1. 3 Weeks Ago  

    Blood DK PvP mini-guide

    Greetings, Death Knights.

    Are you tired of the same old, boring Unholy playstyle and seeing mediocre crits that don't even faze your opponent? Is relying on gargoyle a fleeting strategy, especially since every half-decent player CCs it or simply blows it up in a matter of seconds? Is Frost lacking in survivability and is overall clunky in its rotation to you? Well, I've taken it upon myself to bring you salvation in the form of a small guide on Blood specialization that might just catch your attention and peak interest in a spec that is rarely played for one reason or another, but when mastered, undoubtedly delivers.

    A quick preface; I am entirely new to the concept of forums and decorating my post, so for now it will be extremely bare-bones, but I might come back to it later if it receives any attention. I also welcome all criticism and healthy discussion.

    Before we dive deep, let me point out somewhat obvious things. Blood starts scaling favorably to compete with Unholy at best-in-slot metagame, that is over 6k GS. I'll talk about gear later, but just acknowledge the fact that to outdo Unholy, you will need BiS armor penetration gear. Secondly, I acknowledge that Blood might not be as competitive of a spec in the arena as Unholy, it is more of a FUN spec for BGs and open world PvP. However, with a good partner, you could go far in arenas nevertheless. I personally played in BiS gear with a BiS arms warrior at over 2.2k rating on another private server I won't name. Thirdly, if you hate getting kited and can't bare with it, Blood is not for you. Frost mages, hunters and elemental shamans will cause you much trouble if they are worth their bread. This is just something that you have to accept as a Blood DK. With that said, nothing is stopping you from blowing up these targets in the short period of uptime that you have on them with Dancing Rune Weapon, Hysteria and Unholy presence... Clever and timed use of your cooldowns, with a bit of luck and literally just a few seconds of uptime could net you a victory. Heed my words however, a skilled frost mage with BiS gear will flat out destroy you without letting you touch them. You will also be snuffed out in half the fights where your diseases are dispelled, but only half because you still have the raw damage and self-healing to kill them.

    To begin with, I'll give you two specializations. (+glyphs included)

    https://truewow.org/talent-calculato...stMgxz0MZc:zGp

    Not much to be said here. This is a pure Blood spec with full burst capability. Align your Dancing Rune Weapon with Hysteria and attack damage procs, to wreak absolute havoc. This is the strongest burst combo of all the classes that can wield Shadowmourne. With this, I have often been able to burst down Holy Paladins, who you usually simply can't touch, even with high armor penetration percentages. This spec also has some dispel protection, but don't rely on it because if someone is hellbent on dispelling your diseases, they will be gone sooner or later. However, it can win you a fight against a Ret Paladin, I myself have seen this talent proc 2-3 times in a row against the aforementioned; the guy had to waste 3 or more global cooldowns on dispelling my diseases and simply fell behind on damage in the fight, eventually losing (that is, until he takes out his 1hander and shield).

    https://truewow.org/talent-calculato...bGMIpbd00z:Gzp

    Now here, is a little something extra, a hybrid that is suitable for arena, as it includes undispellable diseases and a controllable pet stun. I'm not a fan of this spec because pure blood does roughly 10% more damage, 20% if above 75% HP. However, you have a better chance at killing kiting specs with the pet stun. Generally, a hybrid is also quite strong in 1v1s.

    Now, let's talk about gear. I'll start with my build.

    I'm a blood elf (for the racial silence and dat ***), I roll with 6% hit, 75 spell penetration, 42% crit (self-buffed), 52% armor penetration and 1200 resilience. (Also 15% parry, 15% dodge)

    I personally have all these pieces below available, so I switch them out depending on what I'm fighting

    Head: WF
    Neck: Penumbra Pendant 284 armor pen+strength
    Shoulders: WF
    Back: 272 Garrosh's whatever strength hit rating / WF cloak of victory
    Chest: WF
    Bracers: Tuskk's Maximized whatever, 277 agility+armor pen wrists
    Hands: WF
    Waist: Astrylians Sutured Cynch, 277 agility armor pen belt / Coldwraith Links 277 str armor pen belt
    Legs: WF
    Boots: 284 Apocalypse's Advance hit rating str boots
    Ring 1: Might of Blight 277 str armor pen / sapphire whatever agility 277 armor pen ring
    Ring 2: Signet of Twilight 284 / agility icc rep proc ring (my first choice)
    Trinket 1: Sharpened Twilight Scale 284
    Trinket 2: Insignia / Deathbringer's Will 277 (if I'm feeling ballsy, with this I have 60%+ armor pen, or whenever I faction change to human)
    Weapon: Shadowmourne / Oathbinder 284 for more crit / WF Claymore 277 ( I equip this when I'm kited to take less damage, rarely to outlast tanky opponents)

    Agility, why? Because Blood is very crit reliant, we need to crit in order to put out dangerous levels of pressure. Don't forget that resilience lowers our crit chance. Our crit multipliers are what essentially lets us see crazy numbers. Also, agility gives us dodge which is quite handy against melees, it lets us use Rune Strike, which is the hardest hitting ability we have.

    Now, the never-ending question of "how much armor penetration"? I'll tell you this much, 50% does it for me as a blood elf. On BiS WF Warriors with around 900 resi, I get anywhere between 4k(with shield) to 7-8k crits with Hysteria when they have Smourne out. On Shamans, I get stable 4-5k crits, enough to pressure them into turtling and healing. Sure, the more armor penetration the better, especially since 90% of our damage as Blood comes from physical damage, but I feel like I've found the perfect middle ground between damage and survivability, for 1v1 at least. In BGs, 1200 resi is barely enough for taking on 2 geared people at once, but just enough to kill at least one foe if he is a melee. This is the amount of resi you want if you're gonna record flashy 1v3 or 1vx situations against scrubs.

    Onto some tactics now, friends. ( I will expand this section eventually )

    - ALWAYS kill the rogue that doesn't have evasion up first. While bursting, you will 3-4 shot a full geared rogue, or at least force them to stealth. The rogue is a glass cannon that has a lot of nasty CC. Same goes for mage, if you can reach them, lay the deeps onto them.
    -Always pick the softest target with the smallest health pool. With BiS and SM, you have a lot of damage on your hands, so don't waste it. In other words, play smart. Don't run in and start hitting that WF warrior who is in shield wall while there's a juicy 20k HP mage standing next to him, waiting to be 2-shotted.
    - Try to always hit your enemies in the back, I kid you not, I've had a mage DODGE my attacks 2 times in a row, quite frustrating.
    - Fight in blood presence. As soon as an enemy switches to you, go into frost presence. The only time you should ever be in unholy presence is against kiting classes (unless you are not their primary target) ; as soon as you are in melee zone, switch to UH presence (or earlier, if you are not being focused) and hit them with all the Death and Heart strikes you can until they immobilize you.
    -Don't overcap your Runic Power. Throw in a Death Coil unless it's a kity class, in that case you should maximize melee damage.
    -Try to stay above 75% health with rune tap, vampiric blood and death strikes in order to maintain your 10% damage boost from Blood-Gorged.

    1v1s

    -WARRIOR: Fight in frost presence. Pop burst right from the start, as well as Icebound, as that's when they will have all their procs, and to avoid charge/ intercept stuns. Nuke them into turtling and kite out their defensive cooldowns. Mark of blood their Bladestorm. Unless the warrior is a ****ing GOD among men, you should win if you are BiS.

    -PALADIN: I would suggest fighting in blood presence. Against a good ret, the odds are not in your favor. Unless you heavily outplay them, you will lose. And even then, they might bubble or bust out the 1 hander and shield. Try to catch the stun with Icebound or Antimagic shell. Use rune tap on cooldown. As soon as ( if, lol ) they pop wings, this is your chance. Pop Hysteria, DRW and pray for some crits, you have 30 seconds to kill them until they have bubble up. If they are dispelling your diseases, keep re-applying them mercilessly. Generally, if it's a paladin other than human that is switching out their weapons throughout the fight, it's a guaranteed loss. When popping mark of blood, instantly follow up with Strangulate so it does some healing before it's dispelled.

    -DK: You will mostly be facing Unholy. Don't let them kite you, if they are spamming chains of ice, do the same and sit tightly on them. If you have good uptime on them, armor penetration does its thing and you will outdps them. Kill the gargoyle as soon as it lands. Preferably keep the death grip for the garg. Keep the trinket for a freshly applied chains of ice, and instantly follow up with AMS to break distance between you. Generally, against the average Warmane DK, an easy win.

    -ROGUE: Wear resi gear. Trinket kidney shot and chains of ice them, RUN. Use rune tap on cooldown. Kite out their Evasion with chains of ice spam. If they cloak anything other than your mark of blood, you should win. Against a good rogue, you have NO room for error. Pop Icebound for when their Kidney shot comes off cooldown. Alternatively, you can choose to sit out their first kidney, to keep trinket for the second kidney or blind. I wouldn't recommend trinketing blind tho.

    -HUNTER: Spam chains of ice (unless pet freedom), break distance, lay the deeps. AMS their traps. You can Line of sight them, and heal off of their pet if they are stupid. Keep in mind, Rune Strike doesn't get deflected by their bubble ability, forgot the name.

    -MAGE: Fire and Arcane are somewhat killable. Death grip the blink, try to AMS nova, standard procedure. Fight in blood or unholy presence. Now Frost, just avoid them like the plague, in BGs and open world. If they are stupid enough to let you come near them, hit them with everything you've got with Hysteria and DRW. Pop AMS as soon as you are about to come into melee zone. When nova'd instantly pop icebound and while you're sitting the nova, you can pop Lichborne and self-heal.

    -PRIEST: Pretty straightforward, prioritize Death strike, heal off of them as much as you can, keep reapplying diseases if they are dispelled. Pop mark of blood and instantly follow up with Strangulate before it's dispelled. Lichborne the first fear, trinket the second. If the fight prolongs until the third fear, you lost, unless you are undead.

    -WARLOCK: Kill or be killed. Pop burst straight away. AMS as soon as possible, keep Deathgrip for when they teleport. When AMS ends, icebound to immune the stun. Keep trinket for Death Coil. Lichborne the fear. Basically, against a good, BiS lock, your lifespan is the duration of your Icebound, AMS and Lichborne. You have roughly 10 seconds to burst down the lock in Blood or Unholy presence, or you die.

    -DRUID: Ferals are nasty with their dodges. Dodges alone will get you killed because they'll keep dodging your death strikes. Trinket cyclone, Strangulate or Deathgrip when they kite away to heal. I would suggest instantly trinketing their first stun and popping burst. AMS their roots buff or incoming cyclone IF they are low health. If they got a restealth out of a cyclone with your dot up, spam Icebound so they don't get the opener stun. Generally, against a good feral, the fight will be prolonged and you will eventually lose, unless they don't do enough damage to outdps your self-healing.

    -ELE SHAMAN + Moonkins are tricky. If it's a good one, you will lose. AMS their roots self-buff, or AMS their starfall, if no ams then icebound their starfall. Grip them at max range. Strangulate them when they hardcast heals. If you have any uptime though, you can burst them down. Ele shamans pretty much follow the same logic. Deathgrip or AMS their Lava burst. Higher chances of beating a boomkin than a good ele sham.

    Enhancement shaman goes down like a sack of ****e. Fite in frost presence. You won't be healing with death strikes because of disease dispel totems, so literally just use rune tap on cooldown, pop hysteria + DRW and kill him with DS + HS spam. The best I've ever seen an enh sham do vs me is bring me down to 50% health and it was a shammy with a bloody 2-HANDER :D. Try not to get your mark of blood grounded.

    ARENA

    Go with an Arms Warrior or Combat Rogue. Literally just tunnel vision one target with the healing debuff. If you are both BiS, you can even kill a plate target with a healer if the rogue plays his cards right. With a warrior, you literally run in and kill or die. Hunter works too, however you will have to peel for your hunter as opposed to the mongoloid mindset of just tunneling a target.

    CONCLUSION

    All in all, as a Blood DK the way I roll it, I see it as essentially becoming a warrior without the healing reduction, but with good self- healing. Pretty good for solo play, lone wolf kind of playstyle. As opposed to an Unholy DK that has to kite other melee classes (like a *****) , you are the one chasing people because you deliver quite some pain in melee encounters. I would recommend this build to anyone who is bored of unholy and wants to pwn some faces like a real man. I personally feel that because Shadowmourne has armor penetration on it, in theorycraft, Blood is the ultimate meta spec to roll in 3.3.5a, and it can do wonders when coupled with a healer or a healing reduction DPS. I've played this for about 2-3 years now and I have to say Blood is the most exciting spec of all the DK specs. And wait until you queue into some green-geared plebs in BGs, you will truly feel like a hero class raidboss ;)

  2. 3 Weeks Ago  
    Everything OK,you played on the other server nice - guide is o okay but you could say more about best setups/counters etc.
    And why take drw if it's bugged ? Kappa.
    https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/20643
    "Note that I used drw after dbw,sts,fallen crusader procs + on bloody vengeance stacks with hysteria.
    https://imgur.com/a/tQaRJ 3 DRW DS crits 5.2k - 5.5k
    https://imgur.com/a/EbJC9 3 DS crits (DK) 17.3 -23.2k"

  3. 3 Weeks Ago  
    I highly recommend taking Unholy Blight over DRW if you're planning on PvP-ing as Blood. If you don't, you just make the already large pool of classes that consider you a free kill even larger. I also recommend taking Desecration to improve your stickiness, which is your main weakness.

    Align your Dancing Rune Weapon with Hysteria and attack damage procs, to wreak absolute havoc. This is the strongest burst combo of all the classes that can wield Shadowmourne.
    That's not really true. Both Paladin and Warrior can burst for very similar amounts but the paladin also ignores 50% damage reduction and the warrior makes it harder to recover with 50% healing reduction. Blood has neither which makes its burst very easy to negate with either a simple use of a cd or just raw healing output.

    All in all, as a Blood DK the way I roll it, I see it as essentially becoming a warrior without the healing reduction, but with good self- healing.
    I like this comparison. A warrior without healing reduction and no double gap closer is basically useless against anything that can heal or kite or very commonly both, much like Blood DKs.

    you are the one chasing people because you deliver quite some pain in melee encounters.
    Well, no. You're the one chasing people because you have the mobility of a kid in a wheelchair and they find it much easier to just walk around you.

    I know it sounds like I'm trash talking Blood DKs in PvP but that's because I am. Unholy not only has better and more consistent damage but it also has much better survivability against casters, the thing that will be doing the most damage to you. Don't let me discourage you from getting BiS arp gear that you can't use with any other spec and trying Blood though.

    Good duel guide btw.

  4. 2 Weeks Ago  
    Unholy is better for pvp here are the reasons:

    1st option unholy dk
    gargoyle : here you need to cc gargoyle or dk and even if you cc one the other one is hitting you so you deal more pressure + as unholy you have undispellable + desecration is slowing in the area second player + you have ghoul hitting and stunning.
    2nd option blood dk
    bursting hysteria +drw : with drw disarm = 10 seconds for dk drw without glyph = 12 seconds = no damage whatsoever or cc/kite dk,
    as blood you damage yourself with hysteria.
    your drw deals 25% instead of 50% (at least if you have arp you can easily see this) on this server so you dont have so much burst.

    Conclusion : blood is fun spec and can be playable in pvp but is worse than unholy, can be ok on lower ratings with WORKING(which actually is not)DRW to burst somebody, or more as tanky with unholy blight + dps with hard cc, can be very good in duel 1 vs 1 with unholy blight (maybe even better than unholy),and propably worse on bg since you most likely will spread diseases as unholy.

    @damnoriginal keep in mind his advice was to take glyph of heart strike which is undispellable slow so if he actually hits this heart strike running from him would be slightly more difficult as a melee, atleast in 1 vs1 situation.
    Edited: 2 Weeks Ago

  5. 2 Weeks Ago  
    @damnoriginal keep in mind his advice was to take glyph of heart strike which is undispellable slow so if he actually hits this heart strike running from him would be slightly more difficult as a melee, atleast in 1 vs1 situation.
    You already hard counter 90% of all melee specs and you're still gonna get kited by ranged. Unholy is sticky because it spams Desecration by just doing its damage, which is the best slow in the game. If Blood picks Desecration, it has to choose between doing damage or slowing, which is much worse but still good enough for fights where you care more about staying on target than damage. For "optimal performance" you want both Heart Strike glyph and Desecration, so you can apply some sort of cancerous slow with every single rune.
    Edited: 2 Weeks Ago

  6. 2 Weeks Ago  
    My guide is still far from finished, I'll make sure to edit and improve it later.

    I didn't know that DRW was bugged, so in that case, I'd have to agree with DamnOriginal and run with an Unholy Blight build. But I kind of disagree with some of your points, my dudes.

    @DamnOriginal

    Yes, a warrior's healing reduction is vital, but they don't deal the same damage as you do with Hysteria+ Blood Presence. A paladin might match your burst with wings and if you don't take DRW, but you have your whole DK toolkit to support your burst. Strangulate the healer, or Deathgrip+ Mindfreeze him and keep bursting. I also just can't see a Blood DK with Desecration, you'd be going too deep into Unholy. Besides, chains of ice is a better slow than Desecration.

    Doesn't Unholy have the same mobility as Blood, depending on that one talent that decreases Deathgrip CD by 10 seconds? You can take that talent as a Blood DK too, I'll add an additional build with it later. I agree with you wholly on the fact that Unholy has better ranged damage and is more suited towards fighting casters, but Blood surpasses Unholy in melee. A perfect example of this is a fight between a Blood and Unholy DK. If the Unholy DK doesn't try to kite and goes toe to toe with Blood, they pretty much lose, in my experience. Also, Blood stomps 90% of all warriors in melee, while an Unholy DK would have to kite the whole duel, rarely going in to refresh diseases and Deathstrike/ Scourgestrike. This sums up the division between the two specs: Blood does more damage in melee, Unholy has better sustained damage.

    @trackerone

    Thanks for pointing out that DRW doesn't work, hope they fix it in the future, it's unbelievable that the expansion is a decade old and they still haven't...
    I will be repeating myself, but Unholy and Blood are good at different things. Blood, however, given 100% uptime on a target in melee, will outdo Unholy. It has stronger tunnelling melee damage with high armor penetration values. I agree with you though, if you wanna get all serious about PvP and go arenas, Unholy is the way to go. However, I would contest your opinion that Unholy is better in BGs, it simply depends on who you fight and how you fight. If nobody is focusing you and letting you sit on squishy targets, I'm sure Blood can outDPS Unholy.

  7. 2 Weeks Ago  
    @DamnOriginal

    Yes, a warrior's healing reduction is vital, but they don't deal the same damage as you do with Hysteria+ Blood Presence. A paladin might match your burst with wings and if you don't take DRW, but you have your whole DK toolkit to support your burst. Strangulate the healer, or Deathgrip+ Mindfreeze him and keep bursting. I also just can't see a Blood DK with Desecration, you'd be going too deep into Unholy. Besides, chains of ice is a better slow than Desecration.

    Doesn't Unholy have the same mobility as Blood, depending on that one talent that decreases Deathgrip CD by 10 seconds? You can take that talent as a Blood DK too, I'll add an additional build with it later. I agree with you wholly on the fact that Unholy has better ranged damage and is more suited towards fighting casters, but Blood surpasses Unholy in melee. A perfect example of this is a fight between a Blood and Unholy DK. If the Unholy DK doesn't try to kite and goes toe to toe with Blood, they pretty much lose, in my experience. Also, Blood stomps 90% of all warriors in melee, while an Unholy DK would have to kite the whole duel, rarely going in to refresh diseases and Deathstrike/ Scourgestrike. This sums up the division between the two specs: Blood does more damage in melee, Unholy has better sustained damage.
    I might agree with warrior and only in terms of the damage component of their burst, the overall effectiveness of warrior burst is just better due to healing debuff. Paladins have both more burst and their burst also ignores damage reduction.

    As for Desecration, it's the best slow in the game when used by Unholy, as half of your damage procs it and you can't dispel/shapeshift/fade out of it. With Blood, the only way for you to proc it is Plague Strike and you're not gonna be doing any damage while spamming Plague Strike, this is the main reason Blood is terrible at sticking to targets and Unholy so good, it's the synergy with Desecration, not the death grip talent. Nevertheless, it can still be useful for sticking to a target when you're fighting a class where uptime is more important than damage, like anything that can't heal.

    The fact that Blood puts its eggs in one basket is the reason it's bad in PvP. Unlike Unholy, which can adapt to most situations, Blood is either good or trash, no in between, which reduces its complexity to a coin flip. Is it melee? Free win. Is it anything that can kite? I guess I'll go make a sandwich.

  8. 2 Weeks Ago  
    DRW not working, so blood on warmeme is just ******ed sustain spec in pvp without real burst. So your guide is usless coz 50-0-21 is for vegetables who dont know what playstile bdk must have.
    Dk retail multiglad.

  9. 2 Weeks Ago  
    Blood DK even with working DRW would still be useless in both PvP and PvE.
    Common sence.

    Its a "fun spec to play", nothing else. :D

  10. 2 Weeks Ago  
    Blood usless in 2v2, but OK for tsg and rdwdk, and realy good in bg and 1v1 if you are skilled enough (and have ing+alch (fap, fap makes bdk realy good in duels)).

  11. 2 Weeks Ago  
    DRW not working, so blood on warmeme is just ******ed sustain spec in pvp without real burst. So your guide is usless coz 50-0-21 is for vegetables who dont know what playstile bdk must have.
    Dk retail multiglad.
    Blood usless in 2v2, but OK for tsg and rdwdk, and realy good in bg and 1v1 if you are skilled enough (and have ing+alch (fap, fap makes bdk realy good in duels)).
    Your profile picture completes this masterpiece.

  12. 2 Weeks Ago  
    ye-ye-ye, but in times when i have 2700 in 3v3 u was 1500, if u even play in retail.
    funny privet server ligic lil.
    I will make its even funnyer - heroic bryn is best weapon for bdk in pvp, bettr just shm. Thred

  13. 1 Week Ago  
    A fun little build:
    https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#jfV...fMGI0bdMbz:bqL
    It involves all the blood stuff with a strong DS paired with a strong DC, a pet and instead of HS you spam PS for the desecration procs and talents which strenghten in + PS glyph. Havent really tried it but theoretically should be fun.

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