WotLK FROST Death Knight PvE DPS Guide [3.3.5a]

[Beanlord]

Runes don't always have a 10 second CD. Your whole argument falls apart from there on.

[Muus]

a maximum of 10, ok, sometimes less, but take pestilence as example, you always end up refreshing your diseases between every 20s (two blood rune cycles)

you can call it 10s, 7.5s, banana, call however you want, im talking about rune cycles

instead of using 3 pair of runes (obliterate), and then using the long empty space for the fillers, put the fillers in between every pair of runes used, thats it.

killing machine is much more likely to appear in that interval than appearing 3 times in a row for each one of those frost strikes

If that is enough for you to understand what i meant, nowi recomend you to follow the tip of our friend and READ again the previous post

[Beanlord]

If you're using Kahories change the priority in the following way:
.
.
.
KM FS
OB
.
.
.

That would basically equate to what you're doing.

[Gnimo]

@Muus

It simply isnt worth it. Like, not even an extra FS after ERW with full procs and KM is also not worth doing... After u get 2/5 T10, Sigil and Arp Cap Obliterates does sooo much DMG, its insane. U want to do it as much as u posibly can in a fight, anything else over/delaying it is a DPS lost.
(Thats why i said prio rune usage and use runic power as a filler while u wait for CD)

It does look like that, if u think about it, 3x Obli > 3x FS should be the same as 3x (Obli > FS), but its not.
(Most of the time u will **** up Rune Grace Period timer and u most likely wont make it on time to refresh diseases with Pestilence aswell)

The 3x Obli > 3x FS spam is the rotation that will do most amount of Obliterates. The only spot in which u can slide in FS to maximise KM usage is arround/before Obli that uses Death Runes, thanks to RGP timer, cos it takes 1 gcd to cast Obli and 2 gcds to cast Pesti > BS, so u can use that "extra" gcd for it (care, FS gcd is a bit longer than Pestilence, just enough to lose Diseases if reckless)
(I said u can do both FS and HB, with HB beeing the safer way cos of its lower GCD - "Constant Rotation")

I dont know tbh, about the FS inbtwn Oblis idea, i remember trying to make it work, but i couldnt (aka, the one in the guide does more DPS)... if u made it work somehow pls do share, il be more than happy to both, update the guide and do more DPS myself. :D

P.S. On our last LoD no buff run, i noticed that u can (while having all Haste buffs - in a 25m raid grp) slip in 2 Howling Blasts in btwn 3 Obliterates ( obli > hb > obli > hb > obli ) and make it in a nick of time when it comes to Pestilence and Disease refresh, but only cos of its reduced GCD (sometimes i did 1 and/or no FSs after that just to make sure i dont lose diseases).

Note: this is only worth if u have to DPS/AoE the **** out of Valks and LK (3+ targets) and is only posible with lucky Rime/Freezing Fog procs.

[Muus]

now that you mention, there is more than only about the killing machine appearing more often, but the howling blast proc too, as the obliterates will have 1 gcd between each other aswell (and this gcd can be used as a howling blast if you please, instead of a fs)

you will not lose obliterates, you can use the moment right after the empower rune weapon to make it syncronised without losing any disease:

UA + BT, IT, PS, Obl, Pest
ERW (and then you have 6 runes to use including 2 deaths, but diseases at max duration)
Obl, FS/HB/Horn, Obl, FS/HB/Horn, Obl, FS/HB/Horn
(*the only obliterates you are ''delaying'' is this 3 initial obliterates that come right after ERW, but after that, its about using as soon as the runes are out of cooldown, which will hapen with a small inerval in between each, and this interval IS the best space for both FS-single target because of the killing machine being more likely to appear, or Howling Blast-aoe, because ALSO freezing frog can appear right after an obli, and as you HAVE now a gcd in between each, it can be used as a HB if you prefer, like VALKS)

the 2 gcds you mention for BS + Pest (or Pest + BS w/e) its fine though, because at some points, you starve runic power, and its not even about spaming runic power over runes anyway, there is a 130 runic power reserve, and on the pair of blood runes part of the rotation, there is no FS/HB/Horn right after the second obliterate/before the BS + Pest

[Muus]

anyway i think i made it kinda confusing, maybe i can be more clear typing somehow the rotation

ok so the start of i i mentioned until right after ERW, but here it is again:

unbreakable armor + blood tap
icy touch, plague strike
1 obliterate
pestilence

empower rune weapon


1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,

1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
1 obliterate,
1 blood strike + 1 pest

1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,

1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
1 obliterate,
1 blood strike + 1 pest

1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
(unbreakable armor + blood tap), 1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,

1 obliterate, 1 howling blast/frost strike/horn of winter,
1 obliterate,
1 blood strike + 1 pest

etc

[Muus]

about the blood strike or pest, which one i usually uses first, its the Blood strike: because if i screw up something on the rotation i can always anticipate the pestilence, and from that moment, i will have to do the pestilence first forever (one window for mistake)

but your idea considering miss/resist and to quickly use the 2nd blood rune to pestilence again sounds promising :P

[Muus]

even though looks like i am emphasizing the usage of runic power, i am aware that runic power stuff is secondary and burnign the runes as soon as they are out of cd is the top priority ofc, it does happen on that rotation of me, same as on yours.. im just using this topic to maybe help to improve something on the secondary priority aswell

btw this is my armory: another Full Str FDK

if you hate burize (squashed) for some reason, you probally hates me instead, he is one of many that played/learned along with me for quite a long time

[Muus]

i recomend to try it out how to maximize the Dual Target dps on all characters on some alliance city that have 2 dummies near by, not 3, not 1, but 2

when one masterize what is the best dual target rotation of your class, you will be masterizing the single target + cleaves part of your rotation, fundamental to clear Valks properly: the biggest water divisor between guild that farm lod and guilds that dont farm it, also many situations like Raging spirits , adds on lady, spikes near by, many kinds of trash mobs, adds on yogg +1 or +0, mimiron p3, anub arak & nerubian burrowers, twin valkyrs, baltharus...... those arent pure aoe, but single target + cleaves, and this rotation of me happens to be the best way to use howling blasts without losing obliterates (in between, always)

[Muus]

and single target wise, i also believe is the best becuase you not only use the same ammount of obliterates, but the frost strikes will crit more often with killing machine being more likely to proc alternating it

[Gnimo]

http://imgur.com/a/01Zkt
(First test, i failed to refresh diseases once, was too slow, thats why there are 2 ITs and no Pestilence miss/resist)
Itemisation should be on Armory, i used Arp Food to Cap it.

Rotation:
IT > PS > BT > Pesti > UA > Obli > ERW
Obli > FS > Obli > FS > Obli > FS > Obli > FS > Obli > HB > Pesti > BS > FS >
Obli > FS > Obli > HB > Obli > HB > Obli > FS > Obli > HB > Pesti > BS > FS >
...repeat...
(HB and FS are depending on Rime "Freezing Fog" proc, and Runic Power)

Rotation is perfectly posible on single target tank and spank fight, aka dummy, and it has no down sides i tought it will have.
Rotation will provide u with higher count on Frost Strikes and Howling Blasts, i almost lost Horn of Winter buff once (did not expect this to happen tbh, its a huge + for this rotation).
Crit % on Frost Strike was more or less the same, so it wont affect this part that much (its completely on RNG when it comes to KM, u cant do **** about this).


Overall, i like it.
Thanks for the Rotation, and the idea in general, i completely left it somewhere in the back of my head.
Will try to test it in the Raid Group and see how it goes there... :D


However, its NOT something i would recomend for a newcomer (newbie FDK thats learning the roots).
When u have to Stop DPSing for couple of sec, or switch targets, this rotation becomes a bit, lets call it tricky...
There are times when u can slide in Obli > FS > Obli > FS spam casualy after a swap to the new target, and there are times when u have to skip it for greater good and do 2x Obli instead, or some other shenanigans (will get to Obli > FS spam point again, but u need to be fast on some decision making).
Since most of FDKs out there dont ever think about "Greater Good" when it comes to DPS, again, i DO NOT suggest this for newbies.
When u master the one in the Guide, u can play with this one and try it out...


P.S. Its not that i dont like Vermin, i simply cant argue with someone who does not spec Blood Caked Blade cos he doesnt like it, even tho there are XXX profs its better to go for it than Subversion. :D

[Muus]

Thats why they did minor glyph of horn of winter, it is a must on 10 man where you are the only dk, else you drop horn of winter buff xD, i surprisingly use horn of winter buff every 3 min, 8 years have passed and i still hear ghostcrawler whispering the ways within

[Muus]

I mean, thr numbers are there for a reason: ice talons lasts exactly 20s, desolation from unholy also 20s, diseases are ment to be refreshed every 20s, blade barrier from blood, 10s pointing out thr change of behaviour regarding the usage of blood runes and many other things that are not explicit on the books

[Muus]

Squashed dont have and i didnt have blood caked blade because we are summer childs, i mean, we born and grow on old core, and back in the day, there was tripple dipping on frost strike, the frost damage from frost strikr is based on thr main physical part of it, so spells and buffs that increases damsge in %, used to increase thr physical main part, and just by that thr frost part was alredy increased, but thr frost part, was also separated benefiting from the damage increased aswell, bql bite for example was insane on frost dk, black ice, 2 points in chill of thr grave was the way, and your threat was god damn high so 3 in subversion was a must for the scumbags like us

[Muus]

Many good summer frost dk friends of me perished on new core: maddevil for example used to be very active in fade and didnt survive the winter. Some others changed to filthy unholy to "adapt". Im glad to see people getting interested on frost once again and guides like this support that spirit so much! Keep it up!