Everyone who dislikes item reservation is completely free to start their own raids without any such rules.
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Moderator
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Member
Mhm, make your own raid... allright, allright, allright.
We should take a step back and look at the bigger picture. In my opinion this "everything reserved" thing just makes the community look really bad. And combined with the ridiculous GS/achiev requirements it's just nuts.
3-4 years ago you would get laughed at for reserving an item, but nowadays people set master loot even in OS and reserve the stupid satchel xD or they roll "need" on every item in RDF etc.
Warmane is probably the least friendly place for new players right now, like all the decent, nice people vaporized after moltdown and all we have left are the toxic noobs. Sad, really. If it continues on Lordaeron then there's no hope...
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Moderator
That's quite over-dramatic.
There's nothing intrinsically illegal about reserving loot or having gear requirements - not any more than ganking. I don't see people declaring the end of Warmane because we allow ganking, and there are few things less "newbie friendly" things than that. People learn to deal with it, since it's part of the game. They join guilds, they group with others, they avoid places when there are gankers. Of course there are people who complain and ask for it to be made into a bannable offense, but it's still part of the game.
We can't be expected to force people to not reserve loot any more than we can force them to accept a character of every race in their raid for "racial diversity." They are creating and leading the raid and they are being explicit about that kind of loot limitation. Just like we aren't going to make a rule that forces you to join one such raid, it would be ludicrous to enforce that they can't set limitations.
If so many people see a problem with reserving loot, yes, why not make your own raid? I'd assume that would be easy to get it filled if there are so many people who take issue with that. What's stopping people who don't like the way others do something from starting it their own way? If there are people who are "unfriendly with new people", why aren't you doing the opposite to welcome these new people?
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Member
The only problem that comes out from making your own raid is if you have limited time.
It takes around 2 hours to make a proper ICC 25 Heroic group going with a PuG, not to mention another 3 hours if you want to reach the boss of your liking - taking DC's into consideration, etc.
Some people have only those 3 hours to play, and making the raid of their own isn't a luxury.
So the only way out of this situation is to join a guild that doesn't mind you being time-limited. You can find guilds like that if you just look hard enough.
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Member
I have to agree, why shouldn't raid leaders be allowed to reserve loot?
They do all the hard work of making a raid, which can take up to an hour, checking gear/achieves/skills/dps/w.e, and then they run the raid, manage all the players, and in the end get nothing. How is that fair for them?
Make your own raids and don't reserve the loot. After you go three raids with no loot, lets see if you want to continue making raids and not reserving >.>
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Moderator
That's true, but would only apply if the number of people unsatisfied with reserved loot isn't as large as people make it sound like and/or all of these people have this trouble with lack of time, no exceptions. It would only take one out of twenty-five people to be able to organize a 25-man raid without loot reservation, after all. Hell, if they are this numerous they could even create a Guild centered around raiding without loot reserving and not have to depend on random raids.
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Member
Nah. I'm all about freedom. People are free to reserve things. And I'm free to not join their raid if I don't like their rules.
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Member
In retail Wrath, you would be laughed out of trade chat for starting a raid with DBW reserved or with primordials reserved. Just my experience, of course, it may have been different on other realms besides the one I played on.
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Member
I don't even know how ppl manage to get a full 25 guys group for ICC when they reserve boes, primos, plus their class items or something else.
Like why would you even go in that raid? For achievements? Bruh.
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Member
this community sucks a*s! period.
ninja is banable , item reservation is not.. fun server so blizzlike
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Member
so....... its a fun server because ninja is bannable? did that hurt your profits much mr ninja lol
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Member
I feel like you do not know what does ninjaing mean.
If you reserve an item you do that before the raid announcing it in the global chat spam or however are you making it so everyone knows that.
If you ninja item, you just take the items without any permission and by not following the loot rules (if you have reserved it then you have permission of all players who join the raid given to you the moment they ask for an invite in the raid).
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Member
All I read is "just don't join those raids" and "we raid leaders have such a hard time hurr".
How many ICC raids do you think there are at a given time? Are you aware of this server's population? How many people prepared for a raid do you think there are? "If you dislike something just ignore it and do things your way" does not fix a problem.
The loot that drops from a boss belongs to the GROUP that killed the boss. Not to a single individual. I can't explain this any clearer. It's ****ing common sense. I understand that reserving is not breaking any specific rules, but maybe you should try to understand that when there's a single ICC group on the whole realm with "BoEs and primos reserver", things aren't very fun.
So, yeah, deal with it guys. Right? Right?
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Moderator
I still don't see what keeps you or any of the numerous people who have an issue with that from starting your own raids without item reservation then. As I already said, this is exactly like ganking. It's certainly not fun for the people getting ganked, but it's part of the game. People have to find their own way to handle it.
The loot doesn't belongs to the group. It belongs however the loot rules are defined at the beginning. That's why there are loot rules stated before a raid even starts. You join one fully aware how it will be distributed, including items the leader is reserving. What do you do when you don't agree with the loot rules, even when there aren't item reservations? Normally people just don't join something they don't agree with. People organizing something aren't forced to accept your terms, it works the other way around. Otherwise what would be next, people would want Staff to forcibly include someone in some top guild because they want in, but have been rejected... and you know how hard it is to join a top guild when you don't meet their requirements or disagree with their rules.
You can't depend on Staff to intervene with something that isn't against any rule or game mechanics, simply because you consider it unfair or dislike it. Fixing this "problem" might be up to the people who consider it a problem working together.
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Member
Since the loot belongs to the group, you would be okay with a hunter getting a cloth item to disenchant if he wins the roll, right? After all, the loot is as much his as the mage that needed the item.
Loot belongs how the leader chooses to distribute it. If it's such a big issue, make your own raid. You sarcastically state that "we raid leaders have such a hard time hurr", so I assume you find leading a raid easy. Why not lead your own raid, and have no reservations. Since everyone hates reserves, your raid will fill up much faster than the others.
