Implement a Raid item level limit

[Grimsbane]

Maybe to keep all the raids alive and not just facepalm after a new patch with new raid is introduced i was wondering, maybe put an item level restriction on a raid. For instance, Karahzan - when a player has all equipment slots filled with Kara gear level it would have a item level of fully equipped kara gear, once he goes over that limit he wont be able to enter unless he equips the max item level gear again.
This imo would keep all expansion content alive even when all the expansion content is released.
What are your thoughts.

[taralej]

So basically you want timewalking on TBC. I don't see how that's gonna happen. TBC is neither the first nor the last expansion to suffer from such fate (wait, actually it's the first, but you get my point).

[Grimsbane]

No not timewalking, just a n item level restriction on each raid. So if you in full SWP gear you wouldnt be able to enter Kara in that gear

[taralej]

That would kinda make people either hoard low gear or do raids half-naked. I don't think there will be that many tanks who would want to re-live getting 1-shot on Prince, or destroyed by Nightbane, or hit for 18k crushing by Gruul etc etc. You get the idea.

Don't get me wrong, I love TBC PvE. But in all honesty, TBC PvE is about the journey. Those raids were novel and challenging, but they were challenging in a "bad way", so to say. That is, the challenge came from pure RNG instead of skill. I'm overgeared and Nightbane and Gruul still wipe the floor with me. Two melees + cleave on NB and you're dragon dessert, especially if one is crushing. Two melees in a row from Gruul >10 stacks and you're gronn goulash. No one likes that, and no one would want to replay that once they're over it. Tanks wouldn't want to become less tanky. DPSers wouldn't want to gimp themselves. Healers wouldn't want to sacrifice healing and mana regen and having to heal weak tanks again.

That's just my opinion.

[bigbazz]

Being able to gain power and to defeat old content more easily is the whole point of obtaining upgrades, you're basically asking Warmane to add some custom feature that has nothing to do with TBC and pretty much nobody wants. All your idea does is restricts people from content while trying to force them to play by your rules, let me tell you that the enjoyment of roflstomping content after progress is over is an important part of the fun for many people.

[Grimsbane]

I am asking for a custom i8dea because its a custom server. It also would keep the TBC content alive. If you just want to rolfstamp would we still be playing retail?

[shacramas]

Many people are collecting gear for their OS in Karazhan right now, your suggestion is bull**** OP.

[taralej]

It's not bull****. It's long-term oriented. Still, I don't see it happening. A very small part of the players would actually be happy about it. Most will just be frustrated by it, like the disabling of RDF on Lordaeron which many praised and then started hating, to the point where they actually moved to Icecrown for it when ICC was released simply because you lose 2 EoFs every single day that way and Lordaeron's "design" doesn't matter when both realms are at same content.

[bigbazz]

I am asking for a custom i8dea because its a custom server. It also would keep the TBC content alive. If you just want to rolfstamp would we still be playing retail?

Well retail is a different game, Retail starts out much much harder than TBC content but once you outgear it you roflstomp it even more than you do when you overgear TBC and then when new content comes out the old becomes effectively obsolete. TBC content is mostly easy fights being done with overly sensitive mechanics that are sometimes hard to judge from a visual standpoint, and a major component being threat, but it remains relevant almost the whole expansion as a ladder stepping stone.

A lot of the difficulty in TBC is bull**** mechanics anyway, a perfect example is Alar and the fire patches, the visible effect has little relation to the actual area of effect of the fire, you could be visibly safe but you'd die all the same. Retail on the other hand gives much more feedback (visible/audible) to the player that they can relate and react to directly, so while the content is harder and much more complex it's easier to "play" and react to in real time due to less guessing work being involved.

It's apples and oranges between the two. Karazhan is an easy raid, I've done my fair share of progression in Karazhan so when I do it now I want to do it quickly, and having gear restricted while in there as some sort of handicap is helping no-one, it's incentivising no-one.

[taralej]

I second that^. I've tried retail throughout the years, including Legion until 2 weeks ago. The PvE mechanics are not "easy". They are more visible, but they are a lot more complex and require actual coordination, unlike older expansions where half of the success depends on pure luck (will the infernal land on the melee group? will NB put fire under the tank? will Medivh cheat in the most disgusting way possible? will Gruul hit the tank 2 times in a row? will Lurker's adds target healers? will Moro tomb the off-tank?) where players have absolutely no control. If you're lucky, you'll kill the boss. If you're not lucky, you'll most likely wipe no matter how geared your group is. The fights where players DO have control tend to be completely straightforward (Aran, Illhoof, Magtheridon phase 2).