Cataclysm [Guide] Frost PvP

[Davelan]

Blood dk's have some stupid damage atm. Their death strikes do 30k crits on my 3.8k resil fdk. Ofcourse it's not normal, i'm sure there is some sort of bug to it.

However this doesn't mean you'll lose against blood dk's, the trick is to save your burst till the enemy used his ams/ice bound(blood is immortal in icebound cuz of talents)/vampiric blood. Now the problem is that blood dk's have their rune tap proc on 35% health so what you gonna do is:

-First start kiting with chains of ice
-Second if he reaches you make sure you necrotic strike and run again
-Third make him drop to 70%, and pop Pillar and start bursting.
-99% he'll pop defensives such as ams or ice bound
-Keep doing this while shaving in some death strikes
-Do not use lich borne until you drop to 30% health
-After he used both of his abilities ams and icebound you have to start getting into close fight and stack necrotic strike.
-He'll use Vampiric blood here, for 99%.
-The vampiric blood heal will be negated by your necrotic strike however he will get a full rune tap heal twice.
-He'll be back at 60% wait till VB wears off and start bursting with everything you have. Thus he will only be able to use 1 rune tap which will completely be absorbed by necrotic strike together with his death strike heals. Since your burst delivers a very high necrotic absorb.
-Now it's his turn to put ams and lich what you gonna do here is chain him off before he's gonna go 20% put hungering cold from a fair distance. And since 99% of the blood dk's in molten such they'll panic and just trinket --> full strang death.

Ofcourse I can't make this completely right because it's all situational like he can grip you on hungering cold, or he can get lucky crits and destroy you vice versa. You can get **** tons of procs and destroy his ***.

Bleh the stupid bug abt BDK is that he can turn ALLL of his runes to death runes. Idk what kinda bug that is but still. Ive been winning them by just kiting, Howling, deathcoil spam. when griped, necrotic and chain and run again.

@Jyx: Been wating to ask, Why improved frost presence? .-. We'll be in UH most the time and Blood when dealing with rogues but. Why improved frost?

[Kemii]

@Jyx: Been wating to ask, Why improved frost presence? .-. We'll be in UH most the time and Blood when dealing with rogues but. Why improved frost?

Improved frost for 8% extra Runic Regen. More Runic = More Frost Strike = More Rune Refunds (Runic Empowerment) = More Howling/Necro.

[Blazemourne]

why do you not put dw spec ? is it a bad Idea to use dw in arenas and BG ?

[Youseewhyx]

why do you not put dw spec ? is it a bad Idea to use dw in arenas and BG ?

DW is pretty good however in high end pvp you'll find yourself changing back into 2h.

DW frost= one hot everything
2H= Sustained damage

Dw is fun and provides more burst which will do very good when you are playing ret/dk in 2s and ret/dk/rogue or TSG in 3s. However all the other comps are superior to these and those are played with 2h frost or unholy.

[Blazemourne]

DW is pretty good however in high end pvp you'll find yourself changing back into 2h.

DW frost= one hot everything
2H= Sustained damage

Dw is fun and provides more burst which will do very good when you are playing ret/dk in 2s and ret/dk/rogue or TSG in 3s. However all the other comps are superior to these and those are played with 2h frost or unholy.

really but say I have Soul drinker form Dragon soul can I go DW then ? I mean I love DW and I heard ppl in retail went DW after getting that

as for rotation I am still having probs getting used to the new ones
OB>NC>HB>FS
is this correct ?

[Kemii]

why do you not put dw spec ? is it a bad Idea to use dw in arenas and BG ?

Don't get me wrong DW is great and I own a DW offspec, but the higher you get the more you need the control 2h brings, rather than the burst that DW does.

I presonally don't be taking DW seriously till I have dual Soul-Drinkers and Bone Link.

Even then I'm more likely have Gurth and still be 2h.

[Youseewhyx]

really but say I have Soul drinker form Dragon soul can I go DW then ? I mean I love DW and I heard ppl in retail went DW after getting that

as for rotation I am still having probs getting used to the new ones
OB>NC>HB>FS
is this correct ?

Yeah that weapon is some good **** indeed, however in 4.3 dw will still lack that pressure.

As for rotation, as a dw you'll completely ditch the use of obliterate. It's usefull sometimes but still not good enough to use 3 talent points a prime glyph for it. You rotation is more like: hb/Ns>fs

[Youseewhyx]

Don't get me wrong DW is great and I own a DW offspec, but the higher you get the more you need the control 2h brings, rather than the burst that DW does.

I presonally don't be taking DW seriously till I have dual Soul-Drinkers and Bone Link.

Even then I'm more likely have Gurth and still be 2h.

Gurth is bad for frost, it's good for unholy though.

Maybe whenever we get soul drinkers we might consider going dw since it adds a huge amount of survivability.

The main problem is that as a frost dk you cannot wear a pve wep+a pve trinket. You'll lack resilence. So you have to choose between wep or trinket.

[Kemii]

Gurth is bad for frost, it's good for unholy though.

Maybe whenever we get soul drinkers we might consider going dw since it adds a huge amount of survivability.

The main problem is that as a frost dk you cannot wear a pve wep+a pve trinket. You'll lack resilence. So you have to choose between wep or trinket.

See I was gonna get http://www.wowhead.com/item=77990 I know its a tank trinkets, but the stupid amounts of stamina, and on proc mastery.

Or maybe even http://www.wowhead.com/item=68981 For the passive mastery and the "Sacred Shield" proc when your low life.

[Youseewhyx]

Tank trinkets won't save you, i mean why do you think 99% of the pvp'ers go full resil gear. That's because having low resil but high stamina/or a shield makes you vulnerable against burst classes. In the end that 20k absorb won't make such a difference if you take more damage.

If you take gurth you can't use another pve item(maybe as unholy you can).
If you take double soul drinker, you can't take another pve item.

The best way is to use gurth for unholy and one pve trinket for 2h frost. While wearing 2 soul drinkers for DW Frost.

[Blazemourne]

so does the gemming remain the same ? what CD do you guys suggest I mean I am changing my keybinds for the first time so I need some help here so far I use Horn of winter, strangulate and outbreak
as for dw does it get better in MOP ?

[Grymninja]

Erm... Mr. Toshika, I would say that you are wrong with something... I wouldn't drop Obliterate from bars, because with Obliterate I can pull great dmg on cloth when KM procs. Made like 25k dmg on cloth and I was not even on PoF.

Oh, and one tiny detail: I managed to do 25k dmg on cloth on KM proc, being DW :D... so, I totally disagree with you, Obliterate still has its place.

So, your guide is non-accurate, it may be good in theory, but its unaddapted to Molten :D

HER guide is completely oriented TOWARDS Molten...

[Youseewhyx]

Erm... Mr. Toshika, I would say that you are wrong with something... I wouldn't drop Obliterate from bars, because with Obliterate I can pull great dmg on cloth when KM procs. Made like 25k dmg on cloth and I was not even on PoF.

Oh, and one tiny detail: I managed to do 25k dmg on cloth on KM proc, being DW :D... so, I totally disagree with you, Obliterate still has its place.

So, your guide is non-accurate, it may be good in theory, but its unaddapted to Molten :D

The thing is frost strike still does 20k+ on cloth targets without cd's. So the difference is only 5k which is useless when you find out that obliterate uses 2 runes and frost strike only rp. Now if you add howling blast +necrotic strike you gonna do more pressure+more damage.

Obliterate:
2runes>25k+20rp

frost strike:
34rp>20k+ 2 runes(HB+Ns)>20k+8k+5k>33k-34rp+30rp>33k-4rp +45% chance for a fully depleted rune

Maths bro

[Kemii]

Erm... Mr. Toshika, I would say that you are wrong with something... I wouldn't drop Obliterate from bars, because with Obliterate I can pull great dmg on cloth when KM procs. Made like 25k dmg on cloth and I was not even on PoF.

Oh, and one tiny detail: I managed to do 25k dmg on cloth on KM proc, being DW :D... so, I totally disagree with you, Obliterate still has its place.

So, your guide is non-accurate, it may be good in theory, but its unaddapted to Molten :D

Im a girl...

And this guide is for molten, I never played DK on retail. This is based purly on what I have experienced here on molten.

This is for 2h Mastery... not for your DW, you want to write a DW guide go ahead, have you even tried my spec, before you came all high and mighty? Proberbly not.

I see Cerionn showed you the reason why the spec is superior, and why I'm right.

I come bearing Screenshots.

On a HC Training Dummy.

FS Spec:

Spoiler: Show

Oblit spec

Spoiler: Show

On a T2 Vicious Spriest 3.8k Resil.

Frost Strike

Spoiler: Show

Oblit Spec

Spoiler: Show

Oblit = Not worth it.

[Kemii]

And I am saying just that Oblit is still good for CLOTHERS and ONLY CLOTHERS. :) AND ONLY ON KM PROC! Otherwise of course... Frost strike spam

So your gonna waste 3 talent points, and a glyph in the CHANCE that you come across a clothy and ONLY then when it is on KM proc..... #****logic

My spec and glyphs allow for sustained damage no matter what class. Works especcially well agaisnt things like Pala/Resto Druid/Warriors/Shamans etc...