WotLK Random or not? Arena Queue 4.8k GS vs. 6.3k GS players.

[Mohaxxo]

Getting 6k+ don't always mean people have donated for their gear. There is Guilds with hundreds of LK 25HC kills on Icecrown. Also getting 6k is very easy task for even a casual player. You said you have played since the beginning of Lordearon, i assume by now you are BIS geared so you should be on equal terms of gear with Icecrown players. No imbalance there unless you are complaining that now you have to fight against other geared players. On other hand you are saying you and your partner are under 5k gs.... i am a bit confused.

Anyhow cross-realm arena was enabled because Lordearon PVP was almost non existing, or at least this is my understanding. If you want to make the argument that Cross-Realm arena is unfair i can understand that, but asking for arena gear brackets is simple stupid. Warmane have decided that this system, even unfair to a extend, is the better option then non existing PVP on other realms. If its so game breaking for you, maybe you really should quit Warmane and go sub to BFA.

25HC kills for a casual player? No, not that simple. My partner is 5.4, and I am 4.8k. And I do not want any higher GS or else I meet tons of vendor players in battlegounds. What I am saying is, if Warmane can do something about it. To fix it so that people under 5k gs only would meet other people of the same gs in the arena, then it would be great. I love Warmane, well atleast Lordaeron heh.

[Meowto]

25HC kills for a casual player? No, not that simple. My partner is 5.4, and I am 4.8k. And I do not want any higher GS or else I meet tons of vendor players in battlegounds. What I am saying is, if Warmane can do something about it. To fix it so that people under 5k gs only would meet other people of the same gs in the arena, then it would be great. I love Warmane, well atleast Lordaeron heh.

Arena brackets are a bad idea, however little balancing was done by blizzard was done with s8 gear in mind, the game just breaks at lower levels. And if you can get rating/achievements etc at lower ratings you would soon see a bracket that is just as broken. Not to mention that once you have that, as you said, people will want to stop gearing Up. (which also is why bg brackets are a bad idea).


The crux is how we gear and how it doesnt work once everyone else is geared up. Separating people isnt the issue.



If for example you had 2 arena flushes per week and all rating requirement were gone from gear the pvp system would be so much more healthy (basicely how it was handled later on).

[Anyone0]

25HC kills for a casual player? No, not that simple. My partner is 5.4, and I am 4.8k. And I do not want any higher GS or else I meet tons of vendor players in battlegounds. What I am saying is, if Warmane can do something about it. To fix it so that people under 5k gs only would meet other people of the same gs in the arena, then it would be great. I love Warmane, well atleast Lordaeron heh.

If you don't want better gear then that's your problem. Arenas have never been separated by gear. You do arenas to get better gear, which allows you to climb higher. Otherwise what's the point of Wrathful gear if you could stay with Furious gear and face only other players who have Furious gear?

Normally people don't stop their gear progression when they reach Furious gear. If you want to stop your progression at that point and want to fight only others with similar gear, you get advantage because you would be fighting against teams who have just started their gear progression (and often skill or class knowledge/experience progression). It's basically like level 79 twink queuing for battlegrounds to fight against players who are leveling but instead of having better gear than others, you have more experience of playing your character at that gear level than the teams you face. And you choosing to stay at that gear level to queue for battlegrounds is pretty much the same thing. The difference is that arenas have a ladder with season rewards and items that you can buy when you get more rating.

[Mercy]

Do people forget that Relentless gear from arena points (rating not required) and/or Emblems of Frost is a thing? Why isn't being mentioned and people are acting as though they should easily be able to go straight from Furious to Wrathful? How often do you see people doing ICC with full sets of Ulduar gear?

Furthermore, why should players be separated by gear levels in arena when they are already separated by skill rating? Because you don't want to fight people who are better geared than you? If someone is geared to the point where they have a guaranteed win over you, they will climb rating and after time you won't see them anymore. Meanwhile, you're collecting arena points for Relentless items.

I don't see the issue. Perhaps someone can better explain to me what exactly is the problem?

[Mohaxxo]

Do people forget that Relentless gear from arena points (rating not required) and/or Emblems of Frost is a thing? Why isn't being mentioned and people are acting as though they should easily be able to go straight from Furious to Wrathful? How often do you see people doing ICC with full sets of Ulduar gear?

Furthermore, why should players be separated by gear levels in arena when they are already separated by skill rating? Because you don't want to fight people who are better geared than you? If someone is geared to the point where they have a guaranteed win over you, they will climb and rating and after time you won't see them anymore. Meanwhile, you're collecting arena points for Relentless items.

I don't see the issue. Perhaps someone can better explain to me what exactly is the problem?

I never wanted this to be a rant post. I only wanted to know if you guys had any future plans on separating queues in arena, like you do in battlegrounds. I know now that you never will do this. Thank you for the reply. You may close this thread.

[hsypersakura]

but instead of having better gear than others, you have more experience of playing your character at that gear level than the teams you face.

is just like wotlk players can't understand the joy of fighting same item level enemies xD

[Frostwolf011]

Do people forget that Relentless gear from arena points (rating not required) and/or Emblems of Frost is a thing? Why isn't being mentioned and people are acting as though they should easily be able to go straight from Furious to Wrathful? How often do you see people doing ICC with full sets of Ulduar gear?

We used to do that, and now the difficulty has ramped up.

I don't see the issue. Perhaps someone can better explain to me what exactly is the problem?

You gave them the finger(gear separation in BG's and possible mercenary system) and people want the whole hand.

Tho tbh I also see their point of view since the amount of Lolmourne people running around is ridiculous, and when 2k+ rate people constantly drop MMR to 1300 no amount skill can bridge that gear gap unless you are gladiator material. And even its almost impossible.

[Amdus]

You gave them the finger(gear separation in BG's and possible mercenary system) and people want the whole hand.

Yes that's exactly what it looks to me, people got some feature that they in my oppinion didn't deserve and now they want everything served on a silver plate, when you start giving people perks that makes everything easier they want more, that's why retail is a joke atm, they listened to all the whiners and gave them everything they wanted:

Original wow dev team: "Demon hunter won't be playable."
Whiners: We want demon hunters!
Activision team: There you go, Demon hunters for everyone and level 90 boost, subscribe!

Now some people will take for granted to get the same perks.

Tho tbh I also see their point of view since the amount of Lolmourne people running around is ridiculous, and when 2k+ rate people constantly drop MMR to 1300 no amount skill can bridge that gear gap unless you are gladiator material. And even its almost impossible.

I agree with this completely, I mean the shadowmourne plague doesn't bother me at all, but the amount of mmr droppers and scripters is beyond ridiculous. I think this may be a controversial statement, but the reason of arenas being so uncompetitive and in constant decay is because the plague of scripters, and one can't really be playing all games with fraps or any recorder on, but trust me it's beyond ridiculous; Today in example a mage casted poly on my partner, and inside his 1.5s cooldown assuming he doesn't have a million haste I decided to pop wings; Guess what? Got stolen INSTANTLY, when I say instantly I mean instantly, I didn't see the wings on myself I saw the wings on him, like wtf dude...

Other than that everything else is perfect aside from the whiner favoritism aswell, and although I'm horde I really really hope that you don't succumb to the crying over the human racial and leave the things as they are, but honestly some GM's spectating arenas to catch up scripters would be something very good, because seriously there are a couple of alliance guilds where absolutely EVERYONE uses scripts: Interrupting master summoner, instant shattering throw (Tested by intentionally using HoP or Divine when it wasn't necessary), instant Spell steal, instant cyclones, instant fears, garrote and gouges... Sometimes is ridiculous and one wonder HOW THE **** they get away? It's so cheeky...

And as Mercy said, you have relentless gear available and cheaper than wf, the stats are not that different, a bit lower but you really feel the difference when you wear relentless, perhaps is not necessary to get the whole set but if you feel you struggle just get a few pieces and you'll see it makes the deal.

Sorry for the rant, tried to keep it as much on-topic as possible, best regards!

[Allylilith]

I personally feel like arenas are a lot better than bgs. To bring a bit of context: I casually play double warrior in arena and we are both around 5.5k gs (with a lot of pve gear and dog**** enchants/gems on my side) and we are 1.4-1.5k rated. Ok, I haven't played on such a low rating in years (maybe ever?) and we of course face mainly BIS icecrown players, up to smourne hpala war BIS guys. This seems incredibly infair at first sight (it kind of is lol) BUT there is a reason why these guys are on such a low rating, and beating them feels only better.
My advice to anyone who wants to enjoy arena: Don't look at your rating, just get in there, own some noobs and enjoy it. There is nothing better than 1v2 overequipped gorillas and winning.
Restricting arenas to gear would completely destroy the purpose of rating and gearing up.

P.S I am prot war and I might only have a relatively good time because of my great survivability, espacially against melees who are the biggest problem for most people

[Mercy]

I never wanted this to be a rant post. I only wanted to know if you guys had any future plans on separating queues in arena, like you do in battlegrounds. I know now that you never will do this. Thank you for the reply. You may close this thread.

That's fine. Others picked up on it. I'll leave it open so they can continue to discuss.

[Skoobydoo]

25HC kills for a casual player? No, not that simple.

You don't need LK HC kill to reach 6kGS.

My partner is 5.4, and I am 4.8k. And I do not want any higher GS or else I meet tons of vendor players in battlegounds.

I've been on Lordaeron since the beginning and had to improve my skills greatly to reach 2.3k rating. But now, so far, Ive only met players which only made me wanna subscribe to bfa lol, and quit Warmane because of how unfair and unbalanced it has become.

Aaa.... so you have been playing for years and you had reach 2.3k rating, but all this time you never pass 5k gs? I have very hard time believing that. The cross-realm system and BG gear brackets are fairy new, you should have been able to reach close to BIS gear long long time ago if you really had played the much time. And if you wanna keep yourself lower gear on purpose because of RBG, that's your own decision and the consequence are that you will be destroyed in Arena.

is just like wotlk players can't understand the joy of fighting same item level enemies xD

Actually we do understand it. Most teams above 1700 rating are all close to BIS gear and are all same itemlevel. What we don't understand is why someone who just start on this server think he should be special and protected from players who play for months and years.

[Allylilith]

You don't need LK HC kill to reach 6kGS.

Actually we do understand it. Most teams above 1700 rating are all close to BIS gear and are all same itemlevel. What we don't understand is why someone who just start on this server think he should be special and protected from players who play for months and years.

well you just 100% confirmed his issue: Most teams above 1700 are BIS = you have the be either an amazing player or have BIS gear (which like 98% of the people got in the shop for real money) to merely get to 1700, which has been a place for mediocre geared, unskilled players in any expansion on blizzard servers. On retail you could always swiftly climb the ladder as good pvp player, which I assume he is when his claimed 2.3k exp is correct. I understand that this is an inevitable problem when you always stick to the same patch on a private server and that this issue grows unimaginable as soon as a shop for gear comes into play, but you don't have to act like you wouldn't know all of this

[Skoobydoo]

well you just 100% confirmed his issue: Most teams above 1700 are BIS = you have the be either an amazing player or have BIS gear (which like 98% of the people got in the shop for real money) to merely get to 1700, which has been a place for mediocre geared, unskilled players in any expansion on blizzard servers. On retail you could always swiftly climb the ladder as good pvp player, which I assume he is when his claimed 2.3k exp is correct. I understand that this is an inevitable problem when you always stick to the same patch on a private server and that this issue grows unimaginable as soon as a shop for gear comes into play, but you don't have to act like you wouldn't know all of this

Retail had season 8 for 3-4 months while Warmane have it for multiple years now, its only natural for majority of players of be fully geared. The guy also claims he is playing since Lordearon launch, he had plenty of time to get his gear. There is absolutely no room to complain. He actually have chose to not progress with gear so he is in lower RBG bracket. This is why they should have never make this gear brackets, give them a finger they try to bite your whole hand. And if someone is not skilled and not geared, i am sorry he does not deserve to be high rating. Look at Blackrock players, they are not BIS geared, plenty of them are using WF weapons or Shadow's Edge, but they do just fine on the ladder.

Yes sure 98% of players have all donated for their gear.... i guess no one is actually playing the game according to you.

[Frostwolf011]

Yes sure 98% of players have all donated for their gear.... i guess no one is actually playing the game according to you.

Not 98% but plenty of them. And they still fail in ICC HC even with donated gear :D

[hsypersakura]

What we don't understand is why someone who just start on this server think he should be special and protected from players who play for months and years.

this server?, be clear. Lordaeron.

i mean, a lot of people joined lordaeron because there is no shop and took the buff raids and x1 rate as a side effect.

So in some form, when people joined lord they didn't want to be "protected" from players that play for months and years as you point out, they didn't want to play against donors.