1. Fury Warrior PvE DPS Rotation Guide [3.3.5a]

    This will be the second in the mini series about rotation, itemisation, talents and other things end game - best in slot - Icecrown Citadel and Ruby Sanctum content related for Melee classes (might add range also, but I am not as good on those as I am on melee).

    Video on Fury Warrior rotation - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jfx1KdSWeI
    New video, fewer mistakes - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sH8AKeyqDrk
    In the second, "new" video, you have time stamps for every little thing I did in the video and explanation on how to handle rotation in general.

    Armory of the character - http://armory.warmane.com/character/...ecrown/summary

    Talent Builds:
    https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#Lhb...0eRVkAo:GMozVo
    https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#LGb...0eRVzAo:GMozVo
    https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#LN0...0eRVzAo:GMozVo
    https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#LG0...0eRVkAo:GMozVo
    Any of these will work.

    LoD no Rampage Imp Demo Shout build:
    https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#Li0...0eRV0Ao:oMGoVz
    This will be especially useful for 0% LoD if you have no one else doing Demo Shout (no Feral/Bear tank).

    LoD greedy no Rampage Enrage build:
    https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#Lhbf0fhZ...0eRV0Ao:GMoVzo
    If you are Draenei (or have Gloren and Crypt weapon comp):
    https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#Lhbf0fhZ...0eRV0Ao:GMoVzo
    This build should only be used if your raid has a Feral or a Fury Warrior with Rampage (that wont die at any point of a fight).
    Do not use this as a primary spec, especially if you are doing 10m raids.
    If you have dual talent specialisation and are not playing anything else than PvE as Fury, your second spec should be one of these.

    Once I am done with all the videos on all melee specs I will try to update the "guide" and add a bis list, talent links, etc...
    Until than, enjoy the videos as they come.

    Best of luck!
    Edited: August 21, 2020

  2. First comment for god knows what!

  3. Even if you dont use Rend, taking Deflection with Enrage is totally wrong, everything else is fine(second, third and fourth builds are wrong, because of it). Good guide! Cheers!

  4. Enrage is there to be activated off indirect damage.

    Saying Deflection is bad, in situations when you over aggro a Raging Spirit, or a Boss, is like saying /cancelaura macro to remove a shield before infest is good, so you have a 30% chance for 4% damage increase, while increasing your chance to die.
    You will get Enrage proc from every 3rd Direct Hit, if RNG is average at best, and as a DPS with such a high damage output and increased damage taken, you DO NOT want that.

    If you die, you do 0 dps. Enrage is not worth the risk.

    I linked multiple specs so people can notice the base/core talents and chose the rest themselves.
    Any change and difference in talent links I provided will not affect DPS even in 1%.

    If you want higher chance to survive in case you have aggro issues, you want Deflection, regardless of how many points you put in Enrage.
    Next time in raid, whoever wants to argue on how good and how useful Enrage is, count how many times it proced during every encounter, or simply go in the next raid without Enrage (0/5) and call me if you notice any difference.

  5. Your opening is wrong. LOL

    enrage is extremely useful.

    come LOD with me to teach you how to do some real dmg LOL

  6. Google: "Screencast-O-Matic", you can always record yourself, upload the video on youtube, and post the "good" opener here.
    I will remove mine if you have something better.

    Sure thing, I can be online every day past 20-21h server time, not sooner sadly.
    Make LoD, replace one of the Warriors or any DPS and inv me, I will come with 0/5 Enrage. :)

  7. Armory link is to a feral druid.

    You'd want to avoid precasting Recklessness. You want those crits to happen after your trinkets are active even if that means wasting a gcd. Same story with Deathwish, preferably pop it in one of the free globals in your first cycle and not pre-pull, similar to how mages don't precast mirror images.

    I don't agree with spec-ing into Deflection. I see it as a bigger dps loss than an actual survivability gain. Except for solo tanking, if you overagro ragings/boss or die to ghouls+infest combo you shouldn't be doing end-game content with that raid in the first place. Even if it comes down to agro, in most cases that 2% parry is so small that the talent ends up doing nothing. Ragings also don't one shot you if you're topped off and they don't crit, you're more likely to wipe because of the shriek on the raid that happens after.

    Big thumbs up for all 4 specs having Piercing Howl. I'd drop the point in Rampage tho, having multiple warriors spec'ed into Rampage + a cat is a waste of points.

  8. Armory link is to a feral druid.

    You'd want to avoid precasting Recklessness. You want those crits to happen after your trinkets are active even if that means wasting a gcd. Same story with Deathwish, preferably pop it in one of the free globals in your first cycle and not pre-pull, similar to how mages don't precast mirror images.

    I don't agree with spec-ing into Deflection. I see it as a bigger dps loss than an actual survivability gain. Except for solo tanking, if you overagro ragings/boss or die to ghouls+infest combo you shouldn't be doing end-game content with that raid in the first place. Even if it comes down to agro, in most cases that 2% parry is so small that the talent ends up doing nothing. Ragings also don't one shot you if you're topped off and they don't crit, you're more likely to wipe because of the shriek on the raid that happens after.

    Big thumbs up for all 4 specs having Piercing Howl. I'd drop the point in Rampage tho, having multiple warriors spec'ed into Rampage + a cat is a waste of points.
    @precasting CDs
    Delaying CDs after trinket proc is a dps loss. You loose more stacked trinket + deathwish uptime if you wait those 2 globals (trinkets proc almost always on 1st or 2nd aa). Additionally you want your first free gcds to apply sunder armor (each stack is worth about 2% increase in physical dmg done by entire raid this is worth way more than 1 unbuffed instead of buffed crit for you).


    @deflection
    How is 2% lower chance to proc enrage huge dps loss and 2% chance to avoid dmg negligible survivability benefit just doesn't make sense for me. From my point of view it's 2% to potentially save your life vs 2% to proc weak dmg bonus. Impact when it saves your life is way bigger to impact when you get enrage proc.. chance is the same.


    @dropping Rampage
    You can I guess.. if you have more fury wars. I would always take it though. Druids sometimes cast rebirth/innervate. Losing 5% raid wide crit buff for 1-2s a fight is bigger raid dps loss than you having extra point in enrage though. + I don't want to respec for 10m/when there is no other war..

  9. @precasting CDs
    Delaying CDs after trinket proc is a dps loss. You loose more stacked trinket + deathwish uptime if you wait those 2 globals (trinkets proc almost always on 1st or 2nd aa). Additionally you want your first free gcds to apply sunder armor (each stack is worth about 2% increase in physical dmg done by entire raid this is worth way more than 1 unbuffed instead of buffed crit for you).
    On single target sure, pop Recklessness before the pull, but not on LoD. And if webarchives weren't down I'd show you that using Deathwish before the pull is a dps loss. You still have 3 free globals in the first 2 cycles to apply sunders (given you ignore slam procs,which you should do).

    ....I see it as a bigger dps loss than an actual survivability gain....in most cases that 2% parry is so small that the talent ends up doing nothing
    How is 2% lower chance to proc enrage huge dps loss
    Bigger dps loss than actual survivability gain =/= huge dps loss. Don't prove your points by over emphasizing something I didn't say.

    The dps loss from a few parry's in p1 that might not even trigger a new enrage, just refresh the old one isn't big. It's quite small. I never said it's a big dps loss, I just pointed out that every scenario where deflection could come into play should never happen in a proper end-game raid. Spec-ing and adjusting your playstyle in order to fix somebody else's mistakes beats the purpose of creating an end-game guide. Just like how you're not specing 5/5 into improved demo shout because you assume you have capable tanks, it's not that far fetched to assume your rogues + hunters are going to do their jobs with the ragings or healers are going to precast cleavers on each infest.

  10. Archives are back up.

    Fight Duration |Death Wishes |Timing
    0:00-2:00 1 Best single location
    2:01-2:30 2 Cannot time
    2:31-4:00 2 Best 2 locations
    4:01-4:30 3 Cannot time
    4:31-6:00 3 Best 3 locations

    "Death Wish is our primary DPS cooldown, as it is the most powerful and lasts the longest. Since each boss fight has a different fight length, it is true that there will be some fights where you must use this ability in different ways due to how it's cooldown interacts with the fight duration. Take for example a 2:30 fight. It is only possible to use 2 Death Wishes. If you wait to use Death Wish until 0:10 and hit the second Death Wish immediately as it cools down, then you will only benefit from 20 our of the 30 seconds of it's duration, since the fight will end. Effectively, 1/3 of the second Death Wish was wasted because you decided to time the first one. Thus, it is very important to determine around how long the fight will be, so you can decide if you can time your Death Wishes to stack with other procs."

    "As you can see, for fights ending after every 2 minutes for 30 seconds your last Death Wish will be cut off normally, so if you delay any Death Wish previous, your last Death Wish will be cut off even more. If you mess up, it is possible to miss the last Death Wish completely, and this must be avoided.

    Also keep in mind that Death Wish requires a GCD and does 0 damage. Since our rotation is intense when managing our GCD's correctly, it is best to use Death Wish only in the position directly after the 2nd Bloodthirst in our 8s rotational basis, in priority above instant slam. This allows our BT-WW-BT pattern to remain undelayed from the Death Wish. If you are deciding to use Death Wish in the particular rotation period you are in, you must use any slam that would normally go where the Death Wish is going in the 1.0s free space or (depending on when the proc happened) after the Death Wish, each delaying your BT-WW-BT pattern by at least 0.5s. This is okay since we have established before that letting a slam completely expire is worse than that."

  11. On single target sure, pop Recklessness before the pull, but not on LoD. And if webarchives weren't down I'd show you that using Deathwish before the pull is a dps loss. You still have 3 free globals in the first 2 cycles to apply sunders (given you ignore slam procs,which you should do).




    Bigger dps loss than actual survivability gain =/= huge dps loss. Don't prove your points by over emphasizing something I didn't say.

    The dps loss from a few parry's in p1 that might not even trigger a new enrage, just refresh the old one isn't big. It's quite small. I never said it's a big dps loss, I just pointed out that every scenario where deflection could come into play should never happen in a proper end-game raid. Spec-ing and adjusting your playstyle in order to fix somebody else's mistakes beats the purpose of creating an end-game guide. Just like how you're not specing 5/5 into improved demo shout because you assume you have capable tanks, it's not that far fetched to assume your rogues + hunters are going to do their jobs with the ragings or healers are going to precast cleavers on each infest.
    Ok, so deflection first.. I missunderstood, sry about that. But I disagree with your point. Enrage has 30% chance to proc on being hit. Going up 1% parry (lets assume you start at 0 for simplicity sake) makes you hit 1% less often = 1% extra survivability. And reduces your chance to proc enrage to 30% * 0.99 = 29.7%. Enrage at 5 points is 10% dmg increase 0.3% lower chance to proc 10% bonus is 0.03% dps loss disregarding overlaps, etc.



    About that archive.. I know the article... they talk about best timing of CDs in combat. They also talk about 1st use on pull. Since you are going to use CDs at start anyways it is better to do so just before pull.

    Look at it like this:

    -3s Prepot
    -1.5s Deathwish
    combat starts
    0s bt
    1s aa (trinkets are up most likely here)
    1.5s ww
    3s sa
    4.5s bt
    6s sa
    7.5s sa


    vs


    -1.5s prepot
    combat starts
    0s bt
    1s aa (trinkets are up most likely here)
    1.5s ww
    3s DW
    4.5s bt
    6s sa
    7.5s sa

    wasting 1.5-2s of Deathwish + both trinkets + delaying SA by 3s for your raid... I just cant see how this would be better...


    Reclessness on the other hand I would delay till some free in rotation. Since its wasted with DBW crit proc.



    I understand that you strive for highest numbers possible and rely on others to play perfectly as well. I just have different raiding attitude - for me it is a team game, and covering each others mistake is part of it. Its much better to loose even 10% personal dps if it makes pull into kill instead of wipe. I would definitely recommend having 1 fury in raid with 5/5 demo shout.
    Edited: August 7, 2020

  12. I don't have anything against setting up your character in benefit of the raid, there's certain scenarios where it's a must to go the weird route in favor of the raid, but imo that should be part of a basic warrior guide or part of a 0% guide. Specing into deflection as a warrior, magic absorption as a mage, quick recovery as an assa etc. beats the purpose of having an end-game guide and falls more into the progression/0%/solo tank+2heal category. You'll be overgearing the content in a normal end-game raid and already have experience with most of the fights so improving the quality of raid, if nobody does any major mistakes, should be done by improving the speed in which you clear that run. Improving the speed of the run = improving your own gameplay rather than setting random insurances in case somebody fails.

    It's really really hard to proc everything on the first aa. It usually takes 3-4 hits to proc both trinkets + ashen + berserking. I agree on the sunders part, you'll have them up a bit slower if you dw after the first bt/ww instead of doing it prepull but it's not a huge issue even raid wise. The only class that would suffer a bit from it, from the top of my mind, are rogues. They killing spree on the 4th global and you'll be applying sunders only on the 5th.

  13. Do you know that players have Parry Haste? Or at least should...
    Parried attack will increase the speed of your next auto attack?
    Parried attack also reduces melee damage taken by 100%.
    In 70% of the cases (when Enrage wont proc), Parried attack will be a DPS increase.

    You want 5/5 Sunders on the target asap. With some lucky Slam! procs, this means that you don't have an extra GCD during first STS proc.
    Being the only Warrior on a dummy, precasting Recklessness is the only thing I can do (I did fail the 2nd Recklessness in the video, should have done DW > Reck, not the other way around).
    The only window at start would be after the 2nd BT before 3rd BT and 2nd WW, where you can end up using 2 stacks of Recklessness on Heroic Strike.
    Also, if you WW on a single target, it consumes 2 stacks of Recklessness. If you WW at the last stack of Recklessness, you will still get both main and off hand WW damage to crit.
    As for Death Wish, in a 5min Single Target fight as I did in the video, I could have maybe delayed 1 usage for 10-15sec, nothing else. This also depends highly on each fight, and I for sure wont go and do the work for you and tell you at what point to pop it and why. I also had STS when I did BT HS and WW in the video at start, so Recklessness was more than good.

    Rampage is a RAID BUFF. Getting a boss down is a team work as jendah said. End of story.

    Heroic Strike does 495, Cleave does 489 extra damage.
    Heroic Strike has a 20% chance to give you Slam! proc, Cleaving ghouls does not guarantee you that with 2 other warriors you will have the aggro on ghouls. Most likely there is a higher chance to get a Slam! proc than to get Enrage from Ghouls auto attack.
    You also want to push Lich King in 1st Transition phase as soon as possible, and phase 1 is all about that.
    This is why you should not Cleave unless Ghouls are not getting killed by WW, DS, Diseases, etc, AoE that is natural when DPSing the boss.
    The main thing that should proc your Enrage on Lich King encounter is Infest and Pain and Suffering during transitions.

    Now, lets say that minimum amount of talents put in Enrage is 2/5.
    Lets say you are doing 20k constant DPS during that 12sec Enrage window.
    This means that with 2/5 Enrage (4%), 240k damage that you would normally do without it, will increase your damage by 9600?
    Feel free to correct me if I am wrong here. This is just some simple math I am getting out of the hat.
    Does that mean that 5/5 Enrage will increase your damage by 14400 in comparison to 2/5 Enrage, and only 9600 in comparison to 3/5 Enrage?
    How much does 1 Slam deal damage? 10, 15k damage crit?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxjw5AAM6KA
    @1:10 - Parried attack while trying to Cleave the Ghouls
    @1:41 - 1st Enrage from Infest (Phase 1)
    @1:50 - 2nd Enrage from Ghoul (Phase 1)
    @3:54 - 3rd Enrage from Infest (Phase 2)
    @5:10 - Defile on him, could have Intercepted the boss if he had Heroic Fury and have less down time from walking back in
    @7:18 - 4th Enrage from Pain and Suffering most likely (2nd Transition)
    @7:30 - 5th Enrage from Pain and Suffering (2nd Transition)
    @7:52 - 6th Enrage from Pain and Suffering (2nd Transition)
    @8:02 - 7th Enrage from Pain and Suffering (2nd Transition)
    Non of the 2nd Transition Enrage procs were used on the Lich King.
    Fight lasted for ~12min 30sec.

    Do the math yourself, both how much Enrage increased his damage, how much is the difference between 2/5 and 5/5 Enrage there, and how much DMG he lost with Parry and while running instead of doing 2nd Intercept.

    I did not do this to try and say something bad towards Ceo(A KA) or the guild he is in (go apply and help the man out!).
    He is one of the players I respect and someone who I think knows how to play this game on multiple classes.
    This is just an example I knew I could get with good gameplay, not many mistakes, to show how bad the uptime of Enrage actually is.

    Its one thing to play as general population should.
    Get Raid buffs from talent tree (Rampage).
    Apply debuffs that are helpful (Sunder Armor).
    Get extra mobility in talents to reduce down time or need to move (Heroic Fury).
    Try to reinvent the wheel, hope RNG will bless you, and that others will do their job so you can get some magical dps increase and preach how its the only way to play it at the end game (more than 2/5 Enrage).

    I got nothing against anyone playing with 0/1 Rampage and 5/5 Enrage. Do whatever floats your boat.
    Stop talking how its "pro"/"good"/"best" way of playing a class.
    This is why we have morons Cleaving Blood Prince Council and getting smacked while doing so.

    If you are good, you will do your job and try to live as much as possible while doing it.
    This means get Rampage, apply Sunders (Demo Shout also if required), DPS what needs to be killed (not what increases recount numbers) and dont die.
    That is Fury Warrior, at least on 3.3.5a patch.
    If you have something better, feel free to record and show it. You don't even need to be in the raid, go on a dummy, DPS for 5min, and show us what you did.

    P.S. Thanks for the link report, I am trying to record more vids without a lot of free time, so I will edit everything latter. Sorry for the delay...

  14. You should make 2 specs, one with rampage one without and decide wether you have feral or other warrior that can use it.

    Aim for as much enrage stacks as possible. For max whore on single target spec into glyph of Exe. Lolz. Never open with BT, etc etc etc. Every good warrior in endgame guild knows that at this point.

  15. Rampage is a RAID BUFF. Getting a boss down is a team work as jendah said. End of story.
    Having 4 people overlapping the same buff is awesome team work indeed.

    Heroic Strike does 495, Cleave does 489 extra damage.
    Heroic Strike has a 20% chance to give you Slam! proc, Cleaving ghouls does not guarantee you that with 2 other warriors you will have the aggro on ghouls. Most likely there is a higher chance to get a Slam! proc than to get Enrage from Ghouls auto attack.
    You also want to push Lich King in 1st Transition phase as soon as possible, and phase 1 is all about that.
    This is why you should not Cleave unless Ghouls are not getting killed by WW, DS, Diseases, etc, AoE that is natural when DPSing the boss.
    The main thing that should proc your Enrage on Lich King encounter is Infest and Pain and Suffering during transitions.
    Completely disregarding your 2set bonus which has a significantly higher chance of proc-ing when cleaving. And that 16% ain't no joke

    https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1877046...=all&sort=time -> this random warrior I found on the internet is doing exactly the opposite of everything you're saying there and he's also not spec'ed into Deflection. Anybody know his in-game name so I can send him a mean letter? He clearly needs to hit the target dummies more often

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