Gearing for pvp from scratch

[Russtz]

Hey guys,

I just hit 80 a few days ago and am currently in the process of gearing up my rogue. To my understanding the only way to reallly get good gear is to do PvE, although correct me if I'm wrong. My main priority is PvP and getting in the arenas but obviously i have to have the gear to do so. Ive tried doing some research but haven't been able to get specific answers really.

So as if you were explaining it to a 5 year old where should i start to get PvP gear, mainly daggers. Right now I'm just grinding honor to buy the armor from the vendors but I see that the only weapons available for sale require a 2.2K arena rating. I'm currently using the heirloom ones and i feel like i just do terrible damage. Where should i start to get some decent daggers, if it is possible getting them through PvP only, I would prefer to do that.

Thanks in advance.

[likqansdj]

Form groups or join RDF for FoS/PoS/HoR reg/HC to gear up with some PVE items.
The only PVP weapons to buy in-game are Wrathful since this is the end of the expansion. You'll want to farm at least the iLvl 232 daggers from those dungeons.
PVE gear also gives you sustainability over your heirlooms/greens/blues while trying to farm honor in BG's, and as a rogue, the PVE gear would give higher dmg stats to help you with kills. Though, you will need to rely more heavily on your defensive CD's.

Joining a BG in greens/blues/heirlooms is how you get farmed, repeatedly. You will offer almost no help to your team other than to maybe be a meatshield and "take one for the team". PVE purples will help you get those kills, live through 2-3 hits, and all around allow you to gain more honor for those PVP items.

Sadly, that's how PVP gearing goes when it's the end of the expansion and you don't want to spend real money on Wrathfuls.

[xandor]

Doing dungeons won't help much, it is ok but the gear is kinda useless. Normal mode (farmable) is 13-51 ilvls lower than pvp gear AND it has no resilience so it won't help you in pvp.

I kinda recommend donating if you haven't to skip queue and to unlock the trade section. Then you can sell gold for coins in trade section (if you don't want to donate more) to get BiS weapons, it is extremely much faster and easier to get a BiS weapon with gold than by getting it "legit".

Join every WG, wg shoulders are ilvl 251 so they are kinda equal to relentless and only way you are getting better is if you go 2000 rating or buy them with coins. There is also several 245 ilvl items from wg and you also get 25k+ honor from doing the weekly quests so that is half a item from quests every week + 1-4k from a wg I think depending on if you win or lose.

Try to join VoA, chance for random pvp item there but probably requires you to have decen't gear (almost everyone on icecrown are like 6k+ GS so ye, they wouldn't want to take someone with hierloom daggers but still if you can get in there it is good).

Do 10 arena games a week even if you lose. You still get points so you can get relentless items.

If you haven't already got it, level engineering (hand mounted pyro rocket = 2k dmg with 45 sec cd and also a sprint, best pvp profession and kinda cheap to level)

[Shred92]

I started with gs 0 (instant 80) and I just afked in bgs and bought all I could with honour (wf cloak/neck/wrists/ring, relentless belt/boots, furious set). Then with a bit of gs go get your ashen ring. The rest (trinkets, lk weapon, etc) you will have to buy with coins. And then arena.

[likqansdj]

He asked how to gear for PVP and you guys instead basically tell him:
1. "Stay in your greens/heirlooms cause PVE is useless gear" - PVE purps > heirloom/greens in every aspect of this game, and it's instant upgrades instead of waiting AFK for your team to build honor
2. "Sit AFK for 2 weeks till you can afford the basic PVP gear, then empty your wallet on the rest" - Just pure lol. Ever joined a BG with half your team in leveling gear, and they're also sitting AFK or on follow? More like, "Sit around AFK waiting to be carried so you can carry others later that do the same."
At least spamming arena and WG was a step in the right direction for him.

BTW Russtz, you're BiS PVP weapons/trinkets/Rep Ring are PVE drops in ICC, so having some PVE gear while gearing PVP is NOT a bad choice ever. There's pugs that spam /global and clear LK every week right before reset and they take almost anyone. Closer to reset, better chance you have with low gear.

If you're worried about having wrathful weapons, don't be. They have very low resil, lower iLvl than BiS PVE weapons, and the difference between NM ICC weps, Wrathful weps, and HC ICC weps is in reality minor. If you can't kill someone with NM ICC weps, then Wrathful/HC ICC weps wouldn't have changed that. It's not some dramatic boost from the top end avg dmg. Your gear scales to itself. The better your other gear is in relation to your weapons, the better your weapons are.

[Shred92]

Yeah good luck getting 277/284 stuff from pugs, ****ing lol

[likqansdj]

Clearly, you skipped the last paragraph.
Also, I've pugged 9/12 HC a few times. It's a 9yr old expansion with scripted bosses that do the same thing every time you engage them, on timers. Believe it or not, there are people that can manage to remember a boss fight longer than 30 seconds and some of them are on this server.

HC Gunship has 277HC offhand, 277HC chest, and 277HC cloak - EASILY puggable every week
HC Marrowgar has 277HC boots, and 277HC ring - This fight is not much different on HC
HC Festergut has 277HC mainhand and 277HC legs - Same fight as reg with more damage
HC Bloodqueen only gives a 264HC wep and 264HC ranged in 10 and nothing in 25 - Included as another HC farmable boss
If you can do those on normal, you can do those on HC. 1/3 of ICC is basic.
There's also Ruby Sanctum for easy 271NM and 284HC items. It's literally moving in a circle around the boss, stacked with everyone else that's slowly moving, and avoiding the obvious fire on the ground. He's a rogue, that's all he does that fight.
Again, refer to the 1st line of this post to cover the other 284's.

[Russtz]

Clearly, you skipped the last paragraph.
Also, I've pugged 9/12 HC a few times. It's a 9yr old expansion with scripted bosses that do the same thing every time you engage them, on timers. Believe it or not, there are people that can manage to remember a boss fight longer than 30 seconds and some of them are on this server.

HC Gunship has 277HC offhand, 277HC chest, and 277HC cloak - EASILY puggable every week
HC Marrowgar has 277HC boots, and 277HC ring - This fight is not much different on HC
HC Festergut has 277HC mainhand and 277HC legs - Same fight as reg with more damage
HC Bloodqueen only gives a 264HC wep and 264HC ranged in 10 and nothing in 25 - Included as another HC farmable boss
If you can do those on normal, you can do those on HC. 1/3 of ICC is basic.
There's also Ruby Sanctum for easy 271NM and 284HC items. It's literally moving in a circle around the boss, stacked with everyone else that's slowly moving, and avoiding the obvious fire on the ground. He's a rogue, that's all he does that fight.
Again, refer to the 1st line of this post to cover the other 284's.

I appreciate all your help/info.

But don't you have to have certain gear score to even be allowed into ICC (isn't that the final raid in this expansion?) along with knowing the boss fights? This is pretty much all brand new to me so I have no idea how the fights work/what kind of gear score you need etc. Also can I just jump into ICC or do I need to do any quest lines first?

Sorry, I know these questions seem silly probably to most but again have no idea what I'm doing. Just trying to pvp but obviously need the gear first and I'm willing to do PvE to obtain it but I just have no idea where to start.

[likqansdj]

All raids in WOTLK can be entered the second you hit 80, no worries there.

Ruby Sanctum is actually the last raid of the expansion and most groups require 6k+, tho it's not even close to HC ICC difficulty. You can attempt it as soon as you're comfortable in ICC honestly.

Most ICC raids require 5.8+ GS but when it gets close to the weekly reset I mentioned, most pug groups will take anyone to fill spots. IMO, 5k+ GS is the minimum I would take into my raids as a leader, but I strayed from that and did my 1st full ICC at 4.8+ (as main tank), setting it up myself to bypass anyone else's GS limits. (you can join ICC reputation runs at any iLvl and farm trash for the Rep Ring which is BiS and also random BoE epics to sell. No one cares about iLvl with trash)

Trial of the Crusader NM would be the stepping stone raid between RDF HC and ICC, as it drops 232-245 iLvl gear. It's very easy with people 4.5k+ and there's 0 trash with 5 bosses. Most pugs clear it with minimal wipes in under an hour. No need to attempt Trial of the Crusader HC unless you decide you like the raid and want 258iLvl gear from much harder fights. (most pugs down 4/5 but HC Anub'arak isn't a joking matter for pugs)

If you would like to send me a message, I can explain every fight from ToC, ICC, and Ruby Sanctum in quick detail for you, including your personal role as a rogue. There's also 3-8minute vids on youtube of every fight in the game with how-to's if you're interested to see them before you try them.

[Mercy]

The comments about how PvE gear is useless;
While it is true that you remain squishy, you do gain throughput. But also, most importantly, you can use the emblems that you earn to purchase some basic PvP gear from a vendor. It's Furious PvP gear, as I recall. And if you don't want to use your Emblems of Frost on PvE gear, then you can use it for Relentless PvP gear.

[KomodoV01]

using emblems of frost for the relentless set is not a wise choice

[likqansdj]

using emblems of frost for the relentless set is not a wise choice

One small caveat to this is that we play on Warmane. If you're patient and play at the right time of year, you can farm 100's of Frost Emblems within days without ever doing a dungeon/raid and buy every piece of badge gear from any vendor.
WTB Snowmen in the summer!

[Meowto]

To start off, you should collect points every day (log into your account, my account -> collect points), you can only buy furious gear with it but you can get furious weapons/offhand or save some honour.


So, firstly if you still need honour, get into fos/pos and do the whole normal, farm, hor, farm repeat fos/pos/hor on heroic till you have most the things you need. You will need pve gear for the raids you have to run. Next is WG run it every time, you want the shoulders and the trinket. Next is 5man toc trinket farm (since honour wont get you any good trinkets, and i assume u are human). In 4-5k pve you can start farming bgs to get your wrathfull offpieces, you can skip some of the pve and just afk it out but rogues are among the few classes who dont care about resiliance in bgs so much, you can show up, gank a target and move on. As a rogue you can actually do a lot to help in every bg no matter your GS (if you just sap a bis geared char 3 times every DR you are already helping, you can capture flags and chain stun people with dance).

You also want to farm your ashen ring, its the icc rep rings, you can do rep runs where you clear the thrash before the first boss over and over and over till you get exalted.

Now comes the hard part, up to now everything is just a matter of time investement and can be done by everyone. But now comes the harder part.

So to start there are two ways to gear a rogue, you either go AP or ARP (which is better). You cant go ARP unless you are a donor or are raiding in a guild since you need every item to be pve bar 4-5 (basicely main set bar helmet or with helmet, depending on how low you wanna go with resiliance). So AP it is, for AP your best trinket is Deaths Verdict, which is easily farmable, TOC10mn usually requires 4-5k+gs to get into (here your farmed pve gear comes in handy) so you do that every week (but beware, every melee in there will be rolling against you). You also want to get into VOA runs to get wrathfull (or relentless gear)

You can ever try to get the HC and the normal version at once.

Next, as likqansdj said you will want to start pugging ICC every week, just go as far as you can and try to get all the gear. You should also try to get some gear (ranged for example) with emblems so that means running at least your dairly HC dungeon. Try also to get into RS. Just get all the gear you can (you wont to start raiding ICC and RS heroic at some point for them ARP items.


Now for the actual pvp part, you want to do 10 games a week every week for AP. Some wrathfull pieces are easily obtainable, but save your points for now.
So now its time to get the weapon. This part heavily depends on your dedication, exp and skill and friends. You need 1800 cr to buy the t1 pvp weapons for AP. And 1800 is easily reachable for a 5k gs rogue (which is lucky, not every class can), if you are good and have a good partner who is geared that is. So if you know a properly good bis shadow priest? If yes, just have him carry you up to 1800 and get it. But since i doubt that you have to do what all people without friends have to do, buy yourself some.

Start grinding gold, mining, herb picking, farming fire in wg whatever. Get some gold and pay some gladiator shadow a lot of gold to carry you to 1800. After that its just a matter of spamming arenas, getting AP for the wrathfull gear. Getting pve pieces to get further into ICC and get them trinkets from TOC.

So summary, 10 games every week, every raid past ulduar + VOA every week. And try to get as high as you can with the gear you have. Meanwhile farm all the honour you need, get the gold you need, get professions up and go from htere.



Or donate 30 bucks (since 20 bucks is 22 coins and a HC item is 23) and buy yourself the BIS weapon (heavens fall).



Alternatively you can farm gold, sell it for coins, use those coins to buy yourself bis.

[Mercy]

using emblems of frost for the relentless set is not a wise choice

Generally speaking, it's wise to provide reasons for such statements.

Tier or other gear items? I already provided the context of "If you don't want to use your Emblems of Frost on PvE gear".

Primordial Saronite? If you want the gear crafted with them, or if you want to sell them for gold, there are other more productive and efficient ways to earn the gold and then buy the crafted items directly without bothering with trying to save up Primordial Saronite for crafting.

Then what else? Shadowmourne? That's restricted to 3 classes out of 10, and even then requires PvE to which is kind-of excluded if the person doesn't give a rat's backside about PvE.

[KomodoV01]

because its so easy to get via pvp, even then its better to go straight to wrathful set from furious. 60-95 emblems to get one piece of gear (which is bad in this meta) is not worth the time needed to get them.

considering the initial post of 'i just hit 80 the other day' which indicates he is not a end game raid farmer, its simply not worth wasting emblems on the relentless set