Well after few month's of playing here, I notice that damage of some class's is way to high then should be, especially arms and protection warriors and hunters with their chimera bug. I think in general, maybe something wrong with armor pentration script... what you guys think?
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Member
Wotlk Let's talk about warrior, hunter and warlock insane damage in PvP
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Member
Nothing wrong with the classes,it's resilience that's bugged.
To be more specific,the resilience to critical strikes.
You can have 0 resilience or 1200,the lava burst will still hit you basically the same (assuming it's a crit).
So,once again..it's not the classes that are bugged,it's the resilience.
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Member
indeed, it's not the classes but the spells.
Resilience also works fine, the problem is that some spells ignore resilience under some conditions. (that's a problem with the spell, not resilience.)
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Member
Just so you know OP, there's actually been just about zero irrefutable and reproduceable evidence that's been put forward about resilience being bugged.
Chimera Shot's double-dipping doesn't account for more than 10% or so extra Chimera Shot damage in most situations (I know how the berserker buffs and SotA are huge outliers, before people take the liberty to ***** about those). Hunters dominating damage meters in BG's is more a result of their class design than anything - they have a gcd-based playstyle revolving around non-cast gcd's and auto-attacks just like melee DPS do, but the ability to execute all of that from the safety of 41 yards away, a range even most casters have to close.
Warriors are also designed to be able to produce ridiculous amounts of damage on an enemy incompetent enough to allow a warrior to stay on him for an extended period of time, which in BG's on Molten you can count on there being plenty of. It's for this reason that, coupled with their healing debuff that's grossly powerful in WotLK, warriors were one of the most popular DPS specs in arenas, especially healer/dps 2's comps - something you should be able to confirm if you looked up the data on that from back in WotLK.
It's possible that Arp isn't working quite as it should, though. The issue's come up a few times over on the Trinity Core bugtracker, but at the end of the day there's been nothing in the way of a definitive conclusion as to what exactly the bug is.Edited: September 23, 2015
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Banned
The problem is not the warior and the warlock, it's the hunter in battlegrounds. More specific: hunters in full pve gear.
If you would play any other class in full pve gear, except ret paladins and rogues, you'll be as overpowered as the hunters but the problem is that you'll get wrecked in 1 2 3. Full pve hunters on the other hand still have alot of abilities to evade attacks while they crit the **** out of their targets. It has nothing to do with resilience or with the hunters, it's all about the hunter in full pve gear shooting you at max range with a group of enemies in between.
On the other hand, if you catch a full pve hunter, he's dead in 2 hits.
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Member
This fellow knows it. PvE-geared Hunter rocking BiS ilevel 284 Fal'inrush, STS, & DBW + 41 yard range talent + Pocket Healers + Dumb Horde on the enemy team is exactly the formula to wreck the damage meters in a BG.
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Banned
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=35030
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=19509
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=52788
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=75447
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=35099
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=53224
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=53246
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=70727
http://wotlk.openwow.com/spell=52858
Man, look at that "10%", I guess you're right, 10k chimera shots are just 1k higher, you're supposed to hit full resilience people for 9k, just like on Blackrock.
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Member
So you play a hybrid MM/BM/surv PvE/PvP spec with 100 talent points across all trees in battlegrounds? Interesting...
Edited: September 23, 2015
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Member
Hello again.
The following talents provide no double-dipping effect:
- Improved Tracking
- Rapid Killing
- Improved Steady Shot
- Marked for Death
Which leaves you with RWS (always present), Focused Fire (almost always present(, Ferocious Inspiration (this is a BM talent but Rets bring an equivalent buff - but bear in mind you're not always within 40 yards of a Ret), Culling the Herd (abysmal uptime in PVP that's borderline 0%, especially when your pet dies within 3 seconds of making it within melee range of an enemy target), and of course the 2P proc, which is rather notoriously powerful when it does proc, which in PVP is barely. My usage of the phrase "more than 10% or so double-dipping in most situations" evidently stands valid.Edited: September 23, 2015
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Member
People have a lot of gear here. There is no ilvl restriction in gear you equip (like on Blackrock aka Arena Tournament), and a lot of people here have BiS gear (which wasn't the case on retail, you'd have to be in a good PvE guild to acquire all the gear before wrath ended). Yes the classes you mentioned do a lot of damage, but same goes for any class in the game. Have you ever witnessed a ret pala with BiS gear and Shadowmourne? Well yea, trust me, the damage is disgusting. Elemental shamans do insane damage as well, lava burst crits can melt faces. And well, I can keep on giving examples, but I think you get the point. Any class can do ridiculous damage and basically kill you in about 2-3 seconds when they have the right procs.
"If everything is OP, then everything is balanced." - Some Wise Guy On The Internet
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Banned
You guys forget about the pet talent wich gives 10% extra attack power and has a 3 minute cooldown which refreshes when you mount up.
I'm talking about Call of the Wild. Which has a 5 minute cooldown, 3.5 as bm hunter. Increases melee and ranged attack power by 10% for 20 seconds.
Very overpowered in battlegrounds with this bug as a mm hunter. The cooldown resets when you mount up so actually you can have it up 24/7. Alot of hunters are aware of this bug and exploit it, which should be bannable but remains unpunished.Edited: September 23, 2015
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Banned
I love these desperate rationalizations from hunters, they remind me of priests back in the day. You don't even need to have all these talents double-dip, even though I'm seeing no proof that they don't. They amplify double-dip damage just like crits because the double dip portion of chimera shot's damage gets affected by the increase as well.
Edited: September 23, 2015
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Member
CotW/Furious Howl being as bugged as they are is probably the single greatest source of damage discrepancy between Warmane and Retail. When you use CotW each time, not only do you buff yourself, but you buff your entire party. Good news is this is already fixed on Lordaeron, so we know it's definitely going to be fixed when they do finally port over Lord scripts.
Making it bannable wouldn't be advised imo because a Hunter could've just used a Macro that went and automatically popped it inadvertently.
I never denied that Chimera Shot's double-dipping is certainly increasing its damage. I'm denying that in most situations it's as huge an advantage to Hunter damage as a lot of people seem to think it is, and anyone who thinks the damage of a full BiS PVE Hunter will change anywhere near significantly after its fix will be in for a delightfully rude shock. SotA and Berserking buffs will of course be less ridiculous, which is nice. Anyhow I'm not too keen on getting further into this discussion with you again. I mean you already got a thread closed in the past over it, and here you are again making a display of your being misinformed, and when told otherwise, you're asking ME to disprove a claim YOU are making. If you have a Hunter it should be easy enough to test for yourself. It doesn't double-dip off of everything that increases CS damage. Some other buffs CS doesn't double-dip off of are Hysteria, and Beast-Slaying (troll racial).
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Banned
Btw, MM hunter does also on Blackrock insane dmg and is usually topping the dmg charts.
On Blackrock they have even a instant travel form which increase their speed by 100% and makes it possible to escape from every combat situation. Its called Reindeer and gives hunter a ridiculous advantage over other classes.
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Banned
I never said you denied it, I said you're trying to downplay a significant bug as being not very significant by rationalizing it as an arbitrary 10% damage increase and being intentionally vague by saying this rectally-infused 10% only applies in most cases, basically making sure that whenever someone points out that it's not actually 10%, you can just point to that and go "HEY, I SAID MOST, DIDN'T I?" When this gets a proper fix, BiS PvE Hunter damage will be the one that gets hit the most so yes, you will notice a significant difference and so will the people you're shooting at. I'm suspecting the reason you think otherwise is because you don't actually have a point of reference for what non-broken hunter damage looks like.
Yeah, I never got what that was all about, that thread was great. And nobody is asking you to disprove anything because I never said all of those talents double dip but they might since there isn't proof one way or the other. I just said they enhance double dip damage much like crits do, which is obvious and in no need of proof. Any % increase to chimera shot also affects the extra double dip damage that shouldn't be there in the first place to benefit from the increase. It's not rocket science.
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