1. Grull bugged? insane fight

    Hi guys! i got a question about grull boss fight. It seems its realy hard to take him down atm, cause shatter literaly os cause it doesnt scale with armor or life (it should do % dmg based on max hp right?), as full kara geared group we cant realy do it unless we dont have all dps with 1k+ dps. Someone got any suggestion?

  2. It's definitely vastly overtuned, yes.

    I don't know for sure whether the damage should be mitigated by armor or whether it should be % based.

    I do know that the range of shatter is much farther than it was on retail. Which you can tell because the DBM range indicator which worked on retail, does not work correctly here to predict the damage you will take. You can have nobody near you and still take shatter damage from people on this server.

    I also remember how easy he was on retail even for terrible pug groups of 22-23 people with pvp gear ans blues. I'd be surprised if he doesn't have at least twice as much health on this server.

    Also, he melee's the tank during shatter when he should just stand still and do nothing. So it's best if your tank moves out of melee range of Gruul during the shatters.

    And lastly, the reverberation (silence) timer is incorrect, and usually results in silences occurring directly after the shatter happens. Which is literally the worst possible time, and this bug alone would make him a significantly harder fight.

    So, yes. The fight is insanely hard and the devs should look at correcting the tuning ever since they changed the way armor mitigated the shatter damage. Before then, the other bugs didn't even matter because the shatter damage was forgiving enough. I think it was actually very well tuned even with it's problems, until recently.

    If you're a new-ish guild that is still progressing, I'd suggest going to Magtheridon after you kill HKM. It requires more coordination but it's a much easier fight over all as long as your players are able to handle some fairly easy assignments.
    Edited: March 28, 2018

  3. Overtuned and a tad bugged.

    I've commonly heard that he's got more HP than the 2.4.3 version of Gruul in retail, but have not done the math to tell.

    Shatter did always do 2000-9000 damage to a player based on proximity to EACH other player, and I believe that is how hard it is currently hitting on Warmane.

    You can view various bugs in these bugreports:

    Reverberation (Silence) occurring in conjunction with Shatter:
    https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/63887 (OPEN)
    https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/49116 ("FIXED", but many players still experiencing simultaneous Shatter & Reverb)

    Melee Attack during ground slam:
    https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/53857 ("Fixed", though I've heard anecdotal evidence that it is not)

    Shatter damage reduction via armor:
    https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/51065 ("Fixed" so that armor does not reduce damage, unsure whether this was the case on retail)

    Ground Slam not random:
    https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/46199 (Fixed, currently does throw players in random directions)

  4. Got killed with more than 8 K HP and 34% armor with 2 people next to me. That's insane. Should not happen. Shatter is the main cause we can't get him down

  5. While 8K HP is average for the gear level (particualrly if you're sporting crafted gear that tends to be low on stam), it is too low to survive a shatter with two people standing next to you, even by pure theoretical "how-it-should-be-working" standards. Two folk at an average of 10 yds away is still a solid 10k total damage being done to you, working as intended.


    You either need to equip some beefier stam gear for this encounter (I myself strive for 9-9.5k HP fully buffed, which allows for me to be at a 20yd distance from two or three folk), or you need to get your group better at executing the mechanics so as not to be within 22 yds of any other living soul upon shatter. This is the case regardless of bugs.

  6. While 8K HP is average for the gear level (particualrly if you're sporting crafted gear that tends to be low on stam), it is too low to survive a shatter with two people standing next to you, even by pure theoretical "how-it-should-be-working" standards. Two folk at an average of 10 yds away is still a solid 10k total damage being done to you, working as intended.


    You either need to equip some beefier stam gear for this encounter (I myself strive for 9-9.5k HP fully buffed, which allows for me to be at a 20yd distance from two or three folk), or you need to get your group better at executing the mechanics so as not to be within 22 yds of any other living soul upon shatter. This is the case regardless of bugs.
    Sorry, but I have to disagree.
    I only had a little over 8 K health cuz I was already missing some (fully buffed I have 9.3 K health)
    In this video here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL9mSLp7niI << you can see an ele shammy on Warmane's Gruul about 8 to 10 months ago having 8.5 K health. From the 6 minute 40 mark, when groundslam occurs, you can see that there are at least 2 people too close in his proximity, one on the right, and one in the lower left corner (even though his distance meter doesn't show it, must be bugged) and the shatter takes away about half his health. Now that is indeed normal and working as intended. Further more I used to be in a progressive guild back in retail days of TBC and we did Gruul as well. There were times I had 2 people in my proximity as well and was geared about the same as I am now, and though it did quite some damage, it never killed me dead if I was on 8 K health or more.

    Also in this vid > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXBAiJqoRVA < taken about 2 months ago you can see a rogue at the 1:23:26 mark after groundslam, just before shatter, he has 2 people in his proximity (as shown on his distance meter). Now he has 10.7 K fully buffed and gets hit with a shatter with 2 people in his proximity and after he has 6.1 K health left (so that should have hit for about 4.6 K, which is normal). It should not hit for 8 K with 2 people around man, it just shouldn't, that is not working as intended, as you can blatantly see from these vids.
    Edited: April 1, 2018 Reason: fixed typo's

  7. Shattered isn't mitigated by armor, that was the entire point. the "pre nerf" version, should do 4250 damage per person within 10 yards.
    On this server, the range is more like 15 yards. But the damage value is about right.

    the only thing not right with the Gruul fight is the silence timing, the rest is perfectly fine... dying to shatter is a L2P issue, if you have 2 people in range of you, then 3 people played poorly, and people died as a consequence.

    Melee need to move AWAY from the boss. not run straight back into melee range when they get thrown.. DPS need to be away, spreading, DPS during shatters doesn't at all matter. It's a survival based fight, if you live, the dps check is easy (it's like, what, 700 dps per 17 DPSers to kill it before 15 growths? That's nothing.

  8. That's funny, because with 700+ dps maybe 1 or 2 deaths after multiple shatters total the boss was 50% 10 stacks. I've been told numerous times by bt raiders I ask about gruul that without hard damage carries that exceed what would be needed for Gruul you won't beat it.

  9. https://youtu.be/IPinkYtXCv8?t=414 6:56min, on warmane this situation is sure death, there were 3 people arround him

  10. So you want to be free kill free loot?
    People die from same stuff over and over and need to be stuck there since they cant spread out 5 yards, and silence is a big meh, but if ur healing know how to play tank will never die duo that.
    So over all grull is just use brain and it's easy kill.

  11. So you want to be free kill free loot?
    People die from same stuff over and over and need to be stuck there since they cant spread out 5 yards, and silence is a big meh, but if ur healing know how to play tank will never die duo that.
    So over all grull is just use brain and it's easy kill.
    Agree, this is your first real raid, it's not meant to be free loot. Dying from shatters? Poor execution by your group on spreading out evenly. Mark your healers with icons, spread out evenly throughout the room and stay the heck away from them. Tank dying from silence/shatter? Keep hots on him. Your raid leader should be calling this stuff out. " Shatter in 5, hots on tank". Lose a DPS? Battle res right after a shatter assuming you have a good chance of killing him.

    And yes, sometimes you get screwed from the ground slam/shatter. It happens.

    If you can't execute this, how do you think you'll do in ssc or tk?

  12. gruul in retail had 3.5 milions hp here 5.7 milions ... good luckl in dps race you need full t5 PPL with dps to briung him down or his grow will oneshot tank. i dont like free loot but not even such overtuning on bosses...

  13. May 1, 2018  
    I have also been trying many attempts on Gruul, it does feel that it does have more HP than it should.

    Also, the range doesn't seem right.

  14. May 11, 2018  
    I think the calls of "What, you want free loot?" are highly misguided here.

    I understand why hardcore raiders want raids to be tuned higher than they were on Retail, for a challenge.

    However, Gruul is not even close to cutting-edge anymore. The gear he drops with a couple exceptions is worse than the badge gear people will soon be able to buy - significantly worse (to say nothing of the coin shop gear).

    Yes, the fight is possible with T4 gear. But it's an old fight - and just being frank, some guilds are not that good. Gruul was killable even if your guild wasn't that good on Retail for a very, very long time (even when it was current content, actually) - there is no need to gatekeep his overtuning so badly. On Retail, even guilds that weren't very good could still make slow and steady progress, and I think it's been a big barrier to new guilds.

    Whatever, though. ZA soon, which means lifting of T5 attunement requirements, and also means guilds will just skip to T5 and ZA now. The time to fix Gruul when it actually mattered is over.

  15. May 11, 2018  
    Is there any post about t5 attunements from administration?

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