In regards to a recent topic, this post is to summarize the factual evidence to discredit any claims by the EU to be superior gamers to the US or most of NA. In fact, reporting would insist quite the opposite.
https://www.esportsearnings.com/countries
http://www.xygaming.com/content/high...rts-countries/
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...rts-countries/
https://www.therichest.com/sports/ot...s-best-gamers/
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...nue-countries/
Sorry, EU.
The conversation to me, quite frankly, would more or less in reality be an argument such as this:
South Korea v China v Germany v Canada v United States v Denmark v Sweden v Japan
As far as I know, outside of those countries, majority of gaming is irrelevant.
-- following edited and posted again to deter duplicates of subject --
Edit:
inb4 imports -
So from:
https://www.esportsearnings.com/teams
The top two teams:
https://www.esportsearnings.com/teams/102-team-liquid
https://www.esportsearnings.com/teams/101-evil-geniuses
The US:
In the #1 team we're #6 by 7%.
In the #2 team we're #1 by 39%
Looks like you import =\
Edit:
Inb4 Specializations -
https://www.esportsearnings.com/games/231-dota-2
3 out of the top 10 for dota2 are american
https://www.esportsearnings.com/game...obal-offensive
Sweden doesn't even dominate CSGO anymore, Brasil does (yay SA?)
https://www.esportsearnings.com/game...raft-brood-war
https://www.esportsearnings.com/games/151-starcraft-ii
Korea wrecked us all in BW/SC2
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League...d_Championship
Korea wrecked us all in LoL
https://www.esportsearnings.com/countries/us
America won practically everything ever made on a console
https://www.esportsearnings.com/game...es-of-warcraft
China, US and Ukraine dominate Hearthstone
https://www.esportsearnings.com/game...ld-of-warcraft
EU beats US 6-4 in WoW Arena
https://www.method.gg/raid-history/vanilla
Slight EU lead in WoW PvE
Edit:
inb4 history -
https://www.esportsearnings.com/leag...ames/countries
Edit:
inb4 population -
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...-video-gamers/
p.s.
lulz point, but the U.S. companies also own majority of the gaming industry, i mean, obviously. I mean between Blizzard, Valve, EA, Riot, Activision, etc. as well as their streaming devices such as Youtube, Twitch, etc. friendly reminder ecks dee
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Member
NA v EU gaming?
Edited: April 6, 2018
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Member
And what exactly does any of this have to do with Outland?
Secondly, there are several issues with these articles. For what do they wish to measure? Earnings? Earnings for the gaming industry? Individual performance? etc.
The debate about best gaming country/people is probably never going to end, for there are good players all around the world.
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Member
It was a response to an attempt to indicate that the majority of what I say (be it in Global, here, or otherwise) is some random attempt to troll any reader for the sake of, i don't know, my own amusement.
More than likely, and I think quite probably, the response is typical: I find generally when people do not like what you have to say, whether it be factual or otherwise, they generally cover their ears and start yelling.
I'd also said things such as one should typically review arenajunkies, ownedcore, and/or elitistjerks when referencing this version of the game as those were the best players to play it (then and since), that the game as a whole had evolved quite a bit since this iteration of it (as do all games, honestly), and thus have the players. No, I do not think these are the best players to play WoW, but I doubt anyone discovered some scripted mathematical mystery ten years after the fact that was lying in secret code all this time. They ran the numbers, they did the tests.
Most of that has been attempted to be disputed with me time and time again, which I think is kind of funny, the most amusing of which to be the attempt to argue that both the content and average player skill isn't incredibly higher today than it was during this version. I mean, were you to try to link achievements in TBC for PvE or PvP you'd be simply laughed at, not because world first is something to laugh at or server first or Gladiator but simply because they do not apply in 2018.
One of the main reasons well at least from a PvP standpoint and a HUGE reason for this game in fact until quite recently honestly was the sheer reality that only a few participants out of the majority of participants as far as PvP was concerned were playing anywhere near a fair and level playing field which proved to be a HUGE differential years later as many a 'Glad' from, well, pre-normalization couldn't break 2k post normalization and it's practically a meme today (same with what HWL/GM became in TBC/WotLK).
From a PvE standpoint, there was an entirely artificial (clearly) gating system that was mostly time-based which usually meant first come first served, which didn't inherently have anything to do with skill more than likely mostly to do with free time, just like PvP at that point. So, i mean we all know this to be true, if you enter a private server six months before another Guild you're probably clearing content before them should you do nothing insanely wrong all things being relatively equal.
What hasn't changed, however, is the majority of fact from this era: hit caps, itemization, AEP formulas, gear progression, most mechanics (I do emphasize most), etc. Things you wouldn't think would be left to argue a decade after the fact and yet.... somehow.
In this instance it just happened to be NA vs EU gaming with the random insinuations that EU has won plenty of championships in games that, honestly, mostly EU cares about, so that was my retort. Because, interestingly, NA just happens to win almost all of the games that NA cares about, so to use that measure alone would be kind of silly. So instead I used something that was not partial, such as earnings, in general, really, and like I'd said the results honestly didn't surprise me at all. Although, I have a sneaking suspicion if/when Japan ever decides to get into gaming on an international level in esports we have a not so pleasant surprise waiting for us.
And you may find this to be a ridiculous argument that really serves no purpose and reveals no victor and you just might be right. However, and i'm not sure if this is particularly true to gaming, but it does seem that people have a tendency to say whatever the hell they feel like without any supporting documentation, cause, reality, just whatever the hell and it does indeed trigger the living **** out of me. It's one thing to not know what you're talking about and it's an entirely different monster when you don't know what you're talking about and never shut the hell up about it. So, I may seem typically agitated in Global but to be fair I'm fighting an army of falsifying denizens that seek to spread misinformation like the plague so it keeps me busy.Edited: April 6, 2018
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Member
And by the way, I'm aware it might not matter entirely if people say dumb **** about video game history, or whatever. But, somebody has gotta be like "Um, the sky is not green, by the way", right? I'm not gonna just stand here and watch people have a sometimes in depth conversation about how green it is.
It's ****ing insanity and it has driven me crazy over the last 16+ yrs of the internet, I mean, I swear to God every game, every genre, every sub genre that exists there are some random asshats, seemingly every time I log on, spouting something that is completely untrue a bunch of people just nodding at them like 'oh yeah you're right and this why because it sounds good in my head' just madness.
I can't ****ing take it anymore and sure maybe I snap a little bit at this point but Google God damn exists and I want people to use it, do idk twenty minutes of research and be like hey, im full of ****, look at me being all wrong and ****. And instead, what we actually do, like I said is just nod and be like oh he said it, well it must be true, and then they do the SAME THING.Edited: April 6, 2018
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Member
No ill intent meant by saying this, but perhaps it would do you good to get outside and have some fresh air.
The global chat is filled with people from different regions of the world with different opinions and with different feelings. Some will hearken to what you say, be it with facts or not, and others will simply retaliate regardless of what has been said. So why put so much thought into it?
The game is the same but people change. We learn more, we consider new tactics and we improve. I believe a reason for why people scoff at people bragging about triumphs in the past is because it shows they have not understood that we are constantly improving and so feats and accomplishments made in the past might not play the same role now as it did back then. But once again, why react to this? People got different opinions after all.
But I still fear to see what all of this has got to do with Outland, so I reckon this thread would be better off in the General or Off Topic section, don't you think?=)
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Member
Eh, I was thinking that I actually play on Outland and it was a conversation/conversations on Outland therefore probably belonged here to some degree, anyway.
It's not so much as an outside thing as it is I'm just simply over it. I mean, I can't think of an industry where this is so prevalent as it is in gaming and sometimes I wish I just knew nothing about gaming. Well, I don't know anything about professional sports so I'm not just sitting there randomly spouting incorrect things to people like a preacher and if that exists I apologize on behalf of the would-be preachers.
Part of this whole thing is the social interaction which nine times out of ten is pleasant it's just that 1 out of 10 that drives me nuts. And it seems dumb but this is my hobby so I'd prefer people to not spout ****ing nonsense about my hobby every time I meet them I mean if you collected frogs and every time you met someone they stepped on one or spit on it you might be slightly perturbed after a while XD
Like, okay, I guess where i'm going with it in general is that if people don't know much about gaming in depth or the history or the e-sport scene or whatever it is that is 100% perfectly fine. But, if that's the case, shut the phuck up. I don't know why, but it is those same exact people that decide it is their duty to tell people about exactly all of those things they know nothing about.
There is an abundance of information from the best players to ever have played or play this game at your very fingertips (the community, in general) and I implore you, I urge you to use it and immediately desist taking anyone's advice (including mine) other than those players. I think that is a very sane train of thought.
And this rant, well, which it is now, is the over-all "huehue kasprz trolling hue what a troll hurrr" - no, im not trolling.Edited: April 6, 2018
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Banned
According to your own statistic the EU earns more with esport than USA.
https://www.esportsearnings.com/countries
Sweden, a small country that has barely 10 million ppl, earns already nearly half of whole USA.
Now when you count all european countrys together they earn significant more than USA.
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Member
The player count is listed to the side, of which if you add up NA and EU it is actually EU that has more players. Just so you know, as long as we're arguing continent versus country, or two countries versus a plethora, or population.
Also, clearly, at least half of the U.S. isn't even on the PC if that speaks to any level of our general disinterest to PC gaming suffice to say that we have no actual viable real life scenario to which we could repeat a lot of the intricacies in the infrastructure that is present in European or Asian markets.
I mean, I didn't think I had to point this out but I do believe that India and Africa aren't on that list whatsoever and have pretty high populations.Edited: April 6, 2018
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Banned
Isn't it obvious that whole USA with all its states earns more than individual countrys in Europe.
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Member
You're assuming that the people in Alabama, Mississippi, North Dakota etc. are in droves playing video games on the internet and I think it's fairly obvious that they're not. I think you're stuck looking at population numbers over participation numbers.
If you compared participation #'s and pro #'s of New York and California alone and threw out all the other states I don't think you'd like your findings ;3
There's more to this, obviously, that DotA2 accounts for the majority of e-sports earnings in general due to amazingly genius crowd funding and sponsorship etc and that fighting games or sub genres such as that or brood war interestingly make next to no money.
It was too in depth to try to speculate all these things considered. For example, Dota2 has a grandly inflated income potential in relation to its viewership that I'm frankly not really sure how it continues to exist but..
I don't know if you can't detect regional accents because you're not American, I mean, that could very well be the case, but let me the first to tell you the vast majority of us are from around the same area. It is what it is. We all sound alike for a reason. Just like I'm sure most of Canada that we run into is either Ontario or Quebec.
Like, I mean, WoW was one of the most played games ever in the U.S. and you overwhelmingly outnumber us in our own game on this server if you even use your personal experiences as a reference it has gotta be obvious that not a lot of us play.
And i'm pretty sure though I could be wrong that Sweden has the highest numbers outside of S. Korea for participation %.
If you look at numbers India and Africa are HUGE but nearly invisible in gaming.
I don't think it really takes a genius to figure out NA's stance on gaming. Look at our infrastructure in every industry we give a flying **** about in 2018 and look at gaming. We just happen to be the only area without a local tournament presence or not much of a pro scene i mean c'mon? We only have the money to make these games?
I'm not trying to trivialize here but the other sports Sweden is known for is Tennis, Ping pong, Hockey and whatever Bandy is so clearly they have some room to move into the gaming department. South Korea has a few but e-sports is literally listed in their wikipedia.Edited: April 6, 2018
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Banned
Ofc they do, its not like only farmers live their.
This whole statistic makes anyway not much sense because a Esport team usually consist of players from many different countrys.
There are many players from Europe/Asia that are playing in american teams and vice versa.
I doubt that the statistic takes these things into account.
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Member
They really don't as I'm also sure there's not massive amounts of people in Siberia playing either. Majority of US Gamers are typically west coast east coast I think that's fairly well known between us.
And there's flags next to their names I mean fatal1ty like I said is the most well known US gamer on that list and he's like #11.
I don't know if America as a whole is confusing to foreigners but not all the same states participate in the same industries we're really quite different sometimes.
I really don't get why you seem to think that we have as many people in some states doing something as we do in others. Are there as many people from Portugal gaming and i've just missed them? Like, Iceland hello? There are entire gaps of countries in this whole online gaming industry that i dont think youre noticing, states included.
Don't you think its' weird Sweden is so small yet we meet them all the damn time? Have you ever thought about that? We all have the same accent in America yet youre playing with southerners all the time? Where? Where are they? lol hello South Dakota where'd ya go rofl. Dude you've never met somebody from South Dakota in your life lolllllllllll
Dude real talk I want you to Google California and Northeast US and realize 90% of the time that's who you've been talking to. I'm gonna list states youve never talked to just for luls and those that you have
1 AL Alabama LOL no
2 AK Alaska no
3 AZ Arizona probably
4 AR Arkansas LOL no
5 CA California obviously
6 CO Colorado yes
7 CT Connecticut yes
8 DE Delaware LOL
9 FL Florida yes
10 GA Georgia no
11 HI Hawaii lolno
12 ID Idaho wut
13 IL Illinois maybe chicago
14 IN Indiana ehh
15 IA Iowa no cornfields lots of cornfields
16 KS Kansas no
17 KY Kentucky no
18 LA Louisiana LOL
19 ME Maine yes
20 MD Maryland yes
21 MA Massachusetts yes
22 MI Michigan yes
23 MN Minnesota LOL if you ever heard this accent
24 MS Mississippi no inbreeding
25 MO Missouri no except fatal1ty
26 MT Montana not sure if anyone lives in montana but sheep
27 NE Nebraska no
28 NV Nevada Carson City yes
29 NH New Hampshire yes
30 NJ New Jersey youd know
31 NM New Mexico no
32 NY New yes
33 NC North Carolina no
34 ND North Dakota LOL not sure if they exist
35 OH Ohio yes
36 OK Oklahoma no
37 OR Oregon no apparently only SJU lives here
38 PA Pennsylvania yes
39 RI Rhode Island yes
40 SC South Carolina no
41 SD South Dakota LOL
42 TN Tennessee no drunk
43 TX Texas yes bc austin
44 UT Utah implying people live here
45 VT Vermont the 1 guy that lives here
46 VA Virginia yes ty virginia beach and richmond
47 WA Washington yes
48 WV West Virginia LOL
49 WI Wisconsin yes
50 WY Wyoming wut
That is in my opinion a realistic list i mean we hear accents where people are from that's my experiences over many many years but like some of those states like vermont? idk if ive ever even i mean cmon man lol what do you even know about vermont?
I would bet you that 90% of what you know about the US comes from the States I bolded and you probably still know not a word about any of 'em and we never shut the hell up so
I even did you a favor and highlighted accents that even you should be able to tell that are different from Northern Inland/General American or its variations which is mostly what you're hearing and what you hear on TV.
That totally deviates from the original topic but you suggesting that majority of the South or BFE version of the US sits there online gaming is just ridiculous and speaks to how little you know of the country
yes, majority of some of those states are a bunch of farmers i mean lol im exaggerating but thats what happens when you have a country of that size thats fairly new i mean look at our population density what do you think is inbetween NYC and LA? We have patches of no mans land lol there are people in the woods that are by themself oft the grid and i hope you never meet them LOL
LMAO so off topic but i dare you to drive down a rocky road in the middle of some of the states hop out and ask for directions you just time traveled to the 1800s LOL
I could dive into deeper specifics suchas in my area growing up Lacrosse is the dominant sport and is virtually invisible in rest of based states outside of like cali as well.Edited: April 6, 2018
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Member
Not that this matters because it applies to all countries in regards to concentration of applied gaming like it should but I want you, since you're so convinced that America is relatively equal in proportions to gaming, to search for the word y'all or yall in posts in your free time, just take a look. That word is interchangeable with dude, bro, guy, man, etc. in colloquial slang and is just MIA in gaming lol and is just as prevalent. They didn't just omit the way they text/type for your benefit, they're not here, bro. Also, you usually dont hear the funny Canadian accents like "aboot" either because theyre also not here. They live in the wilderness. LOL.
This entire thing just became ridiculous but it's okay i've got nothing better going on at the moment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0uXPjSC4kU
If you're bored watch this pretty funny watching it atm.Edited: April 6, 2018
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Its a fact EU is better at videogames.
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Member
The whole debate is obviously very dull but it kinda bafles me how you can conclude that NA > EU from the statistics you have shown. On pretty much every parameter the EU countries that are listed beats US except of the total earnings of the individual country vs the entire US.
