Ninja in raid - uncommon case. Be warned!

Hey, all.

A few days ago, I participated in an Ulduar pug raid and became a witness of a rather curious dispute. Imagine the following scenario: http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=45039 dropped from Flame Leviathan. The loot system was "Group Loot" at that time, because the raid leader had forgotten to change it to "Master Looter" before we started. He got 3 out of 4 items and made people roll for them based on their main spec. But he didn't receive the fragment - the healer /refused to/ couldn't* give it to the raid leader. As a result, he got kicked and was threatened with a report. The raid leader asked us to report that individual as well, though I didn't do that, because I wasn't sure who was really at fault in that scenario (+ I played as a warlock, so I didn't care who got the shard). When talking about "loot ninja", the following common scenarios come to my mind:

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- Master Looter taking items that were not reserved or giving them to players that did not win, unless it's 2nd highest roll when winner had no use for the item (rogue rolling on caster trinket).
- Changing looting rules during the raid, after it has started.
Example: You joined a raid that was being advertised as one with no reserved items and after first boss raid leader says that he reserves item x from last boss.
- Player exploiting game bug to bypass master loot. In such cases it is best if master looter would fill report that shows player leaving the raid and empty loot window.
- Player need rolling (group loot) on items which he cannot even use.
- In RDF needing on items for OS (unless everyone in party is explictly fine with this).
- Need rolling for other players to have 2 or more roll chances at one item.
- Kicking players from raid for no reason, especially before distributing loot from boss kill that they participated in.

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Source: http://forum.warmane.com/showthread....=1#post2651922

But what about the case I just described? Who was really in the wrong there? People could only roll for their MS and, technically speaking, the healer didn't break that rule. So, I sent a ticket to the GMs wanting to hear their opinion and this was their response:

https://i.imgur.com/7jcBvrJ.jpg

I admit, that I didn't expect this, but I assume that many others don't as well. That's why the purpose of this thread is to inform you of these cases and what behaviour would end up banning you:

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- If you are the RL and you forget to change the loot system to ML, you take the responsibility, when someone snitches something before officially distributing the loot.
- If you are a player, who notices the RL's mistake, don't try to be cheeky and take something prematurely. You will also get punished.

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Soo, yeah. Play responsibly and thanks for reading!

The fragments are soulbound and can't be traded once they are in your inventory. In this case scenario it comes down to everyone passing on the fragment and the one who collects the fragments to need on it. Imho its RL fault not switching to master loot

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Originally Posted by Robbertes

The fragments are soulbound and can't be traded once they are in your inventory. In this case scenario it comes down to everyone passing on the fragment and the one who collects the fragments to need on it.

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After doing some research, I found out, that I was wrong. Usually soulbound items can be traded between party/raid members within 2 hours after being picked up (you can see a blue text at the bottom of their tooltip), but several sources confirmed, that this isn't the case for the Val'anyr Shards:

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Remember that these fragments, once bound, can not be traded to other raidmembers so be careful if you are Loot Master and assigned to distribute these items.

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Bewarned, it can NOT be traded after looting.

Just did a ulduar pug on my paladin. A shard drops with group role on. A couple of poeple think "orange, so i need". Unfortanly a warrior wins it. After some drama, he finaly decides to trade it with me. But he can't.
Bit later at yogg, now with master looter. I roll. some other warrior thinks he can role so he does, higher than me. A paladin guildie see this and tries also to roll and win it for me. Lucky he wins. He trys also to trade it me, and he can't also.

Lost 1 fragement to a ninja, and 1 to some trying to counter a ninja.
Soo next time i'm doing ulduar, i'm going to make sure it's master looter or need before greed

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https://wow.gamepedia.com/Fragment_of_Val%27anyr#Notes
https://www.wowhead.com/item=45038/f...nts:id=1646744

So, thank you for the correction.

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Imho its RL fault not switching to master loot

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That's the reason why I included the screenshot. According to the GMs, both sides did wrong and would get banned, if someone files a report, and I wanted to tell others to be careful. And not just for the Val'anyr shards, but also in other cases, when the RL forgets to change the looting system to ML and players roll freely on XYZ.

So are we changing the rules that are written now? "- Player need rolling (group loot) on items which he cannot even use." And blame the leader for a misstake of forgetting to change to ML?