WotLK What is a Good Spec and Rotation for Leveling/Dungeons?

[OuchmyHead]

I've never played DK and so am really struggling with the class. I went blood spec due to the appeal of extra healing. TBH, I haven't a clue what I'm doing and my DPS suffers greatly because of it.

Even when leveling, I find it takes a long while to kill anything. I wanted to Tank some dungeons, but for me, DK is far less intuitive than say, Warrior or Paladin. I can never do enough damage to keep mobs on me, which I suspect is due to my misunderstanding of runes and how to use them.

What I normally do is apply Icy touch, Plague strike and Pestilence. Then spam whatever abilities I have runes for, typically Blood strike and Death coil and maybe Death strike if I'm low on HP.

I don't really understand how to use Blood boil effectively or efficiently. It doesn't do much damage for me and you can only really use it every now and then. So I've pretty much run out of ideas on how to boost damage.

Should I even be trying to tank as Blood at lvl 72? Or should I switch to another spec? Any tips are appreciated.

[SilverFlash]

For dps,i would recommend unholy,simply because it can ignore one of the two key melee stats,while blood and frost really,really needs it. The stat is ofc expertise. Unholy also has decent aoe capabilities even at low gear,so there's that. Getting dodges is frustrating,but it's not as much of a dps killer as it is for blood or frost.


For tanking,dks have some great and some terrible qualities. Aoe tanking is your worst enemy(it's janky even on frost/unholy),so get used to either not holding everything(especially undergeared/underlevelled),or: telling the dps to wait a couple of seconds with aoe,get ignored,dps takes aggro,dumdum dps dies,you get blamed.
On the other hand,you have amazing st threat,burst threat,ranged threat,and ****load of cooldowns(mainly on blood).

For aoe(3 or more targets),you generally open up with D&D,IT&PS the most dangerous target,use pestilence,and then you have the option to...
Blood Tap to unlock a blood rune to Blood Boil,however BT has a 1 min cd,and nobody will wait 1 min between packs,so use it when you really,REALLY need that aoe threat on 3 or more targets.
Tab target and spam aviable Rune Strikes. It's very much like a warrior's Revenge combined with Heroic Strike,except worse for multi-target but better for st. Make sure you have it macro'd to everything you'll use so you can use it without thinking(carefully mash while runes on cd as to not miss some RS casts).

Alternatively,you can pull with multiple IT&PS,but that requires you to be ahead of the trigger happy group by quite a few secs,so D&D is the basic aoe opener you'll use 99% of the time,except for two targets,which simply you can IT+IT+PS+PS.

With that out of the way,rune usage is then dependant on spec. But generally i go like this - if i need aggro without putting myself in danger aka getting healed properly,i'm spamming IT and use the rest of the runes as fillers for extra threat/cooldowns.
If i need or will need healing,i'll start saving runes for DS/cooldowns that use runes.
Generalized, blood will be your utility rune for cd and frost/uh will be your healing/threat rune.

Blood Boil will always deal **** damage,it's used more of a filler(for dps)/extra aoe threat(in this case obviously use it when needed) to burn your blood runes on with a high number of slowly dying mobs.

The spec i'm using for blood(tank) is a MT spec for raids,but it can also work for dungeons once you get used to it(note that aoe threat will be a bigger issue with this spec) - https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#j0ERqchf...g0xcMIz:ipm0Mm

As for tanking on 72 with blood? Yes,ofc it works,the other tank specs do as well.

Surely others will correct me if i screwed something up,bc i'm way more of a casual dk player,i just shared what works for me most of the time.

[angrylol]

1st, don't learn 2 things at once, will lessen your confusion. I'd suggest learning dps first, then expand on it to be a tank.

You should look at your "rotation" in "cycles". Start and the end of each cycle is when you refresh diseases. However for tanking this is not a priority, but recommendation

Tanking with DK means you will have to constantly switch targets(when necessary), hit whoever has lesser threat. Target 1 auto attack, target 2 blood strike, target 3 death coil, target 4 auto attack(with rune strike), just an example. Blood Boil is meh and you can remove it from your Actionbar if you want, wont loose anything, only use for it is getting initial threat when someone else pulled and all you have is 1 Blood Rune. Switching targets and doing it properly is the way.

Do not macro Rune Strike, you need to be in control of your Runic Power. Don't die lame death because you spent RP on rune Strike and now you don't have enough for Icebound Fortitude.

Now for DPS;

Your rotation is split into 3 things:
1. Keep Diseases up on all targets
2. Spend runes and don't break 1.
3. Spend Runic Power and don't break 1. and 2.

It all lines up perfectly, you will have Runes ready to refresh Diseases and you will have things to spend Runes on in between. And you will have time to spend Runic Power before Runes are ready again and you need to refresh Diseases.

Notice what kinds of Runes abilities use. Blood Strike or Pestilence, both use Blood, so it's a choice depending on situation. Death Strike uses Frost+Unholy Runes, same as IT+PS(refresh Diseases), so you use Death Strike, unless you have to refresh diseases.

Go to dummy and use only Runes, use them as they come off CD and keep Diseases up at the same time, You will notice that "cycle" or "rotation". You will notice multiple seconds of "nothing to do", that's where you use stuff and spend Runic Power.

[morfagor]

I'd suggest mate to not get overcomplicated and learn dps first.
Then, as far as tanking on AoE using death and decay really helps a lot.
Anyways @Angrylol gave a pretty good explanation.

[SilverFlash]

Do not macro Rune Strike, you need to be in control of your Runic Power. Don't die lame death because you spent RP on rune Strike and now you don't have enough for Icebound Fortitude.

This is one of the two things i disagree with,but then again i use a very specific build.
My linked build has 0 RP issues,mostly due to Scent of Blood,and generally you'll spend enough runes to generate the rest of the RP needed. I do agree that macroing it on dps is a bad idea tho,both for dps and survival.

I also forgot to mention that you don't use BS as a blood tank,you use Heart Strike.

Blood Boil is meh and you can remove it from your Actionbar if you want, wont loose anything, only use for it is getting initial threat when someone else pulled and all you have is 1 Blood Rune. Switching targets and doing it properly is the way.

It would be the way,but ain't nobody gonna wait for that sadly. Impatient dps is always an issue,but with the most used tank spec being the weakest in terms of aoe threat,it's more dire. You'll want to use BB even as you proceed to tab target/click through the mobs for even that slight aoe threat boost. Because SoC,DS,WW,Cleave goes brrrr for the dps.

Otherwise i agree,learn to dps first to get a hang of the rune system the easier way.

[OuchmyHead]

Thanks a lot for the detailed replies guys. I tried tanking a few dungeons yesterday after practicing using/incorporating D&D into my rotation. I think the issue I was struggling with the most is that D&D, at least for me, is a very precious commodity. It seems I just need to get better at managing runes and using it at the right times.

Something I noticed while on my Warrior, is that while AOE threat per use doesn't seem as potent as D&D, the cooldowns are extremely short by comparison. I miss having that sort of wiggle room with DK. Like if a pull goes bad, I have an assortment of auxiliary AOE threat. But on DK, if you somehow waste your D&D, it becomes very frantic trying to single target mobs with Icy touch.

As much as Blood boil disappoints me with it's damage, it did come into play a few times for moments when I needed just a whisker more AOE threat and for those pesky non-elite mobs that are sprinkled around between mobs. It also helped a bit in guiding pulls onto my misplaced D&D's.

I used to think that Warrior and Pally tanking was hard, but I have a newfound respect for how much management is involved for DK tanking, at least at lower levels. I guess one could argue that with enough gear any tanking class/spec becomes easy. I just find DK to be far less forgiving due to those long CD's and lack of AOE abilities.

I thought I had Rune strike macro'd to auto-attack but when I press it, it does not do the auto-attack. This is a huge problem for me as I struggle to target mobs in big groups. Most of the time I end up clicking on party members or looting mid-fight.

The first dungeon I did was going well until I decided to pull all 4 mobs around Prince Keleseth and healer could not keep me up. Probably my own fault for not managing my runes properly. He left with no Ill-will, and as I waited for another healer, I was berated by two other party members for not continuing without a healer. That dungeon was a bust as I did not want to continue at that point.

The next two dungeons went near perfectly, with the small exception of me falling off the platform in Nexus lol. Still having major struggles with targeting and my rune management still sucks- not really because I don't know what to do, but more due to the fact that I panic a lot and start spamming everything. In the end, I was just happy that I held aggro pretty well throughout both dungeons.


Again, thanks a bunch for the detailed info everyone, I'm still trying to process all of it. :)

[angrylol]

I think tanks taking Heart Strike is rare, also it would be even more reason to ditch Blood Boil in favor of it.
And I doubt Blood Boil will help with threat from Cleave goes brrr

Blood tank threat is dire, because you waste Blood rune on Blood Boil and expect it to help with aoe threat. Cleaves and divine storms, sounds bad, but then you realize that dnd+diesaeses perfectlyy keeps mob on you and those 1-3 "spiky" targets you can manage by switching targets. Why cast Blood Boil and in the end put extra little threat on that one mob you actually need more threat on? You can just switch to that mob and HS/BS.

I guess that depends on player.

Idk what kind of spec you use, but I usually go for spec like this to level/entry farm dungeons at 80:
https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#j0ERqIhc...g0xZcgh:mip0mV
First pick Blood tree, then Unholy tree, then Frost tree.

Things like extra 3% spell hit, 15sec CD on DND will make you way more realiable and smooth in dungeons. Death Rune Mastery is grand, it opens up insane flexibility and boosts your threat potential into sky, you get 2 extra(optional) IT casts each Rune cycle. Extra duration on Diseases will let you reliably maximize Runes and refresh with Pestilence, maximizing Death Rune Mastery.

[OuchmyHead]

I think tanks taking Heart Strike is rare, also it would be even more reason to ditch Blood Boil in favor of it.
And I doubt Blood Boil will help with threat from Cleave goes brrr

Blood tank threat is dire, because you waste Blood rune on Blood Boil and expect it to help with aoe threat. Cleaves and divine storms, sounds bad, but then you realize that dnd+diesaeses perfectlyy keeps mob on you and those 1-3 "spiky" targets you can manage by switching targets. Why cast Blood Boil and in the end put extra little threat on that one mob you actually need more threat on? You can just switch to that mob and HS/BS.

I guess that depends on player.

Idk what kind of spec you use, but I usually go for spec like this to level/entry farm dungeons at 80:
https://wotlkdb.com/?talent#j0ERqIhc...g0xZcgh:mip0mV
First pick Blood tree, then Unholy tree, then Frost tree.

Things like extra 3% spell hit, 15sec CD on DND will make you way more realiable and smooth in dungeons. Death Rune Mastery is grand, it opens up insane flexibility and boosts your threat potential into sky, you get 2 extra(optional) IT casts each Rune cycle. Extra duration on Diseases will let you reliably maximize Runes and refresh with Pestilence, maximizing Death Rune Mastery.

You are probably right about the efficacy of Blood boil. Though I think it's relevant for a person like myself who struggles with targeting. For me, it's far easier/quicker to use Blood boil in those dire moments when half a second counts. The most useful application for me is when DPS start AOE'ing before mobs settle on my D&D, where I will just run through them with Blood boil and lead them to my D&D.

I have both D&D and Death grip CD reduction talents. I kind of specced into all three trees, but primarily Blood. In Blood tree, I stopped at Heart strike. Not entirely convinced I need to go any further, at least not at the moment.

I am tempted to respec Frost just to try out Howling blast. I feel that could help a lot with my current situation.

[angrylol]

Yeah, that's a good use of Bloodboil, it might have been designed to collect mobs while your DND is on CD.

If you don't have already, find a good addon for nameplates, preferrably that show threat too on each mob, in % or colorcode. Very useful, will assist you in tanking greatly.

[OuchmyHead]

Yeah, that's a good use of Bloodboil, it might have been designed to collect mobs while your DND is on CD.

If you don't have already, find a good addon for nameplates, preferrably that show threat too on each mob, in % or colorcode. Very useful, will assist you in tanking greatly.

Thanks man. I had a look on legacy-wow but not sure what I'm looking for exactly. Many of the Unit Frame addons appear to be missing any illustrations. I'm a little dubious about that lol.