The State of WG and Multiboxers

Retail eventually implemented a change that made it so you couldn't follow other players in battlegrounds. This helps to stop people from AFKing in BGs and Wintergrasp, and would make it so its no longer possible for Wintergrasp to be ruined by a single player playing 20 accounts. It would also stop them from queuing BGs and making their team lose those games.

I get that multiboxing is a legal form of gaining an unfair advantage over every other normal player, but why isn't such a simple change implemented to stop the literal decade of people whining about it? It clearly ruins the fun for everyone else they're involved with, and you'd have to be a moron not to think it's unfair in Wintergrasp where they can blow up all the siege vehicles or turrets by themselves in a fraction of a second and completely turn the entire 240 man game to their advantage. Blizzard saw this as a problem, at least 90% of the playerbase sees it as a problem, and the fix would be extremely simple. This would allow people to continue to multibox for PvE purposes like dungeons and farming gold, or world PvP, while simultaneously vastly improving the quality of gameplay in WG and allowing you to retain the idea that this is a Blizzlike server that allows multiboxing. Is there really any rational argument against this that outweighs making thousands of people happy? It seems like a common sense and foolproof way to increase the playerbase's perception of the server.

Most servers out there don't allow it. This is one of the few that do, go play on one of those if you don't like it. It always amaze's me when people like this say, "Oh but it kills the player base". No, you're wrong. Sorry, it's been said for 10 years. And yet it continues to grow, and max out population.

You're afraid to say what you want,I bet its something like, I don't think it's fair, and I don't want to deal with it, so change the rules to what I want.

Sorry to break this to you, but no one cares what you want. The rules are what they've always been. Quit whining on the forums.

http://forum.warmane.com/showthread....=1#post2771873 is all you need to know. don't like it? tough.

No surprise that the responses are already lacking any actual common sense or thought worth replying to. Any argument made in favor of keeping things the way they are just makes you look like someone who's too bad at this game to see the way it negatively affects the meta, or someone who multiboxes themselves. It's always been the case that most of the people who support it are the ones doing it. You don't like that I have a negative critique with a good solution that's been implemented by Blizzard themselves? Why don't you give me a logical counter argument rather than "THAT THE WAY IT IZ SO THAT WAY IT BE"? I'm not afraid to say what I want, I just told you loud and clear by offering a solution and clearly stating that it makes a PvP zone meant for 240 people completely dependent on which team has the bigger neckbeard with more multibox characters, trivializing the rest of the teams input to the match.

The state of PvP is horrible on Icecrown due to MB and Shadowmourne, and MB is a problem on Frostmourne too. It's really strange to me that people like something that does nothing but hurt their experience, unless you're just complacent due to the guarantee that Warmane won't make any changes to make their server's PvP more fun and balanced. I'm aware of it too and have seen the other 500 threads about this same problem, but I've yet to ever see anyone ever make a good point. It's just parroting of the same 2 things every time. "you just need to organize 10-20 people in voice comms and perfectly coordinate to outplay the single guy who just casted 20 starfalls and wiped every single player in range in 3 seconds", and "Warmane says its allowed, here's the forum link everyone has already seen 10 times".

I've played here for 10 years, and things progressively get worse. I've gotten every single class and nearly every spec to 1800-2300, which leads me to believe that I have a pretty good grasp on what would make the PvP here better and more enjoyable, and not just seem like an afterthought. It's clearly an issue that wasn't ever originally intended to be abused when Blizzard designed the game. Once again, give me a rational counter argument, or don't bother posting, because you just sound like you lack the credentials to make any good judgement of what would make this server better. I don't expect a change, because the response has always been the same. But I would really like to see my opinion swayed by something that's founded in logic, which hasn't happened yet.

Edit: The solution suggested actually completely walks around the argument Mercy makes about limitations unintentionally affecting non-multiboxers as well. You want to use follow in BGs and WG? Why would anyone need to do that other than to tab out/AFK?

i support boxing for the simple fact that it's not against the rules, and people whining and moaning over it every week/2nd week gets old fast. personally think everyone who opens a topic about it should get a forum ban, but sadly not up to me.

and you'd think after 10 years of being here you would of realized your opinion on boxing doesn't matter in the slightest, no matter how good you think it is. If you don't like how they run THEIR server, piss off to another one.

I can see how it does get old. I kind of view it similarly to the protests going on in America lately, apologies for not having a better analogy. There is a very large and very vocal population that has a problem with it, and its very consistently made clear on the forums, likely being the single most posted about topic here despite the replies that are always given. That should say a lot about what the general userbase wants to happen, and I am really surprised it hasn't had any effect on Warmane's stance.

I've heard the no custom content argument made over the years, but gradually, we've seen a variety of custom features that were intended to make the game more enjoyable. Most PvPers play alliance for human racial, leading to a big imbalance in queue times. Complaints were made incessantly on forums about it, and custom action was taken to improve that problem via mercenary mode. I would argue that mercenary mode is a far more custom and game altering change than removing /follow function from PvP zones, the same going for transmog, item/point shop, and the way arena titles and rewards are calculated. I do not believe that my opinion will be one to change anything, but I wanted to have a discussion on the topic since I think I offer valid critique from a very large amount of experience, as not only do I have an extensive knowledge of PvP meta, but have also worked on PvP private server development in the past, and spent a lot of time pondering over scenarios just like this. Unfortunately, our lead dev lost interest and had a lot of irl issues, and is now working for Blizzard, but you couldn't even say our server's name on the Blackrock server or the message simply wouldn't send, though that restriction hasn't been in place since Arena-Tournament sold the server. I only explained this because it's likely that you or someone else will ask me why I don't make my own better server as a response to me mentioning that I have some dev experience.

Simply put once again, I think I can easily dismantle most if not all counter arguments to this proposal due to the experience I have, and think that my solution (Blizzard's solution) would benefit the server much more than it would harm it. Most of the posts made about this topic offer no solution and no real argument other than "MB IS OP", and I'm curious to see if there's any reason that I haven't already seen or considered that would make my proposal not make sense for the server from both a gameplay and financial perspective. I like this server, hence me being here since some of its earliest days. There are only a few issues that persist here that prevent it from being the best version of itself that it could be.

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Originally Posted by insanechaoz

I can see how it does get old. I kind of view it similarly to the protests going on in America lately, apologies for not having a better analogy. There is a very large and very vocal population that has a problem with it, and its very consistently made clear on the forums, likely being the single most posted about topic here despite the replies that are always given. That should say a lot about what the general userbase wants to happen, and I am really surprised it hasn't had any effect on Warmane's stance.

I've heard the no custom content argument made over the years, but gradually, we've seen a variety of custom features that were intended to make the game more enjoyable. Most PvPers play alliance for human racial, leading to a big imbalance in queue times. Complaints were made incessantly on forums about it, and custom action was taken to improve that problem via mercenary mode. I would argue that mercenary mode is a far more custom and game altering change than removing /follow function from PvP zones, the same going for transmog, item/point shop, and the way arena titles and rewards are calculated. I do not believe that my opinion will be one to change anything, but I wanted to have a discussion on the topic since I think I offer valid critique from a very large amount of experience, as not only do I have an extensive knowledge of PvP meta, but have also worked on PvP private server development in the past, and spent a lot of time pondering over scenarios just like this. Unfortunately, our lead dev lost interest and had a lot of irl issues, and is now working for Blizzard, but you couldn't even say our server's name on the Blackrock server or the message simply wouldn't send, though that restriction hasn't been in place since Arena-Tournament sold the server. I only explained this because it's likely that you or someone else will ask me why I don't make my own better server as a response to me mentioning that I have some dev experience.

Simply put once again, I think I can easily dismantle most if not all counter arguments to this proposal due to the experience I have, and think that my solution (Blizzard's solution) would benefit the server much more than it would harm it. Most of the posts made about this topic offer no solution and no real argument other than "MB IS OP", and I'm curious to see if there's any reason that I haven't already seen or considered that would make my proposal not make sense for the server from both a gameplay and financial perspective. I like this server, hence me being here since some of its earliest days. There are only a few issues that persist here that prevent it from being the best version of itself that it could be.

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frankly i don't know why they take such a iron stance on boxing. and they do occasionally change their mind as you pointed out with tmog and merc mode.

and i def would of suggested making your own server had you not added that 2nd part haha.

i don't expect you to have much luck, but i'll refrain from commenting further. i tend to be quite cold on a lot of these subjects, simply due to seeing them so often. not much else for me to add so.

I want to see other people's opinions whether they agree with me or not, so long as it's something thoughtful and original. I appreciate the change of tone as well; a conversation about a controversial subject doesn't necessarily have to be bad

People need to learn to avoid giving multis attention, don't feed them any kills. They'll get super bored if they're left to run around. If you do try to kill them you should use Arcane Bombs which silence everything for 5 secs and or mass fear + blow them apart. They're actually really easy to kill with a coordinated effort.

Arcane bombs are a pretty good idea. It's hard to avoid those groups typically, at least in WG. They tend to sit in key objective areas where you don't really have much choice but to plow through them and get blown up, or go around them to another wall and likely get blown up by the time you get there anyway

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Originally Posted by MaXiMuS54

People need to learn to avoid giving multis attention, don't feed them any kills. They'll get super bored if they're left to run around.

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If it was WPVP then you'd be completely correct.
Since it is WG and he'll get a ****load of honor for just winning the damned thing since we were avoiding him, then you are very much mistaken mate.

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Originally Posted by MaXiMuS54

If you do try to kill them you should use Arcane Bombs which silence everything for 5 secs and or mass fear + blow them apart. They're actually really easy to kill with a coordinated effort.

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Well the problem is that it is WG and coordination is basically not possible since it is a raid group only in name. 99% of the time it is a random group that sometimes wins just based on better gear and a bit of luck.

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Originally Posted by insanechaoz

No surprise that the responses are already lacking any actual common sense or thought worth replying to.

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So any response other than yours lacks common sense. Of course. Of course you’re right….

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Originally Posted by insanechaoz

The state of PvP is horrible on Icecrown due to MB and Shadowmourne

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Yeah, lots of common sense here…. The realm has been up since 2015, lots of people are pvp maxed out, you run into a boxer in WG more often than a BG, yet, SM, (which has been farmed to death for years, and yes some bought, but most earned) running into a box is rare all things considered, but that is the problem with all PvP…. Right.

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Originally Posted by insanechaoz

Why don't you give me a logical counter argument rather than "THAT THE WAY IT IZ SO THAT WAY IT BE"?

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Firstly: I don’t think anyone used caps…. You and everyone else that brings this up, says the same thing, justify your (LEGIT) gameplay or boxing is wrong. Well it has been, sorry you got butt hurt, by a “neck beard” as you put it. Here’s some advice, name calling childish. If you don’t want to be quoted the rules, try bringing up a topic in which the rules aren't so clearly defined, and that hasn’t been quoted a zillion times. And second, if you had been here 10 years, you’d know that its been here the whole time, I’ve been here 8.

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Originally Posted by insanechaoz

Once again, give me a rational counter argument, or don't bother posting, because you just sound like you lack the credentials to make any good judgement of what would make this server better. I don't expect a change, because the response has always been the same. But I would really like to see my opinion swayed by something that's founded in logic, which hasn't happened yet.

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Hmm, yes this one sided conversation does seem like what’s going on in the states, one side saying we want change and no one can have a different opinion, so just shut up, defend your play style to my satisfaction, or just don’t post. Yeah, good rebuttal… here’s mine, grow up, you can’t get everything you want by whining about it, yeah it might work sometimes, but not here, and not on this. You want something to change your opinion, go back through the posts on this topic, there are tons of examples, and people box for different reasons, don't be lazy and expect others to do the research for you.

You came here to voice a complaint about a topic that has been beaten to death, and has been stated clearly over and over, yet you want everyone to clarify for you to understand. There is no need, just read the rules over and over till it sticks.

Why multiboxing in pvp is allowed? Well is quite simple and already pointed out, because is beneficial to the server, for two major reason:
1 - "multiboxers do sometimes donate large sums of money"
2 - It increase the population number

As long as it fulfills those reasons, it doesn't matter if it does more harm than good in pvp scenarios. So trying to change it, is pointless.

If you want to participate in epic Wintergrasp battles (as it was on retail), play on Lordaeron. If you want to see mboxer dominating every battlefront, play on Icecrown. Nowadays I just bring all my alts to Icecrown Wintergrasp and set them on auto-follow to farm easy honor. Even if I lose every battle I still make plenty of gold for doing next to nothing. On Icecrown, weekly quests and honor farming is pretty much all Wintergrasp is good for now.

One of the arguments contra MB is crystalizing in one of the replies althought probably not inteded.

"If you want to participate in epic Wintergrasp battles (as it was on retail), play on Lordaeron. If you want to see mboxer dominating every battlefront, play on Icecrown. Nowadays I just bring all my alts to Icecrown Wintergrasp and set them on auto-follow to farm easy honor. Even if I lose every battle I still make plenty of gold for doing next to nothing. On Icecrown, weekly quests and honor farming is pretty much all Wintergrasp is good for now. "

Put into persepctive how much can for instance get /farm MB honor and/or arena pts which leads to buying epic gems selling them for Gold and in the end Gold selling for coins. So this MB thing is potentially making competiton to server via trading selling gold for coins. Actually is ruining World economy at simplest and inherently contributing to yearly cuts to our economy. Beside already mentioned ruining fun in rated BG/WG.

MB should be allowed in open world withouit any restirctions but in rated PVP enviorment they have no place.
IMO whole MB thing is someones own coping mechanism for their insecurities because nature of it shuts down competitvness and fun for othetr parties involved not to mention dominance over defensless part . Sadly our server become a stage for similar deviant manifestations.

Sorry for my bad english. I was in hurry.

Take care