Realms Further division of BG brackets

[Thorbjorn]

more icecrown levelers might be tempted to try bg's if they weren't constantly ruined by twinks.

No they wouldn't be. People don't go to play Iceclown to que low level Bgs when they can legit surpass the whole bracket within dozen minutes.

[Skuddy]

No they wouldn't be. People don't go to play Iceclown to que low level Bgs when they can legit surpass the whole bracket within dozen minutes.

didn't realize you had gone through and asked them all. my apologies.

[IcarNS]

didn't realize you had gone through and asked them all. my apologies.

It's called common sense.

[Skuddy]

It's called common sense.

people don't go to icecrown for low level rdf's either, but they do pop. but yes yes, no one would do bg's cause #commonsense said so.

go back to not getting into icc with your warrior on lord.

[Heliox]

sounds like your scared of losing your easy targets. boohoo.

Consider a situation:

It's 11:00 AM, there are 2 ally twinks online and 2 horde. They queue up for a bg. 10 minutes later the bg starts, it consist 3 lvlers and 2 twinks on each side. They play the bg for 20 minutes, it's quite balanced. During this time another 1 ally twink and 1 horde twink logged, they queue for a bg. Next bg starts, now it consists 3 twinks on each side and lets say 4 lvlers. Twinks continue to play bgs, meanwhile more twinks log in. They see there are bgs going on so they queue aswell and join the rest. The cycle continues, some twinks log out, some log in, they play bgs for most of the day.

Now consider another situation, twinks have separate bgs:

It's 11:00 AM, there are 2 twinks alliance side and 2 horde side. They queue up for a bg. They wait for 20-30mins, no bg pop up. 1 ally twink and 1 horde twink gets bored of waiting, so they log off. In their place come 2 other twinks each side. But still nothing changes, no bg, since the queue is 3:3. Twinks who waited from the start log out aswell, new come online and start their wait. For most of the day there are no bgs, they happen only in peak hours, because there are enough twinks to start bg.

You may say that's just my theory and it wouldn't be like that. But sadly, it would. The new fresh server opened recently (can't say the name due to warmane policy) has done exactly this, separated twinks from lvlers, and guess what happend? The exact situation I described. You may say that they perhaps had lower amount of twinks, but thats not the case either, because a lot, and I mean A LOT, of twinks transferred from warmane to that server, so the number of twinks there were simillar to what we have here.

Twinks do need levelers. Period. Without them twinking dies. And without twinks levelers probably won't do bgs either. It does not give you experience, you can't be queued for them and for rdf simulatenously, so nobody is gonna wait for over an hour for a bg to start, because that is just wasting time.

Where are you getting this information from? From my experience, this isn't true at all. The 60 bracket is more than capable of filling up battlegrounds with just twinks, and the 39 brackets is doing very well too. I don't know about other brackets, but I'd imagine they'd prefer to fight against twinks anyways.

And ask them how many bgs per day they play. They determine specific time to log in to play with each other, because otherwise they would face the same situation I've described above. I do twink myself and I don't want to be forced for a specific hour to play bgs. What if I'm busy at that time? Or I want to play in the morning, or at night? I simply can't, because there are not enough players to play with.

people don't go to icecrown for low level rdf's either, but they do pop. but yes yes, no one would do bg's cause #commonsense said so.

Well, they do, because it gives them exp. What's so hard to get? Ppl rush to lvl 80 and rdfs are great way to do it.

[Mnggal]

"buhu i get killed by 69 twinks in BGs and rage quit I want my own bracket waaah waaah."
Thats pretty much all I hear here.

[Heliox]

"buhu i get killed by 69 twinks in BGs and rage quit I want my own bracket waaah waaah."
Thats pretty much all I hear here.

Ppl are limiting themselves with some ridiculous rules and then complain about getting killed in bgs. It's like you would limit yourself to only furious gear and then complain that the full wrathful boys are destroying you.

[Skuddy]

Consider a situation:

It's 11:00 AM, there are 2 ally twinks online and 2 horde. They queue up for a bg. 10 minutes later the bg starts, it consist 3 lvlers and 2 twinks on each side. They play the bg for 20 minutes, it's quite balanced. During this time another 1 ally twink and 1 horde twink logged, they queue for a bg. Next bg starts, now it consists 3 twinks on each side and lets say 4 lvlers. Twinks continue to play bgs, meanwhile more twinks log in. They see there are bgs going on so they queue aswell and join the rest. The cycle continues, some twinks log out, some log in, they play bgs for most of the day.

Now consider another situation, twinks have separate bgs:

It's 11:00 AM, there are 2 twinks alliance side and 2 horde side. They queue up for a bg. They wait for 20-30mins, no bg pop up. 1 ally twink and 1 horde twink gets bored of waiting, so they log off. In their place come 2 other twinks each side. But still nothing changes, no bg, since the queue is 3:3. Twinks who waited from the start log out aswell, new come online and start their wait. For most of the day there are no bgs, they happen only in peak hours, because there are enough twinks to start bg.

You may say that's just my theory and it wouldn't be like that. But sadly, it would. The new fresh server opened recently (can't say the name due to warmane policy) has done exactly this, separated twinks from lvlers, and guess what happend? The exact situation I described. You may say that they perhaps had lower amount of twinks, but thats not the case either, because a lot, and I mean A LOT, of twinks transferred from warmane to that server, so the number of twinks there were simillar to what we have here.

Twinks do need levelers. Period. Without them twinking dies. And without twinks levelers probably won't do bgs either. It does not give you experience, you can't be queued for them and for rdf simulatenously, so nobody is gonna wait for over an hour for a bg to start, because that is just wasting time.

that's all well and good for the twinks. but there's 0 incentive for the levelers to join/stay in the bg, with the exception of maybe a healer. a regular leveler isn't going to have anywhere near the gear required to compete with a twink.

honestly don't know how many twinks there are kickin around as i've never payed any attention to them. i just know that everytime i've leveled a new toon, i attempt a few bg's as i'm leveling. and each time it was the same thing. twinks 1 or 2 shotting the levelers, camping the gy, and the levelers leave.

can't say for sure that more would que for bg's while leveling if twinks were removed from normal brackets, only way to know that would be to test it.

Well, they do, because it gives them exp. What's so hard to get? Ppl rush to lvl 80 and rdfs are great way to do it.

quests aren't far faster then rdf's unless you have a premade group(in my experience at least). my point was that people aren't joining icecrown for the low level rdf's, just as the person i quoted said they weren't joining for low level bg's. being able to que for both would be a big improvement for the bg scene, but that's another suggestion entirely.

"buhu i get killed by 69 twinks in BGs and rage quit I want my own bracket waaah waaah."
Thats pretty much all I hear here.

buhuhu i don't want to lose my easy hk's buhuhu.

[Heliox]

that's all well and good for the twinks. but there's 0 incentive for the levelers to join/stay in the bg, with the exception of maybe a healer. a regular leveler isn't going to have anywhere near the gear required to compete with a twink.

Well, for lvlers it's gonna be only few bgs, before they ding to 80 (and only for those who are willing extend the time before they get to end game). For twinks it's their whole gameplay, being a twink revolves around playing bgs. So you want to destroy the game for a whole community, just to make some levelers happy? Ok, that's your point of view, nevertheless I don't agree with it.

i just know that everytime i've leveled a new toon, i attempt a few bg's as i'm leveling. and each time it was the same thing. twinks 1 or 2 shotting the levelers, camping the gy, and the levelers leave.

Guess what, same **** happens when you join the high gs bracket with your 4,5k gs toon. You are getting smashed by shmourne players within seconds, yet nobody complains about that. And while you can just not join bgs as a lvler, since they are just for fun, you have to join bgs at 80 if you want to get pvp gear. So you are forced to get 2 shotted over and over again.

quests aren't far faster then rdf's unless you have a premade group(in my experience at least). my point was that people aren't joining icecrown for the low level rdf's, just as the person i quoted said they weren't joining for low level bg's.

They are not faster, unless you have preamde group OR have quests for a specific dungeon. And while they are not faster, they are not slower either, so why not queue for them and try to get some better items to speed up the leveling even more. At the same time bgs are just time wasters, since they give you nothing. So the choice is rather easy

buhuhu i don't want to lose my easy hk's buhuhu.

He is referring to lvl 60 twinks, and since they are twinks it's only their fault that they are being seen as "easy hk" by 69 lvl twinks, isn't it?

[Amdus]

Could you elaborate?

It has been well put on by Thorb and Heliox so far. I'd add only 2 things:

>In wotlk they added a feature were twink only would face twinks in BG's. If you had your exp locked you would enter the twink bracket and levelers were excluded from getting in. That was easy and viable because wow was at it's population peak and bg's happened all day long thanks to crossrealm.

>While all bg's are divided using the same method (x0-x9) Alterac valley goes like this: 51-60, 61-69, 70-79 and ultimately 80. This wasn't always the case, prior to 3.2 it used to go the same way for all brackets meaning: 51-60, 61-70 and 71-80.
"Wrath of the Lich King Patch 3.2.2 (2009-09-22): Level 80 characters now have their own bracket and there is a separate bracket for characters that are levels 70 to 79. The level of the bosses in the brackets below level 80 will be reduced to compensate. "

Spoiler: Show

You can find more information here: https://wow.gamepedia.com/Alterac_Valley

With this last one being said, you should already have AV for yourselves, and if it isn't maybe it's time to open a bugtracker report or make that suggestion instead.

[mier]

I believe it's still better to have a unbalanced BG of twinks mixed with levelers than having no BG at all.
When you seperate twinks from normal players then nothing will pop up and I guess we all agree that having no BG would be the worst case.

[SixxSyndrome]

Consider a situation:

It's 11:00 AM, there are 2 ally twinks online and 2 horde. They queue up for a bg. 10 minutes later the bg starts, it consist 3 lvlers and 2 twinks on each side. They play the bg for 20 minutes, it's quite balanced. During this time another 1 ally twink and 1 horde twink logged, they queue for a bg. Next bg starts, now it consists 3 twinks on each side and lets say 4 lvlers. Twinks continue to play bgs, meanwhile more twinks log in. They see there are bgs going on so they queue aswell and join the rest. The cycle continues, some twinks log out, some log in, they play bgs for most of the day.

Now consider another situation, twinks have separate bgs:

It's 11:00 AM, there are 2 twinks alliance side and 2 horde side. They queue up for a bg. They wait for 20-30mins, no bg pop up. 1 ally twink and 1 horde twink gets bored of waiting, so they log off. In their place come 2 other twinks each side. But still nothing changes, no bg, since the queue is 3:3. Twinks who waited from the start log out aswell, new come online and start their wait. For most of the day there are no bgs, they happen only in peak hours, because there are enough twinks to start bg.

You may say that's just my theory and it wouldn't be like that. But sadly, it would. The new fresh server opened recently (can't say the name due to warmane policy) has done exactly this, separated twinks from lvlers, and guess what happend? The exact situation I described. You may say that they perhaps had lower amount of twinks, but thats not the case either, because a lot, and I mean A LOT, of twinks transferred from warmane to that server, so the number of twinks there were simillar to what we have here.

Twinks do need levelers. Period. Without them twinking dies. And without twinks levelers probably won't do bgs either. It does not give you experience, you can't be queued for them and for rdf simulatenously, so nobody is gonna wait for over an hour for a bg to start, because that is just wasting time.



And ask them how many bgs per day they play. They determine specific time to log in to play with each other, because otherwise they would face the same situation I've described above. I do twink myself and I don't want to be forced for a specific hour to play bgs. What if I'm busy at that time? Or I want to play in the morning, or at night? I simply can't, because there are not enough players to play with.



Well, they do, because it gives them exp. What's so hard to get? Ppl rush to lvl 80 and rdfs are great way to do it.

I play on Warmane since 2011 and since Molten wiped us twice i couldn't be arsed to play 80s anymore. After the wipes i got rage and i made twinks, i only play twinks since then. I only have 2 80s one on each account that i recently geared just to help my twinks. But seriously twinks migrated from Warmane, classic and tbc items were removed from site (talking about vote points items) so twinking community got another kick in the ***. I get bored when i get on my twinks at this point, the only reason i am still playing is because i wanna get all achievement points i can get on my 60 twink prot worrior. Tho i am affraid at some point i will migrate to another server that has a bigger twink community or i will just simply quit this game in the end. Dunno why Warmane removed the low level items from store. They know twinks exists and many people only play twinks just like me. I cannot use 80's items from store on my 60s so the points i get from logging in are kinda useless for me. Many people quitted twink community or even the game because items were removed from site. Others i spoke to said they would twink if there were items they could get from store with points. Only thing i can do now is world pvp or achievements hunt.

[Mnggal]

Many people quitted twink community or even the game because items were removed from site. Others i spoke to said they would twink if there were items they could get from store with points. Only thing i can do now is world pvp or achievements hunt.

At 19 getting LFH or AGM isnt hard and is easily obtainable by playing the game.
Please dont give me the bull**** about "omg but all the 80s are camping AGM chest"

I mean im all for them adding stuff like lfh and agms to the coin shop but they aint hard to get if you play the game.
naxx gear is obviously locked behind coins and if you want em you invest money to get them

The point store was reworked when they removed the voting system and is extremely unlikely to get any new stuff added onto it since they refuse to add stuff to the coin shop even.