3.3.5 Arcane Mages PvE

[zetoxic]

Just wondering is anyone else out there playing this spec?
How is it with end game gear on end game raids?

[Diemtee]

I somehow doubt there's anyone playing arcane at end game gears cause FFB spec simply outdoes arcane in every aspect. People usually use it on lower gear levels when their crit is still too low for FFB.

[zetoxic]

Well that's disappointing :<

[taralej]

Well that's disappointing :<

Well, it's just how it is. Arcane is not the endgame spec for Mages, Fireball is.

[Mahourai]

If Arcane is fixed it should actually be roughly on par with Fire TTW single-target, and of course FFB should be so far behind it's unplayable alongside Frost, but it's doubtful that this will ever happen.

[Sixtyninee]

Arcane is working now and I have been playing it at end game, it's just fine.

[Jijipls]

Arcane is working now and I have been playing it at end game, it's just fine.

I believe Arcane is currently better than Fire (considering proper itemization) - if you disregard the fact that Fire mages can tunnel Lich King on transition - due to the fact that 2p isn't proccing off of Hot Streak whilst Missile Barrage does proc it.

[Sixtyninee]

I believe Arcane is currently better than Fire (considering proper itemization) - if you disregard the fact that Fire mages can tunnel Lich King on transition - due to the fact that 2p isn't proccing off of Hot Streak whilst Missile Barrage does proc it.

Well I just woke up and heard that Ignite is currently ticking way harder than it should be so I'm thinking Fire TTW is the top spec for the time being.

[zetoxic]

Well at what stats more or less would u consider arcane as viable?
Haste/Sp mostly.

[Sixtyninee]

I've always played arcane from a fresh 80 until end game, but that's personal preference.

[DarkenedHue]

If Arcane is fixed it should actually be roughly on par with Fire TTW single-target, and of course FFB should be so far behind it's unplayable alongside Frost, but it's doubtful that this will ever happen.

Can you provide a citation for this? While numerous sources agree with the TTW/FB > Arcane > FFB order of DPS, I have yet to see one that has said FFB was so bad it should've been as unplayable as Frost.

There's no reason it would be - it's virtually the same rotation and play-style as FB/TTW, with the only major exception being that you're spamming a spell that has a lower spell-power coefficient (115% for FB vs 100.71% for FFB), but a drastically higher crit multiplier (factoring in Ignite, FB crits do roughly 2.5x normal damage, whereas FFB crits do around 3.3x normal damage).

In the end, FFB fell behind because it couldn't keep up with the +12% overall damage buff from TTW, but to say it was as unplayable as Frost spec is quite the claim to make.

[taralej]

Let's soften it up and say FFB just falls back enough as to not consider it, compared to Fireball or Arcane. Worldoflogs shows Fireball being the top DPS spec on WotLK from all classes, together with Fury Warrs, so I'd scratch Arcane from the list too, even though it competes quite well. Fireball just has much better scaling with the end gear compared to FFB or Arcane.

https://web.archive.org/web/20101013...wn_Citadel/dps

[taralej]

Well at what stats more or less would u consider arcane as viable?
Haste/Sp mostly.

You can pick Arcane as soon as you ding 80. It has no hard requirements like Afflocks, BDKs or Combat Rogues. The spec which is more demanding is Fire because it relies heavily on crits.

[DarkenedHue]

Let's soften it up and say FFB just falls back enough as to not consider it, compared to Fireball or Arcane. Worldoflogs shows Fireball being the top DPS spec on WotLK from all classes, together with Fury Warrs, so I'd scratch Arcane from the list too, even though it competes quite well. Fireball just has much better scaling with the end gear compared to FFB or Arcane.

https://web.archive.org/web/20101013...wn_Citadel/dps

The thing you have to bear in mind with data from WOL top parses is that specs heavily dependent on RNG (like Fire mages), are going to be heavily represented at both the top and bottom, because these are the specs that swing forward and backward most drastically depending on the kind of RNG they get. What you linked is not so much an illustration of the typical damage to expect from a fire mage as it is the kind of damage to be expected when RNG is completely in your favor (as was the case for all Fire mages on that list, hence why they made the list).

For a fairer comparison I'd just consult a tool like Rawr, and yes, even Rawr points towards Fire mages being somewhat stronger than Arcane.

[SKNN]

Fire with BiS gears is far from being heavily dependent on RNG actually. Of course it's more RNG dependent than Arcane spec, so your point still stands, and Rawr is indeed a better tool to compare this kind of things.

One thing you should also consider will comparing both spec is the "difficulty" gameplay wise. You can more or less achieve top DPS by spamming two macros if you're playing Arcane, while you need to be a little more focused when playing Fire. It may be important to be able to focus more boss mechanics, which is definitely something Arcane can provide. On the other hand playing Arcane can be pretty boring, so I guess that's something to consider too.