1. 3 Weeks Ago  

    Black Temple

    Is "timewalking" Black Temple going to drop ulduar loot ? Can we get something else and not ulduar loot, i will be frank i hate the concept of bt25 giving same loot as ulduar and im sure more people hate it too.

  2. 3 Weeks Ago  
    You have Icecrown and Lordaeron for TBC Tmog runs or even better - TBC servers. Frostmourne is seasonal realm, so deal with it and wait next years end of it for Icecrown transfer and 24/7 farm of Outland dungeons at your will

  3. 3 Weeks Ago  
    I'd like to clarify something - Frostmourne features timewalking events, in order to compensate the absence of the double ID reset.

    Last year, people farmed the same raid instance twice, in order to obtain more items for their toons. However, the issue with that, at least for the majority of players, was the physical and mental fatigue, which some users experienced when staying "competitive" and raiding twice a week. For that reason, many people asked warmane to remove the double ID reset, in order to make the competitiveness less stressful and time-consuming.

    However, an issue was about to arise from that, which regarded the gearing dilemma. So, in order to satisfy both sides, warmane decided to compromise - they would remove the double ID feature, but in its absence they would create "timewalking" events, where people would be able to obtain "gear from lesser quality than what can be found in the most difficult modes of the current raid tier", i.e. players have the opportunity to catch-up on gear and to experience the old raids on a more buffed scale.

    Also: "The items will also posses pre-applied Burning Crusade transmog appearances", so if you were to farm BT for transmog, you'd still be able to get the desired flashy items.




    • Considering feedback from the playerbase regarding double resets, we have decided to remove double instance resets in their entirety. In its place we want to add a feature that many lovers of old will appreciate. Every content tier of Frostmourne will feature a timewalking experience where a Burning Crusade raid will be scaled up to Wrath of the Lich King challenge levels. We plan for this feature to be as an additional thing to do, in order to bridge the gear gap and an additional fun optional experience for players of Frostmourne. The gear contained within will be Wrath of the Lich King raid items of lesser quality than what can be found in the most difficult modes of the current raid tier. The items will also posses pre-applied Burning Crusade transmog appearances. More information pertaining timewalking will come in a separate thread. Additionally, we plan to offer timewalking periods later in the season, featuring prominent dungeons of the past.


    There will be only one raid reset, but a timewalking optional raid instance will be available.
    Edited: 3 Weeks Ago

  4. 3 Weeks Ago  
    You are making this all about items and not about progress, 1 ID per week is plenty to progress and get gear anything else than that is just chore for gear, clearly 1 raid will be easier than the other which kills the meaning of progress even more, im not against having loot in bt25 but for it to be the same as ulduar25 is ridiculous idea it becomes just a chore raid.
    I liked the idea of having 10man timewalking because its not the main raid and yet it still dropped some bis items like caster wand from prince, but having 2 end game raids that drop the same gear is just as dumb as using the +1 rule for guild runs.
    Theres no double ID in icecrown or lordaeron, its the first time im hearing such complaint that 1 id is somehow not enough for an end game raiding.... guilds make multiple runs if 1 is not enough. The only argument someone can have about whats good about double ID of end game content is focused gear on main char if thats the case why not just increase drop amounts.
    Imo BT25 having same loot as ulduar25 is just a waste of time, and this is coming from a guy that can raid every day.

    It is not optional raid if it drops end game gear even if u exclude hardmodes loot it is still not an optional raid its a mandatory raid that has to be ran.

  5. 3 Weeks Ago  
    You have Icecrown and Lordaeron for TBC Tmog runs or even better - TBC servers. Frostmourne is seasonal realm, so deal with it and wait next years end of it for Icecrown transfer and 24/7 farm of Outland dungeons at your will
    Im not sure u understood what i said so let me repeat it, i dislike the concept of timewalking raids dropping end game gear because they become a chore and not an optional thing to do, i dont want to spend time in BT simply for a chance of getting ulduar gear it makes no sense.
    Alot of people are here because of the progressive release of content and because of ulduar, when ulduar comes out it will be end game tier and i would like to progress ulduar without being FORCED to do BT25, if BT25 drops same gear as uld25 its pretty much mandatory raid and not an optional one like kara10.

  6. 3 Weeks Ago  
    You are making this all about items and not about progress, 1 ID per week is plenty to progress and get gear anything else than that is just chore for gear, clearly 1 raid will be easier than the other which kills the meaning of progress even more, im not against having loot in bt25 but for it to be the same as ulduar25 is ridiculous idea it becomes just a chore raid.
    I liked the idea of having 10man timewalking because its not the main raid and yet it still dropped some bis items like caster wand from prince, but having 2 end game raids that drop the same gear is just as dumb as using the +1 rule for guild runs.
    Theres no double ID in icecrown or lordaeron, its the first time im hearing such complaint that 1 id is somehow not enough for an end game raiding.... guilds make multiple runs if 1 is not enough. The only argument someone can have about whats good about double ID of end game content is focused gear on main char if thats the case why not just increase drop amounts.
    Imo BT25 having same loot as ulduar25 is just a waste of time, and this is coming from a guy that can raid every day.

    It is not optional raid if it drops end game gear even if u exclude hardmodes loot it is still not an optional raid its a mandatory raid that has to be ran.
    Before I continue with my post, I'll just say once again that players' feedback influenced this decision. Unless the majority suddenly follow your opinion, I doubt that we will lose our second source of gear next season. Then again, I am still confused about the wording of the loot drops - so it might be the case that we obtain Ulduar 10 items from BT. Also, if you click on this link:

    http://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=433199

    you'll see some user-made suggestions regarding the double ID reset and the loot dilemma and the criticism against it.
    I'll continue.

    Yes, you are right to claim that making the timewalking events drop relevant tier items would make them less optional and more like obligatory chores. I see where you are coming from, however we shouldn't forget that unlike Icecrown/Lordearon Frostmourne is a seasonal server, where the four phases last around 3 months (some more, while others less). VVe have a finite amount of IDs before the next patch comes live, and for that reason (competitive) people want to get their hands on good loot for their mains before it's too late. Believe it or not, but my current guild tried to farm "Betrayer" from KT, and not a single one dropped - instead, we only got "Last Laugh" in abundance. Usually it's easy to obtain many good Naxx items, because the same gear pieces can drop from various bosses. The same can't be said for Uld, ToC, ICC, and RS. As you can see, item-drop RNG is also a serious argument for the loot dilemma. Is it necessary to have BiS gear, in order to do the next-tier raids? No, it's not, and these guys proved it:


    (they cleared LoD on the second ID in the first week by having some ToC, ToGC, and ICCnm/hc items)

    But some people here want to do speedruns, and for them every bit of gear matters. It's their choice to play like that, and they wouldn't be happy to lose one extra source of gear.
    Spoiler: Show
    Personally, I don't really care about the hardmode/heroic loot that much - I just love raiding with my main and facing challenges.
    But, Kova, why not increase the loot?

    This was suggested in the thread I shared with you above, and it was rejected by many people. The biggest critique was that "players would get more loot for less effort", which wouldn't seem fair towards IC or Lorde players.
    Edited: 3 Weeks Ago Reason: correcting some mistakes

  7. 3 Weeks Ago  
    You said it yourself, you dont need bis to be able to clear end game content and the game has no obligation to give you bis gear for set amount of time, the concept of the realm is progression and not gear whoring, i would be one of those people that couldnt get KT wep and i dont care about it, if you care that much then theres coin shop (of which i am against).
    I dont understand how can anyone see this as a compromise but not as putting shackles on players, we all agree that if it drops 25uld gear its not optional.
    The argument that you might be missing 1 piece of gear on couple of your players is not real argument if you want to argue about the benefits of bt having same loot table as uld.
    My firm belief is that some part of bt will be easier than uld resulting in easier loot, and lets just say the reverse and bt would be harder than uld, how can that make sense on a progression realm ? so its either easier or harder and both make no sense, i suppose you could say that bt wont drop uld hm loot but so what ? it will still give you most of your bis items.
    The main feature of this realm was that it was seasonal, meaning you have limited time to do what you can and after that its the next tier, majority of the people joined for that purpose to experience tier progression and buffed content not to be shackled by "optional " content which they will have to do every week.

    I didnt read the whole topic youve sent and i doubt i will find any valid argument for double reset or another raid giving top tier loot because of simple logic.
    A handful of people arguing for more loot when no real argument can be given is just a handful of people begging for loot.
    Any time people are given the "option" of doing something the easy way the majority of them will choose to do so, this is why gamemasters should not pay attention to these kind of things, just look at what happend with Karazhan....you could reset your ID so guilds ran 5-10 kz runs a day and those same people are the ones that would argue for extra loot.

    Edit:
    Item drop rng is just that, rng. For some people it may take a year of raiding the same content to get full bis, that doesnt mean there should be 3 id resets per week.
    The only content that should matter is the last tier released, anything else should be optional beneficial but not mandatory.
    Edited: 3 Weeks Ago

  8. 3 Weeks Ago  
    1) Pardon my ignorance, but I didn't know that people could reset their Kara id multiple times. Honestly, I didn't bother to do that raid. IF that's the case with BT, and IF BT ends up dropping Uld 25 loot, then I'd agree with you that that might be too much.

    2) Speaking of BT dropping Uld 25 items, I asked this question in this thread:

    http://forum.warmane.com/showthread....=1#post3119316

    You can check it from time to time and see whether Proterean answered my question.
    Regarding this topic - I don't know what else to say, mate. I think that changing the loot table in the timewalking events would be considered only if more people provided the warmane staff with negative feedback. Up until now, I haven't stumbled upon any complaints in that regard - neither from my fellow guild mates, nor people in /global chat, nor people on the forums. The only complaint I remember was how players got fed up with Naxx. VVith my previous posts I just wanted to inform you about the reasons why that compromise was considered this time around. You are more than welcome to criticise that decision, but I don't think you'll change anything if at the end of the day you are part of the minority. Just my two cents.
    Edited: 3 Weeks Ago

  9. 3 Weeks Ago  
    Well, obviously noone would complain about extra loot just like noone complained that you could reset kara id without any limit, this is why gamemasters shouldnt put that much faith into what people in the forum say unless its backed up by decent arguments.
    For example i could justify extra loot if the top tier raid was taking on average more time to be cleared than the 3 month window but clearly that isnt the case and its unlikely to be. And its not like thats the argument peopl are making considering clearing lod in 1 or 2 ids after release.

  10. 3 Weeks Ago  
    Then, if I may ask a provocative question, what do you plan to achieve with this thread, knowing that people care about the loot more so than the "concept of progression"? Like, I am not mocking you for having a legit objective opinion and wanting to express it on the forums, but I'm afraid it's not going to come to the attention of the staff.
    Edited: 3 Weeks Ago

  11. 2 Weeks Ago  
    I'd just like to ask for a definitive asnwer on the issue of BT's loot: is it dropping Naxx or Ulduar loot?

  12. 1 Week Ago  
    Joined a run that started at Supremus with first boss down. Bosses seem to drop Emblems of Valor and items from 25 man Ulduar boss loot tables, and the trash mobs drop items from the 25 man Ulduar trash mob loot table.

    Loot tables for Black Temple bosses and their corresponding 25 man Ulduar boss loot tables look like this...

    High Warlord Naj'entus = Flame Leviathan
    Supremus = Ignis the Furnace Master
    Shade of Akama = Kologarn
    Teron Gorefiend = XT-002 Deconstructor
    Gurtogg Bloodboil = Auriaya
    Reliquary of Souls = Iron Council

    Didn't get further because group didn't even want to attempt Mother. :/ No tier tokens for me

  13. 1 Week Ago  
    Has mother been fixed? I heard she was overtuned I've seen 1 guild kill her so far

  14. 1 Week Ago  
    Has mother been fixed? I heard she was overtuned I've seen 1 guild kill her so far
    According to the site, 9 guilds have killed Mother so far.

    http://armory.warmane.com/pveladder/...a%5B%5D=heroic

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