WotLK So everyone can just temp ban anyone?

[x01x01]

I got a temp ban for "1 day 18 hours due to Ninja in dungeon". Here is how it went down:


0. i'm a Paladin with tank build/specs, but using "outfitter" addon to switch between tank/dps when needed.
1. I queue a dungeon as tank OR DPS to get a better chance to get into a dungeon quick. I get into a dungeon as DPS, so i switch to my DPS build.
2. we get going and a normal mob drops a green shield better than my tank-outfit shield drops.
3. I as the ONLY member of the party press "Need" because, i need it for my tank outfit. i win it with a roll of 4 (because everyone else passed or greeded)
4. The tank stops and starts whining (really, like a child) about how he needed it, and that i dont because im a DPS member of the groups.
5. I tell him that i need it for my tanking outfit and that i only am DPS because i choose both in the queue and got DPS because another tank (him) queued.
6. 4 or 5 messages in, he threatens to report me for ninja looting, because "you dont need it as DPS". and i try to tell him that a paladin can both DPS and tank, and that i am spec'ed for tanking but queued as DPS to fill the queue quicker.
7. Everyone else in the groups tries to tell him to shut up and move on, that a better shield will drop in a moment because this is on the x7 exp server.
8. I tell the group that i dont want to play with somebody threatening and accusing me like that, so i ask them politely to please kick ME from the group so i can play with someone else who actually wants to play the dungeons.
9. Someone starts a vote to kick the tank (not me, and i didnt start the vote). Everyone votes yes and he's out.
10. we queue up, and as a new DPS comes into the group, i get to be the tank and we finish the rest of the dungeon with no problems (and using my new tank shield).
11. Today i try and log on, and i'm temp banned.

Remember, he didnt press "need" on it when we rolled for the item. He just started whining after like a child which the chat history clearly shows.
Also i always press PASS on anything i dont need, which i had until then in that dungeon this was the first item i pressed "need" on, which the history will show.

So does that mean that everyone can just abuse the report system to ban anyone at any time? the chat history has not been looked at or anything as it seems, since everyone in the group agrees he was an ***, not me, i even asked them after if i did anything wrong because i dont want to step on peoples toes and am always friendly with people i group up with in game.

[Islingr]

technically, the loot rules say "if your current role is DPS you only roll [need] as DPS" or something
you could, as I've seen some do back when I still did RDF, ask "mind if I roll on this, I need for my OS?" or "mind passing that to me for my OS?"
you "queueing both" doesn't entitle you to need on everything, by that argument if you had a hybrid ret/prot spec and a holy offspec, you could need on every single item and just say "I have spec" - not gonna work out

sure ****ty entitled <bleep>s exist and you bumped into one of them, but you're no angel either - and you got a ban to prove it, spend your day and a half to read up on the rules on forums

[x01x01]

Sorry the sticky post about ban appeal seems to state that its against the rules to create a post about bans, and that we have to create a support ticket instead.

But i can't delete this post? :( Just delete it if whoever reads this can and i will create a support ticket instead

[x01x01]

doesn't entitle you to need on everything

I didnt, this was the first item i didnt press "pass" on.

sure ****ty entitled <bleep>s exist and you bumped into one of them, but you're no angel either - and you got a ban to prove it

How can you say that without looking into ANY history? This basically means that if i report you for some reason that does not make sense, and you get temp banned, then you are "no angel either"?

Which is my question for this post - Can anyone really just ban anyone like they want to on these servers? seems like it opens up to massive abuse?

[Islingr]

it's not about "everything", and it's not about "you", it's about what could happen, especially with hybrid classes, if they DIDN'T do this.

in this thread https://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=65037 it clearly states:

Example of forbidden acts:
- In RDF needing on items for Off-Spec (unless everyone in party is explictly fine with this).

you playing ret means prot was your offspec

QED

= you get reported, you get banned, the fact the tank was a whiny piece of **** doesn't make it any less bannable

[x01x01]

in this thread https://forum.warmane.com/showthread.php?t=65037 it clearly states:

Example of forbidden acts:
- In RDF needing on items for Off-Spec (unless everyone in party is explictly fine with this).

I just read this rule post as well, and only thing i could think to that specific line is:
I waited until everyone pressed PASS or Greed, and then i pressed NEED. which the history will clearly show.
If we have to NOT use the roll system on loot but the chat, then what is the roll system even there for??
And noone wants to wait, everyone is in such a hurry with the dungeons. if you fall behind they kick you for being slow. There is almost no time to even look at or compare loot. So the build in need/grees/pass roll system seems like it was made perfectly to prevent these kind of siturations, but you say we have to not use it?

So my question still stands that this means if i'm an *** i can just go around in game and ban people for fun? This kind of "ban without looking at evidence" opens up this system for massive abuse and waste of time for the ticket processing staff.

[Shred]

I waited until everyone pressed PASS or Greed, and then i pressed NEED. which the history will clearly show.

That doesn't change anything... if anything it makes it worse.

People use the greed button thinking that others will play fair and only use need if they can need according to the rules.

If players generally thought that others will break the rules then everybody would roll need instead.

[Islingr]

So my question still stands that this means if i'm an *** i can just go around in game and ban people for fun?

yes, yes you can - if you can prove they broke the rules, like you broke the rules by rolling need.

This kind of "ban without looking at evidence" opens up this system for massive abuse and waste of time for the ticket processing staff.

they did look at the evidence, there was a DAMAGE DEALER who rolled need on a TANK ITEM, the rest only lets that specific damage dealer sleep at night, it has no relevance for the case, unless, as stated in the rules - the explicit approval of the entire party.

[x01x01]

they did look at the evidence

Not enough though? at least look at what was going on at that time.. you know, context.

What you are saying is basically that if you drive a little over a stop line/red light to let a firetruck behind you past, the police should give you a ticket or take away your drivers license because you "technically ran a red light or stop sign"?

I just think that this whole ban system is being abused by not-so-friendly people, and it is making for a toxic game experience, making people not want to play on your servers.

I mean look at the history, i have no prior bans, i passed on everything, i even tried to solve the "problem" in the chat but he just right away reported me because he knew this would result in a temp ban just out of spite. I would gladly have given him the item if he asked nicely (but he commanded it in the first message) as i have many times before even though i needed it myself.

Context is important is cases where a punishment has to be dealt or not, this is why context is asked for in a cought if you get sued IRL, else everyone could just put anyone in jail for technicalities very easily.

I wonder how many reports that user has made prior to this, sadly i dont remember the players name and i think the logs that shows only exists on the server so i cant look it up myself?

[Mitzen]

I got a temp ban for "1 day 18 hours due to Ninja in dungeon". Here is how it went down:


0. i'm a Paladin with tank build/specs, but using "outfitter" addon to switch between tank/dps when needed.
1. I queue a dungeon as tank OR DPS to get a better chance to get into a dungeon quick. I get into a dungeon as DPS, so i switch to my DPS build.
2. we get going and a normal mob drops a green shield better than my tank-outfit shield drops.
3. I as the ONLY member of the party press "Need" because, i need it for my tank outfit. i win it with a roll of 4 (because everyone else passed or greeded)
4. The tank stops and starts whining (really, like a child) about how he needed it, and that i dont because im a DPS member of the groups.
5. I tell him that i need it for my tanking outfit and that i only am DPS because i choose both in the queue and got DPS because another tank (him) queued.
6. 4 or 5 messages in, he threatens to report me for ninja looting, because "you dont need it as DPS". and i try to tell him that a paladin can both DPS and tank, and that i am spec'ed for tanking but queued as DPS to fill the queue quicker.
7. Everyone else in the groups tries to tell him to shut up and move on, that a better shield will drop in a moment because this is on the x7 exp server.
8. I tell the group that i dont want to play with somebody threatening and accusing me like that, so i ask them politely to please kick ME from the group so i can play with someone else who actually wants to play the dungeons.
9. Someone starts a vote to kick the tank (not me, and i didnt start the vote). Everyone votes yes and he's out.
10. we queue up, and as a new DPS comes into the group, i get to be the tank and we finish the rest of the dungeon with no problems (and using my new tank shield).
11. Today i try and log on, and i'm temp banned.

Remember, he didnt press "need" on it when we rolled for the item. He just started whining after like a child which the chat history clearly shows.
Also i always press PASS on anything i dont need, which i had until then in that dungeon this was the first item i pressed "need" on, which the history will show.

So does that mean that everyone can just abuse the report system to ban anyone at any time? the chat history has not been looked at or anything as it seems, since everyone in the group agrees he was an ***, not me, i even asked them after if i did anything wrong because i dont want to step on peoples toes and am always friendly with people i group up with in game.

[Realm] Players Code of Conduct [Updated: May 31, 2023]
[Forum] Forum Users Code of Conduct [Updated: September 7th 2022]

1. Your "MS" for the dungeon will be the one you joined in as. If you're assigned DPS role, you can roll need on DPS items, not matter how big tank MS you're outside of the RDF. You got assigned as DPS, you roll DPS. that's it.
3. This is where you got ninja reported. This is where you went wrong with how and when you can roll need for OS. What others roll or don't roll is irrelevant. You needed to ask if you can roll need on it, and the 4 others would've needed to give explicit "yes" answer. Even if only 1 didn't answer, you wouldn't be allowed to roll need.
4, 5 & 6. They can react how they want. Temper tantrum or not doesn't make what you did right.
7. If it's so easy to get a new shield on x7, why did you bother needing that one then? You could've gotten better one down the line.
8. If you don't want to play, you leave. If you make others make you leave because you don't want deserter, they can make another report how you're disrupting gameplay.
9. Yeah, people blindly vote on those, or since they didn't care about the item, they want the person holding them back away. Greed is a weird thing. Greed is why this thread exists.
10. Good for you to be the shining knight of the day.. with your stolen shield.
11. You can ask yourself, was the shield worth it.

Not enough though? at least look at what was going on at that time.. you know, context.

All the context that was needed: Your role, shield, and your need roll.