New meta for Retri Pal or typical ninjalooter

[angrylol]

Don't make pug raid leader decide who should get item, just cause for player #1 it will be a 1,51% dps upgrade, but for player #2 it will be 3,01% dps upgrade. They are both allowed to roll for this item.

Good to know, I'll just roll on GTS because it gives me 1.8% dps increase on my TTW. It's an upgrade.

[Frostwolf011]

Good to know, I'll just roll on GTS because it gives me 1.8% dps increase on my TTW. It's an upgrade.

Except DBW is a physical damage dealer trinket(and rets are physical damage dealers), while GTS is an obvious healer trinket.
Soooo... Pretty bad analogy.

[angrylol]

Well mp5 is a dps increase too for some classes, it's not primary or desired stat, same as ARP on retri, maybe this is a good analogy?

[Frostwolf011]

Nope. You probably meant spirit since it adds crit or sp for some casters. mp5 doesn't contribute to damage at all...
Or did I miss some Warmane specific buff where mp5 adds something to the offensive stats?

[angrylol]

What, if i can skip Dispersion/evocation/whatever and do dps during that time because my mp5 makes it possible, isn't that a dps increase?

[Derbba]

Angrylol, your comments are all over. But. Spirit haste items 200-232 are bis for some dps. Mp5 not. Also in pug raid, all is for roll if not said otherwise. Roll pally or shaman.. doesent matter, they won. If its + for them. Its +. Pug does not roll bis < rest.

[Frostwolf011]

You can't get enough mp5 to get even a mana for an extra spell without tanking your dps noticeably. Yet again, crappy analogy.
On the other hand a pala replacing the 245 eot trinket for DBW will see a noticeable increase in dps at least because of the proc.
Eof physical dps trinket might be better than dbw for paladins but not enough for people to cry ninja like they are on this thread.

[angrylol]

Yeye right.
Taking item with stats that are not great, but is still dps increase is not ninja,
but
Taking item with stats that are not great, but is still dps increase is ninja,

did I get it right? or we are replacing 245 eot trinket on pala, but 277 proper dps ring with 277 healer ring on caster or what is going on here? Replacing 245 ring with 264 healer ring - even with mp5 its a dps increase. Is it not? Aren't we here talking about principle, so why wouldn't it apply to all items? Why just one item and one class?

[Griseggra]

Go to sleep angrylol.

[angrylol]

Cmon, its legit question, logic underneath is the same, so what is the difference?

[Frostwolf011]

Cmon, its legit question, logic underneath is the same, so what is the difference?

No honey, your logic is non existent, because:

Arp is not great. MP5 is useless.

Yeah, it is that simple.

[angrylol]

You don't get it.

item = upgrade (dbw for retri)
item = upgrade (mp5 ring for mage)

dbw will increase dps of retri pala
mp5 ring will increase dps of mage

It's not just about mp5, same as its not just about arp. And mp5 is not useless, in longer fight will will tick up nicely, can mean difference if mage can keep dps or he has to evocation.

So is there like some % dmg or % of items potential, where is the line?

Try to base your "it's that simple" in some logic sweetheart.

[Vilya]

If You wanna argue about about utility of ARP for Retri vs utility of Mp5 for mage, yea, discussion is quite pointless. You know and we know that its nto equal.

And mp5 will never be an upgrade for mage in raid-tier gear.

DBW for retri topic comes every few days/weeks on forum and there are people for/aganist it, as usual. Seems like this war will never end. Imo, they should roll for it, cause it's according to rules - ninja is when someone takes item 1) not for his spec, 2) its not upgrade. DBW is Ok for retri and it can be upgrade. So as long as its not aganist the rules, shouldnt it be allowed?

[Frostwolf011]

And again bad analogy.
If you want to make it a good comparison then use at least the items that have the same impact on the dps: Might of Blight for rets and Incarnadine Band of Mending for mages. Or compare DBW with GTS/Sliver of Pure Ice.

It's not just about mp5, same as its not just about arp. And mp5 is not useless, in longer fight will will tick up nicely, can mean difference if mage can keep dps or he has to evocation.

That means that your group doesn't have a ret/shaman/spriest/anyone with some sort of mana buff if your mage is going oom. That would mean that you have larger issues than who is rolling for what.

[angrylol]

You guys need to try to keep up, you got stuck on "mp5".

If you are saying "retri can roll for dbw if its an upgrade" then you have to let mages roll for mp5 items if they are upgrades for them. It's that simple. You cant have it one way there and another way somewhere else. Analogy is perfect, other spec can use arp better and other specs can use mp5 better. But you say "no its not like that", and mage rolling on mp5 rin IS a ninja.

So? You look at it from some "efficiency in slot", dbw for rets is some 80% efficiency in slot and mp5 ring from marrow on ttw mage is some 70% efficiency. So cutoff is somewhere above 70% and under 80% when its starts to 'thats not ninja, it's an upgrade"? Thats the only logical reasoning i can come uo with why dbw is ok for retri and mp5 ring is not ok for mage.

Maybe you can explain the process in detail and precision so no one ever does ninja and everything is clear which items go to whom.