully into your own interests.

Patriotism is healthy, of course not the extreme variations of it, just normal 'don't touch me and I won't touch you' way of thinking.

*applied to everything bread is just an example of how that works

[Obnoxious]

Would you like that house falling into hands of someone who invaded you? Your family belongings spread around the pillagers as loot, your family members murdered or worse in the very place you all felt safe in?

You mean like what was done to colonize and create USA?

[magaginho]

You mean like what was done to colonize and create USA?

The whole Americas suffered that fate actually.

[Arbiterone]

I'm a Socialist with some Communist ideals.

That's curable. You just need to understand why communism isn't economically viable.
I considered myself a communist in the past too :(. It happens.
Have you ever heard about libertarianism?

The right wing is mostly xenophobic, they have have tendency to generalize and will always blame immigrants.

Shame if the right wing in your country is represented mostly by xenophobics. I don't agree with many of their ideals but hey, they're much less destructible to society than the left wing.

Socialism is pretty cool I think. All systems have their strengths and weaknesses. None are perfect.

I think the best system is the one each individual chooses what they want to do with their lives, without any group or government deciding for him what he needs to do. If the only existing laws are the natural human rights of freedom and property, I see no weakness.

Capitalism is kinda cool, but it gets out of hand very quickly. Wealth inequality is a big weakness here, because people by nature are also greedy. They make more and more and are unable to rationalize why others are unable to do the same, in reality they're ****ing over the scale and can't see that. They're good with money, but they don't truly understand it. Past a certain point, why should you make more? What are the real life consequences to it? Who does this affect and how?

I don't think wealth inequality is a problem. If one produces more for society, he deserves a reward. Of course, with corrupt governments here and there, in many countries you don't actually have to be useful at all to society to be rich. Though, capitalism itself isn't the problem here, but governments.

Just an opinion outside the right-left wings box.

[magaginho]

I think the best system is the one each individual chooses what they want to do with their lives, without any group or government deciding for him what he needs to do. If the only existing laws are the natural human rights of freedom and property, I see no weakness.

Eh. What about greed?
What about the fact that we're talking about mankind here? It's historically known that mankind is filled with ignorance no matter how much we develop. Give a fellow men the chance of living under no laws and you'll see a destruction road popping in a matter of minutes.
Most of the mankind requires rules, hell, we don't even know how to live in society with the current rules of different countries. Claiming that there's no weakness in such statement is being delusional and being way too pure.

[Obnoxious]

The whole Americas suffered that fate actually.

As did most of Europe, multiple times even, including times they had to get outside help.

[magaginho]

As did most of Europe, multiple times even, including times they had to get outside help.

I still defend the theory that mankind only develops once they feel pain in some sort of way. That's what makes people endure.

Same reason why countries were formed and have such a sense of patriotism; They were born through blood, sweat and tears.

[Arbiterone]

Eh. What about greed?
What about the fact that we're talking about mankind here? It's historically known that mankind is filled with ignorance no matter how much we develop. Give a fellow men the chance of living under no laws and you'll see a destruction road popping in a matter of minutes.
Most of the mankind requires rules, hell, we don't even know how to live in society with the current rules of different countries. Claiming that there's no weakness in such statement is being delusional and being way too pure.

That's not completely true. Yes, greed is a part of humanity, but it does not necessarily mean a bad thing.
Let me give you an example, out of many: You are a greedy businessman. You'd prefer to open a business in a country where you are friends with the politcians, or in a country where the free market competition is dominant?
In a free market your greed will turn into willpower to offer a better service to society. That's the only way to grow richer. Society would not buy your products if you are throwing prices high. Or if you paid low salaries your workers would not work well, your products would decrease in quality, and you would lose a portion of the market to the competition.
You could say you could form a cartel with other businessmen. Tell me, until when you will be able to mantain a cartel, while there are more and more people who wants to compete with you?

It's weird to think for the first time of a world without a government. There are so many problems, all of them directly or indirectly related to the existance of governments. You end up thinking a government is necessary to mantain order. But society in general prefers order over chaos, I'm sure society can organize itself without a government robbing and lying to people, only so that the politicians and their friends will grow wealthier and more powerful.
It was weird to think of a world without kings centuries ago, too.

[Obnoxious]

I still defend the theory that mankind only develops once they feel pain in some sort of way. That's what makes people endure.

Same reason why countries were formed and have such a sense of patriotism; They were born through blood, sweat and tears.

No, they were formed by stepping on others, fed by patriotism, religious excuses and "might makes right."

[magaginho]

That's not completely true. Yes, greed is a part of humanity, but it does not necessarily mean a bad thing.
Let me give you an example, out of many: You are a greedy businessman. You'd prefer to open a business in a country where you are friends with the politcians, or in a country where the free market competition is dominant?
In a free market your greed will turn into willpower to offer a better service to society. That's the only way to grow richer. Society would not buy your products if you are throwing prices high. Or if you paid low salaries your workers would not work well, your products would decrease in quality, and you would lose a portion of the market to the competition.
You could say you could form a cartel with other businessmen. Tell me, until when you will be able to mantain a cartel, while there are more and more people who wants to compete with you?

You're failing to recognize the dark side of greed and that's where the stereotypical corruption from nowadays kicks in. You and me have the same business model; What's gonna happen is that there's gonna exist a Billy out there that will try to corrupt one of us with a deal that will make our sales percentages be ridiculous while compared to the third person. Even if you don't have the support from the government, big companies can still make sure that they own the monopoly and the government won't even be involved until the point where they want their cut of the share. Take a look at the American ISP's and you'll see a perfect model of that. They make sure that their prices are all alike in order to be owners of the monopoly while compared to possible new threats - And either you become part of the system or you're set to fail. And as far as this goes, a vast majority of the current society is blind to the corruption that exists behind this movements. We're talking about millions; Not about hundreds. And when millions come to mind? Everything goes for the simple mortal. Your ideal would be great if society wasn't rotten as a whole; But I dare you to go outside and tell me how many people with real values and standards you'll find. Offer them money and they'll corrupt themselves in a matter of seconds.

Society in general doesn't prefer order over chaos. Society in general is filled with a bloodthirsty behaviour. The rule is really simple; As long as I'll live, I will kill you. If I die, you're forgiven. Take a look at the middle east since that's one of the cases that can provide you a perfect example of that. They had chaos and people state that we delivered them freedom by taking out their horrendous leaders. We teach them how to reign themselves and all you see is kids dying and running thanks to the rights of freedom and property. The fact is that ignorance drives us and ignorance leads to hate. Hate takes away the order and provides chaos and once that happens? Hallowed be thy name.

No, they were formed by stepping on others, fed by patriotism, religious excuses and "might makes right."

Not all of them. Take a look at how Brazil was formed for example. No one was stepped over. Patriotism wasn't fed. There wasn't a religious excuse either. It was D. Pedro pulling a rebellion out of his ***.

[Obnoxious]

Not all of them. Take a look at how Brazil was formed.

By religious excuses (teaching the natives to follow a new imaginary friend by jesuits), "might makes right" (by invading Bandeirantes) and patriotism (with the whole excuse of finding a new exclusive route to India for Portugal).

[magaginho]

"might makes right" (by invading Bandeirantes)

Eh, I didn't remind myself of this until you brought it up. However the blood, the sweat and tears are still present. Brazil got it's independence also thanks to the reflex of what was going on in Portugal (French invasions). In fact, once those invasions were dealt with, they went through an independence war to achieve such status. Pain made the country be born. (I still love the fact that we kicked their asses three times in a row. Even with Spain supplying them).

[apprentice]

You're failing to recognize the dark side of greed and that's where the stereotypical corruption from nowadays kicks in. You and me have the same business model; What's gonna happen is that there's gonna exist a Billy out there that will try to corrupt one of us with a deal that will make our sales percentages be ridiculous while compared to the third person. Even if you don't have the support from the government, big companies can still make sure that they own the monopoly and the government won't even be involved until the point where they want their cut of the share. Take a look at the American ISP's and you'll see a perfect model of that. They make sure that their prices are all alike in order to be owners of the monopoly while compared to possible new threats - And either you become part of the system or you're set to fail. And as far as this goes, a vast majority of the current society is blind to the corruption that exists behind this movements. We're talking about millions; Not about hundreds. And when millions come to mind? Everything goes for the simple mortal. Your ideal would be great if society wasn't rotten as a whole; But I dare you to go outside and tell me how many people with real values and standards you'll find. Offer them money and they'll corrupt themselves in a matter of seconds.

Society in general doesn't prefer order over chaos. Society in general is filled with a bloodthirsty behaviour. The rule is really simple; As long as I'll live, I will kill you. If I die, you're forgiven. Take a look at the middle east since that's one of the cases that can provide you a perfect example of that. They had chaos and people state that we delivered them freedom by taking out their horrendous leaders. We teach them how to reign themselves and all you see is kids dying and running thanks to the rights of freedom and property. The fact is that ignorance drives us and ignorance leads to hate. Hate takes away the order and provides chaos and once that happens? Hallowed be thy name.



Not all of them. Take a look at how Brazil was formed for example. No one was stepped over. Patriotism wasn't fed. There wasn't a religious excuse either. It was D. Pedro pulling a rebellion out of his ***.

Yes greed is the main problem in the world. People say pure capitalism is amazing. But pure capitalism is based on greed. The principle behind it is to become big, bigger, biggest and do not stop there. A lot of these people have more money then they could ever spend. Yet they still keep the salaries of the employee's low. Why? Because the amount of jobs are is finite... and its a wide spread practice. They know that other companies also want to become big, bigger, biggest and surpass you. The greed seen in the world these days is so widely used that people have gotten used to it. They think its fair that one person has to work 3 jobs and still live in poverty just so that some db who got lucky can have 10 houses instead of 9. And a bank account with millions of top of it.

Greed is also seen widely in modern politics, American politics basically cannot even function without lobbies. And those lobbies are basically a "legal" form of corruption. You pay a politician to win with the "spoken deal" to do some favors for them. What is corruption? You pay some one to do favors for you they would otherwise not do. Greed stands for the accumulation of materials regardless of the cost. Again what "magainho" said isps are a great example. If you live in the middle of nowhere you are are charges a stupid amount of money for a tiny bit of internet. Because you have nowhere else to go, they give you just enough to justify giving you service and make you pay extra if you use up that little bit of internet. That is pure greed, its not fair trade in a open market its pure greed.

Hell a good chunk of the wars in history have started on greed. (i want your resources, I want you land, i want your population, etc)
The fault is people... the fault is greed the fault is jealousy the fault is low integrity.

Edit: Greed is everywhere, I just used America's pure capitalistic ideals (the American dream) as example. But greed is seen everywhere

[magaginho]

Hell a good chunk of the wars in history have started on greed. (i want your resources, I want you land, i want your population, etc)
The fault is people... the fault is greed the fault is jealousy the fault is low integrity.

That literally points to my original statement and argument;

It's historically known that mankind is filled with ignorance no matter how much we develop.

History is there to show how bad things turned when we gave people a tiny bit of more freedom without rules attached to that same freedom.

[Arbiterone]

You're failing to recognize the dark side of greed and that's where the stereotypical corruption from nowadays kicks in. You and me have the same business model; What's gonna happen is that there's gonna exist a Billy out there that will try to corrupt one of us with a deal that will make our sales percentages be ridiculous while compared to the third person. Even if you don't have the support from the government, big companies can still make sure that they own the monopoly and the government won't even be involved until the point where they want their cut of the share. Take a look at the American ISP's and you'll see a perfect model of that. They make sure that their prices are all alike in order to be owners of the monopoly while compared to possible new threats - And either you become part of the system or you're set to fail. And as far as this goes, a vast majority of the current society is blind to the corruption that exists behind this movements. We're talking about millions; Not about hundreds. And when millions come to mind? Everything goes for the simple mortal. Your ideal would be great if society wasn't rotten as a whole; But I dare you to go outside and tell me how many people with real values and standards you'll find. Offer them money and they'll corrupt themselves in a matter of seconds.

Assuming that the deal Billy offered is about lowering prices, I don't see how lowering prices to the point that new ISP companies can't arise is a bad thing to society. If society is happy with their service, they will stick to it. If they aren't happy, there is demand for a new type of service. If no government prohibits a new ISP to open, you will see a new ISP services competing with them sooner or later.

Corruption wouldn't be rewarded in free markets. If an entrepreneur sees, for example, a region where all restaurant owners have priced their food high, then he knows he'll take a good portion of their market if he opens his own, if he offers a fair price.

Society in general doesn't prefer order over chaos. Society in general is filled with a bloodthirsty behaviour. The rule is really simple; As long as I'll live, I will kill you. If I die, you're forgiven. Take a look at the middle east since that's one of the cases that can provide you a perfect example of that. They had chaos and people state that we delivered them freedom by taking out their horrendous leaders. We teach them how to reign themselves and all you see is kids dying and running thanks to the rights of freedom and property. The fact is that ignorance drives us and ignorance leads to hate. Hate takes away the order and provides chaos and once that happens? Hallowed be thy name.

If that was true we'd always have world wars every few years. Humanity learned from WW1 and WW2 that wars only make you poorer, not richer, even if you're the "winner".
Middle east is a terrible example against freedom. In fact, if governments didn't do anything about them, the situation would be completely different today. Sooner or later they'd learn commerce is better than violence.
Islamic extremists were armed by governments. Their numbers increased because the people there hated other governments. And whose idea was to move jews to Palestine in the first place, again?