I dont think there is gonna be a lot of people with 75k. Marks maybe, but honor, nope. My paladin has 50 days of playtime, with 32k honor so far i believe. The people which got grand marshal and therefore 60k+ honor are a very small minority. And when it comes to marks, sure, it is a little advantage, but nothing that you cant catch up in a matter of one day. Not really a big advantage considering youd have to have played quite some time on Onyxia to level up and actually get into the BGs.
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I'm a serious PvP player that still plays on Vanilla PvP and got R14. None of the players I know will be rolling Blackrock either. It doesn't make sense.
Day 1 in just Karazhan you got half the server with epic weapons. Gorehowl, Despair, Sunfury Bow, Spiteblade etc. plus I have so much gold I'll just buy all the crafted gear and gems/enchants like nothing. And absolutely we're already honor/mark capped as well as a bunch of us having full T3 level gear to start.
There isn't anything they can do to make Blackrock on a level playing field. That's why I say it will be the noob server. That's what will happen. A lot of people I know are upset about the decision which sucks, but that's why I don't care about it. Bring on the easy targets.
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Sure, I agree with that and I actually think that says a lot about the amount that players currently playing care about PvP min/maxing. The trinkets that keeping coming up are an extreme min/max in TBC arena.
If the players currently on Onyxia don't care about taking full advantage of gearing up ASAP, I'm not seeing the connection as to why they are caring so much about blackrock getting trinkets to be obtained many weeks into the season via arena points.
If the affect that incorporating this server is so big, you'd think that a huge facet of the TBC experience for these players is arena. In my experience, the die-hard arena fanatics take every min/max opportunity they can get. Especially if it's something as straight-forward as farming honor cap months before an expansion releases.
If you are planning on just capping 10 games every week for casual arena points, this entire situation doesn't affect you at all besides positively impacting your queue times.
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That's not true. You probably just played during bridge farm days when nobody was winning games. Go PvP right now in WSG and AB and honor/mark cap is easy.
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Lets not mix up tomatoes and potatoes here. My arguments are out there and untouched by this new topic, and the only thing i wanted to add because of the honor thing is that its not a real advantage. Something which might be unfair to an extent, but in the end you can catch up within a day, unlike with arena points/raid items.
Actually a mistake by myself to come back here, its not like there is gonna be any productive outcome of this thread :D
I said "i dont think", not that im 100% sure. Calm down boy.Edited: September 12, 2024
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We are in agreeance that the honor cap advantage is very small and won't make a difference at the end of the day.
The way you feel about that, is the way I feel about trinket timings, especially with any additional stipulations that the devs decide to put like rating caps, etc.
I know we don't agree on that portion, and that's fine. Good to have both of our opinions out there.
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Not true. I have a level 60 alt, and im having a hard time reaching 30k hks and im at only 35k honor. it will take literally months to get to 75k honor. By that time TBC will be already released.
It is not easy to get Honor cap, and im doing PvP right now in WSG and AB.
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On TBC Classic the issue was not as prevalent due to the existence of GDKP and SR Pugs which are generally lacking on private servers.
Good example of catchup gearing, however this affects literally every character created after week 1 of raid opening or arena season start simply because of how TBC gearing is designed with weekly resets and no form of catchup if you missed a raid or an arena flush and is not specific to Blackrock or Onyxia. Also catching up 75.000 honor in a day with x1 honor rate would be very impressive.
Back to the topic, Obnoxious examples with limiting Blackrock gear access in some form during the early stages of the arena season seems reasonable considering only the last 2 weeks or something like that are the most important ones if you aim to play for season end rewards.
Also if you turn down on all the emotional aspects of socializing in wow and what not and look at gearing directly the difference between a fully "raid" geared character compared to the second best option using a mix of badge of justice and dungeon/rep gear is pretty minimal if you follow a standard best in slot list in season 1 as a rogue player for example. In this case we are looking at a difference of like 40 AP and 100 HP and 10 agility, a very minor advantage to say the least. And one of the items is even a guaranteed drop (Magtheridon's head quest reward).
Obviously this issue increases as the game progresses further into later content patches and seasons and every class is different but if we use season 1 as a test there is not a lot to benefit from by buying raid gear with arena points besides the convenience. So if you compare different classes and item lists yourself and still end up being upset about gear advantage then I do not know what else to tell you.
The biggest difference is giving people an alternative way of progressing through the game, one they might enjoy more than the current one including all the dungeon, rep grinding chores which are extremely frustrating for certain classes, so you allow them to do it in a different form.Edited: September 17, 2024
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Following that logic, wouldn't that mean that a Blackrock player is even further behind any given Onyxia player? All gear on Blackrock is sold for honor (or arena points, which are gated by weekly flushes) and you are saying honor is hard to farm. Onyxia players can farm (or already have farmed) honor right now, and can continue to farm for 1+ week after TBC releases.
So Blackrock players will be starting with about 80 resilience and 0 honor, *which is totally okay with me*. Just not sure where people feel this is unfair lol
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Trinkets keep getting brought up as an example, but it's a much longer list that can work against Blackrock and not for it that aren't a min/max thing.
In TBC there are quite a few powerful crafted items. Deep Thunder 2h Mace for example. Epic cloaks. Primalstrike set etc.
There are reputation rings from Karazhan that are a hand out. You have easily purchased BIS items from badge of justice vendors. You also have several quest items that are very powerful as well as reputation items.
The logistics behind creating fairness among all those items just isn't possible because you can't measure the effort and resources of one player against another and convert that into a point quantity.
That's why it's game breaking and it can't work. At the end of the day Warmane will just have to make an educated guess and see what happens. But in that balancing and finding the "sweet spot" or whatever the more serious players of Onyxia with resources will gain the advantage easily.
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Turn in your marks. Win games. Turn in marks.
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This isn't necessarily true but I see where you're head is at. It's very hard to farm honor right now on Onyxia because people simply aren't queueing enough. You'll get queues, but during non-peak hours and sometimes even during peak hours, you're just waiting for queues to pop and are spamming global to 'Queue AB'.
If you really tried, you could get cap but it takes a lot longer due to wait times. This lackluster PvP scene post-hype of launch is what the staff has stated they're trying to avoid.
Again, in my POV, if Onyxia players had a thriving PvP scene that cares so much about the changes being implemented, we would see them logging on to play and get honor cap. But we aren't seeing that. People are logged until TBC.
This influx of PvP-only players into the PvP side of the ecosystem will keep queues short when these players DO decide to play whether for fun or to push, even late into the expansion, and keep variety in arena across all of the ranges of mmr/cr.
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The PvP environment now is the result of the gear for HK system that Warmane created. Players don't have incentive to play because the gear isn't reasonably obtainable.
Honeslty though it's also the fault of Vanilla just not having a good setup to begin with. It wasn't built to be seasonal or phase oriented in PvP. The battlegrounds were also not geared toward that. Blizzard fixed that later on.
In any case if you did put effort into Vanilla, by this point you should be very well geared and the T3 level gear in many cases is better or comparable to R14. There was no resilience rating. I won maybe 30 games over the weekend and only lost a couple. And that's just gear discrepancy because these new players can't get the gear easily to compete against end game players.
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Of course they have incentive to play. To get honor capped and get ahead for season 1 in TBC. Farm 75k honor now in the content drought, or do it on launch.
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No I'm talking about PvP over all Vanilla because this has been an issue for months now. They stopped playing a while ago.
What you're referring to isn't on people's radar. For one it's an assumption and not a guarantee as that data can easily be reset on the expansion. And two these players left a long time ago and didn't care to finish out Vanilla content. No incentive anymore. There's no season 4 here, the content ended a long time ago in PvP.
