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Member
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Member
Hi. So I am a beginner dk tank on the frostmourne server.
Here is a link to my armory http://armory.warmane.com/character/...mourne/summary
So a few days ago I was trying to clear naxx 10 with my guild I was mainly off tanking since the other tank was better geared. However when we came to patchwerk I was told to hold aggro as the maintank should take the hateful strikes. The problem is he like 3 shot me before healers had a chance to react. He hit me three times for around 10k.
So my question is did I do anything wrong? I am def capped and I believe except upgrading legs and wrists to an epic ones from dungeons my gear is as good as it can be from dungeons. So do dks just suck as tanks early wrath? Any advice will be appricieted
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Member
You should be using "Anticipation" from unholy tree to boost your avoidance. Get your stamina enchants on legs, bracers to boost your health pool and death strike + rune tap heal value. Get your other missing enchants as well. You should be timing your death strikes and rune taps to counter health dips such as the one you've mentioned.
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Wind of Northrend
"Anticipation" wont save you lol, especially at that level of gear.
Download Atlas Loot, and check the Reputation factions, this goes for ALL DKs on Frostmourne, DPS and Tanks.
There are some nice 200 ilvl epics you can find there.
Farm A LOT of Gold, that can get you some BoEs or craftable items that will help you overall (same goes for DPS and Tank DKs).
Overall the idea is to get the BEST out of all that is offered outside of the raid before going in it.
I remember tanking Naxx 10m on RETAIL back in the days, my first item was tank shoulders from Anub'Rekhan, and that was not the state of the game with 3.3.5a talents, so you should have a better chance of tanking **** now.
Get the best gear out there, gem it, enchant it with best **** that is able at the moment on the server, and if you still get killed like a paper, maybe its skill that you are lacking.
The best would be to ask around the "best" guilds on the server (Frostmourne) now and see how they started and what they did, in context of "is DK a bad tank at this state of the game" (which should not be the case from what I personally think).
Just dont respec, talents are fine. :D
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Dargenslayer
At the moment in your gear and with your sigil activated, you are just shy of the defense cap. While this isn't the reason you died (you would have likely gotten one shot if patchwerk crit on you), it's defintely something to address. You'll be able to cap it by putting the shoulder inscription (either hodir or the pvp one, whichevers easier for you to get), the earthen leg armor enchant (resilience stamina), and perhaps the chest or gloves defense enchant. Additionally, maybe use defensive glyphs instead of DnD+Disease (I would recommend Icebound Fortitude and Vampiric Blood/Unbreakable Armor, depending on your spec - see below).
Second point, while your spec is great for endgame tanking in basically every tier, I believe it isnot the strongest in your current gear. Primarily, Vampiric blood and Will of the Necropolis are weaker talents the less HP you have. While I have no hard numbers comparing the talent specs for you, I had a lot of success tanking my first Naxx25 on the server as a frost-specced death knight tank. It has better pure mitigation talents (Frigid Dreadplate, Improved Frost Presence, Unbreakable Armor, and Guile of Gorefiend). Blood is widely considered the superior tanking spec in t10 because of the pure EHP it provides, and Frost was considered weaker as well because Unbreakable Armor overcaps your armor by quite a bit, making it a fairly weak defensive cooldown. At your current gear level, with your low total HP, the mitigation provided by frost seems at least to me to be superior. I would recommend a talent spec like this: https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#j0EMRchcoZhgxxmMIk00fzhh.
third point is the point thats been made by others above me: use your rune tap + death strikes to heal yourself more proactively, and make sure to always 2x blood boil before the fight starts to get blade barrier up, and lead with icy touch along with your taunt to proc your sigil.
This is my dk tank on frostmourne, feel free to message or mail me in game if you have questions:
http://armory.warmane.com/character/...mourne/profile
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Member
This guide is so bad, and new dks are going to get fooled by the attention this has gotten and by the fancy colors it has and pick retrded specs like dungeon hero spec and run round icy touching 1 or 2 mobs while the rest is killing the group, and I could write an extensive list of whats wrong in the spec and you would just argue against it and pretend you know more and its just futile, i mean u dont even know about the chilblains spec, u try to make blood a multi purpose spec by suggesting heart strike and glyph of death and decay, the unholy spec u made that u keep describing as **** (=bad) is a million times better than "dungeon hero spec" and is used for the same purpose, any talent tree you make the playstyle is the same for you "spam icy touch" no matter the situation, you even suggest plague strike glyph for tank like wtf, u dont know how certain abilities function, u recomend the use of death strike for aggro in one of your specs, u would rather take more blood boil damage over chance to reduce spell damage taken, u suggest the use of pet stun in a spec without master of ghouls talent, u talk about **** uve never tried before, you give more importance to raid buffs than the actual purpose of the specs, k rant over.
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Wind of Northrend
Those specs are just a suggestions, nothing else, and sadly, are still better than any other alternatives on these same forums.
I guess you can always make a better guide yourself. :)
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Member
Hey Gnimo, it's me again.
I just wanted to ask if PTS proc is valuable on dk ?
Generally experienced tanks don't want to rely on procs and dodge as a survival option in ICC. So they lean on the side of secure personal and external CD usage. I know that ICC has a dodge debuff, that tanks don't have one strict bis set-up, talent synergy, that trinket usage depends on fights etc. I understand all that. But I saw many DKs use it and I was just curious as to whether DK is a special case and benefits more from the proc than other tanks.
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Member
ICC debuff does not make dodge procs less valuable (its flat 20% reduced dodge chance, does not scale with the dodge ratting you have) And its not like procs are bad for tanks, its just that often times they can happen when you dont need them and fail you when you do. Which is less true about scale, because there is a clear trigger.
Trinkets are also thing of personal preference. - you pick 2 out of Scale, Organ, Satrinas scarab, Sindragosas Flawless fang. Difference between them especially on 30% buff is very small.
On fight like syndra/LK armor is very valuable, but effect on sindragosas fang is amazing for the resists, so almost always you take that and pick one armor trinket. PTS with increased armor and dodge proc, or Organ, with less armor, but stackable stamina buff.
Now you have to decide what is better for you.. cca 12% extra dodge for 10s after dropping down or stackable stamina buff? Or do you feel like you have enough armor and choose Satrinas for increased hp pool on demand?
I think that at least in 30% buff environment you are best off with PTS, because that extra dodge is more likely to save your life in a pitch than a bit of extra stamina/hp. And thats imho true for every tank. (but I could see valid reasoning for any combination of those trinkets... Organ is also a great choice - especially when you offank as it will be fully stacked entire ph1 and Satrinas provides you with increased hp pool which works against both physical and magic dmg)Edited: August 22, 2020
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Member
I know some time has passed, but take a look at that spec again. You have both Threat of Tharassian AND Two-Handed Weapon Specialization? I really would suggest putting points in Death Rune Mastery.
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Member
Hello, what about these talents https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#j0EMqIbI...xbtcMhk:pimmMz with minor Glyph of Death's Embrace instead of Raise Dead(my case). I find Lichborne talent to be very useful in dungeons for removing Fear or to prevent it from landing. For raids the talent is still useful as another self heal option. I also find 3/5 Killing Machine to be enough procing or if you want you can swap 1 point from Spell Deflection for 4/5 KM and another one from Deathchill for 5/5 KM, but i still think that my talents are better due to giving the player more options all around and again i find 3/5 KM to be enough.
Waiting for opinions. Cheers!
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Member
3/5 killing machine is fine, i also traded it for 2/5 glacier rot. Still not sure if it is proper way.
But as for me, i still have some doubts. Do u really have threat issues? Bloody vengeance i mean, 3% total dmg for tank is pretty low number. U can trade 2 points from it: 1 to spell deflection, 1 to anticipation. I think it is better option.
And my last suggestion (that i will be bullied alot for), heart strike is low dmg no threat modifiers, it is just a filler, and even double target stuff in numbers is pretty low. As for me it is not mandatory, and i traded it for extra1x anticipation. But yeah, i know, most of ppl will be not agree with that.
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Member
Well, 2/3(30%) Spell Deflection should be enough and Bloody Vengeance is 9%(stacks 3 times) not 3%, also Heart Strike (filler or no filler) is doing double demage compared to Bloody Strike for 1 point(na brainer here). And to answer your toughts: every demage you can buff will make you less spaming Icy Touch bot, giving you the room for proper CD use and more Death Strikes, also more demage from it too.
About Glacier Rot - Yes, good choice. Really strong option too and from my build you can trade it for -1 Lichborne, -1 Deathchill, -1 Spell Deflection and make it 3/3 Glacier Rot or 2/3 Spell Deflection and 2/3 Glacier Rot(this is probably how you play it).Edited: October 26, 2020
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Wind of Northrend
Lets call this: https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#j0EMqIhcsbobsZhg0xVMhzZ0b
"The avoidance talent build"
Lets call this: https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#j0EMqIbIcbobsoZhg0xVMcz
"The extra aggro talent build"
Anything in between works as well and is a personal preference.
Someone likes the 2% extra dodge and rng, someone likes little bit more aggro on from HS to greed for extra DS.
You wont ever die because you did not have 2% extra dodge, you wont lose aggro if you use BS instead of HS if you are doing IT with KM every time you have a proc.
You can also use something like this: https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#j0ERqIhccbobsZhg0xVMczZM
Point is, people try to "min-max" talent build for Blood DK tanks, while playing like trash, and think its the spec they are lacking.
If you master the play style, you will notice that any of these talents will work, and make your own personal build in the end.
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Member
Have almost same as last build, but 2x dodge instead of hit. lel.
And what are your thoughts about it. Is it idea to burst death and decay for aoe ?
Cause i wanted to try something like this: ignore expertise cap, gear till spell hit cap (with marro legs), improve imorbidity 3x3. The point was to hold aoe threat as dk (in terms of OP bis boys, not average pug run). Is it enough to hold aoe in bis? Or still warrior will take aoe threat. (we have enough frost dk dps-es here, to go without double buff).
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