That worked out real well for this vanilla private server I know of that shall remain nameless. They tried to do the same thing, didn't go over very well with the community. Lets ban everything until all you have to do to win pvp is push buttons, oh wait....
-
Member
-
Member
Without the software I cannot be pressing the other characers, quite a big point to just dismmiss.
Can you give me an example of other third party software ?
Saying Itunes (or something compareable, fraps, browser, operating system, calculator) does not really count, see because this kind of third party software does its thing (play music for example) but while doing that , it does not interact with your wow client in any way.
-
Member
But using the multiboxing software to press the other characters keys does not make it botting, which you implied multiple times. You may think that it's not fair and "quite a big point" but no rules are being broken by multiboxing.
3rd Party software can be anything, Windows, virus scanners, rootkit scanners, auto key/mouse pressers and anti malware programs are examples.
According to Wikipedia: "In computer programming, a third-party software component is a reusable software component developed to be either freely distributed or sold by an entity other than the original vendor of the development platform."
According to ISBoxer:
"But I've heard that "Third Party Software is not allowed!"
First of all, that is wrong regardless of the game being discussed. It's impossible to play any PC game without using any "third party software". The game itself relies on third party software, such as Windows and DirectX. It is a common misunderstanding of the terms set forth in a game's EULA/ToS/ToU. "Third Party" does not imply that you are doing anything wrong. All it means is that the software does not come from the First or Second parties, which are the game publisher (e.g. Blizzard) and you. In our case, I am the Third Party. Both Blizzard and Sony Online Entertainment have either explicitly or implicitly allowed software that I provide: WinEQ 2 and EQPlayNice have been staples of EverQuest multiboxing for several years, and Woody from GUComics got an answer long ago, directly from John Smedley, saying that they would not ban for using EQPlayNice; A few years ago, Blizzard inadvertently banned WinEQ 2 users, but then reverted those bans and gave the players 2 days on their subscription time to make up for the mistake (similar to what happened when Blizzard inadvertently banned Linux players). Clearly, "Third Party Software" is allowed, as long as it abides by the rules set forth in the EULA/ToS/ToU.
There are other types of software that are also allowed. Some other common examples include video recording software (e.g. FRAPS), voice chat software (e.g. Ventrilo), even in-game instant messaging software (e.g. X-Fire, though note that if you try to use X-Fire in-game features with ISBoxer you may experience a performance hit).
So, what types of software are NOT allowed?
Let's take from World of Warcraft's Terms of Use (other games generally use similar language), which says in relevant part that you may not...
2(a) use cheats, automation software (bots), hacks, mods or any other unauthorized third-party software designed to modify the World of Warcraft experience;
2(c) use any unauthorized third-party software that intercepts, "mines", or otherwise collects information from or through the Game or the Service, including without limitation any software that reads areas of RAM used by the Game to store information about a character or the game environment; provided, however, that Blizzard may, at its sole and absolute discretion, allow the use of certain third party user interfaces;
and further that you acknowledge...
17(a) WHEN RUNNING, THE GAME MAY MONITOR YOUR COMPUTER'S RANDOM ACCESS MEMORY (RAM) AND/OR CPU PROCESSES FOR UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAMS RUNNING CONCURRENTLY WITH WORLD OF WARCRAFT. AN "UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM" AS USED HEREIN SHALL BE DEFINED AS ANY THIRD PARTY SOFTWARE THAT, WHEN USED SIMULTANEOUSLY OR IN CONNECTION WITH THE GAME, WOULD CONSTITUTE A VIOLATION OF SECTIONS 1, 2 OR 9. IN THE EVENT THAT THE GAME DETECTS AN UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM, BLIZZARD MAY (a) COMMUNICATE INFORMATION BACK TO BLIZZARD, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION THE ACCOUNT NAME, DETAILS ABOUT THE UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM DETECTED, AND THE TIME AND DATE THE UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM WAS DETECTED; AND/OR (b) EXERCISE ANY OR ALL OF ITS RIGHTS UNDER THIS AGREEMENT OR THE EULA, WITH OR WITHOUT PRIOR NOTICE TO THE USER.
That just says that Blizzard is using a method of detection (called Warden) to try to detect things that are against the rules. ISBoxer and Inner Space offer no protection from Warden or similar detection methods from other MMO publishers, because these products are not designed to break the rules and thus do not need any protection.
Blizzard has banned many players for breaking the rules, but has not banned a single player for using ISBoxer. With few exceptions (see below), neither have any other MMO publishers to date."
http://isboxer.com/multiboxing/is-isboxer-allowed
You determining what third party software counts and what does not count is making up your own rules and plain out stupid.
By the way, how does an operating system not interact with your wow client? I'm pretty interested in how that's working haha.Edited: January 28, 2016
-
Forum Veteran nº 69
If you consider that botting then it is by far the most pointless bot to ever exist. And thank you DBUndeR for writing the wall of text so people have a chance at understanding the TOS.
Edited: January 28, 2016
-
Member
Kudos, Simple, direct and emotionless logic, Thank you for stating it in a way I was unable to do, You've clearly been dealing with these moronic opinions longer than I.
+1
-
Member
So you copied the advertisement for ISboxer, ofcourse they will endorse this. And I am not discussing IF multiboxing is against the rules, it isn'nt. Blizzards TOS is setup in such a way that they can ban multiboxing anyday without changing a letter in there. This is because of the following words: authorised third party software. But as ISboxer also states, they allow it for money.
So what am I discussing: Allowing multiboxing on a private server that does not implement new patches/expansions and allow people to buy BiS creates an environment where PVP gameplay gets toxic because at a certain point a multiboxer can become unbeatable (kind of like the wow episode of southpark lol) and no im not a sore loser, everyone his fun but playing AV after AV where you are just running into the boss room to get insta shocked until the tickets bleed out really gets old.
Should multiboxing be banned in my opinion ? No not even, but there are many ways in between. There could be a 'place" for multiboxers where they can fight each other, or maybe there can be a toon limit that would balance it out. I'm no expert on balancing game mechanics but sureley there must be someway all parties can enjoy pvp play in a balanced way where everyone has a somewhat even chance.
-
Member
I copied the advertisement of ISBoxer because they had the most clear explanation of how third party software is being defined by Blizzard and why it is allowed. Not because they endorse it.
In a post 2 days ago you said this:
And not even a day ago you said this:
Cheating and botting are against the rules, so you definitely discussed/implied that multiboxing is against the rules.
In the 11 years of WoW, Blizzard still hasn't banned multiboxing which is being performed since the beginning of WoW, not even with all the dc's and lag prepared has been causing lately and I don't see them doing it in the near future.
Like I said earlier, everyone is effected by not implementing new patches/expansions. A lot more people, multiboxers as well, get BiS gear eventually, doesn't matter if it's bought or farmed, buying gear only fastens the process and may increase the amount of BiS wearers, but that counts for single character players as for multiboxers. So the amount of BiS gear gets scaled up over the whole server, this means that the single character players and multiboxers enjoy the effect of BiS together.
No multiboxer is unbeatable, because a multiboxer can't perfectly control every single character's movement and actions. They are very vulnerable against AOE spells even if the characters are spread out.
Enjoyment of PvP is a subjective matter, one does enjoy fighting multiboxers and the other one does not. It is pretty much impossible to achieve enjoyment for all parties, because in PvP there is always a winner and loser. Balance can be created by organizing the fights against multiboxers, like the multiboxers organize the fights in battlegrounds. In my opinion, there is no need to change rules if balance can already be achieved. If you want balance, go and create it yourself.
-
Banned
In addition to what has been said, you won't face the same MBer every bg or every other bg on retail.
MBx5 I don't give a **** about, but if the 20MBs come to the new server after deathwing ragnaros merge thing and they are present at the time I play, I'll probably just stop playing because this is what will happen:
Option 1: MBx20 rapes people because 20 randoms cannot think together (let's face it 20man coordination, outside of a guild, is something very rare in MMOs)
Option 2: Enough of the guild is on and we get a stupidly easy boring game raping the MBer.
Outcome: Equally boring (and sometimes I guess we get a game without the MBers after we make him log off after smashing his keyboards)
Warmane/Molten cares about population above all and MBers are population, like hackers, so nothing meaningful will be done about them unless they have an actual noticeable negative effect on population numbers, which is very unlikely. (Though unlike hackers MBers are allowed in retail)
The best community tactic would be:
1. If you don't have an alt, make one.
2. If you get in a game with the MBer /afk (unless you have some solid premades in there, in which case just rape the MBer)
3. Spam global warning which #BG he is in.
4. Log to alt.
Leave MBs with BGs closing on them with no people ?? profit.
Alternate tactic: Move to lordaeron.
1: Leveling there is a pain.
2: You are almost guaranteed not to donate any more if you play there...
...until they finally have BiS in the shop after all content is released, but even then most people will not pay 100coins+ per item, you have to get the rest of the items, if you bother to get the rest by raiding you already have an efficient team and don't need to buy that one item anyway... so I guess you are guaranteed not to donate until they brake their promises and lower prices, still that is a blow to their wallet in the mean time in addition to being in an environment likely to be free from anything over 5MBers (lets face it, making a decent 5man premade to counter them is not hard)Edited: January 29, 2016
-
Banned
Would you do the same (quit playing) if you would consistently face a premade of 20 individual players?
-
Banned
This logic. XD
So when u gank randoms with ur bg premade it is challenging but when fighting against a multiboxer its stupidly easy and boring?
Trust me, u gonna have a challenging fight against our multibox premade.
-
Banned
@Selaya Depends. The best bgs are big premades vs big premades, however if it was only possible to get 1x or 2x 5man premades at that time vs 20man premade on horde all the time and the randoms were not good and following instructions, then yes, I would also quit playing for a while in that situation.
@Jakkre The first sentence you made up would result in a boring situation also, and Mr Pot talking to Mr Kettle about ganking is somewhat amusing.
@Jakkre Yes, beating MBers with characters which all share DRs is boring and easy with a competent premade of equal size.
@Jakkre No, we won't have a challenging fight against your premade, unless you out number us, in which case it will just be the usual boring face roll for you guys, unless you really suck or our randoms are competent and follow instructions.
The issue is that 20MBs only need 4 people (at most), while 20man premade without MBs needs 20 people. It is much easier to get 4 people (or less) on at the same time and playing as a team than it is to get 20 on at the same time and playing as a team.Edited: January 30, 2016
-
Banned
@KittensForSale
Finding something boring is a subjective opinion u know.
Im not bored while playing my BGs.
If u are so bored of everything then why do u play at all?
If pve guilds are able to form 25 man raids it also shouldn't be a problem to form a 20 man bg premade with a pvp guild.Edited: January 30, 2016
-
Banned
1. I do know.
2. Thank you for this information, I always really wanted to know this but was too afraid to ask.
3. I'm not, thus invalidating your question and the premise of your attempt at a false dichotomy disguised as a question... or simply "Question not applicable" if you weren't trying to make a bad argument and just can't read and/or understand.
4. Nice attempt at creating a strawman to my actual point... or simply "Yes" if your strawman was the inadvertent result of poor comprehension abilities.Edited: February 1, 2016
-
Member
Why not going straight to the real problem:
What does multi boxing offer to the community ?
Just cite negatives and positives.
Like Does multiboxing make Bgs more balanced? Word pvp more attractive?can help to run dungeons or raids? arenas more competitive?reduce quee time?
-
Banned
this has got to rank as one of the dumbest things i have ever read on these forums....
ill counter with something simple though
what about people that have no clue how to play this game? do they do anything you mentioned? no.
what does helping to run dungeons and raids have to do with anything is beyond me.
god this threads cancer has reached a critical mass where it is now a black hole somewhere in space and all it is doing is sucking the brains out of people who are so blind, ignorant, and butt hurt and crapping them out into another dimension of warped reality.
Quote
