Unholy dps openers

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February 26, 2017
Adriancina

Unholy dps openers

I've been experimenting with a lot of different openers with unholy and figured out an opener that works wonders, utilizing all you can fit in a proc timing at the start of the fight, using sigil swapping, consumables etc. For the veteran unholy players this won't be news, but for the new players it might help increase your dps.
These openers use a frost subspec/reaping talent build. Here's how it goes:

Start off with sigil of virulence, sigil swap

Army of the dead 5.5 seconds before pull - IT - PS - 2 BS - SS(macro) [if lucky, this will trigger sigil proc for 200str] - ERW - 2 SS - DC (use if you get maxed out on RP due to resto druid/disc priest RP gain to prevent overcapping, otherwise skip) - SS [you now have virulence proc and 3 stacks of hanged man] - saronite bomb/racial/engi hands/potion (you can chose to prepot since the potion effect lasts untill gargoyle with 2 seconds to spare) - BT/unholy presence - Gargoyle - switch back to blood presence on the next free rune

SS(macro) is something i figured out works by cheesing the gcd you get when switching gear in combat. It will allow you to use a skill/spell and instantly switch an item piece effectively using up only one gcd to accomplish both. The macro i use to acomplish this goes as follows:

#showtooltip scourge strike
/cast scourge strike
/cast !rune strike
/equip sigil of virulence
/equip sigil of the hanged man

Be careful when using this macro, it will only work properly if used while you are off gcd. If used while gcd is still in effect, only the /equip portion of it will go off, making you waste a global cooldown.
I only use this macro for the starting burst as i suspect sigil of virulence has an ICD that triggers upon equiping, hanged man does not.

If you chose not to sigil swap or you don't have it/is not working for you, here is some alternate rotations depending on your sigil of choice:

Start wih sigil of the hanged man

Army of the dead 5.5 seconds before pull - IT - PS - 2 BS - SS - ERW - 2 SS - DC (use if you get maxed out on RP due to resto druid/disc priest RP gain, otherwise skip) - SS - saronite bomb/racial/engi hands/potion (you can chose to prepot since the potion effect lasts untill gargoyle with 2 seconds to spare) - BT/unholy presence - Gargoyle - switch to blood presence on next free rune

Start with sigil of virulence

Army of the dead 5.5 seconds before pull - IT - PS - 2 BS - SS - ERW - saronite bomb/racial/engi hands/potion (you can chose to prepot since the potion effect lasts untill gargoyle with 2 seconds to spare) - unholy presence - Gargoyle - blood presence - 2 SS

This is just something i've come to know throughout my experience playing unholy and felt like i would like to share them with the community as i've seen some unholys struggling to pull off decent numbers on burst.
Feedback is most welcome and i'd like to see you guys give this a try, post your own openers and post some numbers. :)

May the dps race begin!
February 26, 2017
Turbolqk

Start with Plague Strike and then Icy Touch. Makes Frost Fever and Icy Touch hit harder. FF because of RoR, IT cause of Ebon PB.
February 27, 2017
Plasmanion

5My start is to have fun and everything comes together no thinking needed.. I never practice but I am winning 90% of the time no thinking required.
February 28, 2017
Sciffer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plasmanion

5My start is to have fun and everything comes together no thinking needed.. I never practice but I am winning 90% of the time no thinking required.

Translation: I don't want to put effort to learn the best my class can do, and I play with noobs.
March 3, 2017
Plasmanion

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sciffer

Translation: I don't want to put effort to learn the best my class can do, and I play with noobs.

That is right my friend :)

I am sorry I killed you :(
March 7, 2017
Jarjkeqt

I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but:
First and foremost, take those lovely ideas you've come up with regarding Sigil swapping and toss them out the window, even though I appreciate the thought behind, sigil swapping does not exist in 3.3.5, it used to pre 3.2.2.

Regarding Unholy Presence, simply no. It does not worth it, the bonus Gargoyle will receive is insignificant (over exaggerating a bit) compared to the potential loss in DPS due to presence switching.
March 11, 2017
Adriancina

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarjkeqt

I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but:
First and foremost, take those lovely ideas you've come up with regarding Sigil swapping and toss them out the window, even though I appreciate the thought behind, sigil swapping does not exist in 3.3.5, it used to pre 3.2.2.

Sigil swapping mid fight, yes, since sigil of virulence has a 20sec ICD that triggers upon equip. Sigil of the hanged man on the other hand does not, so the only viable way to swap sigils is at start after the first scourge strike before ERW (from virulence to hanged man) using the macro i provided or swap back to virulence during a pause during a fight (sindy air phase, right before putricide transition, bone storm if your raid leader insists you do not dps during bone storm, BQL air phase, LK transition) and use it on your next SS.

Alternatively you can swap back to virulence after your first scourge strike in cycle1 of your rotation since: 2 rune cycles = 20 seconds = virulence ICD and by the time the ICD is over, you will have 3 chances at proccing virulence and 2 hanged mans. This way you will have a minimum 3-5 second downtime with sigils (depending on rune grace) and is a risky thing to do since virulence is a chance proc, not a guarantee. But if you are lucky it will net you the extra STR. I don't do this since i prefer consistency (hate the concept of DBW as well, ughh..) so i just swap on burst and transition phases.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarjkeqt

Regarding Unholy Presence, simply no. It does not worth it, the bonus Gargoyle will receive is insignificant (over exaggerating a bit) compared to the potential loss in DPS due to presence switching.

On the contrary, it is much more than worth it. Unholy presence will net you 5-6 extra gargoyle shots which more than even a scourge strike crit will do.
A test i just did increases gargoyle damage as follows (used death's choice instead of dbw for consistency)

Tested on ebon hold dummy with only self buffs
Talent build used for test: http://wotlk.openwow.com/talent#jZG0...hIx0bx0ux0uIqo

Blood presence:

Gargoyle - 22 hits, 1 miss (seriously **** this, i'm overcapping hit atm), minimum hit 3.6k, maximum hit 4.5k, avg. hit 4.2k = 100.1k damage
Scourge strike - 11 hits, 5 crits, minimum damage 1.5k, maximum damage 8.2k, avg. damage 4.4k = 69.8k damage
Gargoyle + SS = 100.1+69.8= 169.9 damage

Unholy presence:

Gargoyle: 28 hits, minimum hit 3.6k, maximum hit 4.5k, avg. hit 4.4k (different avg due to miss chance) = 122.2k damage
Scourge strike: 10 hits, 4 crits (got lucky with about the same crit chance here), minimum damage 1.5k, maximum damage 8.2k, avg damage 4.3k = 64.0k
Gargoyle + SS = 186.2k damage

I'd post a skada pic but i play on potato resolution.
So even without one scourge strike in the rotation unholy presence gargoyle pulls off 16.3k more damage on burst on dummy alone. From the avg gargoyle damage you can see it does not benefit from 15% damage on blood presence but does from unholy presence haste making it the better option for burst if used right before gargoyle. SO:

PS->IT->2xBS->SS->ERW->2xSS->unholy presence->Gargoyle->blood presence->blood tap/blood strike

^for maximum efficiency on opening up and i left out the usable items not to clutter it with text but make sure to use all str/AP/haste buffs prior to gargoyle.

With raidbuffs the haste gets a lot more powerful with spell damage scaling and additional attack power buffs so the difference in damage can go from 30k to up to 80k damage on a single gargoyle depending on the raid composition and timing of procs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plasmanion

That is right my friend :)

I am sorry I killed you :(

Why are you here? Write something worth reading or kindly get lost.
March 11, 2017
kidsgetrekt

no offense but ur specc is totaly garbage........Morbidity, Reaping ? Seems more like u practice for PVP than PVE......
March 11, 2017
Plasmanion

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adriancina

Why are you here? Write something worth reading or kindly get lost.

Sorry internet hero I will now get lost I don't want to get textually owned by your keyboard might and magic. /ignore onlinefighter

Anyway Adriancina thanks for the guide!
I pretty much don't have any advanced opener as you do and that is so awesome I wish one day something like that comes to my mind :) .
My opener is Strangulate > Diseases > SS > 2 BS > DC and then diseases again and repeat.. Ofc I use every trinket that adds power before the rotation.. Right now I have Wrathstone I know its not that good but I use it always and it adds power so its ok. It's pretty much basic rotation something like that :D
March 11, 2017
Adriancina

Quote:

Originally Posted by kidsgetrekt

no offense but ur specc is totaly garbage........Morbidity, Reaping ? Seems more like u practice for PVP than PVE......

If you do not provide argument behind what you say, i can take it as nothing else than ****talk. And despite your profile picture, i'll explain.

It suits my playstyle, i prefer utility and versatility to pure damage in a raid so in taking morbidity d&d is on a shorter cooldown for trash clears in addition to death coil being your 4th highest damage dealing ability (AMS + DC spam from a distance) and since i'm offtanking most of the fights i can't afford a trash and boss spec. If i had points to spare i'd put 'em in desecration (LDW, DBS, VDW adds) and imp UH presence (move speed, what's not to like) as well.

And regarding reaping, i don't understand what's garbage about it? You get an extra scourge strike every other cycle. A single SS outdamages 2 blood strikes and allows you to do effortless presence switching for gargoyle and gives you more options on movement heavy fights, allows you to refresh bone shield more easily without the need to blood tap, refresh diseases if you weren't paying attention, an extra death strike if you have to taunt the boss.
March 11, 2017
Gnimo

There are couple of UDK builds that can be used, depending on what u want.

http://wotlk.openwow.com/talent#jZG0...bIxcdx0zx0uIqo
Utility build.
Built for maximising AoE DPS duo to 2/3 Morbidity.
Reason u go 2/3 is simply because u wont almost ever be able to do DnD every 15sec exactly. U need atleast 18-22sec before u cast 2nd DnD.
Reason u dont go for Reaping with Morbidity is cos those 2 talents are not good with each other.
In order to get full value of Reaping u need to hit SS using every single Death Rune u get.
In order to get full value of Morbidity u need to pop DnD whenever its off CD.
These two counter each other...

http://wotlk.openwow.com/talent#jZG0...0Ixcdg0zx0uIqo
All arround DPS build.
This build is perfect for Single Target DPS and has a great AoE potential.
This build is the best for fights such as Lich King 25m HC and Halion 25m HC.
U dont need Morbidity cos u wont be using DnD unless there are Valks or Adds arround u, and both of them spawn every 30sec.
U dont need Reaping cos u have to pop DnD from time to time and that will result in 3 talents wasted.

http://wotlk.openwow.com/talent#jfVMVZZfM0Ixcbx0ux0uIqo
Single Target DPS build (u should use Glyph of Disease for this one)
This build is all about single target DPS and stacking as much Armor Penetration as posible.
I wouldnt recomend using this build but if u want to test it and have great DPS in fights such as DBS and Festergut, this is the way to go.

Overall Conclusion:
1st talent build is great if u have to AoE like a monster.
2nd talent build is great if u need to AoE every 30sec.
3rd build is for fun i guess...

I would suggest using 2nd, aka: All Arround DPS Build.
Reason why Dirge is valued more than Morbidity is simple.
Morbidity combined with Glyph of Dark Death wont ever increase the DMG of Death Coil by 5/10/15%. Its always gona be less than that... I dont know the exact number but lets say that the 3/3 Morbidity with Glyph of DD will increase DMG of DC by 11.5%. (again idk the exact number this is just an example)
Dirge will provide u with 20 extra Runic Power every Cicle so in the end u will cast **** ton of extra Death Coils.

As for the Opener Goes:
http://forum.warmane.com/showthread....344509&page=11
At the midle of page 11 there is an UHDK rotation guide. U can check it out and try some things urself i guess...
All i can say is that:
"Army of the dead 5.5 seconds before pull - IT - PS - 2 BS - SS(macro) [if lucky, this will trigger sigil proc for 200str] - ERW"
This opener will put u on an awkward spot in which ur runes that u used for AotD will have Rune Grace Period active after ERW while other 3 wont, resulting in uneaven rune regen timers and a badish rotation.
If u want to precast army of the dead, u should pop DnD > AotD arround 9-8sec before the pull. That way u will have Rune Grace Period on all of ur runes after the combat starts. Care with using ERW this way, u might need to wait for another Cicle to use it perfectly.

Best of Luck.
March 12, 2017
Jarjkeqt

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adriancina

Sigil swapping mid fight, yes, since sigil of virulence has a 20sec ICD that triggers upon equip. Sigil of the hanged man on the other hand does not, so the only viable way to swap sigils is at start after the first scourge strike before ERW (from virulence to hanged man) using the macro i provided or swap back to virulence during a pause during a fight (sindy air phase, right before putricide transition, bone storm if your raid leader insists you do not dps during bone storm, BQL air phase, LK transition) and use it on your next SS.

Alternatively you can swap back to virulence after your first scourge strike in cycle1 of your rotation since: 2 rune cycles = 20 seconds = virulence ICD and by the time the ICD is over, you will have 3 chances at proccing virulence and 2 hanged mans. This way you will have a minimum 3-5 second downtime with sigils (depending on rune grace) and is a risky thing to do since virulence is a chance proc, not a guarantee. But if you are lucky it will net you the extra STR. I don't do this since i prefer consistency (hate the concept of DBW as well, ughh..) so i just swap on burst and transition phases..

I'll make it abundantly clear, this is a bug. Sigil swapping DOES NOT exist in 3.3.5, it is bugged in warmane and I'll post a bug report in a couple of minutes.
That's why I rather not address the Unholy Presence part of our discussion, many realms are not bug-free and sometimes coming to conclusions regarding rotation or gear on a legacy realm is ambigious.
Things don't work 100% as they should and as a result your calculations are sometimes wrong or inaccurate.

Anyway, simulations and calculations in the past has proven that Unholy Presence does not worth it,

Soruce I've been playing this class for about 9 years now.

EIDT: https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/41455
March 12, 2017
Gnimo

From what i know switching Sigils, Weapons, Idols, Ranged Weapons, while in combat, resets ur auto attack swing timer.
This is the one and only reason why it should not be used in a fight. (with or without the bug of double bonus beeing fixed)

As for the usage of Unholy Presence goes, it has its uses in PvE, perfect fight for this presence is Profesor Putricide.
If u have to move a lot, and if u need burst DMG, Unholy Presence is the perfect way to go...

Other than that, UH presence can be usefull in fights such as:
Lady Deathwisper phase 1, where u want to spread them diseases and pop DnD before those adds die. Switch to Blood right after last set of adds is dead, before p2 starts.
Gunship Battle, same reason aka trying to be usefull and do some DMG before things die. UHP all the way. UHP all the way.
Profesor Putricide, faster moving away, towards the oozes, using every single rune and runic power to maximise ur burst potential. Switch to Blood after last 2 oozes are dead before p3 starts.
Dreamwalker, spreading diseases on supresors asap are valued a lot. UHP all the way.
March 13, 2017
Jarjkeqt

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gnimo

From what i know switching Sigils, Weapons, Idols, Ranged Weapons, while in combat, resets ur auto attack swing timer.
This is the one and only reason why it should not be used in a fight. (with or without the bug of double bonus beeing fixed)

As for the usage of Unholy Presence goes, it has its uses in PvE, perfect fight for this presence is Profesor Putricide.
If u have to move a lot, and if u need burst DMG, Unholy Presence is the perfect way to go...

Other than that, UH presence can be usefull in fights such as:
Lady Deathwisper phase 1, where u want to spread them diseases and pop DnD before those adds die. Switch to Blood right after last set of adds is dead, before p2 starts.
Gunship Battle, same reason aka trying to be usefull and do some DMG before things die. UHP all the way. UHP all the way.
Profesor Putricide, faster moving away, towards the oozes, using every single rune and runic power to maximise ur burst potential. Switch to Blood after last 2 oozes are dead before p3 starts.
Dreamwalker, spreading diseases on supresors asap are valued a lot. UHP all the way.

I'll address specific parts of your answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gnimo

This is the one and only reason why it should not be used in a fight

Are you kidding? The only reason NOT to use sigil swapping in a fight is not the swing timer, not even the GCD it triggers. It is that IT DOESN'T WORK.
Check patch 3.2.2 on retail:
"Relics: All buffs provided by relics (idols, librams, totems and sigils) now share an exclusive category such that gaining a buff from one of these items will remove all other buffs gained from items in this category."
- http://us.battle.net/wow/en/game/patch-notes/3-2-2

Please stop rushing to conclusions and gather some information before you submit a post. It is a bug and that's why sigil swapping isn't viable. It was overpowered during Trial of the Crusader when Sigil of Virulence was released, Blizzard figured it out and patched it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gnimo

As for the usage of Unholy Presence goes, it has its uses in PvE, perfect fight for this presence is Profesor Putricide.
If u have to move a lot, and if u need burst DMG, Unholy Presence is the perfect way to go...

Heck no. Every decent DPSer out there should be enchanting Cat's Swiftness on his feet, or 15 stam + movement, which doesn't stack with Unholy Presence, so it is a waste. UHP is a DPS loss, and you don't need the speed if you enchant yourself properly for progression fights.

In a realm where everyone is 6.9k gs with BiS gear and wreck havoc upon encounters then nobody even gives a **** about Cat's Swiftness and just go AP. But in every decent progression fight where survival is above all it is the enchant you seek, and it goes for almost every melee DPS out there, depends on your specific class. For instance ferals don't need that, for obvious reasons.
March 13, 2017
Gnimo

My point was simple. Even tho its bugged and sigil swaping is working now (YES I READ UR BUGREPORT AND VOTED IT UP), the fact that swap resets ur swing timer and gives u a GCD (forgot to wright that part), makes it something not worth doing.

As for Unholy Presence goes... Im so glad u put in so much time in making those sims back in the days.
If u think going Unholy Presence is simply for the movement speed, and not for the 0.5sec reduced GCD, i have nothing else to tell u.

Il give u one example:
Green ooze is retargeting, u have couple of sec to burst everything u got and u are trown in the air away from it.
While in Unholy Presence u can basicly use every single rune before u get trown in the air, and burn runic power while flying and running back towards it.
Unholy Presence gives u ability to use every single resource u have and maximise ur DPS burst.

Fun fact: Unholy Presence is also viable when it comes to Frost DPS, and if Rime proced more often it would actualy be close to Blood Presence single target constant DPS.
Blood Presence only wins over Unholy Presence in fights where u are constantly stuck on ur target DPSing 24/7.
If u cant make it work, dont say it doesnt work...