Please help community to understand better what is NINJA LOOT or NOT.

[Obnoxious]

If there were no rules set, it wasn't being fair - it was creating rules on the spot.
The guy won the item, it belongs to him as far as the rules went. If he wanted to give it to someone else on his own was his problem, but keeping him from having the loot he won was stealing from him, no matter how you put it... and he was smart enough to have screenshots to prove it.

[Setis]

If there were no rules set, it wasn't being fair - it was creating rules on the spot.
The guy won the item, it belongs to him as far as the rules went. If he wanted to give it to someone else on his own was his problem, but keeping him from having the loot he won was stealing from him, no matter how you put it... and he was smart enough to have screenshots to prove it.

So your saying if im fully geared and win an item i should still get it even tho i dont need it at all?

[Obnoxious]

So your saying if im fully geared and win an item i should still get it even tho i dont need it at all?

I'm saying the stated loot rules are the only thing that count, no matter what gear you or someone else might have.
If the person who won it wants to give it away to someone else is entirely up to them, not to rules created on the spot after a roll has even already happened. And if you don't want that to happen, make sure that's part of the loot rules before the raid starts.

[Setis]

I'm saying the stated loot rules are the only thing that count, no matter what gear you or someone else might have.
If the person who won it wants to give it away to someone else is entirely up to them, not to rules created on the spot after a roll has even already happened. And if you don't want that to happen, make sure that's part of the loot rules before the raid starts.

So since no one ever states any rules i can just go with my full geared toon and roll for transmogs and 4th offspec items(assuming i win the roll). And this in turn will mean that leaders would either kick me or give the loot to someone else wich is "on the spot rule" as you say and create a lot of ninja loot reports. Raid leaders beware im coming (insert evil laugh).

[Sixtyninee]

So since no one ever states any rules i can just go with my full geared toon and roll for transmogs and 4th offspec items(assuming i win the roll). And this in turn will mean that leaders would either kick me or give the loot to someone else wich is "on the spot rule" as you say and create a lot of ninja loot reports. Raid leaders beware im coming (insert evil laugh).

That's why I suggest asking for loot rules at the beginning of the raid.

[taralej]

Ok perfect, thanks.
So u are saying me that if i'll organize a raid, i can easily avoid to write all references about reserverd items , and noone can report me, because they cant have evidences for prove it.

Because its clear that if i write:
Lfm Icc25hc fresh , need 1 tank, 1 heal some dps, wisp me achi/gs
Noone will think to ask me if somethings is reserved, so they will never can have a screen about it.

btw thanks for the time ;)

I'ts all clear now. Now we know how to act.

No, mate. In the end it's left to the leader's discretion to decide which item goes to who. It depends on his knowledge about classes whether or not he decides an item is good for a member or not. If he thinks that those bracers are bad for Demonology and doesn't want to give them to you because of that, there's not much you can do. Even if you give him proof etc, he can just stick to his opinion.

In much the same way some raid leaders give Toskk's to warriors while others don't; DBW to DKs etc. You get the idea.

My point is that he didn't "ninja loot" it. He just genuinely doesn't think that item is for you and that's all. You know it's for you and you want that item - that's why you're taking this so personal, but you shouldn't in a PUG raid.

As you see, I'm not defending him in particular - I'm just trying to let you understand how he thought so you don't get so aggravated. As a player who used to have the top Demo Warlock on Ragnaros at ICC release, I also had to argue with Resto Druids and Priest healers over items all the time during ICC progression and they hated me for that, but in the end those who knew what Demo is about knew that we need Spirit + Haste (Crit) and gave me the items when I won them.

[PlatinumGaara]

No, mate. In the end it's left to the leader's discretion to decide which item goes to who. It depends on his knowledge about classes whether or not he decides an item is good for a member or not. If he thinks that those bracers are bad for Demonology and doesn't want to give them to you because of that, there's not much you can do. Even if you give him proof etc, he can just stick to his opinion.

In much the same way some raid leaders give Toskk's to warriors while others don't; DBW to DKs etc. You get the idea.

My point is that he didn't "ninja loot" it. He just genuinely doesn't think that item is for you and that's all. You know it's for you and you want that item - that's why you're taking this so personal, but you shouldn't in a PUG raid.

As you see, I'm not defending him in particular - I'm just trying to let you understand how he thought so you don't get so aggravated. As a player who used to have the top Demo Warlock on Ragnaros at ICC release, I also had to argue with Resto Druids and Priest healers over items all the time during ICC progression and they hated me for that, but in the end those who knew what Demo is about knew that we need Spirit + Haste (Crit) and gave me the items when I won them.

Man u will understand that u cant confide in a pug raid on all raid leader's knowledge about classes and prio's class loots.

If there were no rules set, it wasn't being fair - it was creating rules on the spot.
The guy won the item, it belongs to him as far as the rules went. If he wanted to give it to someone else on his own was his problem, but keeping him from having the loot he won was stealing from him, no matter how you put it... and he was smart enough to have screenshots to prove it.

I'm really happy that finally a gm is active on community's problem, and probably u are listening our problems and u are understanding that server's rules actually have some problems and gaps.

[Gwola]

Ninja looters are people who take items without rolling for them basicly , so by that logic reserving items is ninja looting . End of story .

[PlatinumGaara]

Ninja looters are people who take items without rolling for them basicly , so by that logic reserving items is ninja looting . End of story .

Yesterday there was a guy that was grouping for icc25hc , DFO and DBW reserved.
I give up.