1. Player base getting smaller?

    I have been running around, giving people gear and weapons for good year now. I do it every month. One big buyouy on ah and give stuff for low. But. But now, i have seen less and less new people, all low lvls i see have main and heirloos. Past 2 months i have managed to help 8 low lvls, as before i did 20+ same day. So question is. Is icecrown dying? No new flow anymore?

  2. There are new players but most of those ''new'' guys are actually another smurfs or something just to trick you to get money,etc.

  3. I'm new, but already considering leaving because of the P2W structure.

    I donated to skip queue which doesn't bother me that much, i mean they have to make money to keep the server up. Later i then saw you could buy endgame & pvp gear, which totally ruins the experience for me :(

  4. I think it's partly because squish - no one wants to invest time if they know their fruit will be deleted.

    I'm new, but already considering leaving because of the P2W structure.
    If its P2W - name the items you can't get ingame by playing and not paying please. I'm trying to think of one, but I can't.
    Edited: February 13, 2020

  5. This is the counter-argument everyone uses when P2W is mentioned, ofcourse you can grind and get the same items, but what is the point if you can just buy the items and get it over with?

    This is the root cause of gearscore inflation, and it hurts battlegrounds when you just get stomped by P2W chars, since such a big percentage of the player base utilize the shop.

    I want progression to be on equal grounds, killing LK and gaining rare items have a lesser meaning since you could just skip this step by donating.

  6. This is the counter-argument everyone uses when P2W is mentioned, ofcourse you can grind and get the same items, but what is the point if you can just buy the items and get it over with?

    This is the root cause of gearscore inflation, and it hurts battlegrounds when you just get stomped by P2W chars, since such a big percentage of the player base utilize the shop.

    I want progression to be on equal grounds, killing LK and gaining rare items have a lesser meaning since you could just skip this step by donating.
    So you don't know what P2W means.

    Go play Lordaeron.

    Server is up almost 5 years since last wipe, people who never donated have BiS gear and SM's too. So how do you tell if someone farmed their gear or bought it after they destroy you? Every time you get killed you go look up enemy in Armory or something?

  7. So you don't know what P2W means.

    Go play Lordaeron.

    Server is up almost 5 years since last wipe, people who never donated have BiS gear and SM's too. So how do you tell if someone farmed their gear or bought it after they destroy you? Every time you get killed you go look up enemy in Armory or something?
    Are we in kindergarden?

    I can't comprehend where you want to go with your argument, but P2W = "Pay to win", if you pay x amount of currency and gain x amount advantage, it's by definition "Pay to win".

    I will decide what I choose to play, and I intend only to share my opinion on what ruins the experience.

    Unless you have an interesting point of view that adds to your argument, I think we are done :)

  8. You tell me.

    P2W means you can get stuff for real money that you cant reasonably get any other way. Doesn't fit.

    You decided and now you are throwing a tantrum about it.

    Yes we are done. :)

  9. Most players don't and won't ever donate. Past those, a lot will only ever donate once to get queue skipping on Icecrown. If you want to consider it "pay-to-win" it's up to you, but it's a cop out when your reasoning is "what's the point to play the game if you can use coins?," even more so when used to compare to others ("that guy has all the gear and didn't work for it, I'm triggered").

    The general expectation is that people play a game for their enjoyment. If you like the grind to get to end game you will enjoy playing it and how others got their gear shouldn't be an issue; if you don't like the grind and just want to play endgame, you have the option to skip all that and enjoy playing it. If someone's enjoyment exists only as a reflection of what others did, I'm puzzled how playing an MMO could ever be enjoyable. There will always be people ahead if you didn't join on day 1. There will always be people who got boosted or carried by friends or guilds. There are even people who will pay gold to be carried and get a title, achievement or loot drop (that's on retail as well).

    About this "pay-to-win" being to blame for "gearscore inflation" (gearscore...), considering the first point, that's already false due to the amount of people donating not being the majority. The server also has higher rates that make it easier for people to get gear, which can be gear that will be high enough to let them in stuff they aren't skilled enough to handle. But the major factor in it is a raid leader either wanting to be carried or not wanting to carry others, because of that. Ridiculous requirements are a safety net for a bad raid leader to get carried or to be sure that even bad players will deal and take enough damage that they won't ruin the run. Still, as always, the solution to that is within anyone's reach, yet so few don't pretend they can't see it at their faces: create your own raids with reasonable requirements.

    Regarding the main point of the topic: we still have peak times and queues the same as before, so I can't see how you've assumed the playerbase is getting smaller.

  10. I think it's partly because squish - no one wants to invest time if they know their fruit will be deleted.



    If its P2W - name the items you can't get ingame by playing and not paying please. I'm trying to think of one, but I can't.
    Man, your statement about the gold squish is straight ******ed! I don't get it how people still whine about squish being unfair to them, as they grinded all year to farm X amount of gold. Even if we ignore the intelligence behind playing WoW to farm gold, this argument is still invalid AF, as purely economically this squish HURTS NO ONE. It is reducing each and every player's current gold in half, which means that in regard of VALUE, all things expect ingame stuff like mounts, chopper parts, vendor stuff you buy for gold - REMAIN EQUAL VALUE WISE If you have 100k, and 1Primordial Saronite is worth 1k gold now, after the squish you will have 50k gold and one primordial saronite will cost 500 gold or so. Same with all mats and player-farmed-and-sold materials. Sick of PVE players and farming players with 5 spells on bars with an average IQ of 65 screaming dramatic stuff about this, which is just a normal precaution to fight ingame inflation.
    Edited: February 13, 2020

  11. Man, your statement about the gold squish is straight ******ed! I don't get it how people still whine about squish being unfair to them, as they grinded all year to farm X amount of gold. Even if we ignore the intelligence behind playing WoW to farm gold, this argument is still invalid AF, as purely economically this squish HURTS NO ONE. It is reducing each and every player's current gold in half, which means that in regard of VALUE, all things expect ingame stuff like mounts, chopper parts, vendor stuff you buy for gold - REMAIN EQUAL VALUE WISE If you have 100k, and 1Primordial Saronite is worth 1k gold now, after the squish you will have 50k gold and one primordial saronite will cost 500 gold or so. Same with all mats and player-farmed-and-sold materials. Sick of PVE players and farming players with 5 spells on bars with an average IQ of 65 screaming dramatic stuff about this, which is just a normal precaution to fight ingame inflation.
    You are wrong. First 2 squishes gave some fruit to remove gold farmed on x7 rates. Last one did nothing of what you are talking about. Neither will this.

    Actual fact is that after squish prices slowly dropped after halving hyperinflated prices caused by squish. They dropped very slowly(reason for that - probably gold from banks that was forced back into economy due squish - drains out), from, example, item 250g then it dropped to 190 till the end of Aug and then started to slowly raise again(reason for that - probably impending squish). So you are saying that people couldnt farm enough gold in 9 months to cause inflation, but then, suddenly, they could?

    All squish does is double gold number on prices before squish and then "fixes" it back to normal price. And you say that's a great thing?

    I can see that with 65 IQ, then what does it make you?
    Edited: February 13, 2020

  12. I'm new, but already considering leaving because of the P2W structure.

    I donated to skip queue which doesn't bother me that much, i mean they have to make money to keep the server up. Later i then saw you could buy endgame & pvp gear, which totally ruins the experience for me :(
    Maybe its better to switch to Lordearon then, you cant buy gear there. As for p2w a lot of people pick Icecrown specifically because they can buy gear. At the end of the day even retail is p2w now so this is pretty normalise nowadays.

    P.S. Dont waste time arguing with angrylol its complete pointless.
    Edited: February 13, 2020


  13. P.S. Dont waste time arguing with angrylol its complete pointless.
    Sure its pointless if he doesn't have argument, just some feelings about it.

  14. hyperinflated prices caused by squish
    The prices are inflated because unlike real economics (which some people love to tip their fedora while "applying" here), gold is spontaneously generated and "production" is just going farm some infinitely respawning stuff, with no cost in personal, no maintenance, no shortages or anything else that affect real economics. As more people hoard gold, the greedier keep kicking prices up to "control the market," turning it into something only established players have any chance to make use of. While the effects might be short-lived (which is a whole different subject), it does means that for a period of time prices won't be an AH version of "LFM Dreadmines GS 6k+."

  15. The prices are inflated because unlike real economics (which some people love to tip their fedora while "applying" here), gold is spontaneously generated and "production" is just going farm some infinitely respawning stuff, with no cost in personal, no maintenance, no shortages or anything else that affect real economics. As more people hoard gold, the greedier keep kicking prices up to "control the market," turning it into something only established players have any chance to make use of. While the effects might be short-lived (which is a whole different subject), it does means that for a period of time prices won't be an AH version of "LFM Dreadmines GS 6k+."
    Maybe, but if that were the case prices would start to go up instantly after stabilizing after squish. But they actually drop. I find it hard to believe there is some magic involved that makes everyone spend their gold after 9 months farming it, like a clockwork. More believeble explanation would be that people start to hoard things for the next squish, it is announced or not - at this point it is irrelevant.

    What actually controls market is relatively new players and the amount of gold they can farm in certain amount of time, lets say 1 month. My control is limited, all I can do is push to the maximum. Excluding some odd anecdotes I cant sell my gems for more than someone is willing to pay for them(he spends time to farm it himself or buy from me). And deposit costs exists for exactly this reason.

    Probably with time things would get more expensive, but what is the number, because it is not 50% each year, and I doubt its even 10%, but cant tell anything because squish taints all the results.

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