WotLK Tired of sub, going back to Assassination PvP, need answers from skilled players

[bumchaka]

sts + dbw is more than fine. atleast half of your damage is still physical as mut. also dbw s active lasts 30sec

i used double 1.8 for the extra damage with this spec https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#f0g...bfbh0zb:TGrmzV. this was a personal prefference so it might not be the very best setup
/you can drop 2p from dual wield spec and put em in heightened senses if you run into lots of rogues
/wound on offhand for insta slow
/sprint glyph is mandatory in arena for that fast sap/positioning/chasing etc
/prep glyph for the extra disarm

go for 5%hit, 900+ resil then full ap. assa stuggles in 3s so i d recommend avoiding this bracket

don t bother with haste

pve offparts with arp are always good

test with the items you have before buying something else and see what works

have fun dude

@robycucu If you had to take 2 points out of something for 2/2 Blood Splatter what would you take it from? Out of curiosity. Since we see so many platers around bleed effects seem to be very relevant. Thanks

Edit: Second question in your opinion. How crucial is having the Dual Wield Specialization ability? It seems extremely important but then I've seen some mut builds not taking any points into it at all.

[ihfhfaiofsaoif]

https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#f0e...roIuZZxbrbuhzb

Built with blood splatter.

Mutilate is not your main source of dmg, that’s why dualwield specialization and lethality ain’t not your primary talent choices. They are good vs targets with low armor - basicly only mages but no matter how you spec your assa, it will always struggle vs mages due to limited uptime on your killtarget. Aside from that specific scenario, envenom/poisons are your main dmg source that’s why the built I’ve posted is designed about putting your target in a wheelchair and keeping constant pressure on it. Additionally in the current 284 meta, you will face a lot of plate wearers, high armor targets which makes talents that boost your physical dmg even worse.

[bumchaka]

https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#f0e...roIuZZxbrbuhzb

Built with blood splatter.

Mutilate is not your main source of dmg, that’s why dualwield specialization and lethality ain’t not your primary talent choices. They are good vs targets with low armor - basicly only mages but no matter how you spec your assa, it will always struggle vs mages due to limited uptime on your killtarget. Aside from that specific scenario, envenom/poisons are your main dmg source that’s why the built I’ve posted is designed about putting your target in a wheelchair and keeping constant pressure on it. Additionally in the current 284 meta, you will face a lot of plate wearers, high armor targets which makes talents that boost your physical dmg even worse.

Touche!!! I love the look of this build actually, that's a huge help. I may consider moving the 3 points in find weakness to something else geared towards my play style but i dig the build. I appreciate the explanation you gave on the dual wield spec as well.

One last question, what's your opinion on the 1.8/1.8 daggers vs 1.8/1.4? From what I've read and gathered it should be x2 1.8? Your Thoughts?

Thanks again

[Overloard99]

Touche!!! I love the look of this build actually, that's a huge help. I may consider moving the 3 points in find weakness to something else geared towards my play style but i dig the build. I appreciate the explanation you gave on the dual wield spec as well.

One last question, what's your opinion on the 1.8/1.8 daggers vs 1.8/1.4? From what I've read and gathered it should be x2 1.8? Your Thoughts?

Thanks again

I think you should use 1.8 with 1.4 or 1.5 speed. Mainly because of crippling poison and such. But since you already got crippling poison as your talent, I guess it should go higher for more damage.

Idk I just thought going for lowest speed in off hand should be better since off hand has like 20% of miss or whatever it is.

[robycucu]

@robycucu If you had to take 2 points out of something for 2/2 Blood Splatter what would you take it from? Out of curiosity. Since we see so many platers around bleed effects seem to be very relevant. Thanks

Edit: Second question in your opinion. How crucial is having the Dual Wield Specialization ability? It seems extremely important but then I've seen some mut builds not taking any points into it at all.

Sorry for the late reply.
I don t like to rely on bleed damage so i wouldn t even consider taking that talent. It s useful against rogues to make restealthing harder or leaving a dot on a target you can t chase but the damage is meh.
Regarding dw spec. You use mutilate all day so why not boost its damage?

[ihfhfaiofsaoif]

Because the points are better spend on talents that increases envenom dmg / uptime / combopoint-/energy regeneration. DW spez is just useful vs mages. Against anything else, mutilate will hit like a wet noodle no matter if you have it talented or not. So why would you spend 4 points into a talent that only helps vs 1 class, which will still hard counter you, no matter with or w/o dw spez.
Against anything else, envenom is the way to go, that’s why 3/3 in FA and FW are much better spend.

[Franzpijo]

Better use offsets with haste or arpr?

[Greedman45]

Better use offsets with haste or arpr?

Haste all the way. 75% of your dmg aint going to be physical

[upenex]

I do assa pvp alot.
Go with fast offhand 1.4 since it will stack deadly faster, and once its stacked it will do mainhand dmg aswell
Also going for Dualwield talents u need 2 slow daggers, i use those points somehwere else, sine im 1.8 / 1.4 combo

[somasundara]

Hey Mate...

Quite informative post..Can you also suggest a viable talent tree focusing mainly on Envenom spams..also when i am tunneling 5cp envenom vs 5cp rupture on plates..what do you suggest.

Thanks !

[somasundara]

I agree with some parts, I disagree with others.

1) STS + DV , double DV , STS+WFS. You could even go STS+dbw since your wfs is on normal. Stay away from Herkumi/Taij for pvp, both are complete garbage. Don't be scared of armor penetration, some of your bis items have armor penetration anyway (PP belt, marrow boots).

2) 1.8+1.4, don't go double 1.8. Heaven's Fall/1.8 WF dagger in main hand, Lungbreaker/1.4 WF dagger in offhand. Up to you.

3) 1k+ resil in 2's/bg's/wpvp, 1150+ in 3's and soloq. Most of your gems should be resil for yellow+blue, ap+resil for red

4) Your talents are bad, the linked talents from the above poster are also mediocre. Glyph of Envenom is a waste of a glyph slot (not a great one, but still, sprint/CoS/tott/Vigor are all decent for the 3rd slot) not to mention the 3% damage and reduced poison damage on yourself that you're skipping. Bloodspatter, however, is viable and does a fairly decent job against the amount of platers doing PvP.

Tuskar's Vitality does not provide the same amount of movement speed as Sure Footed. If you don't like Sure Footed go for Quick Recovery, or if you plan on playing a lot solo you can even fetch improved kidney. Quick Recovery is also great against classes that dodge a lot, like ferals or hunters. I also don't see the point in going 5/5 in Deadliness instead of picking up Find Weakness instead, which point for point is a stronger talent. I'm fairly certain that Lethality is also better than Deadliness.

Also in the talents linked ifhf I don't see the point of 3/3 in Initiative. You won't be restealthing as often as a sub, you do a bit more tunneling. Focused Attacks is also not the best talent around. This would be my suggestion with Blood Spatter since you want to play that: https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#f0e...cuZ0hZebfbh0zb

These talents are somewhat customized for your playstyle. I personally play 3/3 Deadened Nerves instead of 3/3 Find Weakness since I'm mostly playing soloq and I'm playing Sure Footed just for some easier kiting.

The talents you can play around depending on your playstyle are (for the most part):
Currently in the talent tree (not necessarily maxed out): Lethality, Improved Poisons, Quick Recovery, Murder, Find Weakness, Dual Wield Specialization, Master of Deception
Not in the talent tree: Sure Footed, Deadened Nerves, Focused Attacks, Setup, Heightened Sense, Initiative

If you want to lurk around wpvp, fetch Heightened Sense as well and just drop some damage from somewhere (1 point from lethality, 1 from DW specialization and 1 from FW for example). If you want to just kill somebody in a kidney, drop Master of Deception and get some extra damage. The talents above are interchangeable, everything else is pretty much mandatory. Hope this post helps.

Hey Mate...

Quite informative post..Can you also suggest a viable talent tree focusing mainly on Envenom spams..also when i am tunneling 5cp envenom vs 5cp rupture on plates..what do you suggest.

Thanks !

[ihfhfaiofsaoif]

My favorite spec: If you face lots of stealth, feel free to put points from initative to master of detection.
https://wotlk.evowow.com/?talent#f0e...ZZxbrbuhzb:TrG

This spec is basically maximum output via envenom spam - however dont spam envenom. Instead stack 5cp wait for maximum energy and trinket procs, then spam envenom. env->muti->env->muti->env.

When waiting for procs, make sure you try to shiv/crippling as much enemys as reachable. Rupture can be used esp. while tunneling a target. Feel free to use SnD b4 swapping targets or while tunneling hpal, dpriests, rshamans. Pushback can be great esp. when combining it with mind numb poison.

When having a target low already (>60%hp), you wont kill anything If you start spamming you dmg. Again pool CP/energy, optimal having your priest lowfearing the killtarget (vs. healers/locks+pet great) b4 you start killing target.

Put 2x 1.8, wound on offhand to be able to shiv cripp/wound.

If found myself improving alot in 2s, once I realized that thinking ahead of about 10 to 15s regarding my CDs/trinkets, is the key of playing as rogue and lowfear on healer is basically the main strat to kill.

[Nmnm]

https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#f0ecoeTo...Zebfbh0dbM:TiG
1.8/1.4 daggers, deadly offhand. Never go 5/5 seal fate and 2/2 deadly brew if u use mutilate 1.8/1.4.

[phrias]

To be clear, there are 2 spes: evenom and the old assa.

The first is base on poison and evenom, the second on mutilate.

Evenom spe is suppose to hit like truck even on plate, it's a tricky spe because with poison you can't use blind like a tard, futhermore you are visible. In this case I prefere use 1,4/1,8 weapons to stacks poison more quickly. ( and not spamming kriss)

Old assa spe use the same poison as sub spe, the goal of this spe is too stack attack power/ crit. You have more control in this spe than evenom because you can use blind without matter. But you'll have some problem vs plate gear. There are some people who use this spe with full arp.

I suggest you to look at akrios video like (he use both spe, evenom in arena, assa in some 1 vs 1): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2WefYizuAY


To prevent damage for war, don't dismantle when he bs, use feint + eva. Use dismantle when you are under pressure or when he use his zerk spell which allow him to crit. I personnaly think with two spe are way more skill demanding than sub.

[zheleznikaa]

I know the main topic here is going away from Sub, but can anyone shed some light on the best off hand for sub pvp? When using Heaven's Fall as a main hand.
Lungbreaker or Scourgeborne Axe?