Where Are The Staff?

[angrylol]

Irony meters raising.

Guys lets fix this. Everyone, stop being toxic!
Community fixed. I did it, I solved it!

[Mercy]

Why aren't there more developers being hired if you are unable to fix issues that have been present for years? There are other server cores out there that far exceed this one in terms of bug fixes, active development and core stability.

I wish it were as easy as it seems from the player's perspective. About your second sentence, none of those other servers host the population we do. The stress on the servers is immense. Code breaks under stress. I could go on and explain this away, but ultimately what I say about it doesn't matter. All we can do is ask for your patience and understanding.

Why aren't you addressing toxic behaviour on a DAILY basis? Tickets are going unanswered for over a week that involve scamming, toxicity and racism...

We do. Moreso than many think we should. Moreso than *I* think we should. But we do. I think several other posts in the thread so far address this point. The community is huge. Absolutely massive. The staff is very limited in number. The community is also responsible for itself. We shouldn't need to hold anyone's hands.

The thoughts I am left with after seeing sh** like this happen regularly, is that the staff don't care and that this is a project only interested in generating profit, much alike what Blizzard has become.

We do care. Of course we do. Otherwise, I wouldn't be here replying to you. It may seem easy to think otherwise, and there are plenty of people that preach that and spread the negativity which feeds into community toxicity towards the staff. But we do care.

[Vilya]

Why aren't there more developers being hired if you are unable to fix issues that have been present for years? There are other server cores out there that far exceed this one in terms of bug fixes, active development and core stability.

Cause its not proffitable and have no sense in many aspects. You gotta prioritize the most important things. The amount of quests that work well is awesome, nobody will hire more people and pay them just so they can take care of this 3% of non working quests. Staff is targeted on solid bugs in raids/bgs and class mechanics - just look for latest changelogs. And guess what - its good, cause this is far far far greater problem.

Why aren't you addressing toxic behaviour on a DAILY basis? Tickets are going unanswered for over a week that involve scamming, toxicity and racism...

Cause the amount of it is huge. You would need entire team just to sit on global/major cities that will take care of what people said. And guess what, You would just end up with even more tickets from people that gets mute/ban, claiming they dindu nuffin. There is no point in it, specially when You can just /ignore anyone.

The thoughts I am left with after seeing sh** like this happen regularly, is that the staff don't care and that this is a project only interested in generating profit, much alike what Blizzard has become.

Yes, they are interested in generating profit. Not only, but they are into it. Just like anyone who runs his bussiness. They still provide free/drastically cheap experience for many players. So instead of being small crybaby, enjoy the game, be a bit thankful.

Otherwise - create Your own server and show Warmane how it should be done. I'll keep my fingers crossed for ya.

Has anyone else felt the same?

Yes. But its just so small percentage of playerbase, that its hard to even take it seriously.

[Eluwen]

I wish it were as easy as it seems from the player's perspective. About your second sentence, none of those other servers host the population we do. The stress on the servers is immense. Code breaks under stress. I could go on and explain this away, but ultimately what I say about it doesn't matter. All we can do is ask for your patience and understanding.

We do. Moreso than many think we should. Moreso than *I* think we should. But we do. I think several other posts in the thread so far address this point. The community is huge. Absolutely massive. The staff is very limited in number. The community is also responsible for itself. We shouldn't need to hold anyone's hands.

We do care. Of course we do. Otherwise, I wouldn't be here replying to you. It may seem easy to think otherwise, and there are plenty of people that preach that and spread the negativity which feeds into community toxicity towards the staff. But we do care.

Thank you for the comments. Not sure I agree with you on certain points, a lot of these answers you've given me are very easy answers but appreciate it none-the-less.

[Eluwen]

I wish it were as easy as it seems from the player's perspective. About your second sentence, none of those other servers host the population we do. The stress on the servers is immense. Code breaks under stress. I could go on and explain this away, but ultimately what I say about it doesn't matter. All we can do is ask for your patience and understanding.

I gave no impression that it was easy. I don't accept that it's unfixable with your budget and population. I'm not looking for a template answer like most of the forum users and whilst I appreciate some feedback, I was asking for more insight into why this is the case. Patience and understanding after some bugs are present for 4 years? If that's what you're asking of me, at what point should I question if my patience and understanding is being wasted when there are no signs or communication surrounding the problems that are widely documented? 5 years? 10?

We do. Moreso than many think we should. Moreso than *I* think we should. But we do. I think several other posts in the thread so far address this point. The community is huge. Absolutely massive. The staff is very limited in number. The community is also responsible for itself. We shouldn't need to hold anyone's hands.

I think this statement summarises why the, as you've stated, well-documented toxicity of this server is perpetuated. How the **** is punishing someone actively going out their way to be blatantly toxic and as inflammatory as possible seen as "holding anyone's hand"? That is not accountability or a caring attitude toward your players. Of-course it is that player's responsibility as a part of the community to be civilised (to an extent), but come on for **** sakes. Look at any internet-based community and see how there needs to be at least some form of consistent regulation to keep it accessible to players who want to enjoy the game and avoid the endless slew of toxicity.

Instead of the non-argument of "Staff are limited" or "The population is massive", why aren't you providing methods that you intend to address the problem? I'm aware you're a huge server, who isn't? That's why a lot of players join initially. You've grown astronomically, so increase your Management team? We are talking very basic principles of business here. Yes it will mean less profit initially but for players like myself, it will keep us around and fighting for your corner instead of against it when you show us you care, instead of using hollow words.

We do care. Of course we do. Otherwise, I wouldn't be here replying to you. It may seem easy to think otherwise, and there are plenty of people that preach that and spread the negativity which feeds into community toxicity towards the staff. But we do care.

I'm not sure a reply on a forum displays a "caring" attitude. Look at most of the responses in this thread, for example.

And no, it isn't "easy to think otherwise". I've given a lot of time into my thoughts and feelings surrounding the state of the server and this forum thread. As I've already stated, I like this server. I have friends here. I have enjoyed myself to no end and contributed as thanks but I have noticed a trend downward lately.

[Shred92]

You demand more staff is hired (but you won't pay for it), you demand the community changes at your whim... Have you considered this may not be the place for you?

[Shred92]

What does it mean that you "don't accept that it's unfixable with your budget"? Does that mean that you find it unacceptable that they don't hire more developers, or that you think the developers are incompetent?

What do you mean when you say "the non-argument of "Staff are limited" or "The population is massive""? Does that mean that you think the staff gets paid for slacking off, or that you think they should reallocate time they spend dealing with actual problems players have and start banning people because you refuse to use the ignore feature?

[Note to the rest of users: he deleted a post in between.]

[angrylol]

Don't bother man,
he asked for opinions, I gave him mine, he called it "ridiculous post" not addressing anything, then proceeded to tell how everyone is invalidating his experiences. Unaware of the irony.

Looks like one of those "this thing i don't like - you fix it now, how dare you" dudes. Just a bunch of copypasted whining, expecting people to copypaste his OP back to him, seeing others in the same kind of misery might make him feel better. Circlejerk didn't pan out, everyone is toxic now.

Everyone who actually wanted to make things better has done so, they found friends and made guilds, doing all the stuff they want without any behaviors they don't like. Others are those pitiful "martyr" types, crawling into worst situations possible, even making them worse, then everyone is supposed to feel for them and do something about it. Yeah, wasted words.

[Eluwen]

I appreciate that you are one of few here trying to address my points logically rather than assume and judge who I am as a person, although I question your intentions considering your final sentence.

What does it mean that you "don't accept that it's unfixable with your budget"? Does that mean that you find it unacceptable that they don't hire more developers, or that you think the developers are incompetent?

What does it mean? It means I don't accept it as an answer. There was a fully working WOTLK core in 2008 with a player-base of 12,000,000. I appreciate Blizzard was a multi-million dollar company at the time, but they expanded their resources as the player-base grew. They addressed the problems or accepted they would lose players.

To add to this, I have played other private WOTLK servers at their peak with at least 8,000 players that show nowhere near as many bugs. I think it's a dishonest answer and I don't buy it.

What do you mean when you say "the non-argument of "Staff are limited" or "The population is massive""? Does that mean that you think the staff gets paid for slacking off, or that you think they should reallocate time they spend dealing with actual problems players have and start banning people because you refuse to use the ignore feature?

I've explained why it's a non-argument already. It is not for the reasons you've assumed.

[Note to the rest of users: he deleted a post in between.]

In an effort to remain honest, I deleted a post because I'd like it to remain on-topic and I was at risk of taking it off-topic. Interesting that you felt the need to mention it though.

[Eluwen]

Don't bother man,
he asked for opinions, I gave him mine, he called it "ridiculous post" not addressing anything, then proceeded to tell how everyone is invalidating his experiences. Unaware of the irony.

Looks like one of those "this thing i don't like - you fix it now, how dare you" dudes. Just a bunch of copypasted whining, expecting people to copypaste his OP back to him, seeing others in the same kind of misery might make him feel better. Circlejerk didn't pan out, everyone is toxic now.

Everyone who actually wanted to make things better has done so, they found friends and made guilds, doing all the stuff they want without any behaviors they don't like. Others are those pitiful "martyr" types, crawling into worst situations possible, even making them worse, then everyone is supposed to feel for them and do something about it. Yeah, wasted words.

The narrative you've come up with in your head is astonishing to read about. I'm beginning to wonder if you feel threatened by my post, and if so why?

I apologise you felt I didn't address your post, it seemed farcical at the time to give you that courtesy considering I spent more time writing mine and you didn't address any of my points. Talk of irony... Here you are:

I personally feel the staff being overbearing. Wasting their time on banning ninjas, scammers, waisism(and all the other words from twitter)....

No evidence to suggest they're overbearing. No logical reasoning. Every player can agree that ninjas, scammers and racism are bull****. So no idea what your point is.

People with real problems have to wait extra day for help.

What do you consider a real problem?

It's quite irrelevant how we feel.

You believe it's irrelevant how we feel which means you will dismiss anything I say as a player. Do you believe that about yourself as a player too? Because if so, I'll acknowledge that and carry on ignoring what you post.

[angrylol]

Not sure how threatening or something this is, for me it's simply "old news". Yeah, sometimes things suck, what a surprise. Make it better for yourself, when you know how to do that, you can start to go on long tirades telling others how to do things. I'm just hoping that you might see the truth that such things exist, same was wind blows, same as Sun shines. No one goes around yelling how the Sun should be banned, they out the sunscreen on.

No evidence to suggest they're overbearing. No logical reasoning. Every player can agree that ninjas, scammers and racism are bull****. So no idea what your point is.

And now you speak for everyone, is that right?
There is plenty evidence, try to spam a bit on Trade selling something for half the normal price. You will get 20 whispers from gullible derps, ripe for scamming. Because "rules will protect them", isntead of them using brains and recognizing obvious scam.

What do you consider a real problem?

What I consider problems are things that players need to break 4th wall to solve. Sort of "mechanical" problems. Things like ninja players can solve themselves. "toxic" whatnots players can deal with themselves. Isn't that perfectly reasonable, even desired to be expressed and room for that purposefully built into MMO?

You believe it's irrelevant how we feel which means you will dismiss anything I say as a player. Do you believe that about yourself as a player too? Because if so, I'll acknowledge that and carry on ignoring what you post.

Sure thing, but the fact that you dismiss certain opinions means you didn't actually want discussion, you wanted people to go "omg toxic is bad!", as if that can possibly bring any kind of solution. If those things would be possible to ban out of existance, they wouldn't exist already. But the scammers still are scamming, ninjas still are stealing, they are being banned for years now.

[Eluwen]

And now you speak for everyone, is that right?

If you'd like to admit that you're okay with racism, scamming or ninjaing, nobody is stopping you.

There is plenty evidence, try to spam a bit on Trade selling something for half the normal price. You will get 20 whispers from gullible derps, ripe for scamming. Because "rules will protect them", isntead of them using brains and recognizing obvious scam.

This is victim-blaming and it's not an attitude I agree with. Common sense is important, we agree there, but if scams were obvious then people wouldn't fall for them.

What I consider problems are things that players need to break 4th wall to solve. Sort of "mechanical" problems. Things like ninja players can solve themselves. "toxic" whatnots players can deal with themselves. Isn't that perfectly reasonable, even desired to be expressed and room for that purposefully built into MMO?

Can you give me an example? I think you're referring to bugs? I would love for Warmane to focus their resources on bugs, but they aren't doing that either so where are the resources going?

Being that WoW was the biggest MMO in the world and continues to be, and even under Blizzard's reign, they never condoned and actively banned behaviour like scamming and racism. I think the idea of "let the community manage itself" disregards the players that actively go out of their way and spend their time ruining the experience for others. That should always be punishable to me. It can be too excessive to ignore sometimes.

Sure thing, but the fact that you dismiss certain opinions means you didn't actually want discussion, you wanted people to go "omg toxic is bad!", as if that can possibly bring any kind of solution. If those things would be possible to ban out of existance, they wouldn't exist already. But the scammers still are scamming, ninjas still are stealing, they are being banned for years now.

Which opinion did I dismiss? That you don't think players feelings should matter? By ignoring you, I was listening to you. Understand? There seems to be a lot of speculation around my beliefs coming from you but no questions about what they actually are.

I know what you're saying here, and I actually agree to an extent. I don't think all toxicity should be bannable because that's unrealistic and idyllic. I've had my fair share of times telling players to "F*** off" if I felt it was necessary. I've stated this already but to reiterate, I have observed downward trends in the amount of toxicity and an increase in the amount of bugs I've been experiencing. I foresee the server ending up with a worsening and gradually non-existent community and I don't want that.

Having said all this, I think there is a precedent for community behaviour that should be set and regularly enforced by the authority that owns it. Those that have better judgement as they have experience of the landscape. I do not think this is being upheld enough and therefore more people are continuing to get away with it and the extent of the problem becomes cancerous.

[scorpyo]

You can disagree with me all you want. You've not even come close to answering any of my questions, and instead targeted me as the problem. I am happy to debate. I am not happy to have people trying to invalidate my experience.

Oh boy oh boy! You certainly are thin-skinned!

People DO answer your question, just not the answer you would like them to give to you. Too bad!

I'd say the answer @OhieMitzen wrote to you is about some of the most real, logical and rational I have read in this thread.

Such is reality. Staff does take care of things if it is worth taking care of and that is a fact. But if you have a thinner skin than that, that is your problem and neither Warmane's problem or this community's problem. You'll have to learn to deal with a certain level of toxicity, just like in real life.

You are playing a game where we kill each other, we have emotes like /spit, /rude, /fart and other... Honestly... What do you expect? Teddy-Bear-country?

Welcome to reality!

[angrylol]

If you'd like to admit that you're okay with racism, scamming or ninjaing, nobody is stopping you.

I am for letting people show their colors, so I can see who is what and choose with whom I play. How is that wrong to let people spit out their behaviour, so everyone sees from whom to stay away?

This is victim-blaming and it's not an attitude I agree with. Common sense is important, we agree there, but if scams were obvious then people wouldn't fall for them.

Right, victim blaming. Everyone gets scammed sometime. What I did was reflect how to not fall for it next time. Had a laugh how gullible I was. Asked others their thoughts on how widespread such a thing is. Took action so it doesn't happen again. Didn't need a staff member to put my pants on corerctly with brown stripe to the back.

Can you give me an example? I think you're referring to bugs? I would love for Warmane to focus their resources on bugs, but they aren't doing that either so where are the resources going?

Once I was stuck in "parallel phase" because some quest turn in didn't trigger removing aura from me. Needed help.
Deleted(somehow) my Ashen ring, there is no way to get it back or another in game. Needed help.
Long time ago step in Queldelar questline didn't work, GM had to come and set me on the next part manually.
Those 3 are all my "actual" problems I have had in 9 years playing here.

What you do when you encounter a bug, you report it with as much information as you can. If it's important it will get fixed soon.

Being that WoW was the biggest MMO in the world and continues to be, and even under Blizzard's reign, they never condoned and actively banned behaviour like scamming and racism. I think the idea of "let the community manage itself" disregards the players that actively go out of their way and spend their time ruining the experience for others. That should always be punishable to me. It can be too excessive to ignore sometimes.

WoW is not the biggest MMO anymore. It was tough, when people had a way more freedom in their sandbox. coicidence? probably.
Humans behave like humans, be it good or bad.

Which opinion did I dismiss? That you don't think players feelings should matter? By ignoring you, I was listening to you. Understand? There seems to be a lot of speculation around my beliefs coming from you but no questions about what they actually are.

Then what are your beliefs? All I see is "someone else fix it please".. ?

I know what you're saying here, and I actually agree to an extent. I don't think all toxicity should be bannable because that's unrealistic and idyllic. I've had my fair share of times telling players to "F*** off" if I felt it was necessary. I've stated this already but to reiterate, I have observed downward trends in the amount of toxicity and an increase in the amount of bugs I've been experiencing. I foresee the server ending up with a worsening and gradually non-existent community and I don't want that.

Having said all this, I think there is a precedent for community behaviour that should be set and regularly enforced by the authority that owns it. Those that have better judgement as they have experience of the landscape. I do not think this is being upheld enough and therefore more people are continuing to get away with it and the extent of the problem becomes cancerous.

I have a solution:
to play on Warmane every player has to wear a shock collar, like an animal. Say a bad word, offended player gets to zap his ***. Utopia achieved.

[Eluwen]

Oh boy oh boy! You certainly are thin-skinned!

Here we go again. See the other 2-3 broken records and the responses I've already provided to their assumptions about who I am.

People DO answer your question, just not the answer you would like them to give to you. Too bad!

I've no problem with people disagreeing with me.

I'd say the answer @OhieMitzen wrote to you is about some of the most real, logical and rational I have read in this thread.

@OhieMitzen, and yourself, are asserting that this is my problem. That I should somehow be less sensitive and "open my eyes" to the reality of the world. For one, it's patronising. I'm not a child. I've suffered like all adults have, and I'm very aware of the unfairness of life.

Let's be clear here. You don't know anything about who I am, my beliefs, how thick or thin skinned I am, or the full extent of my experience. I am giving you, and I repeat, examples. I can't write out all my examples or I'd be here all ****ing day. That's my point.

Such is reality. Staff does take care of things if it is worth taking care of and that is a fact. But if you have a thinner skin than that, that is your problem and neither Warmane's problem or this community's problem. You'll have to learn to deal with a certain level of toxicity, just like in real life.

Worth taking care of? I've had this discussion with someone already. What's "worth taking care of" to you?

You are playing a game where we kill each other, we have emotes like /spit, /rude, /fart and other... Honestly... What do you expect? Teddy-Bear-country?

Welcome to reality!

Are you seriously using fantasy and in-game emotes to justify excessive racism and toxicity? What you're describing isn't reality. You literally just described the fantasy elements, and then tell me to wake up to reality?

Christ alive.