New core, HUGE pally nerf

[Funkymusic]

Yes, they did.

/sigh

they were middle of the road DPS on retail and used only to tank LK. other than that they were brought for 1 thing. Utility. they have amazing buffs and spells that 99% of molten refuses to use like salv sac ect. no ret ever topped any meter ever in WOTLK retail. if you think that then 1-you are on the best crack of all time 2 you never played retail 3 your are on the second best crack of all time

end

[Celila]

/sigh

they were middle of the road DPS on retail and used only to tank LK. other than that they were brought for 1 thing. Utility. they have amazing buffs and spells that 99% of molten refuses to use like salv sac ect. no ret ever topped any meter ever in WOTLK retail. if you think that then 1-you are on the best crack of all time 2 you never played retail 3 your are on the second best crack of all time

end

Disagree completely, now granted i wasn't in a top raiding guild in retail, so i played mostly with pugs and my guild whom never got past 4/12 HC, however with all the truth of my raiding ability laid out, I KNOW i saw them in the top 5, consistently in retail, and no one can tell me I didn't. i'll say that i might have just played with good ret's, but no need to insult sir. Friendly discussion.

[Kasumii]

Disagree completely, now granted i wasn't in a top raiding guild in retail, so i played mostly with pugs and my guild whom never got past 4/12 HC, however with all the truth of my raiding ability laid out, I KNOW i saw them in the top 5, consistently in retail, and no one can tell me I didn't. i'll say that i might have just played with good ret's, but no need to insult sir. Friendly discussion.

Top 5? I'm confused

My recall of top 5 classes when I was doing heroic 25 back in the day were:

* Hunters
* Unholy DKs
* Mages
* Kitty Druids
* Warlocks

That was my memory of guilds who were 11/12 or 12/12 HC. But what do I know.
These top 5 classes will shift from fight to fight but this is generally the pattern I saw on heroic LK.
Buffs depending sometimes boomers or warriors would break the top 5.

Edit: Confirmed from old world of logs that unholy DKs did more than frost DKs

[ally19]

try rolling mage or lock. completely unplayable.

[Kasumii]

try rolling mage or lock. completely unplayable.

Maybe it's not the class that's unplayable.

[Lynea]

Disagree completely, now granted i wasn't in a top raiding guild in retail, so i played mostly with pugs and my guild whom never got past 4/12 HC, however with all the truth of my raiding ability laid out, I KNOW i saw them in the top 5, consistently in retail, and no one can tell me I didn't. i'll say that i might have just played with good ret's, but no need to insult sir. Friendly discussion.

It's pretty easy to have that experience depending on the raid comp, gear level and skill level discrepancies in the raids you took part in. However, worldoflogs does not lie.

[romz]

Or Ret was fixed by retail standards....you know that is a possibility.

[hirlix]

In retail the top dps were rogue, warrior, feral and mage. noone came past those.

[Lindwurm]

So far i have only noticed 2 Paladin "nerfs" with this new core:

1. The cleave range on SoC got reduced by about 80%. Not sure how high the range is supposed to be, but it was definetly too high before the new core as it sometimes even hit people which were out of range of Judgement.

2.If you hit someone with Crusader Strike and an Auto Attack at the same time, SoC will only procc once.

[Lynea]

So far i have only noticed 2 Paladin "nerfs" with this new core:

1. The cleave range on SoC got reduced by about 80%. Not sure how high the range is supposed to be, but it was definetly too high before the new core as it sometimes even hit people which were out of range of Judgement.

Good.

2.If you hit someone with Crusader Strike and an Auto Attack at the same time, SoC will only procc once.

Sorry to tell you, but that's an old bug.

[toniplavna]

When rogues become 1st dps then core is ok.

[sarkasmuslol]

When rogues become 1st dps then core is ok.

this ^^
back in my retaildays rogs were top notch

[cebolenkosi]

Top 5? I'm confused

My recall of top 5 classes when I was doing heroic 25 back in the day were:

* Hunters
* Frost DKs
* Mages
* Kitty Druids
* Warlocks

That was my memory of guilds who were 11/12 or 12/12 HC. But what do I know.
These top 5 classes will shift from fight to fight but this is generally the pattern I saw on heroic LK.
Buffs depending sometimes boomers or warriors would break the top 5.

Yea you forgot Fury warriors, Combat and Assassination rogues these specs classes should pretty much up in the top 5 in fact a fury warrior should do more dps then a frost dk

[dike]

this ^^
back in my retaildays rogs were top notch

not after RS release kekeke

[asen70702]

If you're playing Ret because it did good DPS, I don't think you really have any business playing it in the first place. A Ret's strength was never meant to be its DPS.
A properly specced Ret brings 5 raid buffs just by attacking a target. Add in blessings, auras and hand abilities. That's what a Ret's role in a raid is for.

Why then paladin can carry Shadowmourne ?