I hope you understand this is a new community and RDF in Vanilla is a new concept - your rules that have "worked" sinze 2016 might not anymore. Hence this entire thread...
We have simply asked for clarification on a number of very common vanilla scenarios - some of which you might have missed. So I urge you to read them and sleep on it, because although this might be the first post - with the ninja loot ban rate this certainly wont be the last.
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Forum Veteran
Are you aware that people have been leveling trough RDF, all the classic dungeons? It's nothing new or unknown. And it does not even matter, it's the exactly same rules, even if value some specs get out of the items may or may not be different. Give us a specific item/scenario that has you in this huge state of confusion.
Edited: November 24, 2023
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Ignoring your previous reply which leads me to believe you have either not read/understood a word that's been said in this thread or you're simply a forum troll (latter seems more likely).
I'll bite on this one anyway.
Unless warmane has had a vanilla server previously that I've not seen, this is entirely a new dynamic - items and classes were "fixed" in TBC and made much more streamlined, even stuff that dropped from vanilla dungeons. So it is absolutely different... here are some examples:
Can a warrior tank roll on Edgemaster's?
Can a feral druid roll on Shadowcraft?
Can a healer roll on Briarwood Reed?
Can a spellhance roll on spell power gear?
Can rogues roll on Dal'Rend's OH?
Itemization in classic isn't cut and dry - this item = this role. Most of those examples are things that go directly against the "rules" that people in this thread believe refer to ninja looting despite all of them being perfectly valid and for their role. This just highlights the confusion and this whole attitude of "Just try your luck and you might be ban" is ridiculous... so people just have to accept they might be ban if they perceive the vague ninja looting rules differently to the GMs? How's that a healthy attitude for the server.
And none of this addresses the fact that if you say to all warriors or shamans - you cannot roll on DPS gear (their agreed upon MS) while queuing as tank/healer, RDF will become baron and queue times will sky rocket. We want those people to feel like they can tank or heal and still progress their desired route without the threat of being ban.
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Forum Veteran
Rules are rules, but have you ever tried communicating with RDF players? It's odd that they just might share your views, and agree with you doing things your way. It's the same with OS need rolls. You talk to the other people, and if they are okay with you rolling need, then it's settled between you people, even though the general rule is "No needing items for OS". In D&D there's a saying: "Specific rules over general rules."
You should ask GM's about those items. Who knows, maybe they too think some items are weird, and MS for many classes/specs/roles.
My quick thoughts, hopefully it helps for some answers:
- Briarwood Reed works for any caster, heals and DPS alike.
- Spellhance depends on how Warmane's GM's sees the spec. Do they see it as legitimate spec as any other (arms dps, combat rogue) or do they see it as illegitimate as in essence enhancement is meant to be more of an melee Hunter (AA focus, fewer spells).
- Dal'Rend off-hand item is as stupid as it is, tank item? Yeah, **** was stupid in vanilla.
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Definitely agree here. Warriors can use 1-hand + shield, or 2-hand and they can tank in any spec, prot, arms or fury, all the way up to 60. They can also use any weapon that increases their dps/threat output and overall raw stats, regardless of if the said item has +spellpower or + intellect.
Example: Ring gives +13 spirit +6 intellect, or a +37.5 dps caster sword, which is easily better than most green items but has spellpower.
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Find other players who think the same, join with full party and split the loot in any way you all agree to do it.
Or just wait few weeks for realm to build/spread "common knowledge" or call it whatever, so everyone on realm instantly agrees who can need on each item. Probably everyone will agree that Egemasters is completely legit to roll NEED as a tank, but until then, I suggest you don't. Go and buy them instead.
Stop trying to get people banned
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In my group, Hunt pressed Need for his tank warrior friend, on the subject of edgemaster's handguards.
Does this comply with the rules???
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Technically the hunter is the only one of those two allowed to need on that due to it being mail, according to the current rule for needing on items.
However its against the policy to roll for a friend. So it would be considered ninja looting if he did give it to the warrior.
This is how the current rules read at least. The warrior should have discussed with the group that he wanted to roll for the edgeguards.
This is my interpretation of the rules as stated in the policy. (see my original post for link)
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Deserved ban for the shaman.
If you get into the dungeon and it’s stated you have the DPS or Heal spot you roll Need on the role attributed and Greed/Disenchant the rest.
At the start of the dungeon, say you queued as double spec and tell which items you need. Can’t reach a compromise ? Leave.
I have played many vanilla/tbc/wotlk private server since 2012 and it’s seem the normal procedure.
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I mean this is up for debate based on the existing rules, regardless - (I was there) The accusor instantly said "ninja", "reported", "cya". To which he submitted a ticket, screenshot, without even a chance to reconcile. The shaman was then ban, without warning or means to defend himself and it wasn't till something like day 4 of the 5 day ban that the appeal was approved.
Regardless of how you feel about the rules, this is an incredibly brutal and unfair process, especially considering how vague the rules are.
And I'd like to reiterate, if rolling on your MS** as an OS tank or healer becomes a bannable offence, we'll simply lose over half the tanks/healers willing to queue... I've already stopped queuing tank since reading all this.
**(yes MS. Pre-dual spec, it's simply the one you're talented for and post-dual spec, the one you want to play - any other interpretation is absurd and probably that of someone who refuses to play a different ROLE to help queue times)
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am i allowed to roll on "Lavastone Hammer" as warrior even though it ups spellpower? If my weapon does way less dmg why shouldnt i since its an upgrade for me and i need it?!
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I think the only part of what you're taking about that has any merit is your holy priest example the rest is a non-issue as you know what role you're getting into before you enter the dungeon. There are legit pieces that someone like a H Priest can roll on and are in various gearing guides across the internet. For example Hypnotic blade/Orb of the Forgotten Seer for Smite/Dungeon healing specs. Especially the Orb there are very few choices of offhands up to that point. The lines are definitely blurry in this case.
https://www.wowhead.com/classic/guid...priest-weaponsEdited: November 28, 2023
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It seems if someone in your group consider your roll ninja looting, thats what matters. It dosent matter that the person is completly wrong, its his opinion on the matter that counts.
Im fury tanking as warrior, rolled need on leather legs with 1% hit (no1 else needed them) and I get reported by a mage calling "ninja loot". Now im banned for 5 days EVEN THO I instantly equipped the legs and used them. How is this ninja looting? Needing on items that is upgrade with bis stats for your class.
Having some completly clueless person decide if it was ninja or not is just crazy to me.
This system and ruleset and the enforcement of the rules is chocking how bad it is tbh.
Its been soon 24h since I made a ban appeal describing the entire situation and no staff has come back yet with a explanation on the matter.
This is a serious low mark from Warmane side tbh.
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Forum Veteran
You got banned because you confused what's in your head with reality. Players reported what happened, their opinion or what they consider as what is irrelevant. GM looked at the evidence, observed that rule was broken and gave you ban. Nothing is confusing, everything is perfectly clear.
Don't roll on dps crap as a tank. You tank as fury/etc/whatever and get confused? Read that first sentence again.
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Forum Veteran
In any vanilla server that need roll would've been completely acceptable, but here it is not.
