! macros sometimes shifting you out of form

I only shapeshift using macros with ! (like /cast !Cat Form), so I should never be leaving form. But when mashing buttons I sometimes shift into form and then immediately out of it, which is really bad. I waste globals, I lose dmg, I take more dmg, I'm slower and I need to spend more mana to once again shift back into form again.

Also the main action bar sometimes doesn't switch properly to cat/bear, so I'm sitting in bear form with nothing but starfire/wrath/moonfire on my bars.

I'm not using any addons that could be influencing this, what's happening?

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Originally Posted by helltrix

I only shapeshift using macros with ! (like /cast !Cat Form), so I should never be leaving form. But when mashing buttons I sometimes shift into form and then immediately out of it, which is really bad. I waste globals, I lose dmg, I take more dmg, I'm slower and I need to spend more mana to once again shift back into form again.

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Imho, everything comes from the macro, and the fact that you mash it.

Here's how I interpret the sequence:

1) You are in human form, and you mash the macro.
2) You turn into a cat, and a 1.5-sec GCD occurs.
3) If you queue another "cat form" shapeshift (on accident), the game would proceed to remove your current stance.
4) However due to the GCD, the game doesn't allow you to enter cat form again.

Kripparian explains it here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgDjG_0ecTI&t=188s

[edit] I just tested the !Cat Form macro. Ye, I was wrong about that. It seems that the game is smart enough not to cancel the effect. Well, it goes to show how much I know about the !shapeshifting macros.

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Originally Posted by helltrix

Also the main action bar sometimes doesn't switch properly to cat/bear, so I'm sitting in bear form with nothing but starfire/wrath/moonfire on my bars.

I'm not using any addons that could be influencing this, what's happening?

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As for the other question, if I have to make a guess, I'd say it's prolly an addon that changes your action bars. I have noticed some discrepancies with Bartender whenever I use it. EIther that or you mash other keybinds, which change the action bars {iirc, the keybind for the various action bars was like "shift" + "F1"/"F2"/"F3"/"F4"/"F5"/"F6" by default; could be wrong, though}.

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Originally Posted by Kovachut

Imho, everything comes from the macro, and the fact that you mash it.

Here's how I interpret the sequence:

1) You are in human form, and you mash the macro.
2) You turn into a cat, and a 1.5-sec GCD occurs.
3) If you queue another "cat form" shapeshift (on accident), the game would proceed to remove your current stance.
4) However due to the GCD, the game doesn't allow you to enter cat form again.

It doesn't seem to me that Kripparian's video applies here.

Kripparian explains it here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgDjG_0ecTI&t=188s

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1) No it happens both in human and in cat/bear form. As another data point, it happens very often on the very first shift when I alt-tab into the game
2) Yes.
3) This is what makes no sense, why would the game - sometimes - remove my current stance. I don't see why mashing the one button would do this. There's something broken there.
4) Yes.

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Originally Posted by Kovachut

As for the other question, if I have to make a guess, I'd say it's prolly an addon that changes your action bars. I have noticed some discrepancies with Bartender whenever I use it. EIther that or you mash other keybinds, which change the action bars {iirc, the keybind for the various action bars was like "shift" + "F1"/"F2"/"F3"/"F4"/"F5"/"F6" by default; could be wrong, though}.

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No, I use the default bar UI and the same thing also happens with all addons disabled. What I've noticed is that if you powershift, it usually keeps the form bars, but sometimes it'll change to caster bar and then immediately back to form bar (about 20 % from my experience). What I think happens is that when you shift into form and this thing happens, it sometimes doesn't switch back to the form bar (maybe about 3 % in total from my experience). So you're sitting in bear/cat spamming starfire.

I wonder if this is related to server-client communication. I've checked the bugtracker and I'm also not the only one. Maybe I should revive it: https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/22301

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Originally Posted by helltrix

1) No it happens both in human and in cat/bear form. As another data point, it happens very often on the very first shift when I alt-tab into the game
2) Yes.
3) This is what makes no sense, why would the game - sometimes - remove my current stance. I don't see why mashing the one button would do this. There's something broken there.
4) Yes.


No, I use the default bar UI and the same thing also happens with all addons disabled. What I've noticed is that if you powershift, it usually keeps the form bars, but sometimes it'll change to caster bar and then immediately back to form bar (about 20 % from my experience). What I think happens is that when you shift into form and this thing happens, it sometimes doesn't switch back to the form bar (maybe about 3 % in total from my experience). So you're sitting in bear/cat spamming starfire.

I wonder if this is related to server-client communication. I've checked the bugtracker and I'm also not the only one. Maybe I should revive it: https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker/report/22301

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Honestly, I can neither confirm nor deny whether the issue with the action bars is caused by a bug. I still think that it's just a keybind, which you click on accident.

As for the first part - it is logical if you think about it. In my previous post, I tried to explain the sequence of events. It doesn't matter if you start in human form or cat, the stance will be deleted if you press the [/cast !Cat Form] command. That's absolutely normal. If you are in cat form, and you click on the cat shapeshifting spell (not your keybind, but the actual original spell) with your mouse, you would see the same result. As I've explain already, by queuing the sequence the game thinks that you want to overwrite your existing shapeshift, and that's why it cancels it.

[edit] I just tested the !Cat Form macro. Ye, I was wrong about that. It seems that the game is smart enough not to cancel the effect. Well, it goes to show how much I know about the !shapeshifting macros.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by helltrix

I only shapeshift using macros with ! (like /cast !Cat Form), so I should never be leaving form. But when mashing buttons I sometimes shift into form and then immediately out of it, which is really bad. I waste globals, I lose dmg, I take more dmg, I'm slower and I need to spend more mana to once again shift back into form again.

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I tested this with a macro:
/cast !Dire Bear Form
Let's say I placed it on keybind 1 while being a bear.
On my non-form, keybind 1 is taken by cyclone.
I proceeded to spam 1.. a lot. As you could imagine, all I did was end up re-applying bear form.

I decided to up the spam.

I added keybind 2 the same /cast !Dire Bear Form -macro.
Nothing bound on non-form keybind 2.
Anyway, I started blasting.. I mean spamming. 1 and 2, 12211212121212121212111222122121121221121122121221 and so on..
Spammed for a bit. Wasn't expecting much, but at one point, my character got out of bear form, and started casting cyclone. My guess is there's very tiny time frame where your character isn't in form, and it took a well timed press out of a form 1 to start casting cyclone. Should've checked combat log.

I bet you run to this problem more, if you're an avid form switcher.

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Originally Posted by Kovachut

Honestly, I can neither confirm nor deny whether the issue with the action bars is caused by a bug. I still think that it's just a keybind, which you click on accident.

As for the first part - it is logical if you think about it. In my previous post, I tried to explain the sequence of events. It doesn't matter if you start in human form or cat, the stance will be deleted if you press the [/cast !Cat Form] command. That's absolutely normal. If you are in cat form, and you click on the cat shapeshifting spell (not your keybind, but the actual original spell) with your mouse, you would see the same result. As I've explain already, by queuing the sequence the game thinks that you want to overwrite your existing shapeshift, and that's why it cancels it.

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If I spend 1 minute spamming F1, I'm not sure what keybind I could possibly press by accidence during that time.

As for the second part, so you're saying the reason it sometimes happens is that the sequencing code of the game is faulty?

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Originally Posted by OhieMitzen

I bet you run to this problem more, if you're an avid form switcher.

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Yeah I'd estimate I switch forms about 10 times per minute and it happens ALL THE FRICKING TIME. Bear charge -> Bash -> switch Cat form... no lol now you're running around in caster form spamming moonfire.

I've done some more testing. On my lowly Lordaeron druid the /cast !Bear Form would also sometimes switch to caster form, but it was weirdly delayed compared to Blackrock. Also on Blackrock I could produce it with travel form, but never with Tree of life, so maybe the coding there is different? In cat, bear and travel you often visibly shift out and into form, but I don't see that happen in tree form.

Edit:
Upon further testing, Tree of life also only switches to Tree of life action bar on the first shift and never again after that (which is great and I wish bear/cat/travel would work exactly like this).

Edit #2:
I could also reproduce it with shaman /cast !Ghost Wolf. This one is harder to spot since there is no action bar swapping on shaman and when it does happen, you'd usually think that it was purged.

I must say, I'm quite impressed that you both tested this interaction. Props to both of you for doing the extra effort! I would have never thought that the issue could lie in mashing different keybinds while shapeshifting. I just thought that the explanation was much simpler.

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Originally Posted by helltrix

As for the second part, so you're saying the reason it sometimes happens is that the sequencing code of the game is faulty?

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I wouldn't say faulty per se, but just hardcoded into what it is. I'd like to post Kripp's video once again:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgDjG_0ecTI&t=188s

Even though his video regards a different topic, he showcases the sequence of events, and this was the part, which I wanted to show you before. If you mash a button a bit too late, you would put an extra command into the queue, and thus you tell the game to acknowledge it. At least, that's how I understand it. However, admitting that the root of the problem might have a bit more complicated explanation, I could also be wrong with my previous conclusion.

[edit] I just tested the !Cat Form macro. Ye, I was wrong about that. It seems that the game is smart enough not to cancel the effect. Well, it goes to show how much I know about the !shapeshifting macros.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by helltrix

I only shapeshift using macros with ! (like /cast !Cat Form), so I should never be leaving form. But when mashing buttons I sometimes shift into form and then immediately out of it, which is really bad. I waste globals, I lose dmg, I take more dmg, I'm slower and I need to spend more mana to once again shift back into form again.

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have you tried to change your current setting on "security ability toggle"?

https://i.imgur.com/AK0LU55.png

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Originally Posted by skullatbash

have you tried to change your current setting on "security ability toggle"?

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I did now, same results.

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Originally Posted by helltrix

I did now, same results.

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how often do you encounter the issue?
edit:
I mean, does it happen to often enoguh to make your pvp experince bad or it happens on rare occasion ? (so it is not a big deal)

Can you record a short clip to show it ?

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Originally Posted by Kovachut

I just tested the !Cat Form macro. Ye, I was wrong about that. It seems that the game is smart enough not to cancel the effect. Well, it goes to show how much I know about the !shapeshifting macros.

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I've been looking at the animation and the action bar for a bit now. I don't know how the game is coded, but most of the time there is no shift-out animation. Most of the the bear/cat/travel form stays as it is and there's just the additional grey smoke animation.

However, about 20 % of the time it visibly shifts out and back into form and those times the action bar also swaps to caster and back to bear/cat form. This also happens if you press the button only once without spamming it. So I suppose this in-and-out is also the reason for failed action bar swaps (and was marked as "dismissed" in the above mentioned bugtracker -.- ).

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Originally Posted by skullatbash

how often do you encounter the issue?
edit:
I mean, does it happen to often enoguh to make your pvp experince bad or it happens on rare occasion ? (so it is not a big deal)

Can you record a short clip to show it ?

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I'd say on average I encounter it every couple of arena games and occaisonally in bgs. Sometimes it doesn't matter much, sometimes it's gamechanging. Until this week, the last time I've played feral was on pre-Warmane Arena-Tournament in cca. 2014. So at first I wouldn't even realize what was happening. After a while I started to consciously notice it, but thought that maybe I was rusty, not used to a bit different keybinds and missclicking or fatfingering. But now that I've really become aware of it, it's got really bothersome.

I'll see if I can get OBS going again, I haven't used this PC in a long time.

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Originally Posted by helltrix

I've been looking at the animation and the action bar for a bit now. I don't know how the game is coded, but most of the time there is no shift-out animation. Most of the the bear/cat/travel form stays as it is and there's just the additional grey smoke animation.

However, about 20 % of the time it visibly shifts out and back into form and those times the action bar also swaps to caster and back to bear/cat form. This also happens if you press the button only once without spamming it. So I suppose this in-and-out is also the reason for failed action bar swaps (and was marked as "dismissed" in the above mentioned bugtracker -.- ).

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Well, I guess I was wrong with my initial conclusion that latency + button mashing + queuing events was the culprit of your issue. Thanks for the info!

I see your point, and in this sense I agree with you that it could be considered a bug if you don't do anything else but using !cat form. On the bright side, all of your tests could be used to describe the issue better in the bug tracker. The previous user didn't provide enogh information on how to reproduce the bug, and the staff didn't know where to look at.

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Originally Posted by helltrix

I'll see if I can get OBS going again, I haven't used this PC in a long time.

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I just made a quick 2 min video to show what happens. During this time I only ever spam the /cast !Cat Form macro bound to F3. The first time it shifts out is on the very first shift at 0:03. This is when I alt-tabbed from OBS into the game and as I've said before it happens much more often if I was alt-tabbed for a while. The second time it happens at 2:04 and this one is what I'm talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=be0ChkOozKY

You can also notice how it sometimes visibly shifts out-and-in and changes the action bar. I haven't had any faulty action bar swaps during these 2 minutes, but I can record that the same way some other time.