WotLK Pvp stat priority

[HomerjayAT]

Hello all

was wondering about the stat priority for hunters in wotlk in pvp. normaly i always went for agility over ap since the spreadsheets always claimed agi is a lot stronger than ap in pve ("why would it be different in pvp" i asked myself). also it grants some armor and dodge which is nice to have in 2s especially. yet the spread sheet value vor each stat is based on the assumption that u have kings buffed permanently which favours agility over ap. in pvp thats often not the case. either it gets purged or u just dont have a pala on your team.
yet resilience reduces specificaly the damg u take from other players n their pets AND also reduces the critical damg taken (and ofc reduces the chance to get critically hit which influences ap and agi geming in the same way).

therefore the crit u gain from geming agility is less worth since players with high resi reduce not just the chance to get critically hit yet also the damg they take in general from crits.

question: geming ap over agi when facing a caster team where dodge and armor doesnt matter?

[Multisnipe]

The difference in gemming straight AP or agilty is not huge, but it's noticeable. From experience, I notice my crit chance plummets slightly when I'm full AP as compared to full agility. It really depends on the RNG. You can go full AP and have godlike RNG and still crit everything on casters, which will obviously be better, however you can lack crits since rng.

Even if the target has really high resilience, I still think its worth gemming agility, since hunters have mortal shots (+30% crit damage) and 3% crit damage meta gem. If you were to go straight AP, you risk RNG of having no crits at all on the target, and I'm sure you can agree that it's really nice seeing a string of crits pop up on your screen Its understandable though that you can hit harder with full AP for the expense of critting less often.

I still think its favourable to gem Agi over AP even when considering the crit mechanic reduction of resilience. A complete AP-Agi rework is probably roughly 200 agi traded for 400 AP. Also, you wouldn't be utilising the talent Combat Experience to its maximum potential, even if it only is 4%, this means that bargaining agi and AP point for point, agility will still always win by a few numbers.

A 20 agility gem gives about 0.25% crit, with talents, so 4 gems = 1%

the difference in AP is about ~150 damage per chimera shot crit, and even less for your other physical shots. You'd have to trade about 2-3% crit, which imo is quite a alot. thats at least 1/50 crits you won't see which can really make all the difference between critting and not critting. Its really up to the RNG, sometimes you might not even hit the target for the top end ranged damage that you have.

The worth of Trueshot aura also accounts for 10% of your AP, which will give you a minor increase per gem.
Really, its up to the RNG. The difference isn't that huge but still noticeable after consistent shots on the same resil level over time. At resil cap, you get 15% less chance to be crit and 33% less crit damage taken. I would only gem when it comes to the point where you don't crit often and hard, then its acceptable to gem a bit of AP since if you're not going to crit much anyway, why get it al all.

On a side note, i don't think you'll find 1414 resilience clothies unless its a disc priest

[HomerjayAT]

Well thanks for the detailed answer yet thats all nothing new and already calculated in. let me put it that way. for pve: how much worse would agility get compared to ap when u have no kings buffed in a raid and your crits do 33% less damage?
im interested in raw numbers and someone who can make a suggestion with calculation regarding that matter.
regarding the resi on clothies: there are enough people willing to tryhard when know they gonna meet a melee cleave when playing for example lsp xD lock is mostly around 1400 resi.

[Multisnipe]

"let me put it that way. for pve: how much worse would agility get compared to ap when u have no kings buffed in a raid and your crits do 33% less damage?"

Did you mean PvP? because in PvE you have so many other factors like ArP, Boss armor, etc

giving an exact number to calculate the difference is rather difficult since you'd have to test each shot that can crit individually and compare highest and lowest hits/crits

To conduct tests, you'd probably have to auto shot, aimed, chimera a couple thousand times (for best accuracy) on a high resilience cloth, conducted two times using AP and Agi sets, which is really time consuming if you want to see chimera/aimed's results, as well as considering different cloth classes taking damage differently

[DarkenedHue]

let me put it that way. for pve: how much worse would agility get compared to ap when u have no kings buffed in a raid and your crits do 33% less damage?

I simulated this on Shandara's Spreadsheet by turning off the Kings buff and taking all talent points out of Mortal Shots and Piercing Shots (the lack of those crit mulitpliers achieves a reduction in crit damage close to 33%).

The difference between Agility and AP fell tremendously, although Agility remained very slightly better.

Stat Weightage with Kings, 3/3 Piercing Shots, 5/5 Mortal Shots:
Agility +1 2.456
AP +1 0.952

Stat Weightage without Kings, 0/3 Piercing Shots, 0/5 Mortal Shots:
Agility +1 1.605
AP +1 0.782

[HomerjayAT]

beautiful. thats exactly the answers i was looking for. cheers n happy easter guys ;)