I was looking into this server and noticed players putting up guides referencing an expertise bonus on weapon specialization racials. I hadn't seen WotLK since 2009, but I was certain that these racials were converted to 1% crit bonuses instead of expertise. I checked it and I was right, patch 2.3 of TBC changed all of these racial bonuses from 5 expertise to 1% crit chance.
I'm wondering if this server is using the older racial versions from an older xpac intentionally.
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Member
Are the wrong Weapon Spec racials being used intentionally?
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Forum Veteran
TBC 2.3 https://wowwiki-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_2.3.0
There is no converstion from "expertise" into "crit" there
I read, about items's bonus, a convertion from "Weapon skill" into "Expertise":
About, about racials,All items have had their bonuses to Weapon Skill Rating converted to a new stat called Weapon Expertise Rating
Btw it seems Blizzard changed "Mace" and "Sword" racial from "1% crit" -> to "x% expertise" afterward.Dwarf: Gun Specialization now increases chance to critically hit with Guns by 1% rather than increasing weapon skill.
Gnome: Escape Artist cooldown increased to 1 min, 45 sec.
Humans: Mace Skill now increases the critical strike chance with maces and two-handed maces by 1%.
Humans: Sword Skill now increases the critical strike chance with swords and two-handed swords by 1%.
Orcs: Axe Skill now increases the critical strike chance with axes and two-handed axes by 1%.
Troll: Bow and Thrown Specialization now increases chance to critically hit with those weapons by 1% rather than increasing weapon skill.
Indeed
TBC 2.4.3 database: http://tbc.cavernoftime.com/spell=20864
Wotlk 3.3.5 database http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=20864
TBC-Classic database: https://tbc.wowhead.com/spell=20864/mace-specialization
It is always about expertise, for Mace and Sword specialization.
So it is not a warmane custom changeEdited: January 11, 2022
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Member
Even in your link it's written clearly that the racial bonuses were changed from 5 expertise to 1% crit. No matter what WotLK patch is being used, the proper effect of those racial abilities is to add 1% crit, not 5 expertise, and not 3 expertise. At no point during WotLK was the effect then changed again to 1% expertise, so it's irrelevant what later change was during a later xpac. I can personally attest that during 2008-2010 those racial bonuses were for 1% crit and not 5 expertise; that's a substantial difference.
No matter which way you slice it, warmane is using the wrong effects on these racials. I'm asking if that's intentional, and if so I'd like to know why.
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Forum Veteran
I am not sure if you are trolling or not but I guess you have missed the point.
When you log in-game and you read this:
"Mace Specialization": "Expertise with Maces and Two-Handed Maces increased by 3."
That info comes from your client. So doesn't this give you any doubt about the fact that:
"patch 2.3: Humans: Sword Skill now increases the critical strike chance with swords and two-handed swords by 1%."
got changed before of 2.4.3?
2.3 patch got launched on 13 November 2007
Check how the wiki page of "Racial" changed:
Before 2.3: Racial page as 05-nov-2007
After 2.3 Racial page as 31 January 2008 (as you like, it shows 1% crit)
But look around 2.4 patch and later:
Racials page as 23 June 2008 (so 2.4.2)
Racials page as 22 August 2008 (so 2.4.3)
Racials page as 22 November 2008 (so 3.0.3)
Racials page as 04 August 2010 (so 3.3.5)
It always mention experise for "Mace" and "Sword" specialization
Unless you think this is a conspiracy against you, do you at least have a doubt it should not work as you mentioned?
Or you are still 100% sure that you are right?Edited: January 11, 2022
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Member
I'm not debating what warmane shows. The effects can be set to whatever they please. Perhaps human's got a different treatment back in 2007 because of their dual weapon passives. However, I know that the authentic effect of ax specialization for orcs during WotLK is to increase crit chance with axes by 1%, not to increase expertise by 5.
No, I don't think there is a conspiracy, I'm asking why certain racials have been left in pre-wotlk states.
It's actually quite confusing to reference online sources as many of the conversions from weapon skill into expertise during 2.3 is being listed as a change into 1% crit, which didn't happen until WotLK if memory serves.Edited: January 11, 2022
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Forum Veteran
again, you keep missing the point.
It is NOT warmane that shows 3% or 5% expertise on those spell's tooltip. It is the client made by Blizzard that shows that.
so, even if those racials show "expertise" on 3.3.5 game's tooltip you still believe they should provide "crit"?
Fine. I guess there is an easy way to find out if you are right or not.
If those racials were providing "Expertise" you will see them mentioned on PvE guide written during Retail-Wotlk (since it would help to reach the soft-cap that melee needs to avoid dodge from bosses)
When I think about "PvE retail guide" it usually came to my mind "Elitistjerks". I guess you know what is it.
Lets check this Warrior-pve-dps thread: https://web.archive.org/web/20091107...imple_answers/
On a post with "November/14/2008" as date, so 3.0.3 patch, about the expertise required for warrior I see this:
It mentions "+3" and "+5" racials.
In my opinion he is talking about:
+3 = http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=20864 (human racial)
+5 = http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=59224 (dwarf racial) / http://wotlk.cavernoftime.com/spell=20574 (orc racial)
What is your opinion instead?Edited: January 11, 2022
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Forum Veteran
Btw on my previous posts I thought you were talking about Human/dwarf racials.
So now that you have specified you were talking about "Orc racial", check this:
https://tbc.wowhead.com/spell=20574/...ation#comments
I see x2 comments:
(basically he says that even if "2.3 patche notes" says it should now provide 1% crit -> it is giving +5% expertise in reality2007/Nov/14 (Patch 2.3.0)
Not only was a 1% crit chance instead of 5 weapon skill announced way ahead of the new patch,but it also appears during the patching process and in the .txt file containing the changes as 1 CRIT chance.However,in game it`s a measly 5 expertize rating.No crit,no nothing.Same with humans with swords/maces and dwarves with guns..Waiting for this to be fixed ASAP,Stat!,now,yesterday,etc.
Next comment:
I guess those x2 guys were not playing on a Warmane realm...2008/Jul/14 (Patch 2.4.1)
Back when weapon skill existed this racial increased weapon skill by 5.
It is arguably better now since EXPERTISE is an all-around better stat.
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Member
I don't understand your snark, I find it bizarre. Those two posts are dated during TBC, which is when weapon skill was changed to expertise for all racial bonuses. I know personally that ax specialization was changed to 1% bonus crit with axes during WotLK. The confusion in the patch notes is that not only are the 2.3 changes incorrectly labeled as changes to crit chance, but the further changes from +5 to +3 for humans is unlisted in a changelog, but then shown to be changed again to 1% expertise during WoD. There's a bit of incorrect information in the archives.
Having never played alliance back in the day, I can't attest to the human or dwarf racials. I can, however, confirm that ax specialization was a 1% crit chance buff from Ulduar onward.
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Forum Veteran
https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...and-dual-wield
2010-april-09 post:
Please, can you tell me which patch was live as April-2010 on Retail?So when Im using 2h axe on my DK I got 5 expertise for free. But Im wonder now how axe specialization work with dual wield? If I have 2 axes I will get 10 expertise or this only count from MH? What if I have sword in MH and axe in OH?
Can someone explain me this?
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Member
3.3.3; my memories are from some time ago, but I purchased a race change to orc during ICC for Blood Fury, and I remember clearly standing on top of Saurfang's body with my spellbook open and looking at the 1% crit bonus from ax specialization, because Saurfang had just dropped Ramaladni's.
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Forum Veteran
So, what is your reaction at this MMO-Thread where x3 different players talks about orc's racial providing 5% expertise?
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Member
As anecdotal as my own memory. However I know that during ICC, from start to finish on that final content update, the orc racial was granting 1% crit chance for using 1h and 2h axes as well as for fist weapons. I checked it against a heroic Ramaladni's drop after Saurfang 10m, and because I already had a normal Glorenzelg, I passed it to our warrior. If my orc racial at the time had read as a boost to expertise, I would have certainly kept it as I was playing Blood DK tank at the time.
The information seems muddled over the years, but the effect on live Blizzard servers, Blackwing Lair PvP server, of ax specialization during 2009 WotLK was to increase crit chance by 1% and not to increase expertise by 5.
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Forum Veteran
Dude, nobody cares what you "remember". It is fact that in this patch specialisations were providing expertise instead of crit.
What supports such claim? You can get exact copy of 3.3.5a client, change ONLY realmlist and join Warmane. No additional downloads or any manipulations.
But yeah, ofc they have nothing more to do than alter original skills just to mess with some wannabe "veterans" so that they make pointless lunatic threads like yours...Edited: January 12, 2022
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Forum Veteran
Do you have any proof (beside your memories) that Orc's racial "Axe Specialization" was providing 1% crit chance as 3.3.5a patch?
If yes, then I recommend you to open a Report here: https://www.warmane.com/bugtracker
Warmane's dev will be more than happy to implement it; if that is how it was working as 3.3.5a on Retail.
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Member
Untwist your panties, you're not being attacked. I'm asking an honest question. There's no legitimate reason why you're so hostile, frankly if the server is filled with people like you, then I'm happy to avoid joining.
I'm not asking because I think it needs to change. I'm asking because a lot pservers run on "authentic, but tweaked" logic, so I wanted to know why an older effect was in use. I know how it functioned at least during ICC and through Ruby Sanctum until end WotLK. I'm asking to understand if this is a server with tweaks, and if so the logic behind the tweaks. If it's a matter of information only ghostcrawler would bother to share with us, then oh well, it's lost to time.
