First of all, you acting as if we dont know the game at all and you've it all figured out. Objectives in Isle of contest when we have to defend ? You're probably one of those BG premade heroes that couldn't accomplish anything in PvP at all and stuck at 1300 rating in Arena and your only way to feel proud was doing premades in BG. /clap.
Either bring something constructive and meaningful or be quiet, thanks.
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Member
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Moderator
An argument doesn't have to agree with you to be "constructive and meaningful."
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Member
To be fair, he used a straw man argument against you. However, the proper way to respond to that is either a) point out the fact that it was a straw man argument, or b) ignore it and don't draw attention to it by responding to it. I find option "b" to be the better choice in most cases.
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Member
But doesn't have to be insulting either by assuming people doesnt know the basics and the way his argument is put. I cant call it an argument really. An argument is sometimes meaningful and constructive. Either way, what did he disagree with? or agree with? he simply said that we are a bunch of crying babies who don't know the game. There was no argument presented whether agreeing or disagreeing O_o
The argument here is facing premades as a solo player with low gear and with a whole team that is low gear as well vs BiS players. Where a solo player have to make smart moves, but even if he was Albert Einstein, he wont be able win match single handed. So teamwork is not something I build up with my fellow BG mates, we just happened to be in the same BG and suddenly some are drunk, some are high, some are careless, some might even be blind who knows!? Its solo que. But we are having to play vs completely chosen members, using Discord, and surely had the time to plan and agree with each other, and BiS geared, which adds to the whole package even more! Does this sound fair match up?
So, this is the argument. Fair ? or not fair? cool. But I cant disagree with you by saying "its ur fault men, go learn teamwork and stop cry, thxbye"
plzzz..
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Moderator
He might be harsh, but it's on you to feel insulted by it, really.
His argument is simply that people are expecting to be able to solo or YOLO a group of organized people, often without having gear or skill to be able to even do good against other disorganized people in the first place. Instead of getting organized and dealing with the issue themselves, they are asking us to make it so no one can make an organized group or that groups only fight groups. You might dislike or disagree with his argument that people should be arranging groups themselves, but it's valid, meaningful and constructive - just not in the same direction as yours.
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Member
I mean, we all can start calling others cry babies and its their fault on every thread, where would that take us then ? its gonna turn into high school girl facebook page with these kind of responses honestly. Some certain individuals are spamming the whole forum on every post they dont like with nonsense. It is completely irrelevant to the main topic.
People here in "suggestions" section are saying why things need to be changed not so that one random comes and say "deal with it cry baby"? In an argument, a person shouldn't assume the other party is a complete ignorant without a clear indication. We lose in BGs vs premades not because we cant do objectives but the fact that they do it better and win a fight over objectives due to gear. Why would someone assume that we all dont know the game and we lose because we haven't tried to follow objectives ? After all, its impossible to make randoms in BG group up and start teamworking, this is a fact if anyone play BG would know that. So still, its irrelevant to suggest that "me" as a solo player is to blame for the fact that the majority probably have failed to group and teamwork. Hmmmm so if others cannot team work, why should I suffer?
Still, its not even only about a premade vs soloQ at this point, its the fact that one side is completely solo, 5k GS, vs bis team of players.
Finally, this is suggestion section where "I thought" it was meant to be for creative ideas, meaningful and constructive changes, not a place for people who don't like a suggestion to come and bash others and disrespect them. I think we all deserve respect. I would get a ban or a warning if I called you stop crying.
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Moderator
This is probably why you are overreacting so much to someone disagreeing with you - you believe people are suggesting something that needs to be changed, when the truth is what they are doing is proposing something they want to be changed, in their personal perspective, to fit what would be favorable for the way they want to play.
You're mistaken in your last paragraph. This is a place for people to make suggestions that can and likely will be challenged by players who disagree. This isn't and never was meant to be some sort of "safe space" where you can say what you want undisputed. And about "bashing and disrespecting"? Maybe you should take a step back and check who wrote things like "you're already getting scared that you will get dominated by other premades lol" and "You're too scared of facing a premade? LOL" in this very thread.
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Member
It is a valid viewpoint wrapped in a straw man argument. I take issue with this because in the context of this thread, such a viewpoint is entirely superficial and is obvious to anyone who has spent more than 5 minutes thinking about the matter, making it neither meaningful nor constructive. Time and effort would be much better spent debating the pros and cons of various proposed solutions. Unless there is data, the question of whether or not premade is an issue that needs to be addressed cannot be properly discussed nor answered. It is therefore reasonable for those who wish to engage in this discussion to continue under the assumption that premade is an issue to be addressed and focus on the merits of each proposed solution. Otherwise the thread will just get filled with anecdotes and rants.
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Moderator
I'm not going to stop people from generalized bantering, nor from exposing why they disagree with the suggestion. Your so-called "assertion" of his opinion is strictly based on it going against what you want to happen, which is made obvious when you want the discussion to stick to "pros and cons," throwing out of the window the very pertinent side of whether the suggestion has a point in the first place, exactly what his, yes, meaningful and valid argument is contesting.
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Member
I guess this goes back to your initial response then, if people doesn't have to be nice or this isn't a safe space..etc etc.. then why did you feel the need to jump in and through something about my comment first comment ? If it isn't a safe space, then surely shouldn't be a problem to tell others to be meaningful and constructive or be quiet.
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Member
That is quite an assumption. It should be obvious to those who have followed these threads that there is not enough common ground for useful discussion to take place if we can't move past the first step. As far as I am concerned, these discussions are meant to provide the staff with more ideas and options if they ever decide to take action. If they want to know our sentiments about this issue, they can easily set up a poll instead of digging through endless rants and anecdotes.
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Moderator
Read my first reply to you and you will know why, or at least you should.
As far as I'm concerned as a Forum Moderator these discussions are meant for players to make their suggestions, but under the clear expectation that others might disagree with it and made it known.
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Member
No one is advocating for any type of censorship. In fact, I am quite grateful that this discussion has been allowed to continue. I just prefer to hear more ideas or new viewpoints instead of the same ones that get rehashed and replayed over and over from both sides. We can probably all work at increasing the signal to noise ratio of this thread.
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Member
https://imgur.com/a/VEgdniX
Everyday, everysingle bg. Today i won 2, lose 9. But this is a problem old 2 months (myb less in my case). IM here since 2009.
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Member
They created merc mode just for ally so they could get faster ques so I wouldn't expect any changes. Rated battlegrounds would be a nice solution to alleviate the problem though.
