1. Battleground premade & fun

    Im curious, what drives you to play full premade team on small battlegrounds, when 99% teams have absolutely zero chance to win against you, just want to understand, how people get fun from it.

    I play here for good few years and there more and more guild premades coming on bg, like OD, TKT, IA etc. so I was tempted to join some pvp guild, been in three bigger pvp guilds, there was alyways same story, some randoms on guild chat starts to search for bis people to bash randoms on bg.

    99% battlegrounds looks the same, we are full bis team (average 6.5k gearscore), against non premade(average 5.5k gearscore). I was standing at enemy GY, waiting for this one big shot to do any damage cause opponents were melting faster than ice in the 300C oven, as a healer even less action cause nothing to heal when enemy is dead and do zero damage. Tryed hard to find that fun in these battlegrounds, but couldn't, was extremely boring.

    Is this all only to snipe that 1% of battlegrounds which tends to be more about class composition than skill, where 10 titled gladiators have bare chances against better composition of 10 donors? Or there other reasons? If so write a comment please to help me understand how to get fun from it cause I don't want to quit this game :D

  2. how people get fun from it.
    Winning is fun, simple as.

  3. Well I don't know about anyone else but personally I find that queuing with friends is similar to using a raiding guild instead of pugs.

  4. It's one thing to queue with few friends (5 man premades), and have some fun, do thingies together. But what the author and myself are wondering, how are those people enjoying playing without a challenge, staying on a spawn camping some random schmucks? Is that virtual number of hks that important that you grind it mindlessly everyday ruining the beauty of pvp?

    For me personally I don't have anything against 5 man premades, but warmane really ought to do something (e.g. disable AVenabler) about those 10-15+ man premades . Just yesterday we played AV against horde for 70 minutes, because they were bunkered up at spot where they have terrain advantage, and they don't care about winning or losing, just the magical number of hks. It's mind boggling how can someone enjoy doing that every day.

  5. I have no idea how people enjoy it either. BGs these days are unplayable. You're either part of a premade, or you're fighting against a premade. The results are the same, camping GYs. I recommend just going to blackrock, and don't upgrade any gear or make a Icecrown toon with only relentless/toc25 hc gear, and you'll be placed in the mid-tier bracket where you won't run into premades, if you enjoy BGs.

    It's especially bad if you play Alliance, because 90% of the time you'll end up in an AV premade farm fest that goes on for an hour, with people constantly leaving and joining. So, you either spend an hour getting farmed, or you leave and get the deserter buff.

    Eventually they'll drive all but the premades away, and people will just stop queuing BGs (which is what I have done) altogether.

  6. It's one thing to queue with few friends (5 man premades), and have some fun, do thingies together. But what the author and myself are wondering, how are those people enjoying playing without a challenge, staying on a spawn camping some random schmucks? Is that virtual number of hks that important that you grind it mindlessly everyday ruining the beauty of pvp?

    For me personally I don't have anything against 5 man premades, but warmane really ought to do something (e.g. disable AVenabler) about those 10-15+ man premades . Just yesterday we played AV against horde for 70 minutes, because they were bunkered up at spot where they have terrain advantage, and they don't care about winning or losing, just the magical number of hks. It's mind boggling how can someone enjoy doing that every day.
    Actually I've done plenty of 10-15, even 20-30 man premades with friends. It makes achievements like we had it all along a whole lot easier to control and from having been on the HK farming side I can tell you it's not usually a planned out thing but when we keep catching people in odd places instead of holding objectives it's pretty easy to take all but one base and then camp it. And yet I still solo queue the majority of the time now days without too much hassle. I can raise my odds of winning to the point that I'll win several BGs in a row with relatively minimal effort: I heal and I run an overlay map so I can see who needs reminded to stop fighting between objectives. If I do decide to go shadow then I do a fair bit of off healing and play more defense. I do these things because Horde has lacked healers for the last few years, DPS love chasing people into BFE instead of playing objectives and hardly anyone defends.

    Also you guys know you can dodge premades right? You just wait 5-10 minutes and you'll be in a different queue cycle for usually the next few hours.

  7. Actually I've done plenty of 10-15, even 20-30 man premades with friends. It makes achievements like we had it all along a whole lot easier to control and from having been on the HK farming side I can tell you it's not usually a planned out thing but when we keep catching people in odd places instead of holding objectives it's pretty easy to take all but one base and then camp it. And yet I still solo queue the majority of the time now days without too much hassle. I can raise my odds of winning to the point that I'll win several BGs in a row with fairly minimal effort: I heal and I run an overlay map so I can see who needs reminded to stop fighting between objectives. If I do decide to go shadow then I do a fair bit of off healing and play more defense. I do these things because Horde has lacked healers for the last few years, DPS love chasing people into BFE instead of playing objectives and hardly anyone defends.

    Also you guys know you can dodge premades right? You just wait 5-10 minutes and you'll be in a different queue cycle for usually the next few hours.
    The people we're talking about isn't doing it for the achievs, they already have those. They just farm hks. Several of them have millions of HKs, and they do nothing but farm AV all day, every day. It's been going on for over two years now. Same people. Every single day.

  8. The people we're talking about isn't doing it for the achievs, they already have those. They just farm hks. Several of them have millions of HKs, and they do nothing but farm AV all day, every day. It's been going on for over two years now. Same people. Every single day.
    Yeah but you missed the part where I'm actively soloing this "problem" and I'm not the one complaining here.

  9. Yeah but you missed the part where I'm actively soloing this "problem" and I'm not the one complaining here.
    I don't know what you tried to convey here, but the reason people are complaining is because it's yet another aspect of the game that is being ruined by a small number of people. It's just like WG, before they banned 25 man multiboxers. Most people simply just stopped queuing, and it was basically just a farm fest until Warmane took action.

    I suspect something similar will happen here, eventually. Fewer people will queue bgs, and the queues will be intolerably long.

  10. I don't know what you tried to convey here, but the reason people are complaining is because it's yet another aspect of the game that is being ruined by a small number of people. It's just like WG, before they banned 25 man multiboxers. Most people simply just stopped queuing, and it was basically just a farm fest until Warmane took action.
    My point is I've done both and for the last couple of years I've been doing it alone in PvE gear without much issues. So I'm really curious what the hell everyone else is having a hard time with.

    I suspect something similar will happen here, eventually. Fewer people will queue bgs, and the queues will be intolerably long.
    It's the opinion of the administration that you should use teamwork on a multiplayer game.

    For those speaking about the measures being applied to premades, please note that we have no plans to do this to any extent. People think we can ban AVEnabler, but this is technically not possible, without breaking our own battleground queue system, and we have no plan to do that. Also, banning one addon would just produce another one, a better one. As those who have seen during our April 1st joke, the GearScore addon when disabled, produced a replacement in minutes. Also, we have no issues with people grouping up to play PvP, in fact, we'd say it's a natural way to play the game.

    If you are being beaten by a premade, make one your own, take the initiative, write a few recruitment messages on global. You do not even need voice chat, just minimal cooperation, and you can already compete. This is a massive multiplayer game. Solo play is possible, but it is not the way you go if you want to win in a multiplayer game. This is the case in any multiplayer game. Playing Solo in Ranked in League of Legends will produce a similar experience.

    Naturally, we can limit this, however, this would be counter-productive. Punishing people for grouping up is not the way to go. Chinese players are very aware of this, as they see people playing in premades as dishonorable and even a have a term for it, and are generally more negative to this kind of playstyle and yet they never made any effort to limit it or ban it, as it is the natural way of playing and it is normal to expect people to group up. We have no intention of limiting this playstyle.

  11. I don't know what you tried to convey here, but the reason people are complaining is because it's yet another aspect of the game that is being ruined by a small number of people.
    I believe the point he was trying to convey was either play smarter or make your own premade. If this is too difficult for you, perhaps you're playing the wrong MMO.

    It's just like WG, before they banned 25 man multiboxers. Most people simply just stopped queuing, and it was basically just a farm fest until Warmane took action.
    Its definitely not like the multiboxer issue. The administration was rather clear the limitations were finally imposed because it was causing realm stability issues.


    I suspect something similar will happen here, eventually. Fewer people will queue bgs, and the queues will be intolerably long.

    I've been seeing variations of this phrasing for the last 8 years now. Considering this post is basically complaining about premades, I'd call this highly inaccurate and over the long term proven to be untrue.
    Edited: April 8, 2021

  12. Playing smarter is doable vs 5 man premade, especially if you get some remotely brained and geared people, and therefore those thingies I don't mind, heck even i do it occassionaly with friends. But there isn't anything you can do against a 15 apes that are on discord, that have always the same frontline consisting of dks, few pve hunters and spriest/eles, and 3 heals. Those people don't even try to play bases, but will e.g. in AB leave 1 base not capped and just keep camping people that spawn there. Those same people used to queue alongside mbox and they would abduct whole IOC and just wait in keep to farm hks.

    As for making our own premade, the point we raised went over your head apparently. It's not about winning or losing, it's about quality of game, which nowadays is non existent. Those few balanced rbgs are nicest thing, and the question is why can't we have more of that? You don't fight cancer with cancer, you only get more cancer. Sure my quality of game would improve, I would win 90% of games, but maybe i don't enjoy playing full pve hunter that presses 2-3 buttons from safe distance, and boasts with scoreboard.

    AFAIK you can't join more than 5 man premade ingame without the use of that nasty addon. So by disabling that addon everything would be played as it was meant to be. Or make it somehow that you only play 10v10 or 15v15 premades, leave solo people of out it, i guess that should be doable.

    Anyways the point of these posts is same like against mboxers, it started to become too much. None minded mboxers when it was only 2-3 of them, same with premades, you write a loss in your book and go next one. But nowadays solo queing as alliance is most of time vs premades and it's getting rather dull.

    Thanks for reading, have a nice day.

  13. Wasn't "that addon" disabled a long time ago by having BG numbers removed?

  14. Making your own premade leads to the exact same thing, camping GYs. You either win over the premade, and farm them, or they win you, and they farm you.

    The amount of premades were never this bad. It's a constant now. This is mirroring the multibox problem. Few complained when there was only 2-3 MBers, but down the line it became too many. They introduced Mercenary because there were too few hordes queuing BGs, which I suspect is because they ended up losing almost every single one. There should be made a "premade" bracket of some sort, where you'll only meet other people who are queuing in groups. Or make a system like soloq, where you can add the names of people you want to avoid playing with.

    Oh, and the multiboxers weren't reduced to 5 because of realm instability. The date was pushed forward a week, because of realm instability.
    Edited: April 9, 2021

  15. Wasn't "that addon" disabled a long time ago by having BG numbers removed?
    It was, but I think people found workaround to still do it anyway.

    There's should be made a "premade" bracket of some sort, where you'll only meet other people who are queuing in groups.
    It's already been said more times than should be necessary that we're not doing that.

    As for making our own premade, the point we raised went over your head apparently. It's not about winning or losing, it's about quality of game, which nowadays is non existent. Those few balanced rbgs are nicest thing, and the question is why can't we have more of that? You don't fight cancer with cancer, you only get more cancer. Sure my quality of game would improve, I would win 90% of games, but maybe i don't enjoy playing full pve hunter that presses 2-3 buttons from safe distance, and boasts with scoreboard.
    Battlegrounds are random by nature. If anything, despite at first being in favor of brackets, my stance now is that we should remove all that and leave them to be the clown-firsta they were always meant to be. Anyway, that includes going against grouped people who don't care about objectives and just want to camp. You can argue about fun and morality and aims, but there's nothing illegal about winning simply by not allowing the other side to do anything. And that's what Battlegrounds are about when you strip it of subjectivity: winning.

    Battlegrounds aren't supposed to be balanced or organized. They are what the players on both sides make of it. If what you want to make of it is going solo expecting to have fun, go for it, but don't expect to not get disappointed. You don't decide the tone the Battleground will have on your own, the strongest side does. It's extremely akin to beloved allowed-griefing ganking. The side attacking decides when and how it will happen, you don't get a say who can gank you, where they can gank you, how they can gank you or how many can gank you. It will just happen and most of the time you will lose and not have any fun with it. Irony time: I bet a lot of the people who complain about premades have no issue ganking.

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