WotLK PvP - Libram swapping

[beskuit204]

Hello everyone I'm Scythewrath from Ragnaros and I am introducing this topic to hopefully open up new possibilities for retribution paladins.

Some of you might know that weapons/librams can be switched within the GCD (Global Cool Down) of spell, but not the other way around. Although when switching and item after using a spell will restart the GCD.
I have been experimenting with switching librams (Wrathful Gladiator's Libram of Justice & Libram of Three Truths) in pvp and so far it is quite hard to control and requires some concentration while doing pvp. But ideally the goal is to be able get the healing bonus from Wrathful Gladiator's Libram of Justice while maintaining the strength bonus of Libram of Three Truths without the worries of having the wrong libram at the right time.

So far I'm using Judgements to switch to Libram of Three Truths and Crusader strike to switch back to Wrathful Gladiator's Libram of Justice. So let’s take for instance this macro: (/cast Crusader Strike /equip Wrathful Gladiator's Libram of Justice). It does not prove useful when you are smashing your button and your enemy target is either "Too far away" or "Not in line of sight" since you'll end up wasting your GCD and gaining not gaining the intended libram bonus.

I went to do some research on macro commands that would work for this scenario and the /castsequence macro gave the most promising results. Thus: (/castsequence reset=Harm Crusader Strike, Libram of Three Truths) allows you to spam your buttons and the libram will only switch after the spell has been successfully used. The Minor downside is that you’ll have to press the macro again for the second command to commence. Thus this will create quite a delay in your fighting.

To conclude this, I hope that you understand what I’m trying to achieve through this topic and I would like to hear your opinions about this topic whether you think this would be beneficial or not? Maybe you have a better ideas on how to make this mechanic easier or better. If you know any solutions to make a macro that abides to the cast sequence without having to create extra GCD that would be GREAT! And please share it with us, as I would presume other fellow rets would appreciate it as much as I would.

Thanks.

[Sixtyninee]

I did this a couple years ago, it just takes A LOT of practice to be effective, but highly recommended for anyone who wants to add a bit more difficulty with a nice trade off.

EDIT: I think I was using a macro similar to this.

/equip Libram of Three Truths
/cast Crusader Strike

This macro will equip the libram on the first press and, from what I remember, the first line is ignored if you're already wearing the item so you'll attack.

EDIT2: It only takes a lot of practice if you aren't using macros, like I was, cause I had all my macro slots filled at first.

[Jakkre]

I went to do some research on macro commands that would work for this scenario and the /castsequence macro gave the most promising results. Thus: (/castsequence reset=Harm Crusader Strike, Libram of Three Truths) allows you to spam your buttons and the libram will only switch after the spell has been successfully used. The Minor downside is that you’ll have to press the macro again for the second command to commence. Thus this will create quite a delay in your fighting.

As far I know there are addons which make u able to execute abilitys on key press and release.
Means when u push and release a key it executes the key two times.
This should help u two execute ur castsequence macro twice in a single button smash.

Im not sure though if it is intended that u can switch librams in between GCD.
It might count as bug abusing.

[Lynea]

The gains you get out of this in pvp are extremely minimal, and generally not worth bothering with unless you have range on your target and you're unable to use exorcism/judgment/etc for whatever reason.

For those that may be wondering about this in pve, dont bother with it, it is a dps loss no matter how you try to set it up.

EDIT: I think I was using a macro similar to this.

/equip Libram of Three Truths
/cast Crusader Strike

You'll still have to press the macro twice, because switching librams invokes the GCD. So that doesn't solve his issue. In fact, to put it plainly, you cannot put a libram swap in a macro that also casts and ability that invokes the GCD and expect it to work with a single button press.

It's cleaner than using a castsequence macro, sure, since it doesn't require you to go through the libram part of the sequence if you just want to cast the Crusader Strike while the libram is already equipped. But that's all it improves upon.

[Sixtyninee]

As far I know there are addons which make u able to execute abilitys on key press and release.
Means when u push and release a key it executes the key two times.
This should help u two execute ur castsequence macro twice in a single button smash.

SnowFallKeypress is one example

[Jakkre]

I'm 99% sure that librams are counted with weapons and shields to be swappable in combat and off the GCD.

Ah u are right.
Arms warrior use simliar macros for swithcing to shield+spell reflect.

I just did some testing and came up with this macro:
/castsequence Crusader Strike, Libram of Three Truths, Crusader Strike,Libram of Valiance

When u spam this macro extremly fast it always switch the librams in between the global cd of Crusader Strike and u end up having both libram effects on u.
Using a addon which makes it able to executes a key on press and release should make the macro even better.

[Sixtyninee]

Ah u are right.
Arms warrior use simliar macros for swithcing to shield+spell reflect.

I just did some testing and came up with this macro:
/castsequence Crusader Strike, Libram of Three Truths, Crusader Strike,Libram of Valiance

When u spam this macro extremly fast it always switch the librams in between the global cd of Crusader Strike and u end up having both libram effects on u.
Using a addon which makes it able to executes a key on press and release should make the macro even better.

Yeah I just had a talk with Lynea about how this works. Apparently I was right about weapons and shields being off the GCD but not librams. Librams are switchable in combat but they were added to the GCD after TBC. So it's bugged in a beneficial way right now.

[Jakkre]

Yeah I just had a talk with Lynea about how this works. Apparently I was right about weapons and shields being off the GCD but not librams. Librams are switchable in combat but they were added to the GCD after TBC. So it's bugged in a beneficial way right now.

U mean it shouldnt be possible to switch a libram in between the GCD of a spell?

[Sixtyninee]

U mean it shouldnt be possible to switch a libram in between the GCD of a spell?

Yeah it's supposed to be effected by the GCD in the same way as abilities.

[Jakkre]

Yeah it's supposed to be effected by the GCD in the same way as abilities.

Do u have any source that confirms that?
I cant find much about it on google.

[Lynea]

U mean it shouldnt be possible to switch a libram in between the GCD of a spell?

Like I explained to 69, back in TBC, I had a libram for nearly every single one of my abilities. So did a lot of other paladins. Blizzard added the GCD to libram switching to prevent that shenanigans happening again in Wrath. Trying to bypass 'half' of a GCD like the OP is suggesting is an exploit (swapping the libram after the spell cast, which can skip the previous spell's GCD, but it will reset the GCD) -- it should interrupt casts, and should not be equippable during a GCD invoked by an instant cast. There is one exception, though. The GCD for swapping librams shouldn't be invoked when you are not in combat.

Do u have any source that confirms that?
I cant find much about it on google.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=libram+gcd

[Sixtyninee]

Do u have any source that confirms that?
I cant find much about it on google.

I'm trying to find official specifics right now, but all I can seem to find are forum posts around battlenet/wowhead/etc talking about it triggering a GCD when in combat. All dated wotlk+

[Aderes]

The last thing i remember when i tried this was that: swapping librams does not invoke a GCD if you are fighting a Target Dummy but it does when you are fighting a player.
Duno if this helps at all.
Also i think you should just make a macro like this and keybind it:

#showtooltip
/equip Libram of Three Truths;
/equip Wrathful Gladiator's Libram of Justice

the #showtooltip will tell you which libram you will equip if you press the macro.

[Lynea]

I'm trying to find official specifics right now, but all I can seem to find are forum posts around battlenet/wowhead/etc talking about it triggering a GCD when in combat. All dated wotlk+

It wasn't documented in the patch notes.

http://www.wowhead.com/forums&topic=...s-with-librams

[Jakkre]

Like I explained to 69, back in TBC, I had a libram for nearly every single one of my abilities. So did a lot of other paladins. Blizzard added the GCD to libram switching to prevent that shenanigans happening again in Wrath.

Yeah I know that librams trigger GCDs but that isnt my question.
The question is if its a bug that u can use librams in between the global cd of a spell and if it count as bug abusing to do it.

Trying to bypass 'half' of a GCD like the OP is suggesting is an exploit (swapping the libram after the spell cast, which can skip the previous spell's GCD, but it will reset the GCD)

How do u know that this counts as a exploit?
According to http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...swapping-macro its also on retail possible to switch librams in between GCD:
"heres something you can do the avoid that part of the GCD
if you mash the other libram macro while your still in GCD
it will not invoke an additional GCD"

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=libram+gcd

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=read+carefully