WotLK Is it Allowed to roll OffSpec if the player do not even have dual talent

[Iphone6]

The title says it all,

In Dungs, yea it may be a pass / allowed if everyone agrees. as its just dungeon.

But in raids like 25m while RL giving loot, player A ms dps without dual talent rolling for (OffSpec tank) against those player B,C with dual talent / tank geared gem enchanted os helping the raid.

Everyone checked player A armory but he do not have dual talent but he won the roll for os gear and got the loot from RL.

what are your thoughts?

Is this consider ninja? or still consider as close one's eyes?

Checked the link and googled but no topics like this before

http://forum.warmane.com/showthread....=1#post2651922

Hope to hear from everyone.

Just needed proof and answers for this and move on.

[Thorbjorn]

I don't see why it should be bannable. If he's rolling for OS in raids he's clearly not doing it for the 7g vendor price. Could be that he just doesn't have enough OS gear to actually play it and make it, so he's farming items for it first.

[Keymouse8800]

This are raid leader's rules if he allows MS change its allowed.

[Mitzen]

He was allowed to roll as MS tank from the beginning. Not allowing him do that all of a sudden would be considered rule changing in middle of raid (Ninja looting).

What Thornbjorn said is entirely possible.

It's also possible he was rolling for somebody else, but if you can't clearly provide evidence to back it up, it's almost pointless to even make a ticket.

Reporting Players [Updated: May 22, 2020]

[shhnedo]

If you don't like people rolling on their (possibly non-existent) offspec, don't stay in raids where ms changing is allowed. That's why ms changes are(usually) stated at the start, before anyone gets any sort of instance ID and is locked to said instance - so you can make a choice - do you like being a tank and rolling against 7 ms changers or no?
In a case where ms changes are allowed after killing a boss and people are locked to the instance, imho, it should be considered mid-raid rule changing and possibly even ninjalooting - anyone can change their ms and roll for someone and people have no choice but to stay in the instance and take higher risk than advertised or leave and waste their id for the week.

[Iphone6]

I don't see why it should be bannable. If he's rolling for OS in raids he's clearly not doing it for the 7g vendor price. Could be that he just doesn't have enough OS gear to actually play it and make it, so he's farming items for it first.

He is a dps war ms roll dps (without dual talent as we checked his armory online) and roll off spec tank.
Yes he may be farming items but does prio goes to those who are 3rd tank (os tank formally dps) in raid or a non dual talent

This are raid leader's rules if he allows MS change its allowed.

Nah, he still roll for his dps as ms. Just he did not contribute tank and do not even have a dual talent and got the tank loot as he won off spec roll.
The RL ask me to find proof to let a [B]non dual talent roll os is part of the rules/B] thats why i'm here.

He was allowed to roll as MS tank from the beginning. Not allowing him do that all of a sudden would be considered rule changing in middle of raid (Ninja looting).

What Thornbjorn said is entirely possible.

It's also possible he was rolling for somebody else, but if you can't clearly provide evidence to back it up, it's almost pointless to even make a ticket.

Reporting Players [Updated: May 22, 2020]

He is dps war and been rolling ms on dps gears. but as os roll, he won tank gear without having dual talent. I'm the victim which is the 3rd tank tanking in the raid (formally a dps in raid). At least if he shows his other tank gears and tank spec in dual talent i'll pass.

If you don't like people rolling on their (possibly non-existent) offspec, don't stay in raids where ms changing is allowed. That's why ms changes are(usually) stated at the start, before anyone gets any sort of instance ID and is locked to said instance - so you can make a choice - do you like being a tank and rolling against 7 ms changers or no?
In a case where ms changes are allowed after killing a boss and people are locked to the instance, imho, it should be considered mid-raid rule changing and possibly even ninjalooting - anyone can change their ms and roll for someone and people have no choice but to stay in the instance and take higher risk than advertised or leave and waste their id for the week.

Yes I know the rules if they change ms roll at the start. this is a pug raid so who is in fault here.
He won 3 tanking gears without dual talent (and only me and him rolling and i'm 3rd tanking formal a dps in raid)
The RL (masterloot) or the player A rolling os (without dual talent)


Sorry if my topic is misleading.

Meanwhile, The other question is, if the RL (masterloot) gave the gear to the wrong person who didnt win the roll and the player left the raid / offline straight away / ignored everyone, who is in fault here

:)

Thank you for your thoughts.

Hope it helped other victims for these 2 questions and how we overcome them

[shhnedo]

All you're doing right now is complaining that someone rolled offspec tank without having dual talents. Next thing you'll complain when someone rolls Greed instead of Disenchant while having Enchanter in the group. In other words you are being jelly for literally no good reason. You got outrolled. Big deal. The guy has no second talents - big deal. You have your own idea about loot distribution - host your own raid. That's what I do when I can't be asked to deal with some random guy's inability to raid lead(no, I'm not 200 LoD per week raid leader, I'm just capable of leading a simple 8/12hc for example).

[Mitzen]

He is dps war and been rolling ms on dps gears. but as os roll, he won tank gear without having dual talent. I'm the victim which is the 3rd tank tanking in the raid (formally a dps in raid). At least if he shows his other tank gears and tank spec in dual talent i'll pass.

Imo OS rolls are more free. You either need it for off-spec, or for MS (219 head vs 264 spirit crit ["healer item"] for Shadow Priest is still big difference). Or he has been gearing OS, but haven't bought dual spec yet. Imo too much detective work over OS roll.

Meanwhile, The other question is, if the RL (masterloot) gave the gear to the wrong person who didnt win the roll and the player left the raid / offline straight away / ignored everyone, who is in fault here

Master looter. It's master looted's job to make sure the gear goes to right player. What other player did was ****ty, but he has no obligation to trade the item to right winner.

[Keymouse8800]

So wait you are asking if he can roll OS even thou not having any OS, yes he can.
The Raid Leader can get loot banned for the mistake of giving an item to the wrong guy even by mistake, even picture evidence is sent with rolls and wrong loot receiver its enough.

[Thorbjorn]

He is a dps war ms roll dps (without dual talent as we checked his armory online) and roll off spec tank.
Yes he may be farming items but does prio goes to those who are 3rd tank (os tank formally dps) in raid or a non dual talent

I don't see a reason why there would be a priority list. You both have a MS and OS. It doesn't matter if you tanked a mini at some point or adds or whatever and another person didn't. A spec is a spec, your contribution to the raid doesn't matter in this case. If an OS roll comes up, everyone has equal right to roll for it if that's his OS.

Meanwhile, The other question is, if the RL (masterloot) gave the gear to the wrong person who didnt win the roll and the player left the raid / offline straight away / ignored everyone, who is in fault here

Raid leader's fault for giving the loot to the wrong person. Matters not if it's an accident or not, distributing loot is his job therefore if he distributes it wrongly whether on purpose or not it's ninja looting nonetheless. You may ask a GM in-game through a ticket to double check, it's possible he may have them both banned though.

[Kiillswiitch]

He is a dps war ms roll dps (without dual talent as we checked his armory online) and roll off spec tank.
Yes he may be farming items but does prio goes to those who are 3rd tank (os tank formally dps) in raid or a non dual talent

Well talents dont always mean that he doesnt actually have that spec. There are 3 different talent trees and only 1 off spec. As a paladin, I use addons to save between my Ret PVE, PVP and Tank spec. Just because it's not currently in his talents on armory doesnt really mean anything. Some people may have their PVP offspec at the momment. I do MS Ret PVE and switch my offspec from tank/PVP ret with my talents saved on an addon. Just because they may currently have their offspec as something different in that very moment in time during that specific raid, doesn't mean they don't have that spec at all or perhaps they just don't have the full set for it yet. So they are building it. Honestly armory checking isn't really a reliable way to see if someone is truly using that as their offspec. PVP and PVE specs are in most cases different builds for survivability over pure damage hence require a different talent setup so it will require you to sacrifice a spec to use it even if for just a short time. Perhaps they like to tank and dps PVE, sometimes they like to raid PVE and PVP. Doesn't mean they wouldn't have a tank off spec. If it is a offspec roll, all who roll for offspec for that get to roll. It's only fair. Everyone is there doing a job. unless specifically stated otherwise while the recruitment posts go out on global or where ever. You can't give someone special treatment just because you favor them more, not in a PUG atleast. It's just not fair to everyone else who wanted that gear and invested the time to actually do the raid. I've lost out on pieces I really need several times in a row to people less deserving and less geared countless times. It is literally part of the game.