Was hoping to get clarification on how I should be gemming for PVE.
In this guide they state that I should gem strength until i achieve 50-60% "Passive" armor pen.
What is passive armor pen? Where in my class skills/spec is that? Currently I'm gemmed mostly for armor pen. If I replace on with strength my armor pen in the character window goes down. Makes sense I guess.
I guess I'm confused about how much strength (if any) I should be gemming for.
Thank you.
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Member
Armor Pen Clarification - Fury PVE
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Banned
I suppose the "passive arp" is the arp you have without gems. Either way you should prioritize 100% arp, then go for strength If you have gem slots left.
To answer your question about where you can find your armor pen rating/%, it can be found if you hover over the Attack power stat in the character window.
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Member
"Passive" ArP is ArP you have through gear, gems, food etc. Reason why you should leave gemming for it until you have a lot of it is it essentially scales. So 40->50% is a smaller gain than 50->60%. So say you have 20 str gems at 60% that'd be another 400arp which is about 28% more ArP. Or obviously if you have an ArP trinket (needle encrusted scorpion for example) you do 1400-arp proc = arp you should aim for through gear.
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Banned
Anything other than a trinket proc is passive ArP.
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Member
Since you're new to arp, remember that Sunder Armor doesn't reduce your need for arp one bit. A lot of fury warriors neglect sunder armor because they think 100% arp already reduces all the boss' armor. That's not how arp works. Sunder armor is still going to be a ~6-7% damage increase regardless of your arp.
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Member
its you who doesn't get hope arp works. sunder armor will lower the boss armor for all except the guy who has already 100 % arp. and its certainly not your job to sunder armor as fury damn it lol. prot warrior doest that with devastate duh
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Member
Nice necro.
You're also incredibly wrong. ArP, even at 100% will almost never actually ignore all a boss's armor. There was a post by Ghostcrawler years ago that explained this very clearly. You're welcome to look it up if you don't agree. But what it comes down to is that, even with 100% ArP, you're still only ignoring a certain percentage of the target's armor. What Sunder (and other similar effects, like Farie Fire) does, is it reduces the base armor of the target, which in turn means that you are effectively fighting a target with even less armor, regardless of your ArP.
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Banned
Yeah, well, Offbeat explained it quite well. Anyway, to answer OP's question - "passive" ArP is the ArP you have without trinket procs. Ultimately you're aiming for 100% passive ArP, but at early gear levels this is impossible, so you're aiming for as much ArP as to reach 100% when your trinket procs.
Example: Mjolnir Runestone procs 665 ArP, which means you need an additional 735 ArP to reach 1400 - the 100% hard-cap. When you have this trinket your ArP soft cap is 735. Any ArP above that will be a DPS gain while your trinket is down, but a DPS loss when the trinket procs (because you cannot bypass more than 100% armor, unlike spell resistances). Usually you will be able to go well above the soft cap at ToC gear level and you will reach the hardcap somewhere between ICC10-25.
You should also keep in mind that ArP from Battle Stance and Mace Specialization STACKS with passive ArP, whereas armor reduction from Sunder Armor and Faerie Fire does not. Sunder Armor/ Faerie Fire are applied before ArP.
Rough example: you have 50% ArP and you're attacking a target with 10'000 armor. You will hit the target as if it had 5'000 armor. A Prot Warr stacks Sunder Armor 5 times for 20%. The target now has 8'000 armor and you will hit it as if it had 4'000 armor. Same goes for Faerie Fire.
And as a Fury Warrior, it IS your job to Sunder Armor if there is no Prot Warr in the raid. It comes between your BT and WW cooldowns and Slam procs, when you don't have anything else to click or spend your rage on anyway...Edited: April 22, 2015
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Member
Those are some unfortunate numbers in this example. It might appear that you dont need sunder armor with 100% arpen from gear.
Maximum amount of armor ignored by arpen depends on target armor as well as your arpen from gear. More armor target has -> your arpen ignores less armor. (bosses have enough armor to never allow to ignore you your actual arpen percentage) - with 50% from gear you ignore about 40-45% of bosses armor with 100% arp from gear you ignore about 85-90% of bosses armor (=> lowering base armor with Sunder armor yields about 10% dmg increase regardless of your arp percentage).
It should work like this, but it is currently bugged. (see http://bugtracker.warmane.com/issues/12273)
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Banned
Yes, yes. As Ghostcrawler himself said, you can never really ignore all of the target's armor. Mine was just a rough example.
This bug is quite huge, how come it was reported just a month ago???
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Member
that bug was here since 2009 but still no proofs on it)
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