Unholy VS Frost on pve

so i've been playing an unholy pvp dk on icecrown and i wanted to get into pve.
Now i know frost does higher dps than unholy (exept AoE) but my question is how big is the difference.
from one point of view it would take me less time to gear unholy pve because i have some of the bis items already(like the weapon, trinkets,rings,neck,cloak).
but on the other hand unholy might be too weak to be any good.
now if the difference isnt huge i'd rather play unholy but if it is a big difference ill just starting gearing up frost from scratch.
so basically my question is if unholy is valid in pve and how big is the difference between unholy and frost.

Unholy is better consistently through out gearing. at bis levels the single target is respectable compared to other dpsers but multitarget unholy is no.1.

people take unholys not just for dps but the (de)buffs it bring to the raid.

frost is superior in single target at bis levels and aoe is still respectable.

both have different play styles, frost is very rotation based if you want to put out consistent dps.

In terms of utility both bring something to the table while Unholy is the #1 Raid buffer frost is nice also:
- Improved Icy Touch 3/3 reduces melee and ranged attack speed by 6% which is really helpful for your tank.
- Improved Icy Talons 1/1 gives melee haste by 20% to party members as well, which is a DPS increase for melees.
- Using your Empower Rune Weapon with Unbreakable Armor such as DPSing the ooze at PP or getting rid of a raging spirit provides extraordinary burst needed for those particular situations.
- Versatile spec due to ArP gemming for Single Target or Str for AoE based encounters.

In the end it all breaks down to what you find most entertaining and based on your guild's needs.
Both Unholy and Frost excel given their situation.

I am currently running Frost ArP which to me it feels like the most damaging way to play FDK because I like ripping the f*** outta bosses in ST cases, and to be honest you don't fall behind really that much in AoE if you play your cards well, be aware of your surroundings, and don't mess up your rotation.

For instance on retail Unholy was King but here I noticed too many resists on bosses making it inconsistent and some claim the shadow portion of the damage from Scourge Strike is somehow bugged due to the wrong formula is based upon but not sure and cannot confirm this, I am basing on speculations for my previous statements. Nonetheless it is a viable spec for PvE and really good if you are into PvP there is no other spec on par with Unholy in PvP.

Blood unfortunately is really NOT viable at all raid-wise due to DRW being really broken as it not copies the exact damage of your abilities and that being said it is very undesirable, but you can still have fun with it in dungeons and lower tier raids such as naxx/os etc but keep away from it in high end raids, unless you plan on going tanking.

frost no.1, mdps will cry if dont have haste aura!

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Originally Posted by Cashroll

For instance on retail Unholy was King

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god of aoe ye. both of blood and frost surpassed it on single target dmg tho

Frost is the most consistent of the 3 dps specs, because its' dps is a tad higher overall without cds active and the fact that it deals more damage once the target is below 35% health. It can still AoE very well, but it has very good single target dps particularly on longer boss fights. Frost also brings that tasty attack speed buff for the raid.

Unholy is pretty good for single-target dps, and can be somewhat close to Frost at times.. but not everyone can have a Shadowmourne, and without a Shadowmourne there's a pretty big gap between frost and unholy dps-wise in terms of single-target. You don't bring Unholy for top dps, however, you bring it for the Ebon Plague debuff to improve damage dealt by casters and diseases.

Blood has pretty poor AoE dps, and similar to Unholy is reliant on Shadowmourne to compete with Frost on dps. However, unlike unholy, it can actually beat Frost on shorter boss fights in single-target dps. Blood is about burst damage, they burst very high at the start of a fight and then slowly even-out as a fight goes on. They bring no unique raid buff, and are therefore not particularly beneficial to have in a raid.

If you can get a Shadowmourne there's no reason not to try your hand at Unholy, and even blood if you know that the other DK buffs are going to be present in a raid -but Frost is the most consistent, and you can't really go wrong with the spec.

As for Blood being "useless" because of Dancing Rune Weapon underperforming, that's not exactly true. You won't burst as high, but you will still have top-8 dps in most raids so long as you don't mess up its' very rigid rotation. That is assuming best-in slot gear with a Shadowmourne vs other classes in BIS gear.

@ Erronius

I will have to strongly disagree with you about certain statements you've mode, for instance you claim Blood can beat Frost on shorter boss fights in single target DPS, therefore it has better burst potential in your vision, but that's entirely wrong. With Frost ArP, given you execute the correct optimal initial rotation, you will burst much harder compared to what Blood ( I can give you demonstration in-game anytime you want to show you how Frost can beat Blood DPS in every aspect, easy breezy) is capable right now, not to mention the versatility Frost provides in certain burst situations, such as zerging fast as possible Oozes, Ragings, PP in P3 etc. by saving and synchronizing your UA + ERW to dispose of those entirely, in a fast and clean manner no other DK spec will overperform in this type of situations, even at the start of a fight, be it 2 minutes or 20 long Blood will never burst harder or outpeform frost, not even Unholy for that matter, in any type of gear on Blood, and saying Unholy it's reliant on Shadowmourne it's utterly false. Let's take this situation when Meteor hits in RS 25 HC and adds spawn, a capable Unholy DK who knows his trade, geared with 4 tier 9.5 parts and a HC Gloren, can outdps every DPS in raid at that certain moment, his AoE burst is immense, which will slowly fade and taken over by a FDK (who will rape in single targed) over time but still in top 5, even 3 if he knows what he's actually doing!

One more thing before I close my case here, saying DRW isn't a huge issue for Blood is like saying KM is useless for Frost and will still perform well without it. Here you are once again horribly mistaking, DRW makes sure you dish constant damage throughout the fight, assuring you the consistency you need to make the spec DPS - wise viable instead of the tanking / solo legacy mount bosses or farm MC for TF, Sulfuras spec what it really is on this server. Without the DRW copying the exact amount of damaged as intended, following the right formula of your abilities it's just pure trash, and that's why I suggest to stay away from Blood in high end game content (assuming we are creating an end game case scenario here, otherwise it's fun to mess around with it in lower tier raids) and choose Frost ArP who will dominate every other spec in single target easily and by far, heck even Unholy will outdps Frost sometimes in single target cases if RNGesus is not on your side.

Verdict: Frost - Best single target spec out there if you gem ArP, balanced if you take 5/5 BI and gem Str.
Blood - Worst DPS spec in high end content due to broken DRW, best for tanking and messing around in lower tier raids, and best for solo legacy raids.
Unholy - Best AoE spec in all game, can outdps all classes in AoE if played right, on par with Frost sometimes, excellent raid buffer.

My preference: Frost DPS ArP with 2 agility off-pieces (Gloves and Wrist) works for me best, and in my opinion the best way to play Frost.

All of these above statements have been tested countless times by myself and others (both in-game in multiple cases and through Kahorie's) included and works best in this server, after all we have to adjust the rotation, spec, gear accordingly to this server.