PSA:
Dont place items to a public auction house for low prices and cry when others buy them.
Duuuhhhh problem solved.
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That does not solve anything as the bots/snipers calculate the item for its worth, so if you transfered an epic item worth 2k on average, the bots would still buy it even if you placed it at 1800g. Duh.
Edited: April 7, 2018
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I don't think I've ever seen someone dumb enough to support botting. Congrats
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Show me in my post where i support botting plz.
I also dont support people who complain about someone buying their items they post on a public AH.
Dont put your items on the AH. Problem solved.
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Yeah but see here's what you don't seem to understand. There are different conditions in this case.
It is one thing if I place a valuable item for a cheap price on the auction house and leave for 1h and expect to be able to buy it on my other toon and another when I do it with the intent of purchasing the item, that only I know will be transfered and for what price in less than 3 seconds on my other toon and someone with a tweaked addon/botting program manages to snatch it.
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I'm not sure that bots generally reply... albeit as annoying as it is to lose items on the neutral AH
The issue will always come down to this:
Can a player manually Buyout an auction quicker than you can manually alt -tab and buyout an auction, and the answer is always yes. If you see people loitering at the neutral AH and you list something then you can't really complain.Edited: April 8, 2018
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And this is where you're wrong and where the matter becomes complicated. Without special addons like tweaked Auctioneer it is impossible to do this. It requires the use of an almost completely automated addon with the only function being (for a player, not a bot) an accept button, bound to say enter.
The command is done solely to interfere with transactions for one's own profit at the cost of someone else.
Now compare this to say, scripting in arenas, using addons to bypass ingame mechanics (just like the 0,5 sec AH search cooldown) or doing things that is humanly impossible to do, eg use an addon to track the yard distance between yourself and all enemy players with warnings about incoming casts, what spell it is, how long it takes to cast, when it will hit, aproximation of what it will hit for etc.
Where is the line drawn?
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Impossible? Rubbish.
You're saying that 'Action Sequence A' is slower than 'Action Sequence A' + another action (Alt-Tabbing)
You're also incorrectly assuming that both people (the buyer and seller) are clicking search at the exact same interval.
The line is: If someone is botting and you can prove it by watching them or whatever GMs do, then ban them, along with the 2000 druid bots. Else if someone has seen an item and purchased it, fair game. I've lost items to neutral AH and thusly i wouldn't list them without a /who search beforehand.Edited: April 8, 2018
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Here's the thing though, if you want to post on the booty bay AH you don't know if there's someone at the tanaris/winterspring AH. Also, no actual player would stand at the neutral AH legitimately waiting for a player to try to transfer an item to their other character. They might be alt-tabbed and if their auctioneer goes 'DING' when a cheap item is posted they tab back in, but I guarentee you I can post and buyout my own auction faster than that auctioneer user can react to their addon. It literally takes me 0.5 seconds or less, and they still beat me.
They are bots, and it's painfully obvious that they are bots. In any other situation would people say to just deal with it? Bots in battlegrounds, just deal with it? Botting herbs in terrokar, people should just deal with it? Of course not, so how come when it comes to AH bots we should just deal with it?Edited: April 8, 2018
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You must forgive me, I had completely forgotten humans could read the minds of other humans, let alone humans they have never known of heard of or that are on the other side of the earth. I really wonder why we still use telephones and email tbh.
It is time for you to go onto google. Search: World of Warcraft manual, Auction House. And read up on how the AH actually works before making any further posts.
The sequences in terms of buying the item is not the same, in fact they can't even be compared. Player A knows WHAT item will be posted, WHEN it will be posted and HOW the tab will look like. Player B DONT! Unless you assume that player B can read player A's mind and thus will search the second player A posts the item, with the same search and with the same knowledge on the tab.
Need I go on? You must be able to see how this is different.
No I do not, in fact that is at random, yet once again, Player B does not know what he is searching for, he does not know if there is anything to search for. Only Player A knows what will be transfered. The only way for player B to be made aware of what player A is transfering is by the help of an addon capable of searching faster than the classic AH, mark the item in question and send a buyout option instantly. And this is what the discussion is about, where is the line drawn?
Unless the target moves and/or behaves like a bot that can be observed, you cannot ban the player. Hence without the 3 second rule it is basically impossible to do anything about it, and hence the dicussion of where you draw the line on automated and tweaked addons.
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Enough will the bull**** about addons. I can literally log my character, with no addons whatsoever. I can park it outside an auction house and wait until someone turns up, click Search repeatedly with a mouse and purchase an auction. Your whole point about "he doesn't know what he's searching for" is moot because on a neutral auction house, the number of items is so few that listing by lowest bid first will always show the "1 copper up to 5 silver" buyouts at the top.
Do i need to fraps this to prove this can be achieved by a human?
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Here is a short video of me manually proving this is possible. The items were returned (via mail) to the original sellers (I have screenshot proof of this should you wish to doubt). So here's one for the haters :x
https://vimeo.com/263891287
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Ok, but when I'm doing my auction transfer in booty bay and the guy who instantly swipes my auction is in Winterspring, how did he know when I was going to be posting my auction? Is it more likely that this is a real player literally just standing at the neutral AH all day mashing the search auctions button, or that they are just a bot? Obviously the latter, and I'm confused in what universe you live in that you're actually trying to argue otherwise
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That video is me flying to BB and a guy is trading stuff. I'm making this point because assuming all are bots would be incorrect, and banning people if they use addons to purchase auctions then by the same degree you'd have to ban players for using addons to list auctions. It's a dangerous territory.
I agree, sometimes my auctions have been bought within split seconds, but i cannot prove this was a human or not. The only option is to put a dud item up first and see if it's safe to transfer.
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Then understand that this very thread surrounds that topic along with bots!
I will make this final post and then I will take a long vaccation from the forums and the likes of you. It is like talking to a wall or air. You ignore so many factors in your examples and the video that I wonder if you have ever pondered the problem from the other end, as that is something you must to assure your arguments hold. There is a very small chance that you can precisely time an inserted auction and snipe it manually and that hangs on so many factors that it should be obvious to you it is about pure luck or you sitting with a super human speed in your hands/fingers.
You also show that you have no idea how the normal AH tabs work. The auction house tab does not have to track the lowest price first and I can personally fraps this for you 100 gazillion times if I so have to. The normal AH does not have to show an auction for 1 copper before an auction of 1 silver if there are more than 1 tab of auctions present at the bloody auction house, capish?
But ofc, if you doubt me, then meet up with me ingame on either side, head to the AH in your capital city and try to find my 1 copper auction on the first tab like you describe it.
Now as for the neutral AH matter. I will state the main issues presented to you when trying to snipe me. You will have no idea WHICH AH I am accessing and WHEN I do it. Since I never ever use the same char and location to do my transfers, your odds of detecting me is slim to none, even less when you add in the fact that I always use rogue/druid character and do it in stealth. All you can do is note that there is a Rogue/Druid in the zone via the who list, and you need 3 accounts open just to check the 3x neutral AH zone areas. And you can never tell if they are going to play the AH or are just in the zone for other reasons.
The only way you can pull this stunt off given these conditions is WITH AN ADDON or a BOT! Because you will never have me believe you would sit and press "search" on the auction house for more than 10 minutes before you gave up out of boredom or out of extreme pain for doing the same thing 1h +, an addon cannot be ****ing bored and neither can a bot. Oh and, they need no rest.
Hence, frapsing this was pointless because it hangs on you KNOWING when the transaction will take place, the given price, the good and the current AH tabs.
I am off to the Tanaris beach.
