Tbc was great. Wotlk was great.
Lore was great in both expansions. Raids were great. Pvp was fun. Tbc had a lot less balance in classes even by the end in pvp things like rets were useless. Wotlk was dare I say the most balanced I've seen pvp by the end of any expansion. Tbc raids however you couldent just catch up to guilds in ssc or tk u had to.grind out mags and Kara. Hunter missing a certain piece? Gotta do an entire raid for him. 5 man dungeons in tbc while epic were just plain absurd in difficulty. No matter how geared or skilled players were it was like raiding an actual boss. These were not the 30-45 min dungeons in wrath. We are talking 2-3 hours in a dungeon. No rdf.
Wotlk had death.knights which were way op in season 5 with spam icy touch. Naxx was basically same **** over again even though no one really saw it in.retail. toc was dumbest raid all time. Pointless filler. Ulduar has to be #1 or #2 best raid all time. Icc was easily a top 5 raid as well. Rdf came out. Gearscore was out (but no.one actually used it in retail or any seriousness guild for that matter) i gotta go with wrath.
Vanilla- since I know for a fact hardly anyone in.molten actually played this. It sucked. The rep.grinds the long *** runs all over the place. The dungeons and raids from hell. Sure it had the feel of being huge which is something blizzard got away from. But it was just madness. Vanilla bugs were everywhere remember having to.log in and pvp or.else lose rating? 4 day long AV matches. Remember druids just going bear and popping out only to heal themselves all day long? . While I loved playing it I never want to grind that **** ever again.
Cata- lol. Worst expansion.ever. I mean it. Lfr which I don't.care what anyone says it obviously did effect how guilds raid. 10 and 25 m same loot table was the biggest failure ever and split most if not all 25 m guilds apart. Firelands was cool. End game boss raid was worst ever to date. Its been voted the worst over and over again on countless sites and reviews. Dumbed down talent trees( don't.give me cookie cutter crap in wotlk BC it wasent and.anyone worth a damn knows it) for me catas changes is what started the downfall of wow. As we have seen peak sub time was the end of wrath and release day of cata. Since then has been a loss with no real gain unless a new expansion comes out.
MOP- pet battles or aka wtf Pokemon. Pandas and all the drama surrounding them being in the game. Lore was kind of weak. Raiding improved over cata but that's not saying much. Still suffering from same issues cata was. Removed talents.
Wod- gameplay much better. Graphics much better. Garrisons cool but really isolate the player community not.bring them.together. same issues not fixed since cata. Added new mythic mode (yes because adding another level totally was the fix. So we can raid the same **** even more now....gg blizzard) still no final verdict till its over but all time lows in subs and blizzard going to a in game money way to pay for sub time and insta 90 should be a dead giveaway wow is in trouble.
Blizzard pvp changes all the time. Its pvp. Some classes get buffed others nerf.
We like hard content blizzard just insanely hard no 300 modes to chose from. We don't like lfr. We like killing three things. The burning legion, the scourge, old gods. Oh and no more flying in azeroth plz. Really makes the world small and useless.
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Banned
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Member
i agree till this, the graphs went up with WoD.
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Banned
People play on private servers when they either don't want/don't have the opportunity to pay, want to try an old experience Blizzard refuses to offer or often times both. The peak of WoW's popularity occurred during Wotlk, it's not really rocket science why it has the most people going back to it.
[strike]HA HA HA HA HA HA HA[/strike]
This has never been more relevant:
Spoiler:Show
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Banned
because like i mentioned at the start of each expansion subs go up. why would they implement game time for gold if subs were above MoP and MoP had no gold for playtime implemented?
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The amount of people judging by their personal memories and nostalgia rather than objective reasoning in this thread is too damn high.
@Funky, wotlk also had guilds only doing 10 mans simply because they don't have the capacity or motivation to do 25 mans. Giving 25 mans different loot tables wouldn't make those guilds suddenly change their raid structure. Likewise, guilds who do have the capacity continue doing 25 mans because they simply want to.
The talents part made me chuckle. On average you have like 3 talent points that you can switch around based on class and preference in wotlk, whoop de freaking doo! And then again most high-end pvp and pve players tend to stick to the same build. It's the same **** in Cata. Do tell me more how no-brain talent points like "Increase dmg to x" was making the game more enjoyable. If anything MoP and WoD are the only expansions where Ive had to switch talents around before every encounter or players I faced.
I loved wotlk just as much as anyone else, but the arguments against the other expansions, for the most part, are utterly stupid and smell like pure nostalgia.
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There is no "objective" reasoning for preferring one expansion over another.
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No offense but it seems like you haven't played MoP, mate. I've played all of the expansions and vanilla and from all of them, MoP has the best PvP and Raids/dungeons. Vanilla had no arenas, PvP was hard because finding 40 ppl was hard. TBC PvP was good, raids were super overtuned and had too much RNG. WotLK PvP is meh, raids/dungeons way too fricken easy. Cata PvP is good again, Raids/dungeons are harder than before and very interesting. MoP PvP is good as well, PvP power brings in a bit more balance, raiding is much more harder (so are dungeons) and, in my opinion, much more fun as well. Only thing that throws me off is too many dailies in MoP.
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The poster is speaking of the state of MoP on Molten, not MoP from retail.
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Banned
yea you did but the amount of players doing those vs 25s was a lot smaller.
LOL. here we go with another "everything was cookie cutter" spec kinda person. listen, just to prove you wrong there were at least 3 different specs used by restoration druids at end level ICC to maximize healing on certain bosses. i had to carry glphs for each different encounter and subsequent swap of spec or reglyph for a fight. many other classes had specs that would change depending on the boss and any good progression guild knows this. to say otherwise tells me one of two things. 1. you were not in a progressive guild 2. you never knew about your class enough to see any justification in swapping.
There are people who read EJ and focus on 1 spec that is best overall then there are those who actually theorycraft other specs and moving points around to specifically give them a slight advantage depending upon the fight.
now here on molten its a little different. but even so on my first bane i healed i swapped out to another resto spec built more for faster hots and better direct heals.
some dps classes may have been cookie cutter so to speak especially pure dps classes (mage, hunter, rogue, lock) but the rest of the classes all had different things that could be sought after in the talent tree to improve healing/dps/survival depending on the fight or their roll for a fight.
sorry but you are dead wrong in thinking there were only 3 talent points to play with. there were a lot more than that if you knew what you were doing depending on your class and spec.
i honestly cant believe people still think this way. like i said before there is a difference is rolling a spec because it has the highest overall damage across all encounters vs swapping to a better dps/hps/tank spec for a specific encounter. true theory crafters know this.
dint say it made it more enjoyable? it made it so there was a gap between the best of the best and the rest. when i say that i mean there were people who used the best spec overall then people who would swap specs and talents per boss fight to inflict maximum dps/hps/tanking there were defiantly two types of players and there was a gap. cata talents were close your eyes and fill up a tree. dont get me started on mop and wod talents....
the arguments against the others are cemented by the fact of the subs lost and gained. those are straight up facts that players were fed up with certain expansions and changes. just look at the list of rage rants about cata and why people quit. the amount of end level raiders who had talent dropped off immensely during cata and has yet to resurface. believe it or not really talented players like challenges and it felt as if those things that made the game challenging (wether it be 25m content and 10 content sharing loot, LFR, really easy or boring raids, or stupid talent trees, or whatever else pissed you off about the game) the majority of the hardcore raider base was effectively over after wotlk. you can look up all the guilds that were predominate for years on servers and watch where they died out at. most of them in cata some in MoP.
my guild for example that was realm first everything fell apart at the end of cata. the other guild i raided with died a year into cata. so many top guilds on realms just simply disappeared. These two guilds had been around for years. i mean literally since vanilla. you can use the argument that the game was old and all that but the game was 6 years old by icc anyways and was at its peak. then suddenly within within the first quarter of cata 600k subs lost? 600k people just dont suddenly think the game is old in that amount of time. you can see the current subs here.
like i said before, each expansion returns players (myself included) why? because we want to see if the wow we know and used to love is back. when we find out its not we unsub.
please go look at the top guilds during vanilla-wotlk on all realms. a lot of hem are the same. then poof by then middle to end of cata most are gone or no longer number 1 after spending years at the top. there is a reason for this.
if people liked cata, mop, or the current expansion then thats good and im fine with that. but to say there hasent been some major issues caused by blizzard that has pissed off the community (again pick whatever reason ive stated) and has left them feeling unwanted and made them leave the game is just crazy talk (not that you said it im just speaking in general)
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Banned
i fail to see how pvp is easy like ever. sure there are classes that get buffed to the hills and some get nerfed. but thats EVERY expansion. doesnt mean skilled players get less skilled per expansion.
raids too easy? in wotlk?
apparently you never raided ulduar at curent content. its literally like on every top 5 best raid dungeon list and usually ranks #1-#2 for a reason. forget ICC, naxx and crap ToC. ULDUAR!
i mean my god if you think firefighter 25m/ yogg zero light are easy fights then you must be gohstcrawler himself and have acess to Martin Fury
words cant even begin to explain how wrong you are, sorry but its true.
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Banned
How is it nostalgia if we are currently playing old expansions? This isn't distant memories from long ago. It is right now.
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Member
Not really. WoD is by far the worst expansion. It's so bad that I actually decided to cancel my sub. I would pick MoP over WoD any time.
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People who didn't get to enjoy Southshore vs. Tarren Mill wouldn't understand anyways.
I still rank Cataclysm lower, but MoP in its own right was pretty good. Sure, people don't like Pandas and all that ****. But at least there was stuff to do. WoD would be really good if it didn't feel like it was single-player.
WotLK too. Let's not forget RDF was implemented in late Wrath. :P
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Can someone explain vanilla pvp? I don't get it how they earn pvp gear when on release there was no bgs and arenas at all till bc right? I read there was some kill ratio and best on the realm get some rank or whatever. That sound like some heavy mother****ing **** grinding o.O
wotlk>tbc for me- lore, area (just don't like tbc map at all) except maybe nagrand. In wotlk- grizzly hills, howling fjord, sholazzar just epic. And the music, the music! and grizzly hills and howling. Raids. Also I think that rdf is good thing cause I dont want to spend my time traveling to some instance 20mins I want to play it.
Black temple- no portals. You die, spend 20mins to get back to Illidan- thats lame guys.
Also grinding in tbc- arghhhhhh.
Last thing, Blizzard should remove flying.
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Member
This is a totally spurious line of reasoning. The "sub number" in Wrath was a fiction, and falling sub numbers don't in any way prove there is a game design flaw in modern iterations.
