How raids were ruined

Heroic modes weren't implemented until ToC and that is not out yet plus nobody knows if it will be buffed or not.
Tier 7 and 8 without buffs would be a complete and utter joke, even hardmodes, as WOTLK is 8+ years old, every class is known and all top dps specs are well engrained in the player base. I'm in one of the top raiding guilds on Lord and I tell you, without buffs, most bosses would fall flat on their face in about 3 minutes on average.
The buffs have been reduced several times since their initial release and a motivated, capable group can clear naxx25 in about 2 raid nights.

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Originally Posted by gad777x

sounds like a bunch of guys with l2p issues )) this server is not for you go away and dont come back , thanks.

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lol cmon at least dont pretend you read what he wrote

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Originally Posted by Touchooo

I'd bet large amounts of money on that quote not being there for a very long time. It was last updated in May, so I wouldn't be surprised they added that just then. Could be wrong obviously. Personally I don't care anymore, all I play here is PvP anyway.

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Wow I just looked and you are absolutely correct. That line was not included. You can see by looking at the past page on the website Waybackmachine. https://web.archive.org/web/20151212...lm-Information

Even April 21, 2016 there was no mention of that: https://web.archive.org/web/20160421...lm-Information

The line is not there at all. No where does warmane mention that raid difficult will be changed back in December. This is after over 1 million people had already seen that thread.

I honestly cannot believe how self-centered some of you are. You already have what you want, and that's heroic difficulty raids throughout the rest of WotLK. You will have the challenge and difficulty that you have been looking for. So why argue that those of us who can't maintain as dedicated schedules as yourselves should not be able to see the normal versions? It makes so much sense so that everyone can see all content, hardcore and casual players alike. I am convinced you only have that idea to spite players who cannot play as much as you because of a superiority complex.

Because the argument "haha Blizzard made it a steamroll so we need to overtune it to hell" is absolute bull ****. You already have tuned up raids in the form of heroic versions. Do not even try to use that argument against me.

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Originally Posted by skierdudea

It makes so much sense so that everyone can see all content, hardcore and casual players alike.

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It actually doesnt, which is why i (and probably many others) didnt exactly like the introduction of heroic modes and obviously not the introduction of LFR thereafter.

i never set foot in naxx in vanilla, yet i didnt feel robbed of anything at that point. Every boss i killed was actually an achievement which is not comparable with steamrolling a boss on normal/lfr and then actually getting somewhat of a challenge in higher difficulty modes, even getting to the boss should in many cases be an achievement in itself.

When the game became more accessible with said mechanics, it made everything you could ever accomplish in raids mean less, and it started the decay of wow as we see today. Its just not the same feeling to kill a boss in the Highest difficulty when youve already killed him in *****proof mode 100 times

I quit the server 3 months ago cause unfotrunattely i don't have free time to play the game, occasionally i visit to read the forums and nothing more. I logged in to say 1 thing to the OP, WE CLEARED NAXX WITH BLUE GEAR. 3.5gs to 3.7gs when its released. (before the nerfs)
In order to clear it all ppl must know their class, not be a clicker and be gemmed enchanted. If you have trouble doing naxx now, you are simply a bad player. there is nothing wrong this that but please don't make it look like its warmanes fault.

"This is too hard, I don't like it, change it." - OP

The buffs to raids were one of the main things that was advertised for this realm. People were talking about it on the forums in July. Without the buffs every single raid would be an absolute ****show, with bosses going down in 40-50 seconds.

There's already a realm for those who want to steamroll raids and collect free purple items, it's called Icecrown.

Naxx 10/25 is balanced well. You have to run specific comps and on 50% of bosses 3x heal but its duable. Its funny that we were progressing Maxenna for like 3 hours and than clear Saph. and KT in 20 minutes :D We did full clear on Naxx 10 with 3.6k gs average. About Ulduar, for casual players its buffed alot. I guess you must have atleast full Naxx 25 geared tanks and healers to do half of Uld. and get the Uld gear from it.

Boost is good, but they should nerf it when new content came out beacause people will catch up faster and start progressing current content. Trust me, when everyone is raiding Uld and you are stuck on gearing your guild in Naxx, tts not fun.

ToC,ICC and RS have heroic modes available,so there's no need to screw them like you have already done with Naxxramas and Ulduar,let the game be as it is,focus your energy on fixing and repairing broken stuff,don't break what is already working. Even Blizzard failed when they tried to modify raids between patches,and they have testers and a huge stuff,so keep it safe and fix what you can,don't change the game

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Originally Posted by hrodvitnir21

"This is too hard, I don't like it, change it." - OP
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"The raids are too easy, I don't like it, change it."
-You (only prior to them changing it)

We aren't so different now are we.

This leads to the question, is it worth changing to make it harder if 80% of raiders are casual and are just fine with the difficulty and the other 20% that are hardcore are calling for change to make it more difficult (even though they already have an alternative, which is heroic mode raids).

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Originally Posted by skierdudea

EDIT: AS LATE AS APRIL 21, 2016 THE FORUM THREAD FOR LORDAERON'S REALM INFORMATION HAD NO MENTION THAT RAID DIFFICULTY WOULD BE INCREASED ON THE SERVER. OTHER THAN FEEDBACK FROM OTHER PLAYERS, THERE WAS NO WAY FOR PLAYERS TO KNOW THAT RAIDS DIFFICULTY WOULD INCREASE.
SOURCE: https://web.archive.org/web/20160421...lm-Information

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That source also states "This topic will serve as the primary information page for Lordaeron until a dedicated realm page is added to the information page." The topic, not the first post. Information was mostly added to the discussion as changes and decisions happened, since the last version was supposed to go into the Information section. The information you seem to set so much importance on date was added to the first post much later, after the decision to increase the difficulty of certain encounters was clear, openly divulged and well-known, simply because some players felt it should be there because the question about "buffed content" was brought up fairly often. So, while the date it was added to the first post of that thread might have been April, the decision was widely known before that.

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Originally Posted by skierdudea

By the way - Huge props to Warmane for allowing criticism like this. This thread is pretty critical of them so I thought it may get deleted. They did change the title, but I'm fine with that and it doesn't bother me.

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We delete threads that are offensive, get terribly derailed into flaming or turn out to be completely pointless. Just don't confuse allowing players to discuss something among themselves as the decision on how to handle Lordaeron being changed because of your thread - we have allowed players to discuss multiboxing and RDF, even though the decision about them wasn't going to change.

PS:

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Originally Posted by skierdudea

This leads to the question, is it worth changing to make it harder if 80% of raiders are casual and are just fine with the difficulty and the other 20% that are hardcore are calling for change to make it more difficult (even though they already have an alternative, which is heroic mode raids).

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That's not the way you should look at it, though. The server was declared and made to be a customized experience, something that at first was meant to be a Staff server, which then was expanded because people wanted to play on it. It has followed a customized design, which people are expected to accept if they decide to play on this specific server of ours. So the question should be: why would 80% of raiders who are casual play on a customized server and then complain it's customized?

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Originally Posted by skierdudea

"The raids are too easy, I don't like it, change it."
-You (only prior to them changing it)

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They were always going to be "changed" ie buffed.

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Originally Posted by skierdudea

We aren't so different now are we.

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We are, because you're so entitled you expect things to change according to your tastes. I play on the realm that suits my tastes. If it didn't suit my tastes, I would find one that did, I wouldn't whine for it to change.

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Originally Posted by skierdudea

This leads to the question, is it worth changing to make it harder if 80% of raiders are casual and are just fine with the difficulty and the other 20% that are hardcore are calling for change to make it more difficult (even though they already have an alternative, which is heroic mode raids).

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Nothing was "changed". This was always the starting point. This is how the realm was always intended. Just because those "80%" (a figure completely invented) were ignorant to this fact (something which is entirely their fault), it doesn't mean they should get their way.

Heroic modes aren't an "alternative". Not only because we haven't even gotten to the content that actually features heroic modes, but because the content currently available would be a complete joke with the implemented buffs.

There's already a realm for you, it's called Icecrown.

I used to talk very good about this server. Made my friends play on Lordaeron as well, because it was the perfect blizzlike server, and so we could play our favorite expansion from retail. But. Even thoug everything seemed perfect, we just found out after a massive amount of gametime, that the raid difficulty was increased 2-300%. We didn't see any commercializing that told us before we started, and therefore felt screwed in the *** said on a polite way, after burning off so many hours. It's not logical on any way, that you make an allmost 100% blizzlike server and then not anyway. We all thought that the wotlk raiding system was perfect, and of course we have nothing to say about the setup, but sereously, the Heroric difficulty in retail was made for a reason. If there are people who find the game too easy, then why not make another server with an increased difficulty, and then still have another 100% blizzlike server. For example Death Knight's have become crap as tankers, and it takes a massive amount of gearscore to get into a regular Naxx. And there is no chance that we would rather play on Icecrown, which is absolutley not close to being blizzlike. Throw the noob bomb if you're one of those hungering for an increased difficulty. But for me and my friends, this is a huge disappointment. having a regular blizzlike wotlk server would be perfect. But this is not.

I can only agree on this, it is almost impossible to get into a raid without having 4k gs at least witch is stupid as ****. on Blizlike servers u only need about 3.5 gs to raid and if the problem is it is to easy then make the Heroic Mode Harder then it will be more balanced.

There are no heroic modes for the current open raids. (Naxx,EoE,OS,Ulduar)

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Originally Posted by nelixios

There are no heroic modes for the current open raids. (Naxx,EoE,OS,Ulduar)

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There's hardmode Ulduar and 3drakes OS.