Hello everyone,
As you can see from the title, my suggestion would be to make mercenary mode active for both factions. Right now, there is absolutely no logical reason mercenary mode is only usable on alliance. When you actually think about it, it's very odd only the other faction can use this system.
The original argument of making mercenary mode was to shorten the BG queues for alliance players, which has been achieved to some extend. In my experience horde still has a tiny bit shorter queues but the situation is not even nearly as bad as it used to be; easily 15 minute queues for alliance. By activating mercenary mode for horde players aswell, the queue times for both factions would get even shorter, because solo and small pm horde players would fill in all the open spots holding back a BG from starting.
Alliance PVP guilds fight against each other with the help of mercenary mode. They often make a 30/20 man group, divide it and fight each other inside BGs by using the system. They often make mixed groups aswell, getting people from all other guilds to join in the fun. Denying such an opportunity from horde is not acceptable. You could argue horde can do it in Dire Maul or some other place but it's not even nearly the same thing. You can't really ress, takes forever to get everyone ready for each fight after deaths and a constant worry of multiboxers or alliance raids crashing such events is a reality. There's no other choice for horde but to organize fights like that against alliance guilds and players, who don't even need horde to play BGs since they can just do mixed fights among themselves. If alliance PVP guilds wanted, they could never organize a single fight against horde ever again and just play with each other with mercenary, and horde would be left with no “end game” BG content at all. And horde already barely gets any. Situation will get worse when time goes forward. This will eventually affect the balance between factions and WPvP, more of that later.
There is a rather new Warmane PVP discord server and there has been a discussion of a PVP tournament, possibly even with the help of GMs. Maybe some of you GMs have heard of it, not sure. However, even if there was no GMs included in hosting such a tournament, the only way for every horde guild to be part of it too is with mercenary mode. Quite impossible without it, horde can't fight each other inside BGs and Dire Maul will not be a good solution for the entire tournament, for aforesaid obvious reasons. Horde guilds and players could use the system for their own creative ways to make events and such, much like alliance is doing now, to revive the PVP community on horde a bit.
There is also a rather big disbalance in WPvP between the factions. There are far more lone wolves roaming the zones on the alliance side and since most of the PVP players are alliance, the faction can form a defensive group against big horde raids much faster. Also in my experience, alliance city raids are far more common and horde barely has the people to make a group against them, eventually making the alliance leave by mere boredom rather than getting wiped. By allowing mercenary mode for horde players, there might be a small amount of PVP players willing to switch to the horde side, as I know a few players that are on alliance just because of mercenary mode, even some guilds are alliance partly due to mercenary mode. This could make the WPvP scene a bit more balanced. This is of course my opinion only, as I enjoy WPvP alot and the current situation doesn't really encourage it, since there is absolutely 0 upsides of being a horde PVPer but 1 upside of being an alliance PVPer. Talking about mercenary mode obviously. I also know that many people couldn't care less about WPvP so this argument doesn't appeal those people.
The only question that I really have is; why? Why is it that only the other faction has this mechanic but the other does not? Because I see no reasoning behind this anymore after the BG queues have been somewhat fixed. Even Blackrock used to have this system in place, where both factions could play on either side of the BG. I see zero negative features arising by implementing this system. Right now the other faction seems a bit more privileged purely because of why the system was implemented in the first place. I know nothing of programming or anything related to that but I don't think it would be too big of a job since the system is already in place and has been for both factions in the past on Blackrock.
I hope I will cause some discussion around this topic.
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Member
Mercenary mode for both factions
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Member
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Please, Warmane, this would do so much good not only for the Horde but for the whole server.
Just make a flexible system for us, and we the players will have room to organize a wide variety of events for the PvP community at an unprecedented scale.
I can guarantee that if such a change would be made, , whether we're talking about noobs or pros, the PvP activity on Horde will increase drastically, and that would surely mean more donations. I know a lot of PvP players who just donate full gear on new characters just because their friends/guild told them that they are lacking a certain class/role. I think this is a win/win situation for everyone.
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Moderator
It isn't just one side, as far as I'm aware. It fills in empty Battleground spots with the opposing faction. All that happens is that hardly ever (or never) it's a case that there are too many Horde for too few Alliance queued, it's the opposite that happens, so Alliances are pulled to the Horde side to fill that group. You seem to be under the impression that Alliance turns on Mercenary mode and gets to pick to play as Horde, when that's not what happens, it's an automated shuffling to fill gaps.
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Member
You are missing the point. We don't care about who is playing what faction while we're in BG.
If allies gather 30 people, split into 2 teams of 15 and then queue for lets say AB, and they communicate to each other BG Queue number (enter AB number 2, not AB number 8) so they can face off in a fair fight, ofc they don't control what faction they will be playing (unless only one team has mercenary mode turned on), but they have absolute total control over who they are fighting against, and that gives them A LOOOOOOT of options. It's unfair that Hordes have to communicate and organize with the Alliance to have these fights, when obviously there is tension between both factions and its very complicated to get these things going, and at the same time the Alliance can just do whatever they want by themselves as often as they want.
We want that kind of flexibility to widen our options on what we could do on Horde PvP side. There is just so much that can be done with this system, and it's kind of leaving us Hordes feeling left out and irrelevant to the staff when see the Alliance having such a wide variety of Perks that we don't get to have on Horde simply because we picked the wrong side... A lot of us don't even believe that it's possible to get mercenary mode just by asking, because we think Warmane doesn't even care.
PS: Ever since mercenary came out, I've been very active everyday, and I've never ever, not a single time been put on Alliance team while queuing as Horde. And I do have mercenary mode turned on.Edited: December 3, 2020
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Moderator
No, you're missing the point. The system does nothing of what you expect it to. There's no "turning on for Horde" that will accomplish what you expect. Again, all it does is fill the side lacking people with players from the side with a surplus, nothing else. It doesn't create groups or anything of what you're thinking about. Nothing of what you're writing has to do with Mercenary Mode.
Regarding your PS, I already explained why. It never happens that there are too many Horde queued, it's always too many Alliance. Unless you queue some day when there's too few Alliance queued and too many Horde, you're never going to play Alliance because that side isn't needing fillers. That's exactly what you're not understanding of the system, it's automated, not something you decide you want. Even if I'm mistaken about it being active on both sides, having it active on Horde wouldn't achieve what you want due to the queues always being heavy on the Alliance side only.
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Member
Dear Moderators,
I also agree that mercenary mode should be available for both factions. Players of the alliance have a lot more experience in pvp because alliance pvp guilds can practice in friendly matches, whereas horde are forced to fight randoms most of the time which makes BGs super boring.
I am a firm believer in equality. Mercenary should be available for both factions or should not exist at all.
Thank you for your time.
Regards.
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Member
I am aware of how the system works, atleast that's what I think. However, if it actually worked properly like that, horde queues, even as 15 man premade would always be 0.1 seconds, since there is a huge surplus of players on the opposite faction. I remember getting in WSG to fight for alliance as a horde character when Blackrock still had the system and that server has always been 75% alliance, so that's getting me confused why it couldn't be implemented now. Anyway, even if it worked 100% like you said, there would be no negative impacts on implementing it on the horde side aswell. Quite the contrary, if you take a look at all the other arguments I made in the original post.
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Member
What you are describing to me is how this flawed system works, and the purpose of this thread is to get the Staff to change the code to make it a fair system for everyone. Lets not argue about apples and oranges. This isn't a matter of whether this can be done or not, because we all know that it can since we've seen it on other servers, its a matter of whether or not Warmane is ready to change the code at the request of its community.
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Moderator
Quite the contrary. The more Alliances there are, the longer the queue times will be for Horde, because the surplus is being used to fill the Horde side instead of waiting for Horde players, so it's Alliance players who are getting it fast, but when the surplus is over and all Alliances are in a match, playing for both sides, the next batch of queued players has to wait.
The thing, as I've told Goblin twice already, is that what's on your original post wouldn't realistically happen while, per your own numbers, Horde are only 25% of the PvPers. Horde is the side that requires filling spots for matches to happen faster. Maybe you'd get a statistical anomaly once in a blue moon and by chance, right then and there, it would be a case where there would be too few Alliances queued, while Horde had the surplus, but chances are that wouldn't be anywhere as reliable as what you expect on your first post.
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Member
I respectfully disagree. If it actually worked like that, there would be no 10 min queues still for alliance players with mercenary mode turned off (yes there still is), while at the same time there's an AB starting with alliance players enabling mercenary mode fighting for both factions.
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Member
Hello, I also agree horde should have mercenary mode, when alliance are organizing BGs to fight each other, horde can't really play at those times because of long queues... I would be really happy If horde finally gets mercenary mode.
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Member
What about removing it instead, letting the factions balance themselves alone?
So we won't have 90% of the pvp base playing alliance. Plus the disappearing of other related problems/bugs.
Let's play like it's supposed to be, Horde vs Alliance.
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Member
I've never ONCE seen a horde player on an alli team. It's entirely one way. Like everything else in the state of pvp. What you did was fail to solve the problem you were attempting to solve, and created another problem that didn't exist before. You 'solved' a problem the alliance alone were experiencing because so many players are all huddled up on one side clinging to their racial and double heroic pve trinkets. And you 'solved' it by allowing them to be pawned off on the lowly horde scum to **** with our bgs (afking, actively sabotaging, or leaving us shorthanded). You solved the problems of the advantaged by making the disadvantaged position even worse. Hmmm, what does all of this remind me of? Positively brilliant.
/sarcasm off
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Member
Having it active on horde wouldn't do anything, because MM was designed and implemented with only one objective. Help the poor allies with their Q problem...which is CREATED by the racial imbalance. Wow.
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Member
There. Right there. You guys wanted stats? This is a stat straight from a moderator.
Right HERE is your problem. Stop trying to 'fix' the problems further down stream. Fix THIS problem, and the other ones go away.
It's not a two faction game if 3/4 of the pvpers are all packed up on one side. This is ridiculous. How can the conversation even go on after this statement? You just posted the ENTIRE problem while arguing about how to sove a problem that THIS problem created. Again...Wow.
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