WotLK human double trinket advantage pvp

[Jakkre]

Blizzard wants to sell the game. As you exemplify, calling PvP by its proper nomenclature makes people throw fits, as if liking a side-activity was some personal insult to one's honor. It's just logical that they won't to avoid such reactions.

And now u'll tell me that it wasn't meant as a hidden insult towards pvpers from your side while in fact that was the whole intention of ur post.

[DamnOriginal]

What you do in the game doesn't changes what the game offers. You choosing to only play PvP makes it your main activity, but it remains a side-activty for the whole of WoW content. You're trying to argue that your opinion and personal preference dictate the content the game offers, like if closing your eyes and yelling "THERE'S ONLY PVP THERE'S ONLY PVP" would make the massively larger portion of the game laid on PvE content go away.

PvP and PvE are the two sides of this game regardless of which one has more content. Both are viable ways to play this game and both have sizable amounts of people behind them, even if PvE has more. You're suffering from a fundamental failure to differentiate between your own personal feelings on PvP and what PvP actually is.

And yet again I say: if I could sell irony, I'd have hit another motherload.

Maybe if you stopped arguing that it's gold, you'd have a much easier time selling it.

Blizzard wants to sell the game. As you exemplify, calling PvP by its proper nomenclature makes people throw fits, as if liking a side-activity was some personal insult to one's honor.

See, I don't know why you're still trying to sell this point that anyone is upset over your opinions on PvP. It's the part where you keep repeating that your opinion is fact when it's not based on anything but your own feelings that bothers me and I imagine anyone else that doesn't really share your opinion. The irony is that you're the one who is acting like calling your opinion just an another opinion and not the golden truth is somehow an insult to your honor.

[Obnoxious]

And now u'll tell me that it wasn't meant as a hidden insult towards pvpers from your side while in fact that was the whole intention of ur post.

The fact you take it as an insult speaks about you, not about what I said or my intentions.



Still, this is like watching people claim their personal "identification" overrides biological facts, that biological facts are an opinion, and that their preferred "gender" is real, so I'll just leave delusion to those who crave it.

Just don't forget, to stick to the topic: Every Man for Himself is going nowhere.

[DamnOriginal]

Still, this is like watching people claim their personal "identification" overrides biological facts, that biological facts are an opinion, and that their preferred "gender" is real, so I'll just leave delusion to those who crave it.

*tips fedora graciously and teleports to a more enlightened state of being"

Just don't forget, to stick to the topic: Every Man for Himself is going nowhere.

If that's the case then so is Icecrown's PvP scene. Let's hope you're wrong as usual.

[Jakkre]

The fact you take it as an insult speaks about you, not about what I said or my intentions.

I don't take that as an insult but I can see how some other ppl do.

What bothers me is that u constantly put ur opinion over others and claim that it would be a fact.
DamnOriginal brought it to the point and I can only agree with him.

[Drunkuser]

Forgive my ignorance, Obnoxious are you a forum moderator or a Staff member? I mean is that your personal opinion or the Staff decision?

[Obnoxious]

Forgive my ignorance, Obnoxious are you a forum moderator or a Staff member? I mean is that your personal opinion or the Staff decision?

Forum Staff are Staff members. If you mean regarding Every Man for Himself, no, that's not a personal opinion. The racial isn't going to change. We don't do custom changes of that sort. Had this been in the Suggestions section, it would have been denied at the first post. If you want further confirmation it isn't just my personal opinion, Mercy said the same pages ago:

You won't be seeing any custom changes to racials, so it doesn't matter much.
(...)
Talking about "solutions" isn't necessary because, again, custom changes to the racials won't happen.

[Meowto]

Pvp is a side-activity of wow on retail, not on private servers. ICC is 9 years old now, woltk pve (as in raids) is super outdated. There are guides to everything, theres very little to discover, nothing to strife for. You get BiS and the endgame is over, pretty much. Theres still a ton to do because its wow, but the real pve (i.e the raids) really isnt the main attraction of private servers wow. Its the experience of old wow (i.e the leveling, the gearing, etc) and the pvp (and the not being able to afford proper wow because you are from albania or something) that draws people.

And yes, more people pve then pvp. But thats because every pvper (that isnt BiS via donations) has to pve at least somewhat, for trinkets at the very least. (but not every pve-er has to pvp)



You can only really consider PVE the main activity on servers that are constantly moving forwards and that need new content. Pvp just needs other people to play.




That said, emfh is fine in the game and a custom change wouldnt achieve anything. If anything enable the double agent feature from wod if horde pvp dies completely.

[DamnOriginal]

That said, emfh is fine in the game and a custom change wouldnt achieve anything.

What are you even basing this on? We know 90% of Alliance PvPers are human and we know most PvPers go Alliance because they have no other competitive choice. How is no choice and piss poor faction balance in PvP fine with top 50 ladder teams in all active brackets being 80-90% Alliance? Why wouldn't a custom change to EMFH achieve anything when it's clear that EMFH is the primary cause of these issues?

[KomodoV01]

>human racial, primary cause of pvp imbalance
>no other competetive choice
yikes. this is so far from true.

[DamnOriginal]

>human racial, primary cause of pvp imbalance
>no other competetive choice
yikes. this is so far from true.

Until you present any actual argumentation, you're not saying anything. Can you name one racial that comes even close to competing with EMFH? Can you explain why the arena ladder almost exclusively consists of humans with double PvE trinkets? I'm all ears.

[Meowto]

What are you even basing this on? We know 90% of Alliance PvPers are human and we know most PvPers go Alliance because they have no other competitive choice. How is no choice and piss poor faction balance in PvP fine with top 50 ladder teams in all active brackets being 80-90% Alliance? Why wouldn't a custom change to EMFH achieve anything when it's clear that EMFH is the primary cause of these issues?

Because one racial always will be better then the others, so all pvpers will eventually end up on that faction. And people will then roll on that faction because its easier to get queues there and the best racial is there. And if all racials were equal people would still end up on one side just to find people to play with.


Look at retail over the ages for an example.

[DamnOriginal]

Because one racial always will be better then the others, so all pvpers will eventually end up on that faction. And people will then roll on that faction because its easier to get queues there and the best racial is there. And if all racials were equal people would still end up on one side just to find people to play with.


Look at retail over the ages for an example.

What racial will suddenly take the place of EMFH as the best possible PvP racial for any scenario and class? The answer is none because EMFH is the only racial like that. There is no other racial in the game that provides 15 times the bonuses of other equivalent racials with added customization on top, regardless of what you're fighting or what class you're playing. Is Wotf the best choice vs everything? No, it's only good vs classes with fear. Is Arcane Torrent? Not against non casters. War Stomp? Cast time and DR. Bloodfury? Literally EMFH but 15 times weaker. Shadowmeld? Needs actual skill and timing to be useful. Stoneform? Good only against classes with heavy bleeds/poison/disease.

Every other racial has scenarios where it's good and where it isn't. EMFH doesn't, it's not only ridiculously better than other racials but it's also consistently the best choice for every single possible scenario you can think of. This is why after 10 years, PvPers know to roll human if they want to PvP and this creates the terrible PvP balance on Icecrown. It's time to stop lying through your teeth and take a look at the Outland spread of races to get an idea of what a no EMFH meta would look like. It's not 90% dominated by 1 race because no 1 race has a racial that is the best for everything.

[KomodoV01]

wotf is really strong
orc tenacity is huge, bloodfury is also really big since you can choose when to use it and its a guaranteed ap buff instead of the 66% of kmS that dbw has.
"15 times weaker" ****ing rofl

[DamnOriginal]

wotf is really strong
orc tenacity is huge, bloodfury is also really big since you can choose when to use it and its a guaranteed ap buff instead of the 66% of kmS that dbw has.
"15 times weaker" ****ing rofl

WotF is only usable against 3 classes and shares a 45 second cooldown with the PvP trinket which means it's only relevant in some situations. Not even close to EMFH, which is the best choice against every single class, for every single class, in every single situation, with the added benefit of choosing whether you want a defensive bonus or an offensive one.

I'm assuming you're talking about the orc racial Hardiness when you say tenacity, which isn't anywhere as big as you might think because it's not only a small percentage on a single type of CC but it's also subject to diminishing returns of talents and meta sockets, which usually means that instead of 15%, it averages around 10%. This came up in a different thread but if you actually took a look at the meta sockets the top warriors use on Icecrown and Blackrock, you will notice that they almost exclusively go for 3% crit, not 10% stun reduction, which should give you an idea of how much more impact damage has over the falsely perceived impact of this racial. If there's anything EMFH gives you, it's flexibility and damage.

As for Bloodfury, read what I wrote on page one and feel stupid:

Compare 700str/haste/crit for 30 secs on a 90 sec cd to the next best alternative for other races, which is 322 AP (the equivalent of 160 strength) for 15 secs on a 120 sec cd. Not only is every single variation of the proc offering you more than 4 times the stats but it also has double the duration and 25% less cd, or around 10 times more stats over the same period of time, even when you adjust the stat weights for crit/haste, it's still over 5 times better. Comparing procs with a single stat gives us a much clearer showcase of how stupidly broken this racial is. DFO proc is around 300 SP/sec, Blood Fury is 20 SP (15 times worse), Berserking is 36 haste (8 times worse). We're talking a racial that offers a cd that is 8-15 times better than anything any other race can offer and this is without even taking into account the flexibility it gives you with different trinkets and the increase in passive stats.

The conclusion that EMFH is 8-15 times better than other, similar racials is based on a simple number comparison between end game PvE trinkets and other racials that even a 12 year old should be able to understand, which is why I have the utmost confidence that you'll manage. It's also accurately reflected by the overwhelming representation of humans at the highest ranks on all active ladders, which is also ludicrously higher than any other race.