Warmane Loot Tables

[krzysiooo]

Hello everyone!
I understand this is rather controversial topic, and I would like to see what people's opinion is on it. First of all i think is not a secret that loot tables arent exacly blizzlike, with the main evidence of that being those double item drop that werent a thing back on retail. To be honest most of people agree this is not that big of an issiue. But right now after 6 months clearing most of ICC 25 weekly me and people in my guild started noticing trend in the loot we getting. We are getting the feeling that every single week we are disenchanting pretty much the same items (those crit+mp5+sp plate or tank items are the first ones to come to mind). And i get it, those items arent on hight demand to its only natural nobody is gonna need them. But then there is plenty of items (considered good/bis) that in those 6 months we recall only dropping once or twice if ever. Im caster myslef so i can mostly speak about caster items since i pay addtention to those the most but i think there is no point listing specific items here. Lately we've have been also speeking to people from other guilds about this and pretty much all of them got the same feeling.
Now i understand that this was meant to be realm with challenging PvE content, but nowhere can i find information saying "on top of upping increasing difficulty on encounters, we have also modified loot talbes to drop less good items to make it even more challenging". On top of that i didnt gather any statistical data of actuall loot over the weeks, all this is just based on the feeling me and my guildies got after raiding for the past few months.
So basically with this topic id like to get opinion of more people, whatever this opinion would be. If you think that all of this is "whining for not getting a good loot" or that we just are unlucky thats totally fine. Getting feedback from Warmane staff would also be highly appreciated.


PS.: I didnt really wanna make this post about trinkets, because it would be easier for people to assume this whole topic is just whining about not getting those juiciest tiems, and i gotta admit we have been pretty lucky with the caster trinkets drops. As for STS and DBW however currently after over 6 months of raiding (with core of around 20 ppl staying the same for this period) we have 2 DBW and 1 STS among our roster and thats rather odd to say the least. Although for this i can totally belive we've been just unlucky.

[Obnoxious]

How long you farm for something is irrelevant. Your chance doesn't increases for each time you do it. If something has a 0.1% chance of dropping, it will have the same 0.1% chance of dropping each time you run the instance, it won't add up in any way to increase chances. The loot tables and drop chances are the same as in Icecrown, without any sort of tweaking, the same that have been used for years - that's information I personally confirmed.

[Simitav2]

@Obnoxious. Well he is right, loot tables are no blizzlike 100% guaranteed. The best example is Shadowfrostshard droprate which is for sure not bliizlike since here u have around 20% chance to get a shard from a boss no matter the dificulty of the boss. Idk about normal items, i guess luck or bad luck takes a part there, but in the other hand i dont remember a boss dropping the same item x2 or even x3 times at once.

[Obnoxious]

@Obnoxious. Well he is right, loot tables are no blizzlike 100% guaranteed. The best example is Shadowfrostshard droprate which is for sure not bliizlike since here u have around 20% chance to get a shard from a boss no matter the dificulty of the boss. Idk about normal items, i guess luck or bad luck takes a part there, but in the other hand i dont remember a boss dropping the same item x2 or even x3 times at once.

I wasn't talking about "Blizzlike," just that there are no special tweaks or lower chances on Lordaeron, the database used is the same as on Icecrown. The things you're describing (the opposite of things not dropping, but things dropping incorrectly, I assume) sound like bugs that should be reported in the Bug Tracker, which are a different subject.

[Disktrasa]

I thought the Shards to complete Shadowmourne was intentionally lowered because in retail you only had a certain amount of time to get it and using it before it would become obsolete in form of the next expansion.

You have all the time in the world here and you will be overpowered forever when getting it.

To be honest it's the best way to go, Shadowmourne should be really special, with Blizz drop rates, everyone would have shadowmoune by now.

I remember getting 3 STS's on Ruby sanctum 25 Heroic, I can guarantee you there was cheering on discord.
I also remember when 3 Holy paladin chests dropped of rotface so, goes hand in hand.

[Repost]

First of all i think is not a secret that loot tables arent exacly blizzlike, with the main evidence of that being those double item drop that werent a thing back on retail.

I can think of multiple times on retail where duplicate items dropped. As for the rest, it's more arguable that tables seem biased because you're only looking for specific items. From my experience I see maybe one or two junk items drop per week and I still don't get the feeling that any bis items are uncommon, especially since on a typical week I see most of the bis gear drop.

[krzysiooo]

How long you farm for something is irrelevant. Your chance doesn't increases for each time you do it. If something has a 0.1% chance of dropping, it will have the same 0.1% chance of dropping each time you run the instance, it won't add up in any way to increase chances. The loot tables and drop chances are the same as in Icecrown, without any sort of tweaking, the same that have been used for years - that's information I personally confirmed.

As to first part of your answer. The chance of dropping in this case is unknown to me, so im trying to figure it out based on statistical analysis (technically you cant call it statistical analysis since i didnt gather any hard data, just basing on my expirience). In that case how long im farming something represents sample size, which is directly connected to accuracy of the result. Accuracy of the result increases with the increase sample size. Although i admit, sample size of 6 months (6monthx*4weeks*3items per boss equals 72 item drops) is definitely not large enough to make any accurate statments.

As to second part of your answer. You stated that drop chances are exacly same as on Icecrown, but the question remains whether they are blizzlike.
Now call me greedy, but if i was owner of private server that generates income from people's donations to buy items, i would without a doubt modify loot tables to reduce chances of bis items droping. A player that would otherwise not buy coins, after farming content for 20 weeks straight ant not getting his item is more likley to buy it off a store. But then applying the same loot table to a server that doesnt offer an option to buy items from the item store (like Lordaeron) would only in long run further increase its difficulty (which could be the intention). But you know, thats just a crazy theory.

@Disktrasa As for Shadowmourne part i totally agree with what you said. The unlimited time frame could be factored into drop chances, but the official realm discription doesnt say anything about drop rates adjustment due to unlimited time frame.

@Repost The first part: Most people i spoke to claimed that this didnt happen on retail, im not talking from my experience so might be totally wrong about that.
The second part: Definitely valid point, but im actually not looking for any item atm, dont need anything from normal and we are not progressing hc yet. And us being simply unlucky is definitely possible too. And its not like we are not getting any bis drops, we do. But there is pool of like 8 bis items i can name of the top of my head, and of that pool in the past 3 months we had 2 drops (just 2, not 2 each). But then again, it can be easly labed as small sample size/unlucky.

[Obnoxious]

As to first part of your answer. The chance of dropping in this case is unknown to me, so im trying to figure it out based on statistical analysis (technically you cant call it statistical analysis since i didnt gather any hard data, just basing on my expirience). In that case how long im farming something represents sample size, which is directly connected to accuracy of the result. Accuracy of the result increases with the increase sample size. Although i admit, sample size of 6 months (6monthx*4weeks*3items per boss equals 72 item drops) is definitely not large enough to make any accurate statments.

No sample data will ever give you more than a statistic, which will be nothing but a "personal percentage" that reflects nothing beyond that. You could go for one thousand weeks and never get something with very low drop, with someone else sees them five times in a roll. Again: your chance doesn't "increase over time," it's the exact same each time you go through RNG.

As to second part of your answer. You stated that drop chances are exacly same as on Icecrown, but the question remains whether they are blizzlike.
Now call me greedy, but if i was owner of private server that generates income from people's donations to buy items, i would without a doubt modify loot tables to reduce chances of bis items droping. A player that would otherwise not buy coins, after farming content for 20 weeks straight ant not getting his item is more likley to buy it off a store. But then applying the same loot table to a server that doesnt offer an option to buy items from the item store (like Lordaeron) would only in long run further increase its difficulty (which could be the intention). But you know, thats just a crazy theory.

I'd call it more desperate theory, craving an excuse beyond you simply having bad luck. I guess the retail version would be "Blizzard lowered it so people will have to subscribe for longer to keep trying."

[krzysiooo]

No sample data will ever give you more than a statistic, which will be nothing but a "personal percentage" that reflects nothing beyond that. You could go for one thousand weeks and never get something with very low drop, with someone else sees them five times in a roll. Again: your chance doesn't "increase over time," it's the exact same each time you go through RNG.


I'd call it more desperate theory, craving an excuse beyond you simply having bad luck. I guess the retail version would be "Blizzard lowered it so people will have to subscribe for longer to keep trying."

This "personal precentage" doesnt actaully reflect nothing. Obviously achieving 100% accurate solution is close to impossible, but getting result (precentage) that is within 95%-99% of the unknown analyzed value is not a problem at all with large enough sample size. And accorting to all retail loot statistics all of the items (excluding Primordial Saronite, Shadowfrost Shards, Quest items) ranges from 30% to 15% so i wouldnt say its "very low drop".

And then again, i know desperate theory from player whining for having bad luck. Im sure if i would be presented with loot statistics from Lordaeron they would overlap with those from retail. Btw is there any way to find loot statistics from Lordaeron? That would definitely answer all my questions.

[Verch]

I've been experiencing these issues as well. The whole "bad luck" narrative just seems like a very bad excuse.

I've been farming numerous items on my 29 twink that, on retail, were not only easy to acquire, but also rather ubiquitous. The dungeon bag refuses to give up an "of the Bandit" neck and just gives me caster/warrior necks. I've also been farming world drop helms (of the Monkey, Humbert's Helm). Not only will they never drop but there are no 25-29 green leather helms for sale in the AH and very few 30-39 world helms. Virtually no cloth world helms (of the Owl etc.) for sale in the AH either.

Items with similar/lower drop rate like Mantle of Thieves go up on the AH from time to time, but I've yet to see a single ****in' Pathfinder Hat lol.

[LCALDAA]

The only drops that seem different than retail are shadowfrost shards and Valanyr shards, the rest seems pretty legit