Brainstorming a new playstyle for pve feral cat. [DISCUSSION THREAD]

28/08/2022 Update:

If you're interested in learning more about the GotVV-shift, please start with my posts concerning the 5% crit (i.e. this one). I feel morally obligated to point out the biggest, unsolved issue of this technique so that people would immediately be aware of it before reading further. Nap informed me that this is spell batching, which is part of the old client. According to him, this issue was not present on VVotLK Classic, but since my threads regard the original Vanilla VVotLK, I'm keeping the information here almost unchanged for informative reasons.

That said, I am more than aware that it's not structured well as my thoughts are all over the place. For that reason, I created this guide. Take care!

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Thread Navigation

1. Introduction
   
   1. General overview
   2. The importance of the CC procs
   3. Desperate times call for desperate measures
   4. Is stil heaviuh den feadus?
2. RNG - the untrustworthy friend and unpredictable foe click here
   
   1. General overview
   2. Displaying RNG with /rolls
3. The vital presence of the /stopattack command click here
   
   1. Quick clarification
   2. GotVV without the /stopattack command
   3. GotVV with the /stopattack command
   4. VVhat's the value of a Combo Point?
   5. Bonus damage
4. Attack speed modifiers click here
   
   1. General overview
   2. Our attack speed in a raid setting
5. Sacrificing DoTs in favour of CCs click here
6. FB/Rip/Rake & CCs click here
   
   1. Timing FB
   2. 5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or FB?
   3. 5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or refresh Rip in case it has expired?
   4. Rake & CCs. Should we use Shred or refresh Rake in case it has expired?
   5. Folow-up click here
7. Predator's Swiftness - another reliable way to force CCs? click here
   
   1. Backstory
   2. VVhat can we do with this information?
   3. New equation
   4. Author's note
8. Agility vs Strength vs Haste. VVhich archtype would be the most suitable for the GotVV-shift? click here
   
   1. Unnecessary introduction
   2. An example build for each archtype
   3. Performance of each archtype in fights with different lengths and a different amount of CCs
   4. Final verdict
   5. Follow-up post click here
9. Something about the 5% melee crit click here
   
   1. Follow-up post 1 click here
   2. Follow-up post 2 click here
10. Personal analysis of Savage Roar click here
11. Cat's openers: Shred spam vs SR mid-Berserk vs FB mid-Berserk click here
12. Personal analysis of bearweaving click here
    
    1. Backstory
    2. General overview
    3. Some calculations
    4. GotVV-shift vs bearweaving
    5. Conclusions
13. Restoweaving click here
    
    1. Preface
    2. Comparing the damage of GotVV-shift vs VVrathweaving vs Restoweaving
    3. No weapon swapping
    4. Healing only when PS is up
    5. Conclusions
14. Improving the GotVV-shift click here
    
    1. Daggerweaving
    2. Swinging with the main weapon and swapping idols afterwards - a match made in heaven
15. Being under the hit/exp cap in favour of more offensive stats click here
16. GotVV-shift in retrospect click here
    
    1. Preface
    2. General overview
    3. Attack speed modifiers
    4. Maul-Mangle-Maul vs CC for Mangle
    5. GotVV-shift with a 2.4-speed weapon
17. Nuances in feral cat's gameplay click here
    
    1. Preface
    2. Clipping DoTs
    3. Staying at 100 energy with 5 CPs
    4. Cat's movement speed
18. Exception that proves the rule click here
    
    1. Preface
    2. 4-CP Rip
    3. Going for a 5-CP SR if you're sitting at 4CPs
    4. Going for a 5-CP FB if you're sitting at 4CPs
19. Ogre Pinata pre-pull rotation click here
    
    1. Preface
    2. General overview
    3. An alternative approach
    4. Actual theorycrafting
    5. Follow-up post click here
20. One man's trash is another man's treasure click here
    
    1. Preface
    2. AP increase from Crystal of Ferocity & Scourgebane Draught
    3. Swing timer reset from Oil of Immolation
    4. Eskhandar's Claws

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INTRODUCTION

https://i.imgur.com/9ETZCs4.png

I. General overview

In this forum thread, I've talked about a new playstyle, its advantages and disadvantages, and some tricks around it. Before I say anything else, I'd like to stress on the fact that this is going to be a DISCUSSION thread. I'm more than ready to accept any constructive feedback, which might disprove most of the points I make here. If that's the case, I'll acknowledge the false information and correct it. Keep in mind that not everything is mentioned in the first post!!! You have to read everything here, in order to get a better understanding of the risks and the nuances (orr just view the summary)! Other people's comments are also worth reading, so make sure you check them out as well. Speaking of which:

Big thanks to Nap for basically collaborating with me on this project. Thank you, DarkenedHue, for pointing out some of my mistakes in the OP, and to both of you for sharing the EJ forum page. VVithout you, this theorycraft would have remained in the dust. Nap and wtfzomglol have created some good macros, so make sure you use them. Thank you, Blunta, for motivating me to finally record some tests on dummies and informing me about the lag/human error factor. Thank you, Aldtharios and Nobuemon for your time to respond to my DMs and to shed some light on the 'exploit' topic. Thank you, Sand1dark for informing me about the Predator's Swiftness interaction with Regrowth on discord. Also, props to skullatbash, DarkenedHue, Septimun, and Bigpwn for their amazing work in the bugtracker!

So, without any further ado, here's my take on the "Omen of Clarity" topic:

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II. The importance of the CC procs

Some players see this blue buff and tell themselves “Oh, cool. I get to do an extra Shred. Nice”, while in truth those procs play a bigger role. I dare to say that they don’t just increase our dps - they DEFINE the whole philosophy of the cat’s gameplay. Don’t believe me? You think it’s exaggerated?

I’m going to give you a simple example. Imagine that you just cast Rip on a mob, and its full duration is the same as your Savage Roar’s. So 22 seconds (with the three Shreds). You would probably feel comfortable with the long duration of both abilities, and you would try to bite the target, right? VVell, what if I told you that it’s only possible thanks to our CCs?

If we want to refresh both SR and Rip with as few abilities as possible (let’s say 1x Rake and 3x Shreds), and we exclude the OoC procs from our equation, we would need overall:
- 216/206(with t10) energy w/o TF;
- 156/146(with t10) energy with TF.
And since druids regenerate 10 energy per second regardless in what form they are and regardless what stats they have, in the first case we would need 22/21 seconds, in order to accumulate the required energy, and in the second one - 16/15. Yikes! And that’s with crits and with only one enabler for SR, mind you. Double yikes!

As you can see, finding an opportunity to FB your target w/o any CC procs is impossible, to say the least. VVith this simple example I’ve shown you why we are extremely dependant on those blue buffs, and why we shouldn’t take them for granted. Thankfully, they don’t have an ICD, so every single AA has a 6% chance to proc them. That’s why it’s so important to force those procs by all means necessary. You can do that by equiping items with haste or using the following spells in combat - Nature’s Grasp, Barkskin, FFF. Before fights and when you avoid certain boss mechanics, you should also cast GotVV.

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III. Desperate times call for desperate measures

Here's where the controversial part begins, and this was the reason for creating the thread. As I've stated above, ferals are heavily dependant on the CC procs, and they should use everything they can to force them. But there's something I see that other ferals don't do in fights:

/cast Gift of the Wild while they are still on the boss
(25/08/2021 Update: If you go read my fourth post, you'd see why this macro is incomplete, and we need to add a /stopattack command. Having clarified that, my OP will continue without acknowledging it, because I want you to see the initial thought process)

I want to stress it here - you can cast the aforementioned ability while you are still attacking the boss as you would normally do. VVhile it doesn’t sound like anything new, it does however come with a penalty and a risk. So, what will happen if I exit cat form just to buff the raid, get a CC and shapeshift again? Let’s find out:

VVe /cast GotW -> we exit cat form, rebuff the raid and gain the CC proc -> a GCD appears. Due to the GCD we can’t enter cat form in less than 1.5 seconds, so we would miss out on two AAs (but we can AA once in our neutral form). VVhen the GCD ends, we shapeshift back as fast as possible. Another GCD pops up, which delays our Shred by 1.5 secs. VVhen the second GCD ends, we /cast Shred, and we are back on track.

That’s the desired scenario. In that case we would gain more damage, because Shred would compensate the lost one, and we will also gain 1-2 CPs for refreshing our finishing moves. Proof:

Spoiler: Show

I'll use my Icecrown kitty as an example:
http://armory.warmane.com/character/...ecrown/profile

AP (unbuffed) = 10722
Shred = (AA*2.25 + 666)*Naturalist*Mangle*SR*Rend and Tear
According to some sources, the cat’s AA damage is calculated by multiplying our AP by 1/14 and adding 54.8 (average pawn damage).
Shred (non-crit) = 5736; Shred (crit) = 12998 (with Predatory Instincts and the Meta Gem)

AA = 821*Naturalist*SR = 1201. Even if that becomes a crit, missing on 2 AAs will still be compensated by a single non-critted Shred, and don't get me started on the glancing blows, which have a 24% to occur.

VVhen do I spam GotVV? - only when I'm low on energy, bleeds have >3 seconds, and when my TF and Berserk are on CD. This needs to be clarified.

Like I’ve said, those are the positives, now let’s look at the potential problems (in a chronological order):

Quote:

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- by exiting cat form we take the risk, that our faster attacks might have given us a CC anyway. In that case, we lose the damage from the missed AAs. Casting GotVV doesn’t consume CC procs though.
- by exiting cat form, other members lose our "Leader of the Pack" aura.
- when casting GotVV, there’s a possibility that our buff might whiff, which means we have to spend another GCD to do this again.
- we change back to cat form, but now we have less energy due to having 3 points in Furor.
- when we enter cat form again, our Shred is delayed due to the GCD. In that time our cat AA could proc the CC.
- the more we do this trick, the less mana we have. This might be a problem if a person dies during an encounter, and we don't have enough mana to resurrect him.
- something, something - the need of many wildspine leaves.

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However, I'd like to talk about the downsides here and show you why they aren't that severe. I'll start with the mildest ones and end on the more crucial problems:

"something, something - the need of many wildspine leaves"
They are derp cheap; I have around 300 grammes of catnip whenever I raid.

"we change back to cat form, but now we have less energy due to having 3 points in 'Furor'"
Yeah. VVe lose energy by shapeshifting out and into cat form past 60. That's why I do this trick with as little energy as possible.

"by exiting cat form, other members lose our "Leader of the Pack" aura"
Even though this sounds bad, it's important to mention that this aura can still be given by another player. If you have another feral druid (bear/cat) or a fury warrior in the raid, then no one will lose the 5% crit (this part is false for pservers; see this post). However, if you are in a 10-man raid, and the raid comp lacks a fury warrior, then using that trick will be illadvised. Speaking of 10-man raids:

"the more we do this trick, the less mana we have. This might be a problem if a person dies during an encounter, and we don't have enough mana to resurrect him"
This is another reason why I don't recommend spamming that spell in small groups. You won't have Blessing of VVisdom from a paladin, and your mana (despite being a secondary resource) might be needed in that group size. You just need to save some of it, in case your fellow group members tend do die a lot. And even then:

"when casting GotVV, there’s a possibility that our buff might whiff, which means we have to spend another GCD to do this again"
Now we get into the more spicy things. Let's be real for a second. Since feral druid depends on the CC procs, and we don't obtain them consistently [i.e. we don't get a guaranteed CC proc after X number of AAs, and we don't have a pity timer that increases the odds of us obtaining it after several misses], it's safe to say that our gameplay is extremely RNG dependant. VVhat I'm trying to say is that /casting GotW during autoattacking isn't breaking that pattern. It's the opposite, since we are giving RNG a big push and thus increasing the likelihood to obtain a CC proc. I'll explain it with math:

Every single AA and every single target of our spells (be those friendly or hostile) have a 6% chance to trigger Omen of Clarity. If we imagine for example a small window of 10 AAs, the probability to obtain a CC proc on the 10th attack would be 46%. That's because if we calculate the probability of every single autoattack whiffing, we will get 0.94^10=0.5386 or 54%. Now, let's calculate the probability of casting GotVV on a full 25-man group. If we want to calculate the chances of whiffing on every single buffed player, we will get 0.94^25=0.2129 or a 21% chance to whiff (that doesn't take into consideration the presence of pets). This means that we are more likely to succeed than to miss. This means that the numbers are in our favour. But what happens if we miss? Then we go to the next point:

"by exiting cat form we take the risk, that our faster attacks might have given us a CC anyway. In that case, we lose the damage from the missed AAs" + "when we enter cat form again, our Shred is delayed due to the GCD. In that time our cat AA could proc the CC."
This is inevitable. This is the biggest penalty we have to accept when we spam GotVV constantly. There's a possibility that we actually might lose damage from doing that thing. I can mention once again that the probability of this occuring is small, but it can still happen. This is where the real discussion begins:

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IV. Is stil heaviuh den feadus?

So, as you can see, this small trick can cause a huge headache. Some of you might be wondering why I am even bringing this up if it has the potential to penalise us. I’m going to answer the question by asking another. Are you willing to risk, or are you willing to wait patiently 3-4 seconds while autoattacking in order to pool some energy and be able to cast a single attack again? Personally I got used to it, because the constant spam allowed me to squeeze in some FBs in a single fight and to refresh both SR and Rip when their timers were synchronised. Admittedly, this playstyle is not for everyone, since RNG is not a trustworthy friend, and it won't benefit everyone equally.

VVhat do you think?

RNG - THE UNTRUSTVVORTHY FRIEND AND UNPREDICTABLE FOE

I. General overview

RNG can affect the GotVV-shift in various ways:

- AA damage:

• 24% Glancing Blows;
• Critical Strike % (affected by the 4.8% crit suppression and ret paladin's 3% increase);
• Normal Hits - remaining %.

- Shred Damage:

• Critical Strike % (affected by the 4.8% crit suppression and ret paladin's 3%);
• Normal Hits - remaining %.

- Clearcasting Procs:

• In terms of quantity (i.e. number of procs in a fight; this can affect our energy flow e.g. if we have 90, and we get 2 CCs in a row from our AAs especially during Berserk);
• In terms of quality (i.e. whether we get a CC proc with 5 CPs or less. In case we have 5 CPs and OoC procs, and we are about to use a finishing move. Even then, it really matters if we are about to use Rip, SR, or FB, because those abilities behave differently in the presence of CCs).

This is the reason why I don't typically rely on ingame tests, but resort to general calculations where I set my own conditions. Admittedly, even this approach isn't perfect, cuz there might be some factors that elude me (like boss mechanics). Quite honestly, I don't know how 3-Party simulators approach the RNG factor (if at all). If someone has more knowledge than me in this sphere, then please share your feedback. I'll gladly take it into consideration.

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II. Displaying RNG with /rolls

One of the biggest counterarguments against this "powershifting" was the fear of the RNG factor. People weren't ok with leaving cat form in the middle of a fight just to GotVV the raid and get nothing in return. For that reason, I decided to visualise the chances of this occuring. I took some screenshots of me rolling dices which can mimic how the system determines whether a certain 25-man raid buff can grant a CC proc. Omen of Clarity has a 6% chance to be triggered, so if we treat this like a DnD game, and I want to get a "hit", I have to roll between 95 and 100. It doesn't matter whether that's the first or last roll, nor if it's repeated a bunch of times - in order to trigger OoC successfully, I have to get a number from that spectrum only once among the 25 rolls I do below. Everything else will be treated as a "miss". Here are the results:

Spoiler: Show

https://i.imgur.com/lX2asdV.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/TrYFiFu.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/uahTyT2.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/2bt5Ixv.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/81mMKit.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/YZfalyG.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/RY3I2Mo.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/uo7xOdd.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sXpRwna.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/HQfMyqJ.jpg

As you can see, among those roll sequences only the third and the ninth didn't contain a number from the spectrum I made above. So, the numbers are indeed in our favour.

Note 1: I admit, a more realisitc statistic would have been repeating this experiment 90 more times and seeing how the hit-miss ratio would have looked like. I didn't do that because I didn't want to spend too much time staring at my screen while doing nothing but /rolling, but if there are people here, who are genuinely sceptical about the numbers and want to see more SSs, I suppose I could expand this experiment a bit and make up to 100 roll sequences. However, one could ask themselves whether the forum users are actually going to view each and every SS I would make in addition to what I've posted here.

Note 2: The /roll sequences could also visualise us getting CCs from plain AAs. If every single /roll represents an AA, you can see on every screenshot when that autoattack was able to trigger OoC. It could happen at any time - e.g. on the 6th, on the 10th, or even on the 25th attack - and we wouldn't be able to know when exactly that's going to happen during an actual boss encounter. The thing I'm trying to say is that we can't foresee whether our next AA would give us a CC proc, so we can't make any plans in advance.

I've already read this theory in EJ threads in the "archives" (sounds so mystic), but I've never seen it in motion. Theoretically and IF played perfectly I think everyone can understand this has big potential since people are already spamming GotW as soon as they can't auto attack.
But has there been a singe video, simulation or even dps meter screenshot about it yet ? I don't think so so people prefer to play traditionally. Would you be ready to test it out in a real bossfight?

DBS seems accessible, fester too. But when there's lot's of movement, it becomes very complicated and brings another reason to mess up our already, well known for its complexity, "rotation".


Think about it, a video would bring a very strong piece of evidence, and as far as I know it has never been done. So I don't really understand why you are wasting your time doing rolls when everyone understands how probabilities work.

PS: don't forget you might need Improved Leader of the Pack for mana.

PPS: EJ start of discussion about GotW CC proc : https://web.archive.org/web/20110101...8/#post1736622

I think you've misunderstood Furor. It doesn't give you 60% of the energy you had when you were last in Cat Form. It just gives you up to 60 energy flat whenever you shift to cat form. GotW hits pet units too - realistically the OoC proc chance from this in a 25 man should be in the realm of 85-90%.

Omen of Clarity gaming was always one of the more interesting facets of Feral DPS. But with something like OoC it can be hard to ascertain what's meant to be blizzlike vs what isn't.

Another relevant consideration is the fact that GotW apparently should reset the swing timer. This post dove fairly deep into the matter:
https://web.archive.org/web/20110101...8/#post1751922

It's also very likely that this is an unequivocal DPS gain in scenarios where you're able to AoE, because of how effectively energy converts to damage when you're Swiping a large number of targets.

Big thanks for the link, guys. I'll make sure to check them out before I discuss this playstyle further. However, I'd like to say some things in advance.

@ DarkenedHue

About Furor - yeah, you are absolutely right. The funny thing is that in a past test I allegedly paid attention to my energy regeneration when shapeshifting, and somehow I missed the part that the regeneration stays the same. I guess I'm blinder than I thought. So, big thanks for pointing my mistake and correcting it. My apologies for saying something wrong and misleading others. I'll make sure to edit the OP.

About Gotw buffing units - I was perfectly aware of this. The reason why I didn't consider pets in my OP is because raid compositions differ, and we don't always have X amount of Hunters, UH DKs, VVarlocks in the group. Not to mention, I didn't want to make things more complicated by including more units in the equation (like SPriest's Shadowfiend or Boomkin's trees) that further increase the odds of a successful proc. Like I've said, I wanted to keep the 25 number range.

About the swing timer - yeah, I wasn't aware of it. Thanks for providing me the link.

"But with something like OoC it can be hard to ascertain what's meant to be blizzlike vs what isn't." Is this a hint that I'm exploiting the game? Even though I'd understand that point, if you truly mean it, I don't see why it wouldn't be blizzlike. Gotw works as intended, and OoC states that every target affected by our spells grants a 6% chance to give us a CC proc. It doesn't state that a single spell cast has that chance. This is the effect I'm benefiting from. If there's indeed an exploit somewhere here, then I will stop using this trick.

But then again, what can be defined as blizzlike? From what I've heard, powershifting hadn't been part of Vanilla wow, rather it had been discovered later on. The devs hadn't been aware of that possible playstyle, and after seeing how players had massively used it in TBC, they had nerfed Furor in wotlk. Personally, I like to use whatever resources I'm given by the game (if I know that they are legit) and don't think too much about whether the devs saw it coming. For example - Light of Elune. I don't understand how this was left in the game, knowing that it can help a guild achieve Realm First, but here we are.

@halesk70

"Would you be ready to test it out in a real bossfight?"

I've been already using it in boss fights. Now, I must admit, I'm not the best pilot out there, and probably I won't demonstrate its full potential precisely. Though, I liked the idea of gaining additional CPs and making my "rotation" a bit smoother. I wasn't Gotw-ing the whole raid on every single occasion because I didn't want to go past my bleed timers, but I have to admit that there were times when I became too greedy with the FBs, and RNG didn't give me critical strikes to acquire 5 CPs again. VVell, part of the reason is that I lack crit on my Frostmourne character. However, knowing how I played, I can share some of my experience here. I Gotw the raid when:

- TF is on CD, and I have low energy;
- I'm about to AoE, and Berserk is on CD.

If I see that Rake has less than 2 seconds left on its timer, I prefer to pool my energy. Same thing goes for Rip. In both of those cases, I just mash my FFF, NG, and Barkskin keybinds. If Berserk is activated, I never leave cat form.

"But when there's lot's of movement, it becomes very complicated and brings another reason to mess up our already, well known for its complexity, "rotation"."

Yeah, that's a good point. The timing should be correct, otherwise people can misplay and lose DPS as a result.

"PS: don't forget you might need Improved Leader of the Pack for mana."

I hadn't forgotten about it, but I don't really like this talent. The numbers it provides are small. Still, after admitting that I misunderstood Furor, I'll consider finding a new talent for the extra talent point.

"So I don't really understand why you are wasting your time doing rolls when everyone understands how probabilities work."

There were people that were sceptical about the odds, and they weren't convinced that the numbers were in our favour. Hence why I took those SSs.

The way I see it is, auto attacks in the end are your main source of dmg, and in themselves can proc CC, i dont think the "powershift GotW" is worth it. Better just stick to using faerie fire in those "waiting" times and "calculating" in advance your next moves. Best of luck.

THE VITAL PRESENCE OF THE /STOPATTACK COMMAND
(VVARNING - HUGE VVALL OF TEXT UP AHEAD!)

I. Quick clarification

25/08/2022 Update: This post has been updated yet again. The reason for that is the new information concerning the OoC proc rate from GotVV. My initial source of inspiration was this EJ forum page, where a user shared his opinion on how the probability for a CC was calculated:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by a civilian

If GotW hits 28 targets (25 players, 3 pets - probably a low estimate for a 25-man raid), then GotW has a 1-(1-3.5/60)^28 = 81.4% chance to proc clearcasting. I will ignore combo points and assume the clearcast is used to shred. Hence, casting GotW is worth .814(shred damage) - {number of AAs}[(melee damage)+3.5/60(shred damage)].

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However, I no longer consider this information to be accurate due to three reasons:

1) Incorrect proc chance for a CC from GotVV;
2) Absence of the weapon swing in neutral form also contributing to the probability for a CC;
3) Absence of the weapon damage in neutral form.

1) Incorrect proc chance for a CC from GotVV
A huge role for this plays the following github page, where Aggrend, i.e. a Classic VVoVV producer, viewed the 1.5 GCD from instant cast spells as a factor:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aggrend

[Omen of Clarity's] core data is to proc 3.5 times per minute. That results in the 8.75% chance for instants and spells with under 1.5 second cast time. (3.5/(60/1.5)=0.0875).

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He then mentioned some drawbacks surrounding the probability for a CC proc from various spells, which were refuted with logs and videos on the very same page. VVanting to understand the current script behind the dudu buff, I sent a DM to a warmane developer, and this was her/his reply:

https://i.imgur.com/L8mVQpW.png
https://i.imgur.com/bVqnI2s.png
(referencing this bug report)

2) Absence of the weapon swing in neutral form also contributing to the probability for a CC
I mean, this also gives benefits to the GotVV-manoeuvre, which for some reason was left out from "a civilian"'s formula. If OoC's PPM is 3.5/60, then the PPH with a slow weapon (say a polearm with 3.6 sec swing timer) would be:

1-(1-3.5/(60/3.6)) = 0.21 or 21% per attack swing in neutral form

=> GotVV with 25 players and 3 pets mid fight has a 92.3% probability for a success and 7.7% for a whiff. The weapon swing in neutral form would have 21% for a success and thus 79% for a whiff. Of course, after we attack the boss with our regular weapon, we won't get a second CC but just overwrite the first one. This means that the overall probability for a CC from both GotVV and the weapon swing would be:

1-( 0.077*0.79) = 0.93917 or 93.92%

3) Absence of the weapon damage in neutral form
Self explanatory.

So, here's a more accurate version of the formula imho:

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II. GotVV without the /stopattack command)

Quote:

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0.93917*(shred damage) + weapon damage (human form) - (number of missed AAs)*(AA average damage) - (number of AAs)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage)

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Now it's time to fill it with actual numbers. Here's what my Icecrown kitty has - 14029 AP (with raid buffs + AP flask); 73.2% crit (incl. the 3% crit vulnerability and the 4.8% crit suppression); 100% arp (DA=0.98); t10, no extra AP from the idol, from Berserking, from the ring, and no trinket procs are included here (basically no item procs with the only exception of the extra crit fom the idol):

• AA = 1623 (hit); 1217 (glancing); 3678 (crit); 3030 (average)
• Shred = 7294 (normal); 16528 (crit);14053 (average)
• 11.5% haste in cat form (or 0.7 attack speed with the 20% and 3% melee haste).
• Oathbinder, Charge of the Ranger-General 3972 (average damage in human form with 58% crit, unbuffed)

Ok, we know how much damage I'm capable of doing, now we need to see how many cat AAs we would sacrifice. Here I'm going to show you two videos:

Casting GotVV and autoattacking in neutral form
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_BwhY7Nd64
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoUzwLZJ64o

It seems that the swing timer of my polearm delays more than two AAs as a cat. On my ICC feral cat, I have 11.5% haste, which is equivalent to an attack speed of 0.9 or 0.7 (with the 20% and the 3% raid buffs). That's fine and dandy, but how long will our idle time last?

Quote:

---

{01/01/2023 Update} According to "a civilian", it depended on how late you cast GotVV because the spell could allegedly reset the swing timer. As I'm updating this post, I cannot confirm such interaction ever happening on warmane. If you check the videos, you'll see that the slow swing registered right after the cat one ended. Here's another way to visualise it:

GotVV is cast right after the cat swing
https://i.imgur.com/PhFamiQ.png

GotVV is cast mid-through the cat swing
https://i.imgur.com/1whFtf5.png

In both cases, the delay is equal to the weapon speed from Oathbinder. Since its unmodified weapon speed is 3.6 sec, whereas the one for cat is 1, this would result in 3.6 missed cat AAs. As I've already explained above, one AA deals 3030 damage on average, so 3.6 missed AAs would lead to 10,908 damage loss. Shred deals 14053 damage on average, while Oathbinder - 3972. VVe apply those numbers here and do the math:

Quote:

---

0.93917*(shred damage) + weapon damage (human form) - (number of missed AAs)*(AA average damage) - (number of AAs )*(3.5/60)*(shred damage)

---

13198+3972-10,908-2,951=3,311

---

As many of you already know, this initial misconception led to me considering another possible way to handle the GotVV-shift, which proved to be even better. In the words of the wise Bob Ross:

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71-jMBJ+dmL.jpg

---

III. GotVV with the /stopattack command

VVhat if we don't autoattack the boss in neutral form? If we GotVV the raid and stay idle for a bit, after switching to feral we will attack with our 0.7 speed almost immediately. So, here's the first question - how will the formula look now? VVell, we need to revert the probabiliy of getting a CC proc back to 92.3% or 0.923 and exclude the weapon damage, since that won't be a factor anymore. This leaves us with:

Quote:

---

0.923(shred damage) - (number of missed AAs)*(AA damage) - (number of AAs)(3.5/60)*(shred damage)]

---

Second question - how long will the idle time be? VVell, we need to take the following things into consideration:

• GCD from GotVV = 1.274 secs (shortened duration with 3% and 5% spell haste from a Boomie and VVrath of the Air Totem);
• latency & human error = they increase the idle period;
• AA cooldown = it decreases the idle period.

This is how I will define the delay from here onwards:

Quote:

---

SVVING DELAY = period between the time when the cat AA cooldown ends and the time when I start AA-ing again in cat form

---

VVhat about the conditions?

Quote:

---

In the perfect scenario, we autoattack in cat form and immediately GotVV the raid. A GCD occurs, and after it we shapeshift back to cat and continue dps-ing.

https://i.imgur.com/jspnwvq.png

Casting GotVV right after the cat AA and not attacking in neutral form
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veKC02qnJnY
(I'm using a haste pot and the engineering enchant, in order to lower my attack speed to 0.7. framebyframe estimates a swing delay of 0.97 seconds.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9IBfXquUqI
(framebyframe estimates a swing delay of 1.03 seconds)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkPgjG9ytjw
(framebyframe estimates a swing delay of 1.1 seconds)

So, the delay in the perfect scenario would be 1.1 seconds or 1.57 missed attacks as a cat. VVe apply those numbers to the modified formula and get this:

12971 - 4757 - 1287 = 6927

But, of course, we can't expect to have perfect results every time, so let's estimate a bigger delay. As suggested by "a civilian", I interrupt the normal cat attack halfway. So, what does that leave us with?

https://i.imgur.com/j8zcHfK.png

Casting GotVV halfway through the cat AA and not attacking in neutral form
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lFNb4CFgfk
(framebyframe estimates a swing delay of 1.17 seconds.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCvzBgOXCUY
(framebyframe estimates a swing delay of 1.34 seconds)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2RPIeeBGzA
(framebyframe estimates a swing delay of 1.37 seconds)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ebG1usWNiM
(framebyframe estimates a swing delay of 1.37 seconds)

So, most of the time we would idle for around 1.4 seconds, which is the equivalent of 2 full AAs. VVe apply those numbers to the modified formula and get this:

12971 - 6060 - 1640 = 5271

---

Much better, wouldn't you agree? VVe can clearly see that /stopattack is VITAL to our playstyle, and the benefit from it is greater by a large margin in comparison to the one without it. But wait, I'm not done yet; we still need to consider other factors. A quote from the OP:

Quote:

---

Now let’s look at the potential problems (in a chronological order):

- by exiting cat form we take the risk, that our faster attacks might have given us a CC anyway. In that case, we lose the damage from the missed AAs. Casting GotVV doesn’t consume CC procs though. + taken into consideration
- when casting GotVV, there’s a possibility that our buff might whiff, which means we have to spend another GCD to do this again. X needs to be considered
- when we enter cat form again, our Shred is delayed due to the GCD. In that time our cat AA could proc the CC. X needs to be considered

---

"when casting GotVV, there’s a possibility that our buff might whiff, which means we have to spend another GCD to do this again"
How do we take it into consideration? It's quite simple, really. If we know that the probability of GotVV proccing CC from the first cast is 92.3%, then that would mean that it would whiff in the remaining 7.7% of the cases. In other words, in my formula I'll keep only 92.3% of the damage loss from the missed AAs and the potential CCs (i.e. Shreds) being generated by those AAs, while the remaining 7.7% will be viewed as the gained damage from the second GotVV cast. Here's how it would look like:

Quote:

---

0.923(shred damage) + (0.077*GotVV's second cast) - 0.923*(number of missed AAs)*(AA damage) - 0.923*(number of AAs)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage)

---

The formula for the second cast will be the same with some minor exceptions:
- the probability for a proc won't be 92.3% anymore, but instead 1-(1-3.5/(60/1.5))^56 = 99.41%
- the number of AAs will increase, because we will add an additional GCD (i.e. 1.274) to the original delay.

"when we enter cat form again, our Shred is delayed due to the GCD. In that time our cat AA could proc the CC"
Ok, so, we are only going to apply the necessary changes to this part:

(number of AAs)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage)

The way we address this is by adding 1.5 more seconds to the original delay, so that we can see how many AAs have been inflicted prior to our Shred. The reason why the duration of this GCD is 1.5 and not 1.274 is because "cat form" is not affected by spell haste, as you can see in this clip.

Taking both of these points into consideration, here's how the formula would look like in the end:

Quote:

---

0.923(shred damage) + 0.077*[0.9941(shred damage) - (number of missed AAs with the second GotVV cast)*(AA average damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage)] - 0.923*(number of missed AAs)*(AA damage) - 0.923*(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage)

---

Convoluted? Yes, no doubt.
Confusing? Mby, for some.
Accurate? Abso-****ing-lutely.

Now, let's test the GotVV-shift (featuring /stopattack) with this formula. I'm going to use the same conditions as above:

1) VVe have a 1.1 delay, which is equivalent to 1.57 missed attacks. The average Shred damage is 14053, while AA - 3030. If we want to consider the amount of AAs prior to Shred, we would add 1.5 seconds to this delay, and we will get 2.6 seconds, which will be 3.71 AAs. VVith the second GotVV cast, the delay would be 2.374 seconds, and we would miss out on 3.39 AAs. The downtime before the Shred with the second GotVV cast would be 3.874 seconds or 5.53 AAs. Now, let's do some math:

12971 + 0.077(2nd GotVV) - 4391 - 2807 = 5773 + 0.077*[13970-10272-4533] = 5773 - (0.077*835) = 5709

=> even though we get a negative result from the second GotVV, it's important to note that this shouldn't mislead us into thinking that by doing so we lose damage. If we don't cast the GotVV for a second time after an initial whiff, then the gained damage from the CC would be decreased by 0.077*7798 = 600. Compare it to 0.077*835 = 64, and you can see what I mean. This proves that casting GotVV after a whiff is more beneficial than simply shapeshifting back into cat form.

2) VVe have a 1.4 delay, which is equivalent to 2 missed attacks. If we want to consider the amount of AAs prior to Shred, we would add 1.5 seconds to this delay, and we will get 2.9 seconds, which will be 4.14 AAs. VVith the second GotVV cast, the delay would be 2.674 seconds, and we would miss out on 3.82 AAs. The downtime before the Shred with the second GotVV cast would be 4.174 seconds or 5.96 AAs. Now, let's do some math:

12971 + 0.077(2nd GotVV) - 5593 - 3132 = 4246 + 0.077*[13970-11575-4886] = 4246 - (0.077*2491) = 4054

So, as you can see, I've proved the GotVV-shift with math. So, it's viable, and yet we are just scratching the surface. That's because up until now we've only looked at the bonus Shred damage, but we haven't touched the main part - the combo points. So, I'd like to ask you a question:

---

IV. VVhat's the value of a Combo Point?

For a long period of time, I had no idea how to take this factor more accurately into consideration. I mean, it's not like actual numbers are directly tied to our CPs and are visible to the naked eye. They bring us damage when we have accumulated a lot of them and use them for our finishing moves. Now, I'm going to propose my hypothesis on how we should approach this question. VVe have to consider two scenarios:

• the climax of the fight;
• the last remaining seconds before the boss dies.

1) Climax of the fight

Imagine a player who utilises the GotVV-shift vs another, who doesn't. Both of them would maintain SR and Rip all the time. However, since the first person is going to have more CPs than the other guy, he can't use them for anything else than for FBs. For that reason, this is going to be the thing I will set my eyes on. During the heat of the battle, we typically bite our targets with 5 CPs, so the value of a CP in this case would be based solely on the 5CP FB.

Quote:

---

FB 5CPs (Rend and Tear increases the crit chance by 25, so 98.2% for a crit and 1.8% for a hit):
FB (hit) = (190+290*5+0.35*AP)*Feral Aggression*SR*Naturalist*DA(arp)*1.03*1.04
FB (hit) = 11569
FB (crit) = 26215
FB (average) = 25951
1CP = 5190; 2CPs = 10380; 1.732 CPs on average per CP-generator = 8989

---

However, this would have been true if we had got the damage immediatly after obtaining the 5th CP. But that's not the case. VVe need to spend 35 energy to actually get it. So, we need to lower its value based on that energy. How?

BY SUBTRACTING THE ****ING SHRED DAMAGE FROM THE BITE DAMAGE

Let me explain: Under normal circumstances, if we hadn't got the CPs, we would have used the energy for a Shred.
So, I need to see how much damage my Shred would have given me for 35 energy and subtract it from the 5CP Bite. If my Shreds do 14053 damage on average, and that ability costs 42 energy, then:

14053:42=334.6 (Shred damage for 1 energy)
334.6*35=11711 (Shred damage for 35 energy)
25951-11711=14240 (additional damage from the Bite, i.e. the 5CPs)

This is the thing, which we need to observe. So, knowing that 5CPs constitute that amount of damage, then we divide it by 5 and get 2848 for one CP or 5696 for 2. But, my Shreds generate around 1.732 CPs on average, so one Shred would grant me an additional 4933 damage on average. Now it's time to integrate the value of a CP in our formula. In order to do this, we need to view it as a result from Shred, so the Shred variables are going to determine how big/small the gain is. Here's what I mean:

• 0.923(shred damage) + 0.923*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)
• 0.9941(shred damage)+0.9941*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)
• - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)
• - 0.923(number of AAs prior to Shred - 1)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage) - 0.923(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)

Here's the formula with the CP values:

Quote:

---

0.923(shred damage) + 0.923*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP) + 0.077*[0.9941(shred damage) + 0.9941*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP) - (number of missed AAs with the second GotVV cast)*(AAaverage damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)] - 0.923*(number of missed AAs)*(AA damage) - 0.923(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage) - 0.923(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)

---

Isn't it beautiful? It's a ****ing masterpiece.

2) The denouement of the fight

During the last, say, 10 seconds of the fight we can't always generate enough CPs for a 5CP FB. In that case, we need to view the different FBs (based on 1-5 CPs) and pinpoint the moment when the CPs stop having value. Here are the results:

• 5CP = 25951
• 4CP = 20912
• 3CP = 15872
• 2CP = 10832
• 1CP = 5792

Source: https://wotlk.evowow.com/?spell=48577#see-also

if we subtract 11711 from them, we will get:

• 5CP = 14332 (1CP = 2848, 2CPs = 5696, 1.732CPs = 4933)
• 4CP = 9201 (1CP = 2300.25, 2CPs = 4600.5, 1.732CPs = 3984)
• 3CP = 4161 (1CP = 1387, 2CPs = 2774, 1.732CPs = 2402)
• 2CP = -879
• 1CP = -5918

As you can see, the damage from the 1CP and 2CP FB is negative, so casting Shred is better in this case (granted, we have the needed energy). Nap proposed on discord that we need to use TimeToDie/VVeakAuras(with an integrated "timetodie" timer) for this case. Thank you for the suggestion, mate! This is exactly what I needed.

Here I'm going to ignore the Shred damage from the GotVV-shift and concentrate purely on the CP value. Imho, if we want to squeeze in a FB, then we need to do it with 4 or 5 CPs. Assuming that we have 0 CPs during the last X seconds before the boss dies, you need to be able to cast at least 2-3 Shreds, in order for the CPs to have any value. This means that we will need 119 energy/12 seconds (2xShreds + 1xFB) or 161 energy/~16 seconds (3x Shreds + 1xFB) to be able to inflict the extra ability. If you cast GotVV, you'd gain a CC most of the time, which would spare you 42 energy of additional pooling time. So, the pooling time would be 8 seconds for the 4CP FB or 12 for the 5CP respectively. You could go for another GotVV and spare yourself additional 42 energy, which would allow you to start generating CPs for one last FB 4 or 8 seconds respectively before the boss dies. However, 4 seconds wouldn't be enough, because we'd have 6 GCDs prior to FB (1 Shred = 1 cat GCD = 1 sec; 1 GotVV-shift = 2 rcaster GCDs = 2.774 secs), and we can't reduce that downtime any further. In that particular scenario, we'd have 7 seconds before the boss dies, but we should also give ourselves a time window for the FB and any possible delays caused by human errors and/or latency. Speaking of which, I didn't address that factor up until now, so I'm adding 1-2 seconds for all of the aforementioned cases:

Quote:

---

You have 0 CPs and 0 energy, and the boss is about to die. How much time do you need to generate enough CPs for a FB?

• For a 4CP FB:
  
  1. 13-14 seconds (due to latency/human error) w/o the GotVV-shift;
  2. 9-10 seconds (due to latency/human error) with one GotVV-shift;
  3. 8-9 seconds (due to latency/human error) with two GotVV-shifts.
• For a 5CP FB:
  
  1. 18-19 seconds (due to latency/human error) w/o the GotVV-shift;
  2. 13-14 seconds (due to latency/human error) with one GotVV-shift;
  3. 9-10 seconds (due to latency/human error) with two GotVV-shifts.

If the timer on "TimeToDie" is lower than that, then don't bother.

Disclaimer 1: Obviously, this doesn't take into account any CCs from our AAs.
Disclaimer 2: Obviously, this doesn't take into account the presence of TF.
Disclaimer 3: Obviously, this doesn't take into account low amount of crit%.

---

Spoiler: Show

If you don't understand the last paragraph, click here for more info.

---

V. Bonus damage

Imagine that RNG is bad, your AAs don't give you that many CCs, and you might cast Rip or Rake with a delay. In that case, this GotVV spam would minimise the damage loss because you'd gain burst energy/a quick CP or two. It's hard to imagine how much damage you'd save yourself in such a hypothetical scenario (because, admittedly, it might not happen THAT often), but let's calculate it just so you can see the bonus damage from one single instance:

Rip 5CP (1 tick) = (0.05*AP+501)*SR*Mangle*Naturalist*1.03(Ret Palas)*1.04(CRogues)
Rip 5CP (1 tick) = 2450
Rip 5CP (1 crit. tick) = 5552
Rip 5CP (1 average tick) = 4721

So, you'd get an additional 4721 damage if you manage to prevent the loss of one Rip tick.

---

Link to framebyframe: http://www.watchframebyframe.com/

Hello,

impressive theory crafting, and point made. So you're saying that something like:

Quote:

---

#showtooltip Gift of the Wild
/cast Gift of the Wild
/stopattack

---

Could work? Given A) I watch the swing timer and do it right after I get cat AA, also B) have macros with startattack for main/all dmging abilities? Plus C) obviously using it only when energy/proc starving?

Have to give it a try. Cheers

Edit: Actually made my return to cat form like this:

Quote:

---

#showtooltip Cat Form
/cast [form:0/1/2/4/5] Cat Form
/startattack [form:3]

---

ATTACK SPEED MODIFIERS

I. General overview

Under normal circumstances, Shred is better than an AA, because it has more multipliers. Compare:

Quote:

---

Shred (nm) = (((AP/14)+54.8)*2.25+666)*2.28228
Shred (crit) = (((AP/14)+54.8)*2.25+666)*5.17164648

---

vs

Quote:

---

AA (nm) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*1.463
AA (glancing) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*1.09725
AA (crit) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*3.315158

---

If you do the math, you would see that one critical AA can't surpass one regular Shred because the base damage is still stronger. So, any AP increase would go in favour of the GotVV powershift. However, once you double, tripple etc the amount of AAs, then suddenly they start doing more damage than the regular Shred. For example, this is how 2 and respectively 3 critical AAs would look like:

• AA (crit) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*6.630316

• AA (crit) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*9.945474

That's because we add natural numbers instead of mere decimals as multipliers, which snowball rapidly. Unfortunately, there are some abilities which increase our attack speed in a raid, and here I want to take them into consideration. Here's a small list:

Haste Rating/Attack Speed modifiers:

• Haste from Gear = ~ 16% with BiS ICC gear;
• Melee Haste from the Engineering Chicken = 5%;
• Melee Haste from Boomies/Ret Paladins = 3%;
• Melee Haste from Icy Talons = 20%;
• Melee Haste from Bloodlust = 30%;
• Haste from DBVV hc = 27.7% (700 haste rating);
• Haste from Potion of Speed = 19.8% (500 haste rating);
• Haste from Engineering Enchant = 13.5% (340 haste rating).

---

II. Our attack speed in a raid setting

20/02/2023 Update: The numbers below are outdated because a) "cat form" always triggers a 1.5-sec GCD, and b) GotVV is affected by spell haste, so it also decreases by a bit. I won't delete or change anything here, but you'll find more info in "GotVV-shift in restrospect"

In order to get more accurate numbers, I'll use the CP-centered GotVV formula:

Quote:

---

0.923(shred damage) + 0.923*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP) + 0.077*[0.9941(shred damage) + 0.9941*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP) - (number of missed AAs with the second GotVV cast)*(AAaverage damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)] - 0.923*(number of missed AAs)*(AA damage) - 0.923(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage) - 0.923(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)

---

• AA = 3030 (average)
• Shred = 14053 (average)
• 1.732 CPs = 4933

Since my previous calculations regarded the 0.7 speed in cat, I'm going to lower it by 0.05 and observe the different scenarios with a 1.5 second initial delay and 1.274 GCD for every non-feral ability (for simplicity's sake):

• 0.65
• 0.6
• 0.55
• 0.5
• 0.45

1) 0.65 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 2.31 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 4.27 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 4.27 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 6.23 attacks prior to our Shred).
12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 12938 - 5107 - 1793) - 6460 - 3231 - 1134 = 6699 - (0.077*964) = 6625

2) 0.60 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 2.5 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 4.62 attacks prior to our Shreds). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 4.62 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 6.75 attacks prior to our Shred).
12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 13999 - 5533 - 1942) - 6992 - 3496 - 1227 = 5809 - (0.077*2600) = 5609

3) 0.55 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 2.73 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 5.04 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 5.04 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 7.36 attacks prior to our Shred).
12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 15271 - 6033 - 2118) - 7635 - 3813 - 1339 = 4737 - (0.077*4548) = 4387

4) 0.54 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 2.78 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 5.14 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 5.14 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 7.5 attacks prior to our Shred).
12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 15574 - 6148 - 2158) - 7775 - 3889 - 1365 = 4495 - (0.077*5006) = 4109

5) 0.53 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 2.83 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 5.23 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 5.23 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 7.64 attacks prior to our Shred).
12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 15847 - 6263 - 2198) - 7915 - 3957 - 1389 = 4263 - (0.077*5434) = 3845

6) 0.52 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 2.88 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 5.33 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 5.33 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 7.78 attacks prior to our Shred).
12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 16150 - 6378 - 2239) - 8054 - 4033 - 1416 = 4021 - (0.077*5893) = 3567

7) 0.5 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 3 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 5.55 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 5.55 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 8.1 attacks prior to our Shred).

12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 16817 - 6640 - 2331) - 8391 - 4199 - 1471 = 3443 - (0.077*6914) = 2911

8) 0.45 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 3.33 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 6.16 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 6.16 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 9 attacks prior to our Shred).

12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 18665 - 7378 - 2590) - 9313 - 4661 - 1636 = 1914 - (0.077*9759) = 1163

9) 0.44 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 3.41 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 6.3 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 6.3 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 9.2 attacks prior to our Shred).

12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 19089 - 7542 - 2647) - 9537 - 4767 - 1673 = 1547 - (0.077*10404) = 746

10) 0.43 att speed, 1.5 sec delay -> 3.488 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 6.45 attacks prior to our Shred). 2nd GotVV: 2.774 sec delay -> 6.45 missed AAs (shapeshift GCD -> 9.41 attacks prior to our Shred).

12971 + 4553 + 0.077(13970 + 4904 - 19544 - 7714 - 2708) - 9755 - 4880 - 1713 = 1176 - (0.077*11092) = 322

=> I'm going to stop here because it's obvious that below 0.43 the GotVV-shift is going to lead to a loss.

---

TL;DR:

Your current attack speed.	Is GotVV worth it?
> 0.7	+
0.7	+
0.65	+
0.6	+
0.55	+
0.52	+
0.51	only if you can gain CPs and utilise them in the long run
0.5	only if you can gain CPs and utilise them in the long run
0.45	only if you can gain CPs and utilise them in the long run
0.43	only if you can gain CPs and utilise them in the long run
< 0.43	X

@wtfzomglol

So, I finally came back from work. To answer your question once again - yes, the suggested theorycraft can indeed be profitable. Before I continue talking about it, let me mention something about myself:

As I have explained in my previous post, I am not a pro gamer/min-maxer: Sometimes I make mistakes during boss encounters, I don't typically seek out hardcore guilds, and I certainly don't watch the logs of my own battles. According to Bartle's taxonomy, I classify as an explorer, i.e. I don't aim for perfection, but I am driven by the desire to try out something new. This was the case a few weeks ago when I used to play on Frostmourne (i.e. without being fully BiS and striving to unfold my char's full potential). Right now, I don't even play wow anymore because I want to concentrate on some things irl. As you can see, the OP of this thread isn't a know-all, but just a rusty semi-casual veteran.

VVith all of that out of the way, let me tell you what I know:

Thanks to DarkenedHue and halesk70, I was motivated to test the swing timer mechanic. I installed Quartz, and I saw that if I didn't use the /cleartarget macro, my character took more time to start attacking again (like, 1.9-2.6 seconds depending on the currently equipped weapon). However, with the suggested macro the addon showed me an absence of a such delay (with the exception of the GCD, which is procced by GoTw). After I switched to human form, I always spammed my cat shapeshifting keybind, in order to minimise the AA delay as much as possible. I think that in some cases I used the Gotw a bit too aggressively, but since I didn't use any logs and I didn't make videos of the various boss encounters, I can't tell you how much is too much and what the perfect time would be to go for that trick. As for my damage, I was among the top dps-ers on the meters, but that prolly doesn't mean anything since I wasn't a member of any hardcore guilds.

As I've said, I didn't play for perfection. For me it was way more important to have net positive results, rather to increase their value as much as possible. So, with that in mind:

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Given A) I watch the swing timer and do it right after I get cat AA

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I didn't watch the swing timer, as the Gotw trick already took a lot of my energy and concentration. If I had to pay attention to the latter thing, I would have become mentally exhausted on the 6th or 7th boss (in icc). Point is, you DON'T have to time your GoTw with the AAs correctly, in order to inflict extra damage. You are still rewarded even if you don't do it optimally, which is what I tried to prove with my calculations above.

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B) have macros with startattack for main/all dmging abilities?

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Honestly, I don't know if those would be essential. In my case, I just used my right mouse button whenever I wanted to start auto-attacking again. I didn't want to be bothered with creating macros for all of my abilities, but I must admit that those would be helpful like the one you suggested.

Spoiler: Show

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#showtooltip Cat Form
/cast [form:0/1/2/4/5] Cat Form
/startattack [form:3]

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Quote:

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Plus C) obviously using it only when energy/proc starving?

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VVell, yeah. Most of the time, I used it with 25< energy, but I don't claim that that's the only threshold. It's the one I respected. Anyway, it's worth mentioning that doing the trick even when you aren't starving for energy all that much, or you won't get any combo points from doing it, could still earn you some extra dps. Personally, I don't think that a person should be bothered with min-maxing to a such degree, but I let the rest of the community to decide that. In all honesty, it really depends on the boss encounter. For long fights, such as the LK, the feral player shouldn't be all that careless with his mana management. I mean, it would suck if someone died, and you didn't have enough mana to resurrect them, or if you didn't do the trick on the 3 valks. In other scenarios, such as Fester or Rotface, I personally think that you can afford to be greedy with the Gotw-spam.

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I'd like to tell you how I practised on the target dummies. I replaced the Gotw-macro with the normal druid mark, so that I could get used to this dynamic playstyle. It wasn't all that important if the Mark procced a Clearcasting, but getting comfortable with this new way of playing was all that mattered.

Hello, after weeks of playing I'm now using this technique naturally to increase my damage, you can use this macro to make it easier :

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#showtooltip Gift of the Wild
/cast [mod:alt]Gift of the Wild; !Cat Form
/startattack [form:3]

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How does it work? Hold ALT and spam GotW until you get proc, release ALT to go back to cat form & start attacking. You can also use this macro to remove slowing effects just by pressing on it once. Enjoy.

SACRIFICING DOTs IN FAVOUR OF CCs
(ONLY VALID FOR PLAYERS VVITH ICC AND RS GEAR)

Here's a question - will we gain more damage if we sacrifice a Rip/Rake tick in favour of a forced CC proc (aka Shred), or will we lose it? Should we wait for our energy to refill and refresh the DoT, or should we go for the GotVV-trick?

14029 AP (with raid buffs); 73.2% crit (w/ 3% crit vulnerability and the 4.8% crit suppression); 100% arp; t10, no AP procs from items, no trinket procs, AP flask - i.e. something typical on IC/Lorde

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• Rip tick (non-crit) = 2449
• Rip tick (crit) = 5549
• Rip tick (average) = 4721
• Rake tick (non-crit) = 2489
• Rake tick (crit) = 5640
• Rake tick (average) = 4796

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I'll compare the average numbers to my results from the post Attack Speed Modifiers, i.e.:

Quote:

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• 0.65 = 6625
• 0.6 = 5609
• 0.55 = 4387
• 0.5 = 2911
• 0.45 = 1163

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This leads to the following conclusions:

ICC/RS environment

Your current attack speed.	Can you afford to sacrifice a Rip tick?	Can you afford to sacrifice a Rake tick?
>0.7	only with CP value	only with CP value
0.7	only with CP value	only with CP value
0.65	only with CP value	only with CP value
0.6	only with CP value	only with CP value
0.55 or lower	X	X

And these are my conclusions based on the absence of any trinket buffs. If your trinket buffs are about to expire soon, and you have to choose between forcing a Shred with the GotVV-shift or refreshing your DoTs with a snapshot, you should definitely pick the latter option.

FB/RIP/RAKE & CCs
(VVARNING - HUGE VVALL OF TEXT UP AHEAD!)

I. Timing FB

VVhen you go to a guide, people advise you to bite the target when both your Rip and SR have more than 8, 10, or even 12 seconds. But, where's the truth?
Here, we are going to find out, starting with a quote from the OP:

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If we want to refresh both SR and Rip with as few abilities as possible (let’s say 1x Rake and 3x Shreds), and we exclude the OoC procs from our equation, we would need overall:
- 216/206(with t10) energy w/o TF,
- 156/146(with t10) energy with TF.
And since druids regenerate 10 energy per second regardless in what form they are and regardless what stats they have, in the first case we would need 22/21 seconds, in order to accumulate the required energy, and in the second one - 16/15.

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So, we have 22/21 and 16/15 seconds to work with. Imagine that we get one Clearcasting proc. Since we are going to use it on a Shred, we will save 42 energy, or 4 seconds. Let's add more CCs to the equation and see whether we will find any magical numbers:

1 CC
- 174/164(with t10) energy w/o TF -> a bit more than 17/16 seconds
- 114/104(with t10) energy with TF -> a bit more than 11/10 seconds

2 CCs
- 132/122(with t10) energy w/o TF -> a bit more than 13/12 seconds
- 72/62(with t10) energy with TF -> a bit more than 7/6 seconds

3 CCs
- 90/80(with t10) energy w/o TF -> exactly 9/8 seconds
- 30/20(with t10) energy with TF -> exactly 3/2 seconds

Do the coloured numbers look familiar? ;P

It's really interesting to see how far we can afford to bite the boss under these circumstances. So, if we were to bite the boss when both SR and Rip have less than 7 seconds, we can still pull it through as long as we get 2 CCs. And since this entire thread is all about forcing them by casting GotVV, you can use these numbers to your advantage. But, there are four other things, which we should take into consideration:

• Prioritising FB and sacrificing some Rip ticks;
• Number of GCDs;
• Our critical %;
• Latency/Human error.

Regarding prioritising FB over some Rip ticks: I've briefly covered it in my fourth post, but I'll talk about it here as well. VVith my stats on Icecrown and raid-buffed(100% arp, 14029 AP, 73.2% crit), 5CP critical FB does 25951 damage on average, whereas a Rip tick - 4721 on average. So, if we divide the FB by the latter value, we can see how many Rip ticks we can sacrifice:

25951:4721=5.5

So, at first sight we can afford to sacrifice up to 5 Rip ticks, and we could still benefit from the extra FB. This would mean that we could start generating combo points for it during its 10-second downtime. HOVVEVER, I want to consider something else. VVhat if we cast a Shred and spare ourselves a couple of Rip ticks? Since the latter ability costs 42 energy, I will bring it down to 35, in order to match the energy cost of FB.

25951 - (14053*35/42) < x*4721
14,240 < x*4736
3.00679 < x

This means, that as long as CPs are valuable to us, we can afford to sacrifice up to 3 Rip ticks on theory. ON THEORY! Imho it really depends on the encounter. If on some boss fights we run away from the boss, we could miss the opportunity to inflict a Rip as a result of our greedy plays, so personally I wouldn't be that comfortable sacrificing so many Rip ticks on every occasion (especially on FM, where cats have an Idol for Rip and a pathetic amount of arp for FB). Not to mention, such missed Rips could have benefited from a snapshot at one point, so that's something to consider.

Regarding number of GCDs: As many of you already know, each GCD in cat form lasts one second, and it can't be brought lower than that. So, if we try to refresh Rip and SR with as few abilities as possible, we would need 5 GCDs before we refresh our big bleed (e.g. 1xCP-generating ability for SR -> SR -> 3xCP-generating abilities for Rip). However, every time we force a CC proc with the GotVV-trick, we add two additional GCDs to the equation (one for casting the buff and another for shapeshifting back into cat form). Unlike our cat abilities, GotVV and "cat form" have a downtime of 1.5 seconds, though the duration of the druid buff can be shortened by a bit thanks to spell haste. In this post, you can see how 290 haste rating and some class buffs (3% and 5%) were able to bring down that number to 1.274 seconds. This means that the whole GotVV-shift would last 2.774 seconds in general.

Regarding the crit %: Nothing much to say about this - the more of it we have, the bigger the chances of additional CPs. VVith (close to) full BiS gear, we don't have to worry about the crits because they pop up very often. VVe feel safe having 70%+ crit in raids, and we can afford to do greedy plays. However, on Frostmourne or while still gearing in normal raids we are far from reaching this magical number. So, RNG can mess up our plans if we decide to go for a late FB. Maybe, instead of 5 GCDs we would need 6 before we refresh Rip. In that case, we start pooling our energy 4 seconds earlier.

Regarding the latency/human error issue: it's different for everyone, and it can't be generalised.
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So, what kind of conclusion can we draw from this nonsensical jabber? I'd say that everyone defines their own "deadline" when to bite the boss, which they wouldn't feel comfortable crossing. Is that the time when Rip's duration is 15, 10, 8, or even 6 seconds? How often do you get critical strikes? To what extent do you rely on RNG? So, here's a small equation that could give you a rough idea how much time you have to wait based on certain actions:

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Time needed to refresh Rip = 5 cat GCDs {1 sec each} + 2 regular GCDs per GotVV-shift {2.774 secs in summary} + time for pooling energy and other possible delays - 6 seconds (if Tiger's Fury is present) - (4.2seconds*number of CC procs)

Note1: Switch 5 with 6, if the critical strike is less than 60% or around that number, or you want your SR to have more CPs. You'd need to gather more energy, though.
Note2: TF can't remove the time spent on waiting for the GCDs - just the regular one for pooling energy.
Note3: If you want, you could consider AAs proccing CCs during the pooling time, in which case you calculate how much AAs your toon will do during that time. Then it's a matter of probability. You can also add FFF, Barkskin, and Nature's Grasp there as well.

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Explanation & Example:

Spoiler: Show

5 GCDs constitute 50 energy or 5 seconds, which can't be minimised further. So, we need to pool an additional 166/156 energy or wait 17/16 more seconds (no t10/having t10) to gather enough energy for both Rip and SR. From here onwards, we need to ask ourselves how many CCs we anticipate to obtain and whether those would be procced by AAs or GotVV. Let's say that we force one CC with the GotVV-trick. In that case, we save ourselves 42 energy or 4 seconds, but we also create two GCDs (2.774 seconds), which we need to sit through. So, we will remove 69 energy from the aforementioned 166/156 example, and we will get 97/87 energy or 10/9 seconds additional pooling time. Add the presence of TF, and the pooling time will be brought down to 4/3 seconds. So, with these conditions we would need to sit through 7 GCDs (7.774 secs) and 4/3 seconds of pooling time to refresh both Rip and SR (i.e. a bit more than 11/10 seconds in total). If we go for the GotVV trick again, and we successfully force a CC proc, the pooling time will go to 0, BUT we will have to sit through 2 more GCDs, so 9 GCDs (10.548 seconds) in summary. However, if we get lucky, and our AAs trigger a CC proc, we would need to wait only for the 7 GCDs (7.774 secs) to end.

This means that in this particular example the deadline to use a FB is prior to Rip's 10th or 8th second mark. However, if you decide to sacrifice a tick, you can bite the boss 8 or 6 seconds before our DoT expires. If you decide to sacrifice yet another tick - you could bite the opponent prior to Rip's 6th or 4th second mark of its duration. The choice is yours. Don't forget to acknowledge the latency/human error issue, so you should add 1-2 seconds to those timers. Mmm-kay?

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II. 5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or FB? Energy consumption out of Berserk

https://i.imgur.com/Ord6SGy.png

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FB(excess damage based on additional energy)=(9.4+AP/410)*X(energy)*Feral Aggression*SR*Naturalist*2*Predatory Instincts*Meta Gem*1.03 (Ret Paladins)*1.04(CRogues)*100%arp(DA=0.98)
FB (30 energy, hit) = 2311
FB (30 energy, crit) = 5237
FB (30 energy, average) = 5184
FB (1 energy, average) = 172.8

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If we were to compare that number to 7294 (normal Shred) & 16528 (crit Shred) & 14053 (average Shred), we would see that spending extra energy on FB would lead to a loss of valuable energy, i.e. valuable damage. However, now that we have a general idea of the value of our CPs, let's address this factor as well. Let's look at two cases - one where we don't have a CC proc, and another where we do.

No Clearcasting proc

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Shred dmg for 1 energy = 334.6
=> damage penalty for excess energy from FB = 334.6-172.8=161.8
average CP bonus damage for 1 Shred = 4933
average CP bonus damage for 1 energy of Shred = 4933/42
5CP FB = 25951
Shred (average) = 14054

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Here I'm going to observe a hypothetical scenario - I have 50 energy and 5 CPs. Should I use Shred or FB?

Quote:

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(1) Shred -> 50-42=8 energy left + 10 (from GCD) + 17 from waiting -> FB
(2) FB (35 energy + 15 energy wasted) -> 27 energy (10 from GCD + 17 from waiting)

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I'm mentioning the 27 extra energy in the second scenario, in order to align the energy flow for both cases. The Shred-first example would need 27 extra energy, in order for the player to cast a FB, so we will give that amount of energy to the FB-first example as well and see how both would fare against each other.
"(1) Shred -> 8 energy left + 10 (from GCD) + 17 from waiting -> FB" this here would give us
14054 - 4933 (dmg loss from the wasted CPs) + 25951 = 35072

"(2)FB (35 energy + 15 energy wasted) -> 27 energy (10 from GCD + 17 from waiting)" would be a bit more complicated to analyse. First of all, we are not only wasting 15 energy, which could have been invested in an immediate Shred (I need to multiply that number by the damage difference between the Shred damage and FB's excess one, i.e. 161.8), but now we are 15 energy behind our flow, which would delay a future Shred with an actual CP-value. So, I need to observe it as an additional loss of 15/42*4933 damage. Having described the penalty, we can finally address the gain. The added 27 energy would be used on a Shred (27*334.6) with CP value (27/42*4933) later on. This leaves us with:

25951 - (15*161.8) - (15/42*4933) + (27*334.6) + (27/42*4933) = 33968 net damage

=> If we compare the results, we can see that the damage output in the second case is almost close to the one in the first example, but still falls a bit short. I'm going to remove 1 energy from the starting one, 'till FB starts to deal more damage.

49 energy and 5 CPs
Shred -> 7 + 10 (GCD) +18 -> FB [35072]
FB (14 energy points wasted) -> 28 energy (10 from GCD + 18 from waiting)
FB = 25951 - (14*161.8) - (14/42*4933) + (28*334.6) + (28/42*4933) = 34699 (close, but no cigar)

48 energy and 5 CPs
Shred -> 6 + 10 (GCD) +19 -> FB [35072]
FB (13 energy points wasted) -> 29 energy (10 from GCD + 19 from waiting)
FB = 25951 - (13*161.8) - (13/42*4933) + (29*334.6) + (29/42*4933) = 35430

=> 48 energy is our benchmark. This means that we can afford to use a FB if we have 48 or less. If we have more, then we should resort to Shred.

Clearcasting proc

Here I need to take the following thing into consideration. Let's forget about the excess energy from FB for a bit. If I use CC for a FB instead of Shred, then I technically lose 7 energy, don't I? Those 7 energy don't get compensated within the effect of the CC, so it's a net loss of (7*334.6) = 2342 damage. Let's analyse a possible scenario with 15 energy:

15 energy, CC proc and 5 CPs
Shred -> 15 + 10 (GCD) +10 from waiting -> FB [35072]
FB (15 excess points & 7 missed damage) -> 20 energy (10 from GCD + 10 from waiting)
FB = 25951 - 2342 - (15*161.8) - (15/42*4933) + (20*334.6) + (20/42*4933) = 28461

=> oof. The difference is very huge. I'm going to lower the starting energy by 5 and see whether the FB-first approach would do more damage than the other.

10 energy, CC proc and 5 CPs
Shred -> 10 + 10 (GCD) +15 from waiting -> FB [35072]
FB (10 excess points & 7 missed damage) -> 25 energy (10 from GCD + 15 from waiting)
FB = 25951 - 2342- (10*161.8) - (10/42*4933) + (25*334.6) + (25/42*4933) = 32118

Nope, it didn't. I could lower the energy even more, but any numbers I see would be irrelevant. This is because it's not possible to use an ability with 10 or less energy due to the inevitable block from a GCD. Imagine that we have 42 energy and cast Shred. VVe will go to 0, but the GCD will prevent us from casting FB even if we have a CC proc, so CCs should always be used on Shreds instead of FBs.

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III. 5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or FB? Energy consumption in Berserk

Even though Berserk reduces the energy consumption of our abilities, FB's second effect ignores that, and it consumes the full amount of the 30 energy points for the same damage. Here I'm going to examine only the no-CC case, because it's obvious that with CC we should use it on a Shred.

Quote:

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48 energy and 5 CPs
Shred -> 6 + 10 (GCD) +19 -> FB [35072]
FB (13 energy points wasted) -> 29 energy (10 from GCD + 19 from waiting)
FB = 25951 - (13*161.8) - (13/42*4933) + (29*334.6) + (29/42*4933) = 35430

=> 48 energy is our benchmark. This means that we can afford to use a FB if we have 48 or less. If we have more, then we should resort to Shred.

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I'm going to spare myself a bit of work. Outside Berserk, I can afford to sacrifice 13 energy after the initial cost of FB. Since Berserk halves the energy cost of our abilities, let's see whether I would be able to cast it with 6-7 additional energy (i.e. 18+6 = 24 or 25 in total)

Shred = 14053
14053:21(halved due to Berserk)= 669.2 damage per energy
669.2-172.8=496.4

25 energy, 5 CPs, and Berserk
Shred -> 4 + 10 (GCD) +4 -> FB [35072]
FB (7 energy points wasted) -> 14 energy (10 from GCD + 4 from waiting)
FB = 25951 - (7*496.4) - (7/21*4933) + (14*669.2) + (14/21*4933) = 33489 (close, but no cigar)

24 energy, 5 CPs, and Berserk
Shred -> 3 + 10 (GCD) +5 -> FB [35072]
FB (6 energy points wasted) -> 15 energy (10 from GCD + 5 from waiting)
FB = 25951 - (6*496.4) - (6/21*4933) + (15*669.2) + (15/21*4933) = 35125

=> 24 energy is the other benchmark. Ofc, if Berserk is going to expire soon, and you can't spend your energy on the Shreds on time, you should spend them on FBs, because the energy would go to waste anyway.

TLDR:

5CPs & CCs. FB vs Shred

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Out of Berserk
- Boss isn't dying any time soon - do you have a CC proc?

• Yes. Shred > FB
• No. Is your energy 49 or more?
  
  1. Yes. Shred > FB
  2. No. FB > Shred.

- Boss is going to die soon - can you squeeze in two FBs within the last remaining seconds?

• Yes. Read the previous algorithm.
• No. Shred > FB and try to cast FB during the last second if possible or with around 35 en.

In Berserk
- Berserk is still ticking - do you have a CC proc?

• Yes. Shred > FB
• No. Is your energy 25 or more?
  
  1. Yes. Shred > FB
  2. No. FB > Shred.

- Berserk is about to expire soon - can you utilise all of your energy for Shreds and a FB @ ? 24 energy?

• Yes. Read the previous algorithm.
• No. FB > Shred and you blow your energy as much as possible.

Disclaimer: Ofc, this is assuming that Rip is still ticking, or you don't lose more than 3 ticks (i.e. 6 seconds of its duration). If there's a chance that the last thing happens, then obviously refreshing our DoT has a bigger priority than FB.

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This post is continued here.

Actually, this raises another question. If I have a 5CPs, a CC, and Rip has expired, should I cast Shred or refresh Rip?

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IV. 5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or refresh Rip in case it has expired? 2pt10.

Quote:

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rip tick = 4721
shred = 14053 (DPE = 334.6)
1.732 CPs = 4933

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In order to answer this question more accurately, I need to observe two possible scenarios:
-> we don't have any buffs on us, or they are not going to expire soon
-> AP buffs are going to expire, and we might lose the chance to snapshot Rip

1) In the first case, we simply delay the tick by one second (assuming that Rip expires, and in that very moment we cast Shred). I could consider it as a loss of 2360.5 damage, but in some cases it won't even be a loss, because sometimes we stop ripping the boss a few seconds before he dies. That delayed tick would have inflicted its damage in the remaining time window, so it wouldn't have been lost anyway. Ofc, there's no way for us to predict whether that's possible unless you record your games, and the duration of the fight stays the same.

So, what will happen if you get a CC proc, and you're sitting at 5 CPs? VVell... with 2pt10, Rip would cost 20 energy. In comparison to a Shred, you'd have lost 22 energy or 7361 damage. So, you could consider casting Shred, but by doing so you'd lose the value from the CPs. Let's see whether that would matter:

7361-4933 vs 2360.5
2428 vs 2360.5

It's close, but we can see that Shred is the winner here.

{25/01/2023 Update} In the past, it didn't occur to me that the saved energy could be used on a Shred with CP-value. To illustrate what I mean, here are two hypothetical scenarios:

The cat player has 50 energy and a CC proc.
(1) Shred (CC is consumed) -> 60 energy w/ the GCD -> Rip (40 energy remaining)
(2) Rip (CC is consumed) -> 60 energy w/ the GCD -> Shred w/ CPs (18 energy remaining)

Both examples feature a Shred, so I'm going to exclude its damage as a factor. The energy difference remains 22, which constitutes 7361 damage as I've clarified above. However, this energy is available after Rip is being cast, i.e. after the CPs were utilised, so it should include the CP-value as well. In other words, a more accurate description of the gap between both scenarios would be:

7361 + (4933*22/42) vs 2360.5 + 4933
9,944.95 >>>> 7,293.5

This is with 2pt10 and no trinket procs.

2) In the second case, however, we will lose the damage from the buffs (regardless if they are from our trinkets, or they come from other sources). I won't talk about the juicy enhancements from the DBVV/STS trinkets, but just the simple Berserking (484 AP with our talent and MM's aura).
Shred (extra damage from Berserker) = 359
Rip (extra damage from Berserker) = 1045
let's add those values to the previous comparison and see how things will look:
2787 vs 3424

{25/01/2023 Update} Having clarified that 22 energy needs to include the CP-value as well, I'm going to acknowledge it here:

7361 + (4933*22/42) + 359 vs 2360.5 + 4933 +1045
10,303.95 >>>> 8,338.5

Ok, what about STS? VVith our talent and with MM's 10% aura, the AP becomes 1,781.12, which is 3.68 times higher than Berserker. Using the 359 and 1045 values from the previous example, the buff from STS translates as:
Shred (extra damage from STS) = 1,321.12
Rip (extra damage from STS) = 3,845.6

7361 + (4933*22/42) + 1,321.12 vs 2360.5 + 4933 + 3,845.6
11,266 >11,139.1

Although this still shows a loss, I want to point out that the difference between both cases is relatively small. Imho using the CC on Rip would still be worth it because our CP-generation remains consistent. This could be relevant if you need to refresh SR a few seconds after casting Rip. By going with Rip -> Shred, you would be 2 seconds ahead of the first example in terms of CP-generation. This could allow you to squeeze in an extra GotVV-shift for more CPs before refreshing the 33% damage buff. Yes, I'm aware that this sounds like a very niche scenario, however it would be so much easier to just roll with it and treat it as an exception. After all, the damage gain is quite similar in both cases, but by going with Rip -> Shred you'd be in a more favourable position in case you're behind on your CP-generation flow.

VVith the Strength proc from DBVV, we get 2,014.71 AP with various raid buffs and our talents (4.16262 times the AP from Berserker):

Shred (extra damage from DBVV) = 1,494.38
Rip (extra damage from DBVV) = 4,349.94

7361 + (4933*22/42) + 1,494.38 vs 2360.5 + 4933 + 4,349.94
11,439.3 < 11,643.44

VVhat about hysteria?
Shred (extra damage from Hysteria) = 2,810.56
Rip (extra damage from Hysteria) = 10,386.2
7361 + (4933*22/42) + 2,810.56 vs 2360.5 + 4933 + 10,386.2
12,755.5 < 17,679.7

=> If we have 5 CPs and a CC proc, Rip takes priority over Shred in the following situations:
a) Hysteria is about to expire
b) DBVV's proc is about to expire
c) STS is about to expire

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V. 5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or refresh Rip in case it has expired? No 2pt10.

Even though this section would regard FM for most of the time (or people with a low amount of arp), let's keep the values for Rip and Shred for the sake of simplicity. Without the 2pt10 set, our Rip would cost 30 energy, so the sacrificed energy would be 12 or 4015 missed Shred damage, and that is lower than the CP value.

{25/01/2023 Update}Let's acknowledge the CP-value for those 12 energy once again.

4015 + (4933*12/42) vs 2360.5 + 4933
5,424.42 < 7,293.5

=> casting Shred w/o the 2pt10 instead of Rip (in case it has expired) is a misplay.

---

VI. Rake & CCs. Should we use Shred or refresh Rake in case it has expired?. 4pt10

The energy difference between Rake and Shred is 7, which means a loss of "Shred*7*/42" damage with potential "CP damage on average*7/42" CP-value in favour of refreshing Rake one second earlier and thus preserving a third of its tick. If a single Rake tick is equal to 4796 damage, whereas Shred - 14053 with 4933 CP-value, then the numbers would look like so:

(4796/3) vs 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
1,598.67 < 3,164.33

If AP trinket procs are taken into consideration, then Shred would get an additional 1,494.38 damage from DBVV, whereas Rake - 1,698.1. VVe compare the numbers and get:

1,598.67 + 1,698.1 vs 3,164.33 + 1,494.38
3,296.77 < 4,658.71

Still a loss. However, let's imagine that we're at 3 CPs, Rake expires, and we have a CC proc. If we go with Shred first, most of the time we'd end up having 5 CPs. Refreshing Rake afterwards would sacrifice CP-value.

(4796/3) + 4933 vs 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
6,531.7 > 3,164.33

This is if we go "Shred (we reach 5 CPs) -> Rake (still at 5 CPs) -> finisher" and sacrifice 1.723 CPs. Let's Imagine that we go for "Shred (we reach 5 CPs) -> finisher -> Rake". Regardless if we cast Shred or Rake first, in both cases we'll have the same number of CPs, so I'll ignore the CP-value. If Rake is cast after the finisher, then it will be delayed by 2 seconds (assuming the finisher is SR or Rip). Let's compare the numbers again:

2*4796/3 vs 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
3,197.33 > 3,164.33

If however the finisher is FB, then Rake will suffer from an additional downtime of 4.5 seconds (1 second from the Shred GCD and 3.5 from FB, which will put us at 0 energy due to its second effect). Let's compare the numbers again:

4.5*4796/3 vs 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
7,194 > 3,164.33

This means that "Rake -> finisher -> Shred" is the right play with 4pt10.

---

VI. Rake & CCs. Should we use Shred or refresh Rake in case it has expired?. No 4pt10

I'm just going to observe the situation when CPs are involved because it's obvious that in the other cases it would be a loss. VVithout 4pt10 Rake cannot crit, so its tick damage would be 2,933.1 with 14029 AP. This means:

(2,933.1/3) + 4933 vs 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
5,910.7 > 3,164.33

In case of "Shred -> Rake -> finisher"

If he goes "Shred -> finisher -> Rake", then that person would miss out on 2 seconds of Rake (in case of Rip and SR) and 4.5 seconds (in case of FB). Let's compare the numbers again:

2*2,933.1/3 vs 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
1,955.4 < 3,164.33

and

4.5*2,933.1/3 vs 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
4,399.65 > 3,164.33

{10/03/2023 Update} The previous calculations in this subsection weren't entirely correct because Shred's damage was measured with Arp in mind. For the sake of accuracy, I'm going to use the damage for Rake, Shred, and CPs from Rawr in the context of Naxx and Ulduar (not going to bother with ToGC because I cannot add the HC items).

VVith Naxx gear, a Rake tick would inflict 2,428.8, Shred - 7608.9, and 1.5465 CPs would constitute 2,394.96 damage with 5 FA. This means:

(2,428.8/3) + 2,394.96 vs 7*(7608.9 + 2,394.96)/42
3,204.56 > 1,667.31

In case of "Shred -> Rake -> finisher"

If he goes "Shred -> finisher -> Rake", then that person would miss out on 2 seconds of Rake (in case of Rip and SR) and 4.5 seconds (in case of FB). Let's compare the numbers again:

2*2,428.8/3 vs 7*(7608.9 + 2,394.96)/42
1,619.2 < 1,667.31

and

4.5*2,428.8/3 vs 7*(7608.9 + 2,394.96)/42
3,643.2 > 1,667.31

VVith Uld gear, a Rake tick would inflict 2,523.71, Shred - 8708.69, and 1.6006 CPs would constitute 2,811.55 damage with 5 FA. If the player goes "Shred -> finisher -> Rake", then that person would miss out on 2 seconds of Rake (in case of Rip and SR) and 4.5 seconds (in case of FB). Let's compare the numbers again:

2*2,523.71/3 vs 7*(8708.69 + 2,811.55)/42
1,682.47 < 1,920.04

and

4.5*2,523.71/3 vs 7*(8708.69 + 2,811.55)/42
3,785.57 > 1,920.04

This means that "Shred -> finisher -> Rake" is good if Rake is not delayed for more than 2 seconds. Anything longer than that, and the bleed would require a CC proc investment. Interesting...

.
.
.

I want to analyse one last case for Rake. Imagine that you're in a fight, where you switch targets. To make things easier to understand, I'd like to show you an old clip of mine on Emalon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYr7jnpRu_4

Timestamp: 2:00. I had a CC proc and decided to use it on Rake. The reason for that was because I didn't have any bleeds on the boss on my own, and I wasn't sure whether Shred would still inflict its full damage. You see, R&T's tooltip reads:

https://i.imgur.com/Svvtfn2.png

So, any bleed effects should buff this ability regardless whom they belong, however I wasn't sure whether the wording was to be trusted. After all, GotVV and Nature spells in combination with http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=69369 are not covered in http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=16864, so it's not uncommon for certain mechanics to behave differently from what their tooltips suggest. I decided to test this interaction yesterday, and here are my results:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zn_wEk5QFcM

Non-critical Shreds:

• 1848
• 1868
• 1876
• 1895
• 1873
• 1876
• 1891
• 1901

On average: 1,878.5

Critical Shreds:

• 4184
• 4083
• 4169
• 4083
• 4074
• 4191
• 4182
• 4184
• 4083

On average: 4,137

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2GxruWSEww

Non-critical Shreds:

• 2269
• 2225
• 2269
• 2268
• 2307
• 2311
• 2311
• 2322
• 2300
• 2293
• 2298
• 2300
• 2284

On average: 2,289

Spoiler: Show

N.B.: This was the damage for Shred with bleeds being present. I had two unbuffed, and each of those dealt 1917 damage.

Critical Shreds:

• 4895
• 4932
• 5035
• 5174
• 5101
• 5132
• 5128
• 5097
• 5121
• 5044
• 5128
• 5112
• 5000

On average: 5,069.15

Spoiler: Show

N.B.: This was the damage for Shred with bleeds being present. I had a couple unbuffed, and those dealt 4186, 4230, 4230, 4252, and 4235 damage respectively.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVpTfY2PpYA

Non-critical Shreds:

• 2265
• 2248
• 2251
• 2271
• 2251
• 2263
• 2218
• 2263
• 2280
• 2276
• 2263
• 2274
• 2222
• 2230
• 2274
• 2225

On average: 2,254.63

Spoiler: Show

N.B.: This was the damage for Shred with Mangle being present. There was one Shred w/o Mangle that dealt 1721.

Critical Shreds:

• 4963
• 4899
• 5016
• 4952
• 5022
• 4921
• 4991
• 4921
• 4978
• 4914
• 4945
• 4945
• 4945
• 5016
• 4899
• 4879

On average: 4,950.36

Spoiler: Show

N.B.: This was the damage for Shred with Mangle being present. There were two Shred w/o Mangle that dealt 3788 and 3843 damage respectively.

I only wrote the damage from the Shreds w/o any trinket or TF enhancements. As you can see, the damage from the last clip was (almost) identical to the one in the second video. So, the wording in R&T is correct. Any bleed effect, regardless if it's ours or not, can buff Shred.

This means that CC on Rake at 2:00 was a misplay. VVhat about 5:00, though?

4pt10:
(4796/3) + 14053 vs (14053/1.2) + 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
15,651.67 > 14,875.17

no 4pt10:
(2,933.1/3) + 14053 vs (14053/1.2) + 7*(14053 + 4933)/42
15,030.7 > 14,875.17

=> if bleed effects are not present after we switch to a new target, then Rake > Shred.

THE ESSENCE OF THE ENTIRE THREAD

This used to be the old TL;DR version of this thread, however I recommend checking my guide as it covers more material, it's denser, and it's structured a lot better. That page would most likely still be updated in the future.

Table of Content

1. Demonstration
2. Pros and Cons
3. Recommended talent build
4. Archtype choices (outdated)
5. Macros
6. Suggested add-ons for this playstyle
7. Practice makes better
8. Attack speed modifiers
9. Sacrificing DoT ticks in favour of Shreds
10. Timing FB
11. 5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or FB/Rip?
12. Extras - super niche tips for dedicated minmaxers
13. Not an exploit
14. Food for thought
15. FAQ
16. Trivia
17. Credit where credit's due
18. Used formulas for my calculations
19. Sources
20. Changelog

1. DEMONSTRATION

Spoiler: Show

a) Timing the GotVV-shift during AAs

The desired way to use the powershift (delay ~1.1 seconds)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9IBfXquUqI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1Yepvjdi0M
Quick decription:
-> /cast Gift of the wild
/stopattack
-> you cast the macro a few milliseconds after you attack in cat form;
-> smaller reaction window in case your AA procs a CC beforehand.

The normal way to use this macro (delay ~ 1.4 seconds)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ebG1usWNiM
Quick description:
-> /cast Gift of the wild
/stopattack
-> you cast the macro halfway through the AA cooldown;
-> wider reaction window in case your AA procs a CC beforehand.

The wrong way to use the powershift (delay = million years)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_BwhY7Nd64
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoUzwLZJ64o
Quick description:
-> /cast Gift of the wild
-> you attack the target with your weapon in neutral form.

My apologies for the poor quality from Bandicam. Screencast-O-Matic and Obs Studio were suggested to me, but I could not install them in the past due to using an old and cracked OS (VVindows 7). Even though currently I have already switched to VVindows 10, and I'm able to use Obs, I won't reshoot the above videos. They still fulfill their purpose quite nicely. Also, my recordings may feel a bit sluggish, because after using Bandicam my fps dropped immensely. So, you have to bear with what I have. Fortunately for us, Nap has provided me with his high-quality videos for this demo. Thanks, mate!

---

b) Actual showcase

Disclaimer: I want to make something perfectly clear. I don't consider myself the best pilot for this technique or for the cat spec in general. You are going to see some mistakes, and I'm going to comment on them. However, just because you are about to see suboptimal execution from me, that doesn't mean that the GotVV-shift is bad. The entire criticism should be directed towards the pilot, not the technique! The only big drawback this manoeuvre has stems from a flawed coding in the game (in the auras to be exact). http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=29801 doesn't pop up immediately after we shapeshift out of cat form, which hinders all other non-warrior mdps and all tanks for around 1 sec. I don't have a definite answer, but I am not aware of a real solution for this issue. As long as this delay is present, the theorycraft cannot be considered optimal for the entire raid. The feral player would increase their own damage at the expense of others.

Having clarified that, I will continue:

A LOT OF CRINGE MISPLAYS ON MY PART. BE WARNED!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7jopfkPxYc
Background:

Spoiler: Show

• Realm - Lordearon (no 30% ICC buff for the raiders);
• Festergut NM;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=49016 on me - the BDK changed to dps for this fight.
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=23060 - The chicken didn't cast the squawk;
• Bonus effect from 4pt10;
• 265/263 hit rating; 26/26 expertise; a bit over 1k arp with http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=42995;
• 5.7k gs;
• My gear in this video:
  
  1. Head - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50826 (ilvl 251 t10)
  2. Neck - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50452 (ilvl 264 BoE necklace)
  3. Shoulders - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50824 (ilvl 251 t10)
  4. Back - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50470 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  5. Chest - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50828 (ilvl 251 t10)
  6. Wrist - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50333 (ilvl 264 DBS 25)
  7. Hands - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50799 (ilvl 251 DBS 10)
  8. Waist - wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50995 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  9. Legs - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50825 (ilvl 251 t10)
  10. Feet - wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=49950 (ilvl 264 LM 25)
  11. Ring 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=49949 (ilvl 264 LM 25)
  12. Ring 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50402 (ilvl 277 Exalted Ashen Verdict rep)
  13. Trinket 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50342 (ilvl 251 LDW 10)
  14. Trinket 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47214 (ilvl 200 ToC 5)
  15. Idol - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50456 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  16. Weapon - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47302 (ilvl 245 Twin Valkyries 25)

Commentary of the events in a chronological order:

Spoiler: Show

• Why the lack of sound? -//-
• 0:19 In the past, I didn't know that having two enablers for SR at start would lead to less damage. Now that I am certain of it, I am pointing it out as a misplay so that people would learn from my mistake.
• 0:25 I intentionally delayed TF and Berserk by a bit, because I saw that the boss wasn't positioned well, and I didn't want to pop these CDs too early and sacrifice any value from them.
• 0:40 kinda clutch :D
• 0:44 no CC proc. Normally I would have cast GotW one more time, but I didn't pay enough attention at start and didn't see that the proc wasn't there. Also, Rampage popped up with ~1-sec delay.
• 0:51 Rake and CC was a misplay here.
• 0:58 the better play would have been to refresh SR with 4 CPs (I risked losing a CP with a critical strike) -> Rake -> GotVV-shift
• 1:01-1:02 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 1:14-1:15 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 1:17 clipped Rake. I usually try to do cast it <0.2 seconds, but sometimes I **** up.
• 1:27 Overflowed my energy with TF and used a CC proc on a Rake instead of Shred.
• 1:31-1:32 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 1:40-1:41 no 5% crit for the melees + the CC got replaced.
• 1:49-1:50 no 5% crit for the melees + the CC got replaced.
• 1:53 4-CP FB would have been better. Got punished with the CC at 1:56 that yielded no CPs.
• 1:59 Horrible timing of the innervate. I should have used TF and trigger its CD. Because I cast the inner and then the GotW, I had a lot of energy and delayed the small CD by 10 seconds.
• 1:59-2:02 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 2:05-2:06 good thing that I immediately refreshed SR and didn't wait to get a bit of extra value. The CC proc would have been replaced.
• 2:13 clipped Rake. Again, this is me ****ing up.
• 2:21 Rampage registered?
• 2:27 the better play would have been: GotW -> Shred -> SR -> GotW -> Shred spam till 5 CPs -> Rip
• 2:28 - 2:29 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 2:33 - clipped Rake. I ****ed up because I saw the priest dying and got distracted with the thought of bressing him
• 2:36 this is the 58-60% chance for a CC proc when PS is combined with a Nature spell for an instant cast.
• 2:36-2:37 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 2:49-2:50 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 2:59-3:00 no 5% crit for the melees + the CC got replaced.
• 3:14 I should have clipped SR and proceeded to refresh Rip. I had a CC proc and TF - literally no reason to do what I did here. This led to me overflowing my energy at 3:20 and having 2 unbuffed Shreds. Stupid misplay.
• 3:26-3:27 Rampage registered? The CC got replaced.
• 3:34 SR at the end was correct. I wouldn't have had enough energy for anything, and Berserk was going to expire. I managed to squeeze in one last ability there.
• 3:45-3:46 Rampage registered?
• 3:50 4-CP FB would have been the correct play. This would have allowed me to snapshot Rip with the AP buff.
• 4:05-4:06 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 4:09 4-CP could have been used here, followed by clutch GotVV-shifts for a last-second refresh on SR.
• 4:12-4:13 no 5% crit for the melees. Rampage popped up way too late.
• 4:22 I could have done the GotVV-shift so that I could have more energy after refreshing Rip.
• 4:45-4:46 Rampage registered?
• 4:58 4-CP FB followed by TF and Shred would have been so much better.
• 4:51-4:52 Rampage registered after a second delay?
• 5:00-5:01 Rampage registered after a second delay?
• 5:06 4-CP FB followed by CP-generators for a last 4/5-CP FB in the last second would have been the better play.
• 5:12 no CC proc. Again, I'm blind. Also, no 5% crit for the melees.

Small note - look how poorly this fight was for me. I did a **** ton of mistakes and on some occasions the CC got replaced (the latter means that I lose the damage from the AAs). Despite this, I still managed to inflict a lot of damage thanks to the extra CCs.

A LOT OF CRINGE MISPLAYS ON MY PART. BE WARNED!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYr7jnpRu_4
Background:

Spoiler: Show

• Realm - Frostmourne (w/ buffed content just like on Lordearon);
• PuG raid with two attempts;
• Emalon (fixed = enraged adds explode now);
• OoC - bugged after the recent updates. Shapeshifting also triggers those procs;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=49016 on me. I don't bother other people in PuG raids;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=23060 - It was a PuG raid, and I didn't want to swap trinkets here;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=44253 - I rejoined my FM guild 5 weeks before Ulduar, and I couldn't bother farming gold for the trinket;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=59621 - I rejoined my FM guild 5 weeks before Ulduar, and I couldn't bother farming gold for the enchantment;
• Bonus effect from 2pt7;
• 265/263 hit rating; 29/26 expertise;
• almost 4.2k gs;
• My gear in this video:
  
  1. Head - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40329 (ilvl 213 Gothik/Gluth 25)
  2. Neck - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40369 (ilvl 213 Sapphiron 25)
  3. Shoulders - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40494 (ilvl 213 t7, EoV vendor)
  4. Back - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40250 (ilvl 213 some random boss in Naxx 25)
  5. Chest - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40539 (ilvl 226 Malygos 25)
  6. Wrist - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=44203 (ilvl 200 Exalted with the Wyrmrest Accord)
  7. Hands - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=37409 (ilvl 200 King Ymiron 5 HC)
  8. Waist - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40205 (ilvl 213 Gluth/Heigan 25)
  9. Legs - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40493 (ilvl 213 t7, EoV vendor)
  10. Feet - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=44297 (ilvl 200 Exalted with the Argent Crusade)
  11. Ring 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40717 (ilvl 213 EoV vendor)
  12. Ring 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=37685 (ilvl 200 Chrono-Lord Epoch 5 HC)
  13. Trinket 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=42418 (ilvl 200 JC craft)
  14. Trinket 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40684 (ilvl 200 EoH vendor)
  15. Idol - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=39757 (ilvl 213 EoV vendor)
  16. Weapon - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40388 (ilvl 226 Kel'Thuzad 25)

Commentary of the events in a chronological order:

Spoiler: Show

Before I start with the list, I want to make something perfectly clear. In this video, you're going to see a bugged interaction. Shapeshifting triggered CCs, which is not intentional. For that reason, I've played my cat here as I would normally do - by spamming GotW w/o expecting to get CCs from shapeshifting. Just FYI, I won't make a comment on the cases where powershifting granted me free CCs. Having clarified that, I'll continue.

1st attempt:

• 0:03 Look at the 5% buff. See how it disappeared for a bit, then got replaced by Rampage and then immediately afterwards by LotP. I told you that there's something weird going on with the class auras.
• 0:08 Reflex from the gruns, where I use the chicken. I just make sure that I have equipped the correct trinkets. Please ignore it.
• 0:14 I didn't look at the raid comp. Wasn't aware that there's another cat, otherwise I would have begun with Rake.
• 0:34 I know that I've said in the first post that the energy threshold for FB in Berserk is 24. However, I wanted to clear my CPs so that I could rebuild them again.
• 0:37 Instant LotP?
• 0:42 Rake and CC was not good here.
• 0:48 As I've explained before, this would have been a misplay had I had 2pt10. However, since this wasn't the case in this fight, casting Rip instead of Shred was the correct play.
• 0:53 I should have stood for 1 more second on the boss and cast Shred to get a 4-CP/5-CP SR.
• 1:08 Normally, this would have been seen as a misplay, but the mob was going to die soon, and I wanted to go back to the boss ASAP, so imho it's whatever in this case.
• 1:12 Should have used the CC on a Shred.
• 1:16 No 5% melee crit for one second.
• 1:25 No 5% melee crit for one second.
• 1:38 Ah, yes. 58-60% chance for a CC from combining PS with a nature spell.
• 1:44 Trauma was present, so Mangle was unnecessarily. I should have gone with Rake because no bleeds were present on the add.
• 1:50 Rip was good actually, however after casting it I should have gone to the boss.
• 1:54 Should have refreshed SR tbh. This would have prevented future awkward moments. Wasting CPs was a misplay.
• 2:00 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 2:03 1-CR SR would have been the correct play. I lost a few seconds of Rip from my mistake.
• 2:06 Instant LotP?
• 2:30 Refreshing SR was dumb af, and normally I would have stood under the boss. This was an awkward scenario. If this had been a grun, I would have ignored the mob or, in case my dps was needed there like on Lord Jaraxxus, I would have used FB just so I could utilise the CPs better than this. The better play was GotW for CCs -> Shred -> 4/5 CPs -> finisher.
• 2:33 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 2:42 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 2:58 No comment. I dunno why I went with Rake when it was apparent to me that bleeds were already present.
• 3:07 the CC proc should have been used on Shred.
• 3:09 Looking back at this play, I consider the FB a mistake. I should have refreshed SR and gone for a 5-CP Rip.
• 3:12 Should have cast GotW.
• 3:29 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 3:30 I should have paid attention to Nova. I wasted precious seconds of Berserk.
• 3:58 Rip -> clipping Rip would have been the best option here. Though, an even better play would have been GotVV-shift at 3:53, which would have provided me with the needed CPs for Rip.
• 4:00 No comment. I dunno why I went with Mangle when it was apparent that debuff was already present.
• 4:19 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 4:28 I shouldn't have clipped my Rake.
• 4:30 I spammed SR before casting Shred, but I didn't see that the game didn't process the finisher. So, I had an unbuffed ability + I lost a CP.
• 4:41 No 5% melee crit for one second.
• 4:45 the last CP-generator was not necessary.
• 4:55 I should have ditched the add 2-3 seconds before it died.
• 5:00 Rake was correct here because no bleeds were present on the boss.
• 5:17 No 5% melee crit for one second.
• 5:30 I should have either stood longer on the boss and cast Rip with 5 CPs or just clipped it, in order to switch sooner to the add.
• 5:41 Normally, this would have been seen as a misplay, but the mob was going to die soon, and I wanted to go back to the boss ASAP, so imho it's whatever in this case.
• 5:46 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 5:55 No 5% melee crit for one second.
• 6:19 This could have been a kill IF we had one less dead person, the boss had lower HP, and the prot pala used Divine Shield, Oh, well. Btw, after that wipe some random guy became toxic in that chat that people didn't flask for this boss. Le meow. Imagine flasking for a VoA boss in a pug raid.

2nd attempt:

• 6:56 Damn. Despite me spamming Shred, the game didn't process it during Berserk.
• 7:04 Another GotW would have been nice.
• 7:15 I should have gone for a 5-CP SR because I couldn't stay under the boss here. The CP was wasted.
• 7:24 Rip > FB.
• 7:26 no 5% melee crit for one second.
• 7:30 Going to the boss was intentional, in order to preserve CPs.
• 7:34 No comment. I dunno why I went with Rake when it was apparent to me that bleeds were already present.
• 7:52 Should have cast GotW.
• 7:55 I'm not satisfied with how I handled this. As you can see, I tried to go for a FB, but I was a bit too far and couldn't bite the boss. I don't know why I refreshed SR at 8:01. I should have preserved the CPs for Rip. This is why I don't consider myself a good player when a lot of things are occurring at the same time.
• 8:09 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 8:16 Going to the boss was intentional, in order to preserve CPs.
• 8:19 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 8:26 Instant LotP?
• 8:30 The GotVV-shift was not necessary since I already received a CC from an AA. Again, this is why I don't consider myself the best pilot for this technique because I **** it up sometimes.
• 8:31 Rampage/LotP were almost instant?
• 8:52 Rake before Mangle because I expected the other feral to cast Mangle first. I was mistaken.
• 8:58 The correct play here was to refresh SR. This would have prevented future awkward moments.
• 9:02 Going to the boss was intentional, in order to preserve CPs.
• 9:14 I should have made use of that CC before moving out. I also moved too far.
• 9:20 No comment. I dunno why I went with Rake when it was apparent to me that bleeds were already present.
• 9:25 Ahahaha. Kinda awkward. So, I play on a laptop with a battery that dies within minutes unless it's connected to a power source. From time to time, I get these pop-up messages that I need to charge the battery. Whenever that happens, my toaster decides to tap me out of the game. This is why the game froze here and why you heard that sound.
• 9:46 Going to the boss was intentional, in order to preserve CPs.
• 9:50 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 9:53 This time I learnt my lesson and actually paid attention to the timer of the Nova.
• 10:05 I should have gathered 5 CPs for SR. 4-CP SR would have been the right play had I been low on energy, but it was almost full.
• 10:40 No bleeds were present => Rake was the correct play here.
• 10:46 No 5% melee crit for one second.
• 10:55 Innervate was timed poorly. I should have gathered more CPs for SR -> Innervate -> SR.
• 11:09 Boomer reflexes. I shouldn't have cast that Mangle.
• 11:14 Going to the boss was intentional, in order to preserve CPs. Rip also proved to be the optimal play.
• 11:21 No bleeds were present => Rake was the correct play here.
• 11:25 As I've explained before, this would have been a misplay had I had 2pt10. However, since this wasn't the case in this fight, casting Rip instead of Shred was the correct play.
• 11:26 GotW didn't proc CC due to an unfortunate variance. I should have recast the spell. Also, no 5% melee crit for one second.
• 11:31 Should have used Shred instead of Rake with that CC.
• 11:48 I had ampel of opportunities to cast GotW.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkKdAtB996Y
Background:

Spoiler: Show

• Realm - Frostmourne (w/ buffed content just like on Lordearon);
• PuG raid;
• Archavon;
• OoC - bugged after the recent updates. Shapeshifting also triggers those procs;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=49016 on me. I don't bother other people in PuG raids;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=23060 - It was a PuG raid, and I didn't want to swap trinkets here;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=44253 - I rejoined my FM guild 5 weeks before Ulduar, and I couldn't bother farming gold for the trinket;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=59621 - I rejoined my FM guild 5 weeks before Ulduar, and I couldn't bother farming gold for the enchantment;
• Bonus effect from 2pt7;
• 265/263 hit rating; 29/26 expertise;
• almost 4.2k gs;
• My gear in this video:
  
  1. Head - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40329 (ilvl 213 Gothik/Gluth 25)
  2. Neck - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40369 (ilvl 213 Sapphiron 25)
  3. Shoulders - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40494 (ilvl 213 t7, EoV vendor)
  4. Back - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40250 (ilvl 213 some random boss in Naxx 25)
  5. Chest - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40539 (ilvl 226 Malygos 25)
  6. Wrist - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=44203 (ilvl 200 Exalted with the Wyrmrest Accord)
  7. Hands - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=37409 (ilvl 200 King Ymiron 5 HC)
  8. Waist - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40205 (ilvl 213 Gluth/Heigan 25)
  9. Legs - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40493 (ilvl 213 t7, EoV vendor)
  10. Feet - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=44297 (ilvl 200 Exalted with the Argent Crusade)
  11. Ring 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40717 (ilvl 213 EoV vendor)
  12. Ring 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=37685 (ilvl 200 Chrono-Lord Epoch 5 HC)
  13. Trinket 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=42418 (ilvl 200 JC craft)
  14. Trinket 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40684 (ilvl 200 EoH vendor)
  15. Idol - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=39757 (ilvl 213 EoV vendor)
  16. Weapon - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=40388 (ilvl 226 Kel'Thuzad 25)

Commentary of the events in a chronological order:

Spoiler: Show

Before I start with the list, I want to make something perfectly clear. In this video, you're going to see a bugged interaction. Shapeshifting triggered CCs, which is not intentional. For that reason, I've played my cat here as I would normally do - by spamming GotW w/o expecting to get CCs from shapeshifting. Just FYI, I won't make a comment on the cases where powershifting granted me free CCs. Having clarified that, I'll continue.

• 0:25 Rake -> FB was indeed the correct play.
• 0:28 no proc from GotW at first due to an unlucky variance. Melees didn't have 5% crit for roughly a second.
• 0:43 no proc from GotW at first due to an unlucky variance. Melees didn't have 5% crit for roughly a second.
• 0:49 I should have used SR -> Rake. I wasted a CP by doing it this way.
• 0:57 6% for a CC from Innervate. Nice! Melees didn't have 5% crit for roughly a second, though.
• 1:03 Unnecessary delays of my abilities, but meh. In a grun, I would have played it better.
• 1:09 As I've explained before, this would have been a misplay had I had 2pt10. However, since this wasn't the case in this fight, casting Rip instead of Shred was the correct play.
• 1:31 I should have cast GotW for a proc. It would have prevented the loss of some Rip ticks.
• 1:46 Intentional so that I could build CPs for the SR in peace. If it wasn't for the stun, this would have been the best play in any other case.
• 1:47 no proc from GotW at first due to an unlucky variance. Melees didn't have 5% crit for roughly a second.
• 2:12 unfortunate how those CCs aligned with the TF, but timing that CD was the correct play nevertheless. I had 30 energy before casting the small CD, which was the typical threshold for this. That said, I should have refreshed SR after the first CC, in order to prevent future energy from overflowing.
• 2:19 Rake -> FB was indeed the correct play.
• 2:27 I could have cast GotW at one point here.
• 2:41 Intentional so that I could build CPs for the SR in peace. The game rewarded me with a CC afterwards. Had I gone for a 5-CP FB, I would have either used FB with the CC by mistake or cast another Shred, limiting my CPs for SR.
• 2:47 I should have waited Rake to expire before refreshing SR. The play you see here would have been correct if I had got a CC from an AA.
• 3:03 As I've explained before, this would have been a misplay had I had 2pt10. However, since this wasn't the case in this fight, casting Rip instead of Shred was the correct play. Though, come to think of it, I could have cast Shred with that CC and follow it up with a GotVV-shift, whose CC I could have used to refresh Rip. After all, I was in no rush to refresh that finisher.
• 3:11 Intentional so that I could build CPs for the SR in peace. The game rewarded me with a CC afterwards. Had I gone for a 5-CP FB, I would have either used FB with the CC by mistake or cast another Shred, limiting my CPs for SR.
• 3:15 An argument could have been made for a 5-CP SR, in order to get more value from the current buff. Looking at the video again, I agree that this would have been better.
• 3:24 Should have refreshed Rake. This would have prevented the misplay at 3:34.
• 3:29-3:30 no 5% crit for melees.
• 3:34 Other people's bleeds were already present on the boss => the CC should have been used on Shred.
• 3:53 Rake instead of Shred followed by 4-CP FB would have been better. This would have allowed my last Rake to have full value.
• 3:55 I don't usually pay attention to the CD of my Bress. I just bress people out of reflex. It wasn't necessary here, and I lost some AAs as a result.
• Here's the damage dealt to the boss in case someone's interested.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYCDaji2K1E
Background:

Spoiler: Show

• Realm - Lordearon (no 30% ICC buff for the raiders);
• DBS nm;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=49016 on me - A 6k gs rogue was a much better candidate for it.
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=23060 - You'll see me here as a Goblin engineer. After the raid, I switched to Gnomish and crafted http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=10725;
• No bonus effect from 4pt10;
• 265/263 hit rating; 28/26 expertise; 942 arp with http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=42995;
• 5.6k gs;
• My gear in this video:
  
  1. Head - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50826 (ilvl 251 t10)
  2. Neck - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50452 (ilvl 264 BoE ring)
  3. Shoulders - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50824 (ilvl 251 t10)
  4. Back - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50470 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  5. Chest - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=53114 (ilvl 258 Halion 10)
  6. VVrist - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50333 (ilvl 264 DBS 25)
  7. Hands - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50799 (ilvl 251 DBS 10)
  8. VVaist - wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50995 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  9. Legs - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47259 (ilvl 245 Northrend Beasts 25)
  10. Feet - wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=49895 (ilvl 264 LW BoE)
  11. Ring 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47730 (ilvl 245 EoT vendor)
  12. Ring 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50402 (ilvl 277 Exalted Ashen Verdict rep)
  13. Trinket 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50198 (ilvl 232 FoS 5 hc)
  14. Trinker 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47214 (ilvl 200 ToC 5)
  15. Idol - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50456 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  16. VVeapon - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47302 (ilvl 245 Twin Valkyries 25)

Commentary of the events in a chronological order:

Spoiler: Show

• VVhy the lack of sound? - Since I play on an old laptop, which doesn't have some kind of an audio hardware according to a technician, I cannot use the mic of my headset. This is why I load discord on my phone and mute my client. Another reason for that is that sometimes my game starts to freeze on random occasions if I run it alongside other programs. By disabling the music on my laptop and by using my phone for discord, I slightly increase the performance of my toaster. If you find the lack of sound annoying, just load some music on youtube. kthx
• 0:03-0:08 No, this isn't a game freeze. I just wanted to make sure that OBS is activated so I tabbed out.
• 0:24 I save some energy for Shred before using TF (more on that later). By doing this, I prevent having too much energy and losing some of it from a sudden CC before Berserk.
• 0:25 I use TF before Berserk for a more energy-efficient fight. I follow the rule of thumb - I use CDs as early as possible, in order to get one extra in the long run. Generally speaking, if a fight lasts long enough for me to get an extra TF, then TF should be used before the Berserk (the energy gain from it compensates the miniscule weapon damage buff from the spell). However, not all fights create optimal conditions for this. It could happen that with the "Berserk->TF" opener you would have the same amount of TFs in a boss fight, in which case the latter would be better due to the presence of the buff for our Mangle, Shreds, and AAs.
• 0:33 - This is how you want to use Berserk. Once you reach 18-24 energy, you SHOULD use FB, so that you don't waste any precious energy and start building up CPs for the future. This is a much more efficient way to use your big CD because you actually do something productive, and it helps your future priority list instead of being a plain and meaningless Smorc burst. N.B.: It should be noted that sometimes this won't be possible due to sudden CCs during Berserk. If you get 3+ CCs during Berserk, then you should use FB regardless of energy, In all other cases, the FB should be cast when you have 18-24 energy or at the last second of Berserk.
• 0:39 To add to what I said above, see how I managed to use Shred before Berserk and SR ended. Again, energy efficiency is very important for me.
• 0:41 Slight misplay. I used the GotVV-shift one second too late, which led to me doing a weaker AA. I wanted to prevent going for the manoeuvre and getting a CC beforehand. Generally speaking, using the GotVV-shift a few seconds before SR expires allows you to squeeze in a GotVV-shift in the long run.
• 0:41-0:42 Complete absence of the 5% crit aura. Again, this is the real drawback of the GotVV-shift.
• 0:52 Sacrificng a single Rip tick is an acceptable loss. It's only really bad if we sacrifice more than 3.
• 1:03 I innervated the healer. Since I didn't get a CC (6% chance), I casted GotVV. However, for 2 seconds the rest of the melees didn't have the 5% crit.
• 1:07 CC on the Shred instead of Rake. This was intentional. It's more efficient to do it like this, unless a) you're about to lose a possible snapshot or b) you will lose a Rake tick if you reach 5 CPs with that Shred and are forced to FB the boss.
• 1:10 Misplay. I should have gone for the GotVV-shift and get the CC proc. RNG punished me with the 1-CP Rake, which led to the following outcome:
• 1:18 SR-less Rake.
• 1:20-1:21 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 1:32-1:33 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 1:39-1:40 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 1:41 SR-less Shred.
• 1:46-1:47 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 2:02 I should have refreshed SR when it had ended. I think I might have considered casting Rake for another CP, but I disregarded that decision and went for SR with a delay.
• 2:14-2:15 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 2:19-2:21 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 2:28 3 sacrificed Rip ticks. Still ok because we bit the boss at 2:12.
• 2:06-2:28 I want to comment this time span. Look how bad the timers were. Under normal circumstances, the cat player would have pooled the energy and used it only for SR and Rip. No FB would have been cast. The GotVV-shift allows you to do the impossible and to find room for everything. It's a real shame that the flawed coding of the auras punishes the other raid members for our plays. If we ignore that for a split second, you can see that all other negative things I've said so far are only caused by me.
• 2:32-2:33 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 2:40-2:41 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 2:44 Misplay. I should have refreshed SR with 4 CPs and saved the energy for Rake when building up CPs for Rip. This would have prevented the loss of 2 Rip ticks at 2:54.
• 2:47-2:48 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 3:02 I casted FB after getting a CC. Boomer reflexes.
• 3:03-3:06 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 3:07 RNG decided to punish me for casting GotVV-shift. See how the CC got overwritten by another from a normal AA. As I've clarified in the fourth post, this is a loss of all of the AAs during the GotVV-shift.
• 3:19 SR-less Rake.
• 3:24-3:25 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 3:52-3:53 No 5% crit for the other melees.
• 3:54-4:03 Horrible RNG. Had I received at least one crit in that time frame, I would have refreshed Rip after expiring. I actually thought about casting Rip with 4 CPs, but I thought that I would lose too much damage from refreshing CPs for SR and casting a SR-less Rake, so I decided to deal with this loss, in order not to complicate things. After looking it again, I am certain I should have refreshed Rip even with 4 CPs. SR had a 29-sec duration, which was unnecessarily long given that the boss was going to die way before that.
• 4:10 5 5CP-Rip ticks > 5CP FB. This is why I use TimeToDie.
• 4:12-4:13 No 5% crit for the other melees.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZ1MErE8DZE
Background:

Spoiler: Show

• Realm - Lordearon (no 30% ICC buff for the raiders);
• DBS nm;
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=49016 on me - A 6k gs rogue was a much better candidate for it.
• No http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=23060 - The chicken didn't cast the squawk;
• Bonus effect from 4pt10;
• 265/263 hit rating; 26/26 expertise; a bit over 1k arp with http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=42995;
• 5.6k gs;
• My gear in this video:
  
  1. Head - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50826 (ilvl 251 t10)
  2. Neck - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50452 (ilvl 264 BoE ring)
  3. Shoulders - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50824 (ilvl 251 t10)
  4. Back - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50470 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  5. Chest - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50828 (ilvl 251 t10)
  6. VVrist - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50333 (ilvl 264 DBS 25)
  7. Hands - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50799 (ilvl 251 DBS 10)
  8. VVaist - wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50995 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  9. Legs - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50825 (ilvl 251 t10)
  10. Feet - wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=49950 (ilvl 264 LM 25)
  11. Ring 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47730 (ilvl 245 EoT vendor)
  12. Ring 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50402 (ilvl 277 Exalted Ashen Verdict rep)
  13. Trinket 1 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50198 (ilvl 232 FoS 5 hc)
  14. Trinker 2 - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47214 (ilvl 200 ToC 5)
  15. Idol - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=50456 (ilvl 264 EoF vendor)
  16. VVeapon - http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/item=47302 (ilvl 245 Twin Valkyries 25)

Commentary of the events in a chronological order:

Spoiler: Show

• VVhy the lack of sound? - //-
• 0:06 FailFish I should have waited a bit longer before using the bomb.
• 0:14 Clearcasting at 85 energy led to me reaching the 100 energy cap. As a result, I lost 5 Berserk energy points, which are equivalent to 10 outside of our big CD. It was unfortunate, but only a small penalty, so nothing too serious.
• 0:21 I decided to go for FB, and I'd like to explain why. After receiving the second CC a few seconds before that, I considered that had I continued spamming Shred, I wouldn't have utilised my energy efficiently. Berserk had 7 seconds, while I was sitting at 70 energy. Since we regenerate 10 energy per second, I thought that with one more CC, I wouldn't spend all of it during Berserk. This was an instinct tbh, but it paid off at 0:24.
• 0:29-0:30 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 0:32 I should have used the CC on the Rake and get the snapshot. The reason why I missed it is dumb - I just didn't pay attention to the buff.
• 0:35-0:36 Rampage was registered?
• 0:42 Boomer reflexes. I should have cast Shred and then Rip.
• 0:49-0:48 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 0:54-0:55 no 5% crit for the melees. I didn't want to wait for SR to expire. It's better to get the GotVV-shift as early as possible.
• 1:05-1:06 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 1:08 it was a bit too close. Had I done the GotVV-shift a few miliseconds too late, the Rip tick would have done 30% less damage.
• 1:21-1:22 Rampage was registered?
• 1:24 RNG punished me for the GotVV-shift. My previous CC got overwritten, and this means that the AA damage lost was for naught.
• 1:29 I should gone for the GotVV-shift again. It would have allowed me to refresh Rip a bit earlier. 3 Rip ticks were sacrificed because of this.
• 1:35 I innervated the healer. I didn't get a CC, so I decided to use GotVV again. However, for 2 seconds the other melees didn't have the 5% crit.
• 2:11-2:12 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 2:29-2:30 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 2:40-2:42 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 2:51 for a few miliseconds melees didn't have the 5% crit, but then Rampage popped up out of nowhere.
• 2:59 tbh, I don't know what I was thinking back then to refresh Mangle too early. I think I have considered the possibility to squeeze in a FB, but then rejected the idea.
• 3:07 boomer reflexes. Shred w/o any bleeds.
• 3:11-3:12 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 3:15 I consider this to be a misplay. I should have used a Shred with the CC, then Shred again followed by Rake -> FB -> TF -> Berserk. Honestly, I have no clue why I didn't do it like this. By doing so, I increased the CD of TF unnecessarily, and in doing so I removed the possibility of getting an extra TF in the long run. In other words, because of this misplay the Berserk->TF opener at the very start of the fight would have been more beneficial. Also, I should have used the engineering enchant a bit earlier.
• 3:21 Boomer reflexes. Used FB alongside a CC proc.
• 3:35-3:36 no 5% crit for the melees.
• 3:39 Boomer reflexes. SR-less Rake.
• 3:43 misplay. Dunno what happened with my brain, but it was kinda lucky that I got back into cat form because a few seconds later I received a CC. Still, a misplay is a misplay because it's not intentional.
• 3:52-3:53 Rampage was registered?
• 4:02 misplay? I used Rip, but after checking the VOD I didn't get 5 ticks from it. FB was better, but on the other hand due to the fact that I was left with more energy I was able to inflict a last FB at 4:11. For that reason, I'm not really sure if I did the correct thing. Not refreshing SR was intentional because I wouldn't have profited from it that much. It was better to get the last finisher even with 4 FBs. I waited on the finisher, in order to spend all of my energy on it. Had I used with 35, I wouldn't have utilised the remaining energy on anything.
• 4:27 No DBVV dropped this game. SadgeRoar

2. PROS AND CONS

Spoiler: Show

Pros:

• VVe gain a CP or two (in case of crit)
  -> in the long run, this can be used to squeeze in a FB;
  -> in the short run, this can help us refresh SR or Rip faster if either of those abilities are about to expire.
• Shred is stronger than one AA, and on average it can even compensate 3 lost AAs.
• The probability to proc CC is higher with GotVV than relying on AAs to do the job. Sometimes waiting for AAs to proc a CC would result in less damage if those end up whiffing.

Cons:

• Casting GotVV doesn't guarantee a success 100% of the time. If this powershift ends up whiffing, we have to spend another GCD to do this again. As a result, we would lose the damage from the AAs.
• Getting a CC proc before or after the powershift would result in us losing damage from the AAs.
• By exiting cat form, other members lose our "Leader of the Pack" aura.
• VVe change back to cat form, but now we have less energy due to having 3 points in 'Furor'.**

**That's why you need to do it with as little energy as possible (< 30).

3. RECOMMENDED TALENT BUILD

Spoiler: Show

https://i.imgur.com/6eqPOAv.png
Let’s be honest for a bit - different builds perform better depending on the encounter. On some boss fights, we tend to swipe a lot, and on others we only resort to single-target only. I don't want some people here to be left with the wrong impression that the proposed talent build outperforms all others. However, I recommend it, because it’s generally useful regardless what boss you face.

I’d like to talk about the marked talents for a bit (from most to least important).

- Improved Leader of the Pact - Look, under normal circumstances I wouldn’t have recommended it. It heals us and other melees (incl. hunters) for 2%/4% of our total health with an internal cd of 6 seconds. The healing is **** [let’s assume I have around 40k health with my feral cat in icc (with all of my buffs); 4% would be 1600 HP or 2080 HP with the 30% buff for 6 seconds]. However, the reason why I use this talent is because it returns mana, which goes extremely well with our aggressive GotVV-shifting strategy. One might even say that this talent is one of its cornerstones, so I wanted to stress on the importance of its presence. That said, you don't need to put a second point in this talent. The mana gain from 1/2 is already enough, and we will most likely have GBoVV from a holy paladin. You can use the remaining talent point for something else.

- Feral Instinct - increases the damage of our swipes => helps us clear trash faster, useful in fights with adds like Lord Marrowgar (spikes), LDVV, VDVV, Halion 25hc encounter. Obviously, this isn’t useful in every single boss encounter, but personally I wouldn’t create an OS just for single-target only.

- Survival Instincts - despite being a defensive cooldown (associated with tanking and pvp-ing), I actually consider it to be excellent for a pure dps build. VVhy? That’s because we can use our defensive cooldowns aggressively and ignore incoming damage, in order to inflict more onto the boss. One quick example is Sindragosa when you have a bunch of stacks. Instead of waiting for the debuff to expire, you can just use this ability and continue to dps the boss. Not to mention, alive kitty >>> dead kitty. VVe don't have 9 lives in a fight, so anything that keeps us alive and kicking is welcome.

- 4/5 Furor - Some people might wonder why I am even mentioning it here. VVell, tbh puting one extra point in that talent isn’t bad. I consider it more beneficial than investing talent points into Improved Mangle, because it has the potential to grant us more energy. Basically, having 4/5 Furor minimises the penalty if you shapeshift out of catform, in order to Innervate or Bress someone or to use the GotVV-macro. If you have 4/5, you’d “gain” 20 energy as opposed to 3/5. Don't put 2 talent points in this! If you have 5/5, upon shapeshifting your energy could cap at 100, but due to the GCD caused by the shapeshift you would waste 15 energy or more due to latency/slow reaction time.

- Improved Mangle - it can decrease the energy cost of our Mangle ability by 2/4/6. I don’t recommend it, unless you want to have another spec just for bosses without adds, and you don't bress or innervate your guildmades that often. However, 4/5 Furor grants us more energy than 3 cheap Mangles combined. Most fights last ~2 minutes, some 3+, so throughout the course of a fight we will use Mangle three or four times, which would save us 6/12/18 or 8/16/24 energy. Compare it to Furor, which can "grant us" 20 energy just by investing one talent point in it.

4. ARCHTYPE CHOICES (OUTDATED)

Spoiler: Show

If you check this wall of text, you'd see how I came to the following conclusions:

Recommended archtypes depending on how many GotVV-shifts you do per minute:

• Haste - either none or on average less than 1 per minute;
• Strength - on average at least 1 GotVV-shift per minute;
• Agility - can't beat Strength in practice, but it can beat Haste if you have at least two GotVV-shifts on average per minute.

Strength

Spoiler: Show

Items:
Head - Heroic t10
Neck - Sindragosa 25 hc
Shoulders - Heroic t10
Cloak - Funship 25 hc
Chest - Heroic t10
VVrists - Halion 25 hc
Gloves - Rotface 25 hc
VVaist - Prof. Putricide 25 hc
Legs - Heroic t10
Feet - Lord Marrowgar 25 hc
Ring N1 - Halion 25 hc
Ring N2 - Ashen Verdict rep (exalted)
Trinket N1 - Halion 25 hc
Trinket N2 - Deathbringer Saurfang 25 hc
VVeapon - Lich King 25 hc
Relic - t10

VVhy not Halion 25 hc necklace, TOGC 25 cloak, DBS 25 hc wrists?
I actually did some calculations with the neck and Valihtria 25 hc ring. The att speed was 0.709, and it underperformed by a great amount in comparison to all other archtypes. So, I now use the typical agility gear list and just resort to strength gems, as you're about to see.

Gems:
Red - 10x“20 ArP”, 1x “34 Strength”, 1x “20 Exp”, 1x "20 Strength"
Yellow - 2x “34 Hit”, 3x “20 Hit”
Orange - 1x “10 Hit, 10 Exp” 1x“10 Strength, 10 Hit”
Blue - 1x “10 all primary stats”
Meta - 1x “21 agility, 3% crit dmg”

Enchants:
Head - Knights of the Ebon Blade revered
Shoulders - Sons of Hodir exalted
Cloak - Engineering
Chest - “10 all stats”
Wrist - “50 AP”
Hands - Engineering
Waist - Blacksmithing
Legs - Leatherworking
Feet - Engineering
Weapon - Berserker

Agility

Spoiler: Show

Items:
Head - Heroic t10
Neck - Sindragosa 25 hc
Shoulders - Heroic t10
Cloak - Funship 25 hc
Chest - Heroic t10
VVrists - Halion 25 hc
Gloves - Rotface 25 hc
VVaist - Prof. Putricide 25 hc
Legs - Heroic t10
Feet - Lord Marrowgar 25 hc
Ring N1 - Halion 25 hc
Ring N2 - Ashen Verdict rep (exalted)
Trinket N1 - Halion 25 hc
Trinket N2 - Deathbringer Saurfang 25 hc
VVeapon - Lich King 25 hc
Relic - t10

Gems:
Red - 10x“20 ArP”, 1x “34 Agility”, 1x “20 Exp” 1x “20 Agility”
Yellow - 2x “34 Hit”, 3x “20 Hit”
Orange - 1x “10 Hit, 10 Exp” 1x“10 Agility, 10 Hit”
Blue - 1x “10 all primary stats”
Meta - 1x “21 agility, 3% crit dmg”

Enchants:
Head - Knights of the Ebon Blade revered
Shoulders - Sons of Hodir exalted
Cloak - Engineering
Chest - “10 all stats”
VVrist - “50 AP”
Hands - Engineering
VVaist - Blacksmithing
Legs - Leatherworking
Feet - Engineering
Weapon - Berserker

Haste

Spoiler: Show

Check Blunta’s guide. kthx

5. MACROS

Spoiler: Show

By wtfzomglol:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wtfzomglol

#showtooltip Gift of the Wild
/cast Gift of the Wild
/stopattack

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wtfzomglol

#showtooltip Cat Form
/cast [form:0/1/2/4/5] Cat Form
/startattack [form:3]

---

By Nap:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by halesk70

#showtooltip Gift of the Wild
/stopattack [mod:alt]
/cast [mod:alt]Gift of the Wild; !Cat Form
/startattack [form:3]

---

^you hold "alt" while using the macro, in order to cast GotVV and to stop autoattacking.

I use wtfzomglol's first macro, and I've made /startattack macros for Mangle, Shred, Rake, and SR.

6. SUGGESTED ADD-ONS FOR THIS PLAYSTYLE

Spoiler: Show

Tracking cooldowns of our abilities

• weakauras link
• DroodFocus link
• feralbynight link
• badkitty link

Tracking cooldowns of our autoattacks

• Quartz link
• weakauras link

Tracking the time needed for a mob to die

• TimeToDie link

7. PRACTICE MAKES BETTER

Spoiler: Show

a) Quick thoughts

I'm going to be honest with you here, the trick you saw in the videos won't be a brainless decision as a simple push of a button. The last statement regards using FFF, Barkskin, and NG in fights, which require muscle memory for the most part. Using the GotVV-shift would require you to do extra work in the form of constant awareness and quick decision making, where you assess whether the conditions are optimal for the manoeuvre. You need to:

- keep track of your energy;
- keep track of your CPs;
- keep track of TF;
- keep track of your DoT timers;
- keep track of the swing timer (if you decide to use an addon and be more efficient);
- keep track of your attack speed;
- keep track of the boss timers.

On top of that, you'd also need to mash your shapeshifting spell/macro and Shred ability, in order to minimise the penalty form the idling time. Because of this, I expect that some of you would feel discouraged to try it out and uncomfortable with the idea of leaving cat form and taking risks. I can only say one thing regarding this - you can do it! Is it going to be hard to get accustomed to it at start? - yes, it is. Is it going to push you out of your comfort zone? - yes, it is. Are you going to make mistakes during raids? - probably, but all of this is normal that you shouldn't feel scared of trying it out. I mean, if you already know how to play as a feral cat, then congratulations for learning the hardest spec in this expansion! The GotVV-shift is not going to be impossible for you to learn, since you are already aware of the basics, and in the following paragraphs I will give you some tips on how to start your training. Shall we begin?

b) Out with the old, in with the new

Just like every training out there, yours would begin on the dummy as well. Before you ask, no, we are not going to get any CCs here. This is not our goal anyway! Our goal is to get accustomed to the things I mentioned in the aforementioned list and to get the feel of the manoeuvre as something natural. If you want to perform the GotVV-shift precisely, you need to integrate it slowly in your gameplay. So, pick a macro in the respective subsection (or create something of your own) and follow this programme:

1) Learning the basic pattern:

1. After autoattacking in cat form, cast Mark/Gift of the VVild immediately afterwards.
2. VVhile in neutral form, spam the shapeshift ability (Kripp explains it well here).
3. Upon shapeshifting back in cat form, attack the dummy ASAP.
4. Mash "Shred" during the GCD.

After you repeat this a few times, it's time to go onto the next step:

2) Using the GotVV-shift in the context of your rotation:

1. DPS the dummy as you would normally do.
2. Try using the macro under the following circumstances:
   
   1. you have less than 20/30 energy, and TF is on cooldown;
   2. you have 0-3 CPs (or 0-4, your choice);
   3. your bleeds have >3 seconds of duration;
   4. Berserk is inactive (super important!)
   5. it's advisable to practise casting it twice in a row, so you prepare for that outcome in a raid.

After you repeat this a few times, you can go onto the next step:

3) More advanced tips (optional):

1. watch the swing timer on Quartz/VVeakAuras and train your reflexes;
2. give yourself a small window after the swing, in case you get a CC, so that you can react to it;
3. be wary of your current attack speed! VVatch out if you have "Speed of the Vrykul" (DBVV haste proc).

But of course, training on a lifeless dummy is not the same as facing a real boss, whose mechanics you need to acknowledge. It's always a good idea to have a firsthand exerience in a 25-man raid setting. If you don't want to train in ICC/RS at the expense of your raid companions, your personal guild rank and/or twitch reputation, I highly advise you to go either in VoA 25 (where you can use the GotVV-shift to Shred the boss or Swipe the orbs), or in any low-tier raid out there. The purpose is to get accustomed to the raid settings and to plan your moves in advance before certain mechanics take place.

c) Personal preference

Now that you have an idea how the technique feels like, you can decide for yourself how you'd use it in the future:
1) VVould you reject it completely?
2) VVould you use it only for Swipes on the trash or on certain bosses (Lord Marrowgar, LDVV, Halion 25 hc)?
3) VVould you use it only on target dummy bosses?
4) VVould you use it only when NG, FFF, and Barkskin are on CD?
5) VVould you use it only when you don't have any attack speed modifiers on yourself?
etc etc

8. ATTACK SPEED MODIFIERS

Spoiler: Show

Your current attack speed.	Is GotVV worth it?
0.52 or higher	?
0.51-0.43	not recommended
0.42 or lower	X

Clarification:
not recommended - You could use the GotVV-shift, but gaining CPs and being able to utilise them is a requirement. Even with that, the gain is relatively small and not really worth the effort, unless you're desperate to refresh Rip on time.

9. SACRIFICING DOT TICKS IN FAVOUR OF SHREDS

Spoiler: Show

General observations

	4pt10 is present	Trinket procs are about to expire
Rip tick	?	X
Rake Tick	?	X

ICC/RS environment

Your current attack speed.	Can you afford to sacrifice a Rip tick?	Can you afford to sacrifice a Rake tick?
>0.7	not recommended	not recommended
0.7	not recommended	not recommended
0.65	not recommended	not recommended
0.6	not recommended	not recommended
0.55 or lower	X	X

Clarification:
not recommended - You could use the GotVV-shift, but gaining CPs and being able to utilise them is a requirement. Even with that, the gain is relatively small and not really worth the effort, unless you're desperate to refresh Rip on time.

10. TIMING FB

Spoiler: Show

If you want a more definite answer about when you can afford to bite your target, here are some equations. These can give you an idea how much time it would take you to refresh Rip under certain circumstances. You can either refresh it when it expires or sacrifice one or two ticks. If during combat the timer of your Rip is below the calculated one here, you ought to save your energy for refreshing that finisher. If it's higher, you can safely cast FB.

Both SR & Rip are about to expire soon

Quote:

---

Time needed to refresh Rip = 5 GCDs {1 sec each} + 2 GCDs per GotVV-shift {1.274 secs each} + time for pooling energy and other possible delays - 6 seconds (if Tiger's Fury is present) - (4.2seconds*number of CC procs)

Note1: Switch 5 with 6, if the critical strike is less than 60% or around that number, or you want to generate more CPs for SR. You'd need to gather more energy, though.
Note2: TF can't remove the time spent on waiting for the GCDs - just the regular one for pooling energy.
Note3: If you want, you could consider AAs proccing CCs during the pooling time, in which case you calculate how much AAs your toon will do during that time. Then it's a matter of probability. You can also add FFF, Barkskin, and Nature's Grasp there as well.

---

Only Rip is about to expire soon

Quote:

---

Time needed to refresh Rip = 3 GCDs {1 sec each} + 2 GCDs per GotVV-shift {1.274 secs each} + time for pooling energy and other possible delays - 6 seconds (if Tiger's Fury is present) - (4.2seconds*number of CC procs)

Note1: Switch 3 with 4, if the critical strike is less than 60% or around that number. You'd need to gather more energy, though.
Note2: TF can't remove the time spent on waiting for the GCDs - just the regular one for pooling energy.
Note3: If you want, you could consider AAs proccing CCs during the pooling time, in which case you calculate how much AAs your toon will do during that time. Then it's a matter of probability. You can also add FFF, Barkskin, and Nature's Grasp there as well.

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11. 5CPs & CCs. SHOULD VVE USE SHRED OR FB/RIP?

Spoiler: Show

FB vs Shred (out of Berserk)
- Boss isn't dying any time soon - do you have a CC proc?

• Yes. Shred > FB
• No. Is your energy 53 or more?
  
  1. Yes. Shred > FB
  2. No. FB > Shred.

- Boss is going to die soon - can you squeeze in two FBs within the last remaining seconds?

• Yes. Read the previous algorithm.
• No. Shred > FB and try to cast FB during the last second if possible or with around 35 en.

FB vs Shred (in Berserk)
- Berserk is still ticking - do you have a CC proc?

• Yes. Shred > FB
• No. Is your energy 25 or more?
  
  1. Yes. Shred > FB
  2. No. FB > Shred.

- Berserk is about to expire soon - can you utilise all of your energy for Shreds and a FB @ ? 24 energy?

• Yes. Read the previous algorithm.
• No. FB > Shred and you blow your energy as much as possible..

Disclaimer: Ofc, this is assuming that Rip is still ticking, or you don't lose more than 3 ticks (i.e. 6 seconds of its duration). If there's a chance that the last thing happens, then obviously refreshing our DoT has a bigger priority than FB.

---

Rip vs Shred
- Do you have 2pt10 and 100% arp?

• Yes. Are you going to lose a snapshot on your Rip if you cast Shred?
  
  1. Yes. Rip > Shred
  2. No. Shred > Rip
• No, I don't have 2pt10. Rip > Shred

12. EXTRAS - SUPER NICHE TIPS FOR DEDICATED MINMAXERS

Spoiler: Show

a) Timing FB when the boss is about to die

Use TimeToDie - Keep in mind that this addon is not perfect, because it calculates the time based on the current flow of the raid damage. Some classes do additional burst when the boss is below a certain HP%, so keep in mind that it won't calculate the exact time correctly. Because of this, my personal advice is to stop ripping the boss at around 15 seconds. Below that time frame, you should prioritise FBs. For example, you have 0 CPs and 0 energy, and the boss is about to die. How much time do you need to generate enough CPs for a FB?

Quote:

---

• For a 4CP FB:
  
  1. 13-14 seconds (due to latency/human error) w/o the GotVV-shift;
  2. 9-10 seconds (due to latency/human error) with one GotVV-shift;
  3. 8-9 seconds (due to latency/human error) with two GotVV-shifts.
  
  
• For a 5CP FB:
  
  1. 18-19 seconds (due to latency/human error) w/o the GotVV-shift;
  2. 13-14 seconds (due to latency/human error) with one GotVV-shift;
  3. 9-10 seconds (due to latency/human error) with two GotVV-shifts
  
  

If the timer on "TimeToDie" is lower than that, then don't bother.

Disclaimer 1: Obviously, this doesn't take into account any CCs from our AAs.
Disclaimer 2: Obviously, this doesn't take into account the presence of TF.
Disclaimer 3: Obviously, this doesn't take into account low amount of crit%.

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b) Switching idols in Naxxramas and Ulduar (Frostmourne realm)

The idols available in Naxx and Ulduar are:

• Idol of the Ravenous Beast;
• Idol of VVorship;
• Idol of the Corruptor

At first glance, it might seem like an obvious tactic to switch them manually or with a simple macro in combat, in order to gain their effects and enhance your abilities. However, that's bait! If you switch your idol, then you reset your swing timer and trigger a hidden GCD. This could lead to a loss of DoT ticks and opportunities for CC procs.

That said, there's a way for you to use different relics in a fight, and that revolves around the GotVV-shift. VVhy? That's because the delays from both tricks OVERLAP with each other, so you're getting two things for the price of one. If you use a combined macro, you would cast GotVV on the whole raid and at the same time switch your current idol. After the GCD caused by the spell, you'd shapeshift into cat form and wait for the second GCD to end as well, which would also last one second. This is why you won't see a double delay, but just one.

Here are some macros, which could serve as an inspiration:

Quote:

---

/stopattack
/cast Gift of the wild
/equip Idol of the Ravenous Beast

/stopattack
/cast Gift of the wild
/equip Idol of worship

/stopattack
/cast Gift of the wild
/equip Idol of the Corruptor

---

Be very careful to time your GotVV/Idol-macro correctly! My personal advice is not to use any of those macros at start, i.e. before and during the first Berserk. You don't want to lose valuable seconds of your big CD. You may use them afterwards.

c) Using Predator's Swiftness to proc CCs

Predator's Swiftness is a more reliable source than GotVV in 5--man settings, and you can use it alongside VVrath to squeeze in a bit of damage, however its CC proc rate is 58.33%, and it's only truly rewarding when you don't have any attack speed buffs on you. Moreover, you still need /stopattack with the latter spell otherwise you'd attack the boss in caster form and start the slow swing. For those reasons alone, I would only advise doing that combo in RDF or combining PS with Rebirth in a 10-man and 25-man raid, as even in the worst case scenario (you not getting a CC proc) you'd still contribute to your group. The rules for the Predator's Swiftness-Rebirth-CC combo are pretty much the same as those for the GotVV-shift:

Quote:

---

- make sure to have Predator's Swiftness;
- make sure that your energy is 30 or below;
- make sure to have less than 5 CPs;
- make sure that Berserk is not actively ticking;
- it would be desirable if your TF is on CD, so that you don't delay it needlessly (though, if someone is dead, they can't wait for you forever, so this takes priority over our small CD).
- once you've bressed your fallen comrade, mash the shapeshift spell and autoattack the boss ASAP!

---

d) Swiping as cat

In short, if you're swiping a pack of mobs that would die within 4 seconds, the best approach would be to ignore Rake + SR and to invest the energy and the GCDs only into swipe. In any other situation, Rake + SR + TF + CC = gg.

I've deleted the post, where I showed the numbers. I considered it redundant for the situational information it provided. If someone's interested, they can DM me, and I can share with them the old calculations.

e) Cat's running speed and the range of some bosses' AoEs

Most movement speed modifiers DON'T STACK. Rather, the superior one replaces all others. For example, it doesn't matter if I play as a feral cat or shapeshift to cat as a boomie - I travel with the same speed if I use Dash in both of these cases. So, here are some numbers:

• Normal running speed (unmodified) = 7 yards per second
• Cat form (30% speed increase) = 9.1 yards per second
• Dash/Sprint (70% speed increase) = 11.9 yards per second
• Nitro Boots (150% speed increase) = 17.5 yards per second

But, Kova, why is that important?

VVhenever a boss is about to cast an AoE, the spell could be inactive for a few seconds before it finally goes off. Of course, sometimes it's just a matter of repositioning your toon or the boss in that fight (e.g. void zones on Kel'Thuzad, fire walls on Sartharion 3D, cosmic smashes on Algalon, small vortexes on BPC, shadow traps on LOD etc), but other times you have to sacrifice dps to dodge them. By knowing your character's running speed, you can determine when you need to gtfo from the boss, so you save as much damage as possible. Few examples:

• XT nm/hm [Dark bomb - 12 yards, 9 seconds 'till explosion] -> dps for 7 seconds, or 8 with Nitro Boots;
  
• IC nm/hm [dwarf boss's AoE - 20 yards, 6 sec casting time] -> dps for 3 seconds, or 4 with Nitro Boots;
  
• Mimi nm/hm [Shock Blast - 15 yards, 5 sec casting time] -> dps for 2 seconds, or for 3 (mediocre speed increase), or for 4 with Nitro Boots.
  
• Yogg hm [P1 AoE - 15 yards] -> if you have one of Sara's debuffs, move away from the adds 3 seconds before they explode, or 2 (mediocre speed increase). Save Nitro for the brain room!
  
• Sindragosa [Blistering Cold - 25 yards, 5 sec casting time] - you can gain 2 or 3 additional seconds to dps Sindy.

Of course, you can also spend those seconds in running away from the boss and casting GotVV in peace. The aforementioned examples can give you an idea of how much time you can spare with.

13. NOT AN EXPLOIT

Spoiler: Show

VVhat's the definition of an exploit?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Palutena

This may take many forms, but all of them are obvious. If you are profiting of any in-game advantage that shouldn't be happening normally, its a bug exploit.

---

My proposed macro is based around the behaviour of the "Omen of Clarity" talent. Since it has no internal cooldown, and it has a proc rate of 6% (3.5 ppm) per target, we utilise the latter effect. Gift of the VVild places a buff on all allied units (players, pets, and companions), and each buff counts as one 6% PPM. According to some sources, this has been present in retail wow, and it's working correctly.

Quote:

---

Sources:

https://wowwiki-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Omen_of_Clarity
https://wotlk-twinhead.twinstar.cz/?spell=16864
https://wotlk.evowow.com/?spell=16864
https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...arity-in-WOTLK

Q:Whats the cooldown?
A1:none!!! ;D
A2:Currently it has a 10 sec internal cd, in wotlk that cd will get removed to give kitties a reason to get haste.
A3:In the next data push, you will find Omen of Clarity has been changed a bit. The 10 second cooldown has been removed, the procs per minute has been raised from 2 to 3.5, and melee abilities no longer trigger it.

https://github.com/SunwellTracker/issues/issues/2500

"No ICD works correctly here"
-> "No ICD. [It] works correctly here."

https://www.warmane.com/changelog?expansion=2&id=78
http://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=349912
Q: Is this talent broken? It feels like it has 0 GCD and you can spam it all day as cat or cat tank.
A1: It should not have iCD in 3.3.5
A2: it is a recent fix, now it does not have internal cooldown anymore.
It should proc only from autoattack + damaging spell + healing spell

---

So far, so good, but Palutena made yet another comment:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Palutena

Exploiting skills: If certain skills/spells can be used in an unusual way to exploit and create an unfair advantage over other players, avoid doing so.

---

This is where I want to know where the line between an exploit and clever usage of ingame mechanics lies. How on earth is the player going to conclude which ingame advantage is strong, but not too strong to count as unintentional? VVhat is actually intended by the Blizzard devs anyway? They didn't foresee that "Light of Elune" would be used for speedruns, but here we are. They didn't foresee that feral druids would wear "VVolfshead Helm" and benefit from "Furor" in Vanilla TBC, but they were gravely mistaken. Did they ban the players from using those items or talents? Nope.

Using GotVV during fights isn't something new. This whole thread just shows that it can be used a bit more frequently in fights. You're not going to do a gajilion amount of dps or dethrone Fury VVarriors, Fire Mages, or Combat Rogues from their S+ category. If you're still not convinced, then pls look at this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_ggLGj37qI

Even though I admire the person's ability to use his talents cleverly, THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF A GAME-BREAKING INTERACTION. The GotVV-powershift isn't. Even if this doesn't convince you, here's the Head GM's stance:
https://i.imgur.com/JHV9Biq.png

14. FOOD FOR THOUGHT

Spoiler: Show

(more like "final thoughts", but I will give you something to think about as well)

Quite honestly, when I started the thread back in January, I never thought that it would grow like this. I imagined that I would just bring up the topic within a single post, and that some people would try out the GotVV-shift for themselves and share their thoughts in the comment section. Never in my wildest dreams did I anticipate to write such an in-depth dissertation, and I'm glad that I did. Of course, just because you see numbers here, dear reader, that doesn't mean that you should trust me blindly. Quite the opposite - I DON'T VVANT PEOPLE TO ACCEPT EVERYTHING I VVROTE HERE AND REPEAT MY STATEMENTS LIKE PARROTS. There is a reason why I posted all of those calculations in the previous posts and why I still keep them - I wanted you to SEE VVITH YOUR OVVN EYES MY THOUGHT PROCESS and HOVV I CAME TO CERTAIN CONCLUSIONS. By doing so, you could determine whether the things I wrote were correct or whether I've done some mistakes, which have led to me making false conclusions. In case you don't agree with the formulas, and you see obvious flaws, you would do the community a great favour by quoting the false part, explaining why you consider it like so and what needs to change. This is what I want to see - critical thinking, especially when it comes to unexplored topics.

There is a reason why I never considered this thread as a guide in the first place, but rather as an open discussion. VVhen it comes to unexplored territory, how can one person know everything about it? The answer is, I don't. VVho knows what else we can uncover with this playstyle? Could it inspire people to brainstorm other playstyles? Hopefully.

And so, dear reader, I leave you with my thoughts, my formulas, my work for the last couple of months. In case I stop responding here and move away from VVoVV, you can continue where I have stopped. One last tip before I end this essay:

Quote:

---

Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist.

Pablo Picasso

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15. FAQ

Spoiler: Show

Q: VVhat's the point of this GotVV-shift?
A: Almost guaranteed CCs, which can be used for Shreds, and you would generate CPs. The latter you can use either to refresh your abilities when the time comes or to get extra FBs.

Q: VVhy do you consider the playstyle to be niche?
A: Before learning that auras are applied with a delay, I thought that you only needed a Fury VVarrior in the group to provide you with Rampage 24/7. Turns out, when shapeshifting out of cat form, the game needs a bit of time to realise that the 5% crit aura isn't present and then it searches for the next provider. Unfortunately for us, this isn't a bug. This had been present on retail wotlk, and the current code is based on it. It doesn't help the fact that the staff doesn't consider the delay to be worth removing (see here). This doesn't mean that the playstyle is dead, but it's only beneficial for the feral player. Unfortunately, not even the inclusion of another feral druid guarantees the presence of the 5% crit for the rest of the melees.

Q: Do I need to cast GotVV right after I hit with my cat AA, in order to profit from this maneuver?
A: VVhile it's true, that you'd benefit more if you do the thing correctly, you would still have positive numbers even if you increased the delay of your next AA by a few milliseconds.

Q: VVhy is this guy writing the "W" as "VV"? (I suspect most of you have asked yourselves that question)
A: In truth, the keyboard of my laptop malfunctions from time to time. The "w" letter isn't the only key, which doesn't normally work (I had to copy-paste it in most of the sentences in this thread). The "windows" button, "tab", and "F3" are also part of this category. I say "normally", because occasionally my keyboard starts responding again, but that period doesn't last long.

However, even though at the time of editing this post my "W" is working as I have bought myself a new keyboard, I'm replacing it everywhere with "VV" (except in suggested macros) just to give you something to remember me by. :)

16. TRIVIA

Spoiler: Show

How did the GotVV-powershift occur to me?

Short version:
https://i.imgur.com/tHANHGb.png

Long version:
Tbh, I vaguely remember the days when I started playing as a feral cat more seriously. VVhen I was a teenager in 2010, I played on another pserver, and people there informed me about the 'Omen of Clarity' procs from GotVV. However, since I was a noob back then, I didn't want to be bothered with extra abilities so I dismissed that tip. Fast forward to 2019 when I got hit by the VVoVV nostalgia and started playing on warmane more seriously. I started reading guides and practising on the dummy when one day I stumbled upon this thread:

http://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=393606

From that moment onwards, I slowly started integrating FFF, NG, and Barkskin in my rotation. However, using GotVV while autoattacking hadn't occurred to me so swiftly. It happened on a random day, when I asked myself the following question: "VVait a minute! If people use GotVV prior to fights and during the boss's downtime, why aren't they using it midfight? May I use it when I autoattack?" I can't recall the earliest moment of time when that had happened, no doubt it was either at the end of 2019 or in January of 2020, but I have asked my guildies about this possible playstyle, and down below you can see some screenshots. Check the date. ;)
https://i.imgur.com/ol1cAiU.png
(^Funny thing is that I was right about this macro all along. However, I wasn't aware of the fact that GotVV reset the swing timer back then, I didn't know that my proposed macro actually neutralised the penalty, so I was convinced to remove it. Oh, if I had only known!)
https://i.imgur.com/aeYDW4y.png
(As you can see, I wasn't aware of the formulas provided by evowow, so I couldn't calculate the average dmg properly. I just looked at the critical strike damage.)
https://i.imgur.com/FcBDEXF.png
(Here's where I got convinced to remove the /cleartarget command. This is what happens when the information is partly accessible to you.)
https://i.imgur.com/hXXccLj.png
https://i.imgur.com/4uM92jh.png
https://i.imgur.com/Qx79XGb.png
(No, past me. You were right. You just didn't know the reason for that.)
https://i.imgur.com/EOINWQc.png
(Ignore the numbers in the last screenshot! They were based on false calculations. The relevant numbers are to be found in my fourth post.)

Fast forward to the 9th of January, 2021, and you can see how the theorycraft was further developed.

17. CREDIT VVHERE CREDIT'S DUE

Spoiler: Show

• Nap - sharing the EJ site here, sharing his feedback about how we would lose damage if we make mistakes, providing us with macros and videos and me with extra informaion on discord;
• DarkenedHue - correcting me about Furor, sharing the EJ site, and warning me about the ethical dilemma surrounding this "unintended" playstyle
• wtfzomglol - sharing his macros with the rest of us
• Blunta (i.e. the guy with the new feral guide) - motivating me to record some demonstrations on dummies, motivating me to take attack speed modifiers into consideration, and informing me about the latency issue and human error
• Sand1dark - informing me about the Predator's Swiftness interaction on discord.
• Aldtharios - clarifying whether this playstyle was an exploit or a legitimate way of playing
• Palutena - helping me deal with a technical issue and changing the title of the thread.
• Evowow & mathematics - the MVPs here. Thank you for giving me the answers, which aren't visible to the naked eye in regular raid settings!

Also, props to skullatbash, DarkenedHue, Septimun, and Bigpwn for their amazing work in the bugtracker!

18. USED FORMULAS FOR MY CALCULATIONS

Spoiler: Show

Bonus AP:
-> AP (new) = AP (original)*1.1(Heart of the VVild)
-> AP (from agil) = Agility (original)*1.02 (Improved Mark of the VVild)*1.06 (Survival of the Fittest)*1.1 (Heart)
-> AP (from str) = Strength (original)*2*1.02 (IMotVV)*1.06 (SotF)*1.1 (Heart)

Crit cap for white attacks (behind the target): 100% - 24%(Glancing hits) - X(Dodge chance) - X(Miss chance) +4.8%CSUPP
Crit cap for yellow attacks (behind the target): 100% - X(Dodge chance) - X(Miss chance) +4.8% CRIT SUPPRESSION

White attack = (0.24*glancing) + [(0.X-0.048)*crititcal strike] + [(1-0.24-0.X+0.048)*hit]
Yellow attack = [(0.X-0.048)*crititcal strike] + [(1-0.X+0.048)*hit]

AA = ((AP/14)+54.8)*Naturalist*SR
AA (non-crit) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*1.463
AA (crit) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*3.315158

Shred = (AA*2.25 + 666)*Naturalist*Mangle*SR*Rend and Tear
Shred(non-crit)= (((AP/14)+54.8)*2.25+666)*2.28228
Shred(crit)=(((AP/14)+54.8)*2.25+666)*5.17164648
Shred (base damage with Shred Idol) = (((AP/14)+54.8)*2.25+869)

Mangle = (Autoattack damage*2+566)*Naturalist*Savage Fury*Savage Roar
Mangle(non-crit)= (((AP/14)+54.8)*2+566)*1.7556
Mangle(crit)=(((AP/14)+54.8)*2+566)*3.9781896

FB 5CPs (Rend and Tear increases the crit chance by 24, so I’ll might as well concentrate on the critical strike):
FB = (190+290*5+0.35*AP)*Feral Aggression*SR*Naturalist*2*Predatory Instincts*Meta Gem
FB = (0.35*AP+1640)*3.8124317

Rake = (AP/100+176+3*358+AP*0.18)*Savage Fury*Mangle*SR*Naturalist
! For Frostmournes and people w/o 4pt10 - (AP/100+176) is the thing that crits. Everything else - doesn't. !
Rake (non-crit, 4pt10 or no 4pt10) = (AP/100+AP.18+1250)*2.28228
Rake (crit, 4pt10) = (AP/100+AP.18+1250)*5.17164648
Rake (crit, no 4pt10) = ((AP/100+176)*5.17164648)+((AP*0.18+1074)*2.28228)

Rip (no additional bonuses) = (36+93*5+0.05*AP)*11*SR*Mangle*Naturalist
Rip (-//-) = (AP*0.05+501)*20.9209
Rip (-//-, crit) = (AP*0.05+501)*47.4067594
Rip (multiplier with 2pt7) = 24.7247 or 56.0261702 (in case of a critical strike)
Rip (base damage with Rip Idol) = (AP*0.05+606)

Swipe = Autoattack damage*2.5*Naturalist*Feral Instinct*Savage Roar*X (number of targets within the 5-yard 180° frontal arc)
Swipe (non-crit) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*4.75475*X
Swipe (crit) = ((AP/14)+54.8)*10.7742635*X

modified version of "a civilian"'s suggested formula in the EJ forum page

Quote:

---

0.923(shred damage) + 0.077*[0.9941(shred damage) - (number of missed AAs with the second GotVV cast)*(AA average damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage)] - 0.923*(number of missed AAs)*(AA damage) - 0.923*(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage)

---

my version (incl. the CP values)

Quote:

---

0.923(shred damage) + 0.923*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP) + 0.077*[0.9941(shred damage) + 0.9941*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP) - (number of missed AAs with the second GotVV cast)*(AAaverage damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage) - (missed AAs with the second cast prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)] - 0.923*(number of missed AAs)*(AA damage) - 0.923(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(shred damage) - 0.923(number of AAs prior to Shred)*(3.5/60)*(average amount of CPs per ability)*(damage output of 1 CP)

---

Attack speed = 1/ (("Percent increase or decrease" / 100) + 1) /((current haste rating/2521)+1)

Arp affects our AAs, Shreds, FBs, and Mangles. This is what I use to determine the "damage applied" multiplier.
Armour = 8088.68
Arp cap = 7773.73

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Basasjoblu

EffectiveArmor = Armor – ArP rating / 1399.6 *Arp cap
DR% = EffectiveArmor / (EffectiveArmor + 15232.5)
DA% = 1 – DR%

---

---

Additional information if you want to take into consideration the buffs in a 25-man raid environment:
-> 10% AP increase (MM's aura)
-> 10% Str/Agility increase (BoK)
-> 687 AP (Improved BoM; I haven't included our talents or MM's aura)
-> 155 Str + 155 Agil (DK horn; I haven't included our talents, BoK, or MM's aura)
-> 55 Str + 55 Agil (our improved druid buff + talents; I haven't included BoK or MM's aura, though)
-> 180 AP (flask; I haven't included our talents or MM's aura)
-> 400 AP (Berserking; I haven't included our talents or MM's aura)
-> 220 Agility (Idol; I haven't included our talents or other modifiers)
-> 40 arp/40 agil/40 str (food; I haven't included our talents or MM's aura)
-> 4% damage increase (CRogues) to our abilities
-> 3% damage increase (Ret Paladins) to our abilities
-> 40% damage increase for 30 seconds (Hysteria) to our abilities
-> 20% melee haste (Blood DKs)
-> 3% melee haste (Boomies)
-> 30% melee haste for 40secs (Bloodlust)
-> 500 haste rating (speed pot)

19. SOURCES

Spoiler: Show

Talents:
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=24894
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=17051
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=33856
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=17073
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=16862
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=16999
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=33867
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=51269
https://wowwiki-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Omen_of_Clarity NO ICD for the CCs
http://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=349912 OoC being fixed in warmane
https://www.warmane.com/changelog?expansion=2&id=78

Calculating the damage of feral cat's abilities:
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=48574 Rake
https://wotlk.evowow.com/?spell=49800 Rip
https://wotlk.evowow.com/?spell=48577 FB
https://wotlk.evowow.com/?spell=48566 Mangle
https://wotlk.evowow.com/spell=48572 Shred
https://wotlk.evowow.com/?spell=62078 Swipe

Calculating the damage of the AAs:
https://www.wowhead.com/forums/topic/142010
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Feral_attack_power

Calculating the "damage appplied" effect from our current armour penetration:
http://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=298787

Haste rating/Attack speed:
https://wowwiki-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Attack_speed
https://wowwiki-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Haste

How stats work:
https://web.archive.org/web/20150103...dps-discussion
http://wowthinktank.blogspot.com/200...n-cap.html?m=1
http://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=332641

Procs per minute:
https://wowwiki-archive.fandom.com/w...ocs_per_minute

Dealing with latency:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgDjG_0ecTI (timestamp: 3:08)

"A civilian"'s analysis of the GotVV-shift (w/o the /stopattack command):
https://web.archive.org/web/20110101...8/#post1736622

Origin of the original pics:
https://fineartamerica.com/featured/...t-designs.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rrPP-QOF3k

20. CHANGELOG

Spoiler: Show

24/08/2021
*Major changes to the ninth post.
-> added a table of contents;
-> added spoilers;
-> added a paragraph explaining why it's not an exploit;
-> added videos showcasing the macro on a dummy;
-> added a list of pros and cons;
-> added a list of macros;
-> added a list of addons, which are suited for the playstyle;
-> added a list of used formulas to calculate the damage and stats;
-> added a list of sources, where I got my information;
-> added a list of people/sites, which helped me improve this theorycraft;
-> updated the "tips and tricks" section;
-> added the formula for FB timing when Rip & SR are about to expire;
-> added "changelog";
* Added more info and videos in my fourth post.
* Did some minor edits, in order to improve the readability of some posts.

25/08/2021
*Updated posts N.1, 4, 7, and 8.
-> deleted unnecessary information
-> added some explanation regarding my past statements
-> corrected some spelling mistakes
*Added a post regarding the attack speed multipliers

26/08/2021
*Corrected some spelling mistakes in my older posts
*Added 'FAQ' and 'Trivia' sections in this post.

28/08/2021
*Updated the talent build.
*Corrected some minor typos here.
*Deleted two posts (I already included the information in the relevant posts).
*Deleted the original "Attack speed multipliers" post, and I copy-pasted its contents on a placeholder on the first page. That way, you can all find the relevant information in one place.
*Updated the "Site Navigation" by adding a link to the aforementioned topic.
*Created a table for "Attack Speed Modifiers".
*Added a section "Sacrificing DoT ticks in favour of Shreds".
*Updated the "Table of Contents".

29/08/2021
*Did some minor tweaks to the OP in terms of lexic and structure.
*Deleted the first paragraph of my second post, since it didn't contain valuable information.
*Added more information to the second post.
*Added titles and subtitles to each relevant post.
*Updated the "Thread Navigation" corresponding to the new titles.
*Added numbers to the subtitles in the "Summary".

30/08/2021
*Added the Morpheus-speech pic in the OP.
*Created a new post, where I used a more accurate formula to calculate the average damage of the GotVV-shift (i.e. the name of the post is "More accurate calculations").

31/08/2021
*Updated the "What's the value of a combo point?" section in my fourth post.
*Updated the "Attack Speed Modifiers" section in the "Summary".
*Finished my calculations regarding the attack speed modifiers in the next page.

01/09/2021
*Updated the "Sacrificing DoT ticks in favour of Shreds" section in the "Summary".
*Replaced all "W"s with "VV"s to reference the time when my keyboard was malfunctioning.
*Did the same treatment to the Matrix pic.
*Corrected some small typos in the OP and in the second.

02/09/2021
*Updated the "Vital presence of the /stopattack command" post.
*Added Aldtharios' reply in the "Summary".
*Updated the "tips", "attack speed modifiers", and "sacrificing dot ticks" subsections in the "Summary".

03/09/2021
*Addressed the 4.8% crit suppression in my "The vital presence of the /stopattack command" post.
*Corrected the table concerning "TimeToDie" in the aforementioned post.
*Calculated the value of a CP properly and updated my "The vital presence of the /stopattack command" post with that info.
*Updated the "5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or FB?" section in the "FBs & CCs" post.
*Deleted the "wall of text" on the second page, because I added the relevant information in the old posts.
*Updated the "Timing FB" subsection in the "Summary".
*Added the "5CPs & CCs. Should we use Shred or FB?" subsection in the "Summary".

05/09/2021
*Corrected some typos in the old posts.
*Did some minor tweaks to the old posts, in order to improve their readability.
*Replaced "status quo" with "established norms" in the OP pic.
*Changed the title of my videos, because they contradicted the results from framebyframe, and I wanted to minimise the confusion.
*Added "Food for thought" in the "Summary".
*Reordered the different subsections in the "Summary".

06/09/2021
*Updated the "Sources" subsection in the "Summary".
*Changed the name of the thread (originally "Feral Cat's gameplay and the importance of the Omen of Clarity procs"). Honestly, I did it because I considered that the original title didn't reflect the ongoing topic anymore. Hopefully, ppl didn't consider it as a cheap attempt for a clickbait.

07/09/2021
*Corrected some grammatical mistakes in my previous posts.
*Updated the "Sources" subsection in the "Summary".
*Updated the "Not an exploit" subsection in the "Summary".
*Swapped the position of "FAQ" and "Trivia" in the "Summary".
*Updated the "Practice makes better" subsection in the "Summary".

11/09/2021
*Corrected the modified formulas in the "Vital presence of the /stopattack command" post by adding the 0.814 multiplier to the penalties from the first GotVV cast.
*Corrected the calculations, were based on those.
*Corrected the "Attack speed modifiers" and "Sacrificing DoT ticks" tables in their respective sections and subsections.
*Corrected the tables in the "5CPs and CC. Shred vs FB/Rip" subsection.
*Corrected the information in "FB/Rip and CCs" post.
*Deleted the post on the second page, in order to copy/paste the information in the old posts.
*Did some small tweaks to the old posts.
*Added the "Switching idols during Naxx & Uld (only for dedicated minmaxers)" subsection in the "Summary".

22/09/2021
*Corrected some minor typos and grammatical mistakes in the old posts.
*Added the post "Predator's Swiftness - another reliable way to force CCs?".
*Updated the OP.
-> added "Predator's Swiftness" in the thread navigation;
-> acknowledged more players, who have helped the thread grow;
-> added the correct values of the GCD.
*Updated the "Credit where credit's due" subcategory in the "Summary".
*Corrected the GCD values in the "Vital presence of the /stopattack command" post.
*Corrected the GCD values in the "Predator's Swiftness - another reliable way to force CCs?" post.
*Corrected the GCD values in the "FB/Rip & CCs" post.
*Updated the "Timing FBs" subsection in the "Summary".

27/02/2022
*Corrected the "A small mistake" post on the second page;
*Corrected some values in the "Attack Speed Modifiers" post in the first page;
*Corrected the table in the "Attack Speed Modifiers" subsection in the "Summary".
*Posted "Swiping as cat" on the second page.

28/02/2022
*Corrected some values in my "Swiping as cat" post.
*Added that section in the table of contents in the OP.
*Updated the "Summary".

01/03/2022 ??????? ???? ?????!
*Renamed "Switching idols in Naxx and Uld (only for dedicated minmaxers)" category in the "Summary" to "Extras - super niche tips for concerned minmaxers".
*In the aforementioned category, I included a paragraph for Predator's Swiftness as a somewhat reliable source of CCs. I also included a paragraph for feral cat's running speed.
*Updated the texts on some older posts.
*Deleted a post called "VVhat's new and future plans" because its contents seemed redundant. That said, in that post stood my paragraph for Idol switching, which I copy-pasted in "Extras" (i.e. the previous post).

02/03/2022
*"Swiping as cat" - I put the results in actual tables for better readibility, and I added more conclusions based on the presence of CCs. As a result, I had to edit the "TLDR" paragraph.
*Integrated that post in the "Summary" with a new table.

03/03/2022 ?????? 3-?? ????, ????? ???????????!
*Updated the "Summary".
-> corrected some grammar mistakes;
-> explained some statements better;
-> made some stylistic choices.

04/03/2022
*Replaced the "{" with "(" in some of my formulas for consistency's sake.
*Updated the "Vital presence of the /stopattack command" thread.
-> moved the final formula in the "Climax of the fight" section for more consistency;
-> corrected some minor, insignificant inaccuracies from the quote text box, where I explained the addition of the bonus CP damage.
*Updated the "Summary".
-> moved "Timing FB when the boss is about to die" from "Timing FB" to "Extras" because imho the information there isn't vital for regular players, and it could just overwhelm them instead.
*Did some minor stylistic changes to the other posts (replaced some upper case letters with their respective lower case ones).
*Did some minor changes to the "FB/Rip & CCs" post for better readiblity.
-> changed the border;
-> put the explanation of the "Timing FB" equation in a spoiler;
-> removed some colours, punctuation marks, and redundant texts;
-> coloured the bolded numbers in the first part.

05/03/2022
*Updated the "Sacrificing DoT ticks in favour of CCs" post.
-> cut the excessive amount of text and centered the post around the 3.3.5 environment;
-> took into consideration the updated results from the "Attack Speed Modifiers" post and modified the table based on them.
*Updated the "Sacrificing DoT ticks in favour of Shreds" tables in the "Summary".
*Corrected some minor typos in the other posts.
*Added the post "VVould a 4CP FB be part of feral cat's gameplay?".
*Removed all "cavernoftime" links from my posts.
*Small edit to "Swiping as cat".
-> deleted some empty spaces;
-> deleted the coloured text because imho people have probably noticed the additions by now.

10/03/2022
*Updated the post "VVould a 4CP FB be part of feral cat's gameplay?".

20/03/2022
*I realised that I've made a mistake with "a civilian's" equation, and that the thing I corrected (namely {3.5/60*number of AAs*Shred} was actually correct all along. Up until today, I saw the substraction of the Shred damage coming from the first swing as an additional loss, and that's why I had disagreed with "a civilian". In truth, it's essential to be included as it is because it shows how the CC from the AA would completely nullify the bonus CC from the GotVV-shift, leaving us with the pure loss of AA damage. For that reason, I'm correcting that formula, my numbers, and my tables everywhere:
-> in the post "The vital presence of the /stopattack command";
-> in the post "Attack speed modifiers";
-> in the post "Sacrificing DoT ticks in favour of CCs;
-> in the summary;
-> in the post "Predator's Swiftness - another reliable way to force CCs?".

03/04/2022
*I realised that up until today I've calculated the average damage of all abilities incorrectly. I treated the 104.8% crit cap as if it calculated the actual "attack table", where the probability for a crit was a fraction from that number. However, this is false and it's not how the crit suppression works. The 4.8% crit suppression is just a subtraction from our current crit. VVhile the 104.8% hard crit cap shows that the 4.8% can be pushed over the table with enough crit, the subtraction is still there. Here's a list of the updates:
-> created the temporary post "VVhich part is wrong?";
-> corrected all numbers in the "The vital presence of the /stopattack command" post;
-> corrected all numbers in the "Attack speed modifiers" post;
-> corrected all numbers in the "Sacrificing DoTs in favour of CCs" post;
-> corrected all numbers in the "Predator's Swiftness - another reliable way to force CCs?" post + deleted a bit of unnecessay text;
-> corrected all numbers in the "VVould a 4CP FB be part of feral cat's gameplay?" post; + added more comments;
-> deleted the "VVould a 4CP FB be part of feral cat's gameplay?" post because the information there wasn't important enough;
-> added the information from the aforementioned post in the "extras" subcategory of the summary;
-> other minor tweaks to the summary.

12/04/2022
*Added the post "Agility vs Strength vs Haste. VVhich archtype would be most suitable for the GotVV-shift?"
*Added a link for it in the "Thread Navigation" part in the OP.
*Added the section "Archtype choices" in the summary.

13/04/2022
*Updated the "Agility vs Strength vs Haste. VVhich archtype would be most suitable for the GotVV-shift?" post, where I clarified that Agility can't beat Strength under normal circumstances.
*Updated the "Archtype choices" in the summary with that information.

14/04/2022
*Added one more post, where I described the Rampage-Leader of the Pack interaction.
*Updated the "Pros and Cons" section in the summary.
*Added one more post.
*Updated the "Pros and Cons" section in the summary.

08/05/2022
I don't know how many people would actually read this comment here. A few days ago, I realised that I was able to install Obs Studio after switching to VVindows 10 and record myself. Yes, it's a bit late after learning about the Rampage-delay thing, but my thread desperately needed a showcase. I didn't want to leave the thread unfinished, and that's why I decided to make a sneaky update.
*Added a video of me beating DBS nm in the "Demonstration" section of the summary.
*Updated the formula for FB in the summary.
*Updated the "Macros" section in the summary.
*Added more important Q&As in the "FAQ" section in the summary.

13/05/2022
*Added one more post as a follow-up, describing that on certain occasions the delay is somehow absent.
*Added a second video with commentary to the summary.

19/05/2022
After realising that nothing can be done about the delay, I updated the following posts:
- the OP;
- the summary;
- Grave news;
- Follow-up.

07/07/2022
- Did some minor tweaks to the old posts:
*corrected typos;
*coloured some sections;
*changed the "Update" text in the OP;
*renamed the post "Grave News" to "Something about the 5% melee crit".

07/07/2022
- Updated the "thread navigation" part in the OP.
- Created a "follow-up" post for FB's energy management.

23/08/2022 - 26/08/2022
- Updated the information in the fourth post concerning the presence of the /stopattack command by addressing the formula in the github bug report and the response from warmane's staff.
- Corrected the false information in the post concerning Predatory Swiftness stating that OoC needs successful spell casts in order to proc.
- Corrected the formulas for the cat abilities revolving around the paw damage (54.8 instead of 55).
- Corrected some typos or minor grammar mistakes in other posts.

31/08/2022
- Corrected the formulas concerning the proc chance for GotVV in a 25-man raid in posts "/stopattack vital", "attack speed modifiers", and "predatory swiftness" just for consistency's sake.
- Deleted the last two paragraphs in the "4-CP FB" post, in order to show it in a more positive light.
- Updated the formulas concerning the GotVV-shift in the "Summary".
- Corrected minor spelling mistakes in other posts.

01/09/2022
- Clarified that casting VVrath with PS should be accompanied with /stopattack in the "Predatory Swiftness" post, as otherwise the player will sit through a longer AA CD.
- Added a link in the "FB" and "agility vs haste vs strength" post to their follow-ups.
- Deleted the paragraph in "sth about the 5% melee crit", which talked about alternative raid comps.
- Corrected some grammar mistakes in other posts.

03/09/2022
- Halesk70 wanted me to refer to him as Nap (his discord avatar) from now on. I also changed his WAs links to the wago site.

04/09/2022
- Added the post "Personal analysis of bearweaving".

07/09/2022 (post-retirement edits)
- Updated the post "Personal analysis of bearweaving" (overall conclusions remain the same):
*corrected some calculations;
*added a bit more text clarifying why Lacerate is bad
*corrected some grammar mistakes;
*added horizontal lines.
- Added that post in the table of contents in the OP.
- Added "outdated" tags in the "Summary" for the categories with old information.
- Updated the information regarding PS and idol switching in the "Summary".
- 2022 and not 2028 in the post "PS Another reliable way to force CCs?".

10/09/2022 (post-retirement edits)
- Added a few more calculations in the post "attack speed modifiers".
- Changed the tables concerning "attack speed modifiers" and "sacrificing DoT ticks" in the summary, in order to make it easier to understand.

17/09/2022 (post-retirement edits)
- Updated the "bearweaving" post. Initially, I only intended to correct some typos and grammar mistakes, but after rereading my text, I spotted a flaw in my Maul vs Lacerate analysis. I realised that it wasn't entirely correct because I had included the AA damage in the Maul value, making the latter way superior than what it actually is. Still, my conclusions remain relatively the same. I added more calculations for the GotVV-shifter vs bearweaver scenario, where Enrage is on CD.

20/09/2022 (post-retirement edits)
- Updated the "bearweaving" post:
*added two more videos;
*added few more calculations;
*deleted redundant text.

21/09/2022 (post-retirement edits)
- Updated the "bearweaving" post:
*added more videos;
*explained why the bear cycle needs to be Maul-Mangle-Maul;
*corrected the calculations for bears going back to cat when obtaining a CC proc. The previous multiplier was 3.33(3) due to the roughly estimated 3-second duration. I considered that I should have used the bear AA swing timer, which is 2.25 seconds. The conclusions remain the same.

23/09/2022 (post-retirement edits)
- Updated the "bearweaving" post:
*added a better explanation for spending your rage on yellow abilities;
*structured some parts a bit better.

Thank you all for reading! Have fun trying it out ... and never forget:

https://i.imgur.com/lBmWi50.png

Hello, thank you for all of this theory-crafting, I won't add any useful information since I think you covered every topic on an impressive depth.

This topic gave me lots of ideas on how to improve my weak aura suite which could help optimize the rotation/GotW usage in two ways :
- see when the bleed ticks happens so it's possible to optimize the DoT clipping
- see how "buffed" is a bleed on this model

So I would like to have some information regarding this :

Quote:

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Like many of you already know, it just takes to snapshot the DoTs with our buffs, so that they could be enhanced throughout their entire duration regardless if we keep the buff or not.

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Can you help me understand which buffs can be snapshoted ?
I know it's all buffs that increase your damage in %, and your current critical strike chance. But after testing it seems that all buffs that increase the AP can be snapshoted, is this correct?