New 15 Minute Dungeon Timer?

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Originally Posted by Midna

There was a 15-minute cooldown added to the Random Dungeon Finder. Choosing a specific dungeon will not add this cooldown.
In addition, players will now not be able to votekick players for a few minutes after they join the group.

We are monitoring the RDF situation very closely right now and have a few more anti abuse additions in mind.

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ok, thank you. I can see you guys have also added this from 3.3.3:
"Players who use the Vote Kick option will now be prompted to provide a reason for kicking a party member. This reason will be presented to everyone in the party except for the person voted to be kicked"

Nice.
Btw have you already added this from 3.3.5 patch?
"The functionality of the Vote Kick feature in the Dungeon Finder will now behave differently according to a player's history with the system. Players using the Dungeon Finder who rarely vote to kick players from a group, or rarely abandon groups before a dungeon is complete, will find that the Vote Kick option will have no cooldown. For players who frequently abandon groups or vote to kick other players, the Vote Kick option will be kept on a cooldown. This functionality will adjust itself as a player's behavior while using the Dungeon Finder changes. "

Related bug tracker: #87876

@midna

In case you wanna how blizzard handle players who abuse of "vote to kick" system:

First they have added this on Patch 3.3.3 - PTR Build 11599

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Tracking Stats (These stats will most likely be used internally to identify "bad" players)

Kicked in LFG (follower) (hidden) - Number of times the player kicked someone in LFG, voting, but not initiating
Kicked in LFG (target) (hidden) - Number of times the player has been kicked by someone in LFG
Kicked in LFG (initiator) (hidden) - Number of times the player kicked someone in LFG, initiating the kick
Abandoned LFG (hidden) - Number of times the player abandoned an LFG dungeon
Completed LFG (hidden) - Number of times the player completed an LFG dungeon

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then, with 3.3.5 patch, they have added the cooldown based on player's history (that I have already linked on my previous post):

Spoiler: Show

The functionality of the Vote Kick feature in the Dungeon Finder will now behave differently according to a player's history with the system. Players using the Dungeon Finder who rarely vote to kick players from a group, or rarely abandon groups before a dungeon is complete, will find that the Vote Kick option will have no cooldown. For players who frequently abandon groups or vote to kick other players, the Vote Kick option will be kept on a cooldown. This functionality will adjust itself as a player's behavior while using the Dungeon Finder changes.

This may sound hilarious, but I just had a entirely different problem in a dungeon compared to instantly getting kicked.

Someone joined as a Tank, and just sat there AFK. We had to wait 5 Minutes to kick him and we did.

The same exact guy joined our group again and we waited 5 Minutes again to kick him and we did.

The same exact guy entered a third time as a tank and AFKed and our group abandoned.

Edit: I believe I knew what happened, he's keep joining with the Specific Dungeon Finder to avoid the 15 Minute CD
Edit2: It May just be a leveling bot because these are non-heroics

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Originally Posted by Blockheader

Someone joined as a Tank, and just sat there AFK. We had to wait 5 Minutes to kick him and we did.

The same exact guy joined our group again and we waited 5 Minutes again to kick him and we did.

The same exact guy entered a third time as a tank and AFKed and our group abandoned.

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We are aware of this issue. After our next server update kicked players will no longer be matched up with a group they got kicked from before.

This is ABSURD.

If there will be any cooldown, make it start from joining the group, so that you can actually get a replacement if necessary.

Other than me complaining about the impact it has on Multiboxing, the Five Minute timer to kick someone is understandable.

The saying "don't fix what isn't broken" is how I think of the 15 Minute timer. Of course this is to try to reduce the amount of people refusing to play RDF, but that is not nearly as disturbing as the current system. Will see how it goes, but I believe people will still refuse to play to reduce the timer to 15 minutes from 30 minutes. When I play single player (many times I feel like playing with friends), we run into a dungeon once in a while we don't feel like doing so we just do another one instead. Of course we could just use the "Specific Dungeon" tool, but then were missing out on those 2 extra Emblems each Dungeon.

Also, I believe there is a current problem were people are not getting people to replace spots after people left or been kicked.

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Originally Posted by gutripperr

The saying "don't fix what isn't broken" is how I think of the 15 Minute timer. Of course this is to try to reduce the amount of people refusing to play RDF, but that is not nearly as disturbing as the current system. Will see how it goes

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This is not something invented by Warmane.
That is how it was on retail

As you can understand by reading this patch note (3.3.3):

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-The Deserter debuff given to players who leave a dungeon prematurely when queuing via the Random Dungeon option has been increased to 30 minutes, up from 15 minutes.
The cooldown for using the Random Dungeon option remains 15 minutes.

-The Random Dungeon cooldown is no longer displayed as a debuff. Instead, players will see the cooldown time remaining displayed in the Dungeon Finder window when Random Dungeon or Random Heroic Dungeon is selected from the pull-down.

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Originally Posted by gutripperr

The new 15 Minute Cooldown is annoying when you Multi-Box Heroics because specific ones such as the ICC ones and the Tournament are too hard, so I generally just kick two of my chars out, leave on the other three and group up again for a easier heroic. Now I have to wait 15 Minutes each time I get a Heroic too hard to do.

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Yes premade groups (as when we multibox) should be exempt of this rule ...

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Originally Posted by whitti

Yes premade groups (as when we multibox) should be exempt of this rule ...

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This actually makes sense. Having punishment when you are queuing with your own people makes no sense.

This is just stupidity on a higher level. As a DPS imagine the wait time in queue and when we do get in and unluckily gets teamed up with those *****s that like to leave when it's not their choice of instance. Now 2 other people decide to leave too because the tank or healer is gone and they don't want to continue. And now I'm stuck with another DPS. This new system logic implies that we either 2-man the instance or requeue and wait an eternity to find a tank and a healer OR leave party and wait 15 minutes to requeue again. Either way, we innocent players are left with no option than to waste our time because of someone else. How great is this!! Loving this system. Hope this stupidity does not just end here. Looking forward to more stupidity. Cheers.

My feedback on this RDC is this: it's completly garbage right now but may be useful in the future, I would # all the part of code that you implemented and I refrain myself to say anything else to avoid bans but you can also figure out and understand what players are thinking right now of this implementation.

The resons about my negative feedback is this:
this system works well on retail where the queue system, even for an rdf hc, are really short; but here since it's private server the queue lasts for 20 min or more for hc and I waited even 50 min for a normal queue; but it's not this the main problem, the main problem is that people are leaving rdf for no reasons, so after waiting 20min, you have to wait another 20 min for requeing, and let me tell you: wasting 40 min for an rdf is not making the players happy. I don't even want to mention the buggy reward system if someone try to reque the dungeon and don't get rewarded. Here I describe some situations that I had (during the rdf) and that may happen to everyone:

1) Toc instance (the beginner/slacker): so I joined a toc 5 hc instance, a player was slacking and didn't take the horse, he died because someone started the encounter, so I said in party-chat "you can release and come back", the player released, and while coming back the event restarted (dungeon bug still not fixed) so after we restarted and this player lost about 3 min to chose a horse (idk maybe he was thinking that 1 horse was better than another one), we defeated the faction part but he dismounted near the bosses and pulled all 3 next bosses at the same time, he died, the healer died because wanted to save him and took aggro while tank was switching weapon, guess what? wipe, the tank leave-> the healer leave-> I have to take 15rdc because I have to requeue with someone that has no clue of how that dungeon is working (forced to leave) and can't kick him because we are in 3.
2) Hor instance (the cocky guy): A officer from scale guild (I won't make his name) joined hor with his alt (healer). We were defeating waves, ppl had no clue of priorities/orders. So the enemy mage or priest (i don't remember which mob) killed him because tank commited a mistake and admited it. Guess what? first he called everyone "monkeys" and then he left. I don't want to judge him for leaving because everyone is free to do it, but guess what? healer left->dps left-> tank left, forced to leave because they kicked me too. My message to this guy is that "Idc if you have 300 lods or 500 rs25hc, I've got mine lods/rs too, and I've got friends in scale too so I know that all ppl are not like you but there is not absolutly reason that you join a rdf hc (wearing bis) and leave all insulting them.You can figure out that if you join a rdf hc there are all lvl players (from noobs to pro) and if you have to leave like you did maybe you shoudl start think is better to don't join alone maybe you should join with your guild mates.

3) hall of lightning(the bully guys): This happenned to me in the past before the system was implemented. I joined a rdf hc, I was new to the class (doing rdf hc) doing 2k dps, a party of 4 members kick me because they ***** me about my dps. So if this situation will happen now, you have to imagine that any player may be kicked for 15 min RDC timer and can't do anything about it. So 20 min for queue +15 for rdc +20 min for requeue= 55 min wasted for these people.

4)Pos (the insane situation): So This happned to me today (and it's not a joke even if it sounds like this). I joined this pos and the first part (as everybody knows) is a mount part: in order to make it short you have to avoid mobs and reach the first boss. So we reach the spot after the mount run and the only one missing is the healer that pulled ofc half of the instance and we died. We didn't give up, so we decided to retry, guess what? a dps pull again half of the instance and we died AGAIN. It's not over yet, so we all came back because I am a masochist, guess what? The other dps pull some mobs (I know it sounds insane) and the tank died because the healer was too far, so while defeating these 2 or 3 mobs the healer died too and I was the only survivor. So a dps leaves and I beg the healers and the tank to requeue telling them to don't leave because there is a new rdc that won't make you join again, the tank tells everyone to kick him, but no one wants to kick him and he leaves-> the healer leaves-> forced to leave and wait for the RDC.

My finals consideration about this implementation is that Imho you should have built a bridging queue system between servers before implementing this rdc. The players are only more stressed/annoyed by this new implementation.
Ps: Richard Stallman doesn't approve this. Richard Stallman went to dance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7t96m2ynKw0

This situation is almost as bad as blizzards WC3:Rf crap show that's going on right now. Who thought this was a good idea? What was their logic for this decision???

Something that's just happened: Join rdf hc, get into dungeon, someone decides to leave, another person decides to leave, so group breaks up. Oh look 15min CD.

It was stupid micro decisions like this that caused the WoW player base begin to decline back in the day. And now Warmanes starting to bring in Blizzards mistakes before fixing everything else?

And yes the decline of the wow population started in late wrath then worsened greatly in cata and beyond as micro changes "for the greater good" kept coming on into the game.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Midna

There was a 15-minute cooldown added to the Random Dungeon Finder. Choosing a specific dungeon will not add this cooldown.
In addition, players will now not be able to votekick players for a few minutes after they join the group.

We are monitoring the RDF situation very closely right now and have a few more anti abuse additions in mind.

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Okay. So. Here is a scenario:
We get HoR HC as as group, and healer or tank refuses to do it. We can't kick them for 5m. Nor they agreeing to do anything for 5m. Can that be reported as disturbing gameplay?

The only thing I'd say, remove GROUP 15m cooldown if someone else just leaves the party. There is NO reasons to punish 4/5 people when 1/5 decides to leave.

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Originally Posted by pagaro93

Okay. So. Here is a scenario:
We get HoR HC as as group, and healer or tank refuses to do it. We can't kick them for 5m. Nor they agreeing to do anything for 5m. Can that be reported as disturbing gameplay?

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If they refuse to play, or leave (demand kick) you can report them. The ban will only be few days. Perhaps they'll learn from the experience.